Help required with Tactics, Too much possession but too less goals and chances.

[sangeetnarayan8070]

I’ve using this simple possession based football. Problem with this tactics is that I control most of the game and the defence is solid, 8 goals conceded so far in 20 games. But I don’t create much chances and neither does my forwards score much goal. My league top scorer is Gabriel Jesus playing in the Inside Forward role with just 6 goals in the league so far. There are a lot of goals from set pieces so I have managed to win most of the game shutting up my opponent. How should I tweak it to create more chances while maintaining the control of the game. 
I wanted to use Inverted WingBacks with Ball Playing Defender so that my side would have much better control of the game. I play with an Winger/Inverted Winger because I have one of my star player playing in that position(he isn’t that great he just performs better than anybody else). 
I found that having Deep Lying Playmaker with Advanced Playmaker meant better control of the game and I switch the DLP to an Anchor Man when facing a better team. So far couldn’t properly find out which role suits my ST. Have experimented between Advanced Forward, False Nine and Pressing Forward. F9 gave me a better control, PF works good sometime in Germany and AF has been average. 
Any help will be appreciated. Thanks!

 

[summatsupeer]

The things that stand out to me initially is your playing for set pieces so not surprised you rely on them a bit since players will be quick to go down for a foul rather than continuing to attack.

Another thing is shorter passing, extremely wide and focus play middle is a strange combination.  Playing wider will stretch the team and you'll have possession wider, but then have fewer passing options playing shorter passes.  Exploiting middle where you already have two playmakers will put even more focus and risk taking on them, do they need that extra focus and risk taking?

As far as roles and duties go, I really dont think you need a IWB if you have two playmakers centrally already.  With IW I'd look for a natural overlap to draw opponent to that flank before a back post cross or switch of play to the IF.

[denen123]

You want to play wide, with only one player playing wide.

I don't think your tactic exploits width as you intend it to(except you've used PI's to force wide movements from you wingers).

[sangeetnarayan8070]

2 hours ago, summatsupeer said:

The things that stand out to me initially is your playing for set pieces so not surprised you rely on them a bit since players will be quick to go down for a foul rather than continuing to attack.

Another thing is shorter passing, extremely wide and focus play middle is a strange combination.  Playing wider will stretch the team and you'll have possession wider, but then have fewer passing options playing shorter passes.  Exploiting middle where you already have two playmakers will put even more focus and risk taking on them, do they need that extra focus and risk taking?

As far as roles and duties go, I really dont think you need a IWB if you have two playmakers centrally already.  With IW I'd look for a natural overlap to draw opponent to that flank before a back post cross or switch of play to the IF.

Let me address every point. 
Extreme Wide —> I was in a hope that teams that play narrow could be stretched to create spaces and my forwards could exploit that. So far I have found the IW and IF coming inside and taking advantage of this spaces. ST hasn’t been that great tho. I have mostly played with a PF/F9 but I guess I will try a CF once too. 
Shorted Passing —> For control 
Focus middle —> My best performer might be the left winger, but my best players are down middle and I thought if I focus middle I will be able to utilise them properly. 
This combo also works as some of my players have a switching flank trait and I have seen this catching the opponent by surprise sometime. 

About the IWB thing, I will admit an overlap will be getting defenders away. I was hoping IWB will give more control in the central of the midfield and might even break down opponent’s attack. Can’t really say it had been working though because I have been rock solid in defense this season unlike my attack so I mostly look for offensive phase of the highlights.

[sangeetnarayan8070]

19 minutes ago, denen123 said:

You want to play wide, with only one player playing wide.

I don't think your tactic exploits width as you intend it to(except you've used PI's to force wide movements from you wingers).

IW is set out wide on the left flank, I set WB mostly on attack so he gets fairly up the pitch. 
The idea of the width is just to stretch the defense not really utilise my wide players. 

[denen123]

1 hour ago, sangeetnarayan8070 said:

IW is set out wide on the left flank, I set WB mostly on attack so he gets fairly up the pitch. 
The idea of the width is just to stretch the defense not really utilise my wide players. 

Only your right wing takes advantage of the width exploit. Your left consists of two players on the flank basically both cutting inside with the ball(I'm struggling to find real life examples of that & why you opted for that. What is the purpose of both fullback & winger cutting inside?I'm lost, genuinely). You say stretch the defence & pockets of space gets to be exploited. I agree. But i don't think that how you've set up will work in the game.

The choices for AF combined with two Wingers cutting in is something i like, personally. But you must know that your ST will get isolated against teams that seat deep, even with the amount of support around him(as you've noticed when you've switched to DLF/F9 you've noticed positive changes). But there's so many instructions that are still conflicting, regardless.

[crusadertsar]

Why play for set pieces then? Makes absolutely no sense in the style you are supposedly trying to achieve

Edited October 4, 2020 by crusadertsar

[Experienced Defender]

10 hours ago, sangeetnarayan8070 said:

The most likely reasons you have too much possession are:

- very aggressive defensive instructions (far from sensibly designed though, so I guess your team is very strong in terms of players' quality)

- a number of possession-friendly in-possession instructions (except for extreme width)

- the use of 2 playmakers in the middle (although the AP with attack duty is not really possession-friendly type of playmaker)

The most likely reasons your tactic is ineffective - or insufficiently effective - attacking-wise in spite of all that possession are the following contradictions:

- extremely wide width coupled with short passing makes very little (if any) sense

- playing for set pieces makes no sense in a tactic/tactical style like yours (considering the rest of it)

- lack of attacking width on the left flank (although that is not necessarily an issue and can work in certain types of tactical setups/styles, but not always and not for every team)

- the already mentioned overly aggressive manner of defending deprives your attacking players of space they could otherwise utilize more effectively because you are pinning the opposition into their own defensive shell, making them even more defensive than they already are (assuming that most opponents play very defensively against you anyway)

So these are key issues you need to address in your tactic.

[summatsupeer]

8 hours ago, sangeetnarayan8070 said:

Let me address every point. 
Extreme Wide —> I was in a hope that teams that play narrow could be stretched to create spaces and my forwards could exploit that. So far I have found the IW and IF coming inside and taking advantage of this spaces. ST hasn’t been that great tho. I have mostly played with a PF/F9 but I guess I will try a CF once too. 
Shorted Passing —> For control 
Focus middle —> My best performer might be the left winger, but my best players are down middle and I thought if I focus middle I will be able to utilise them properly. 
This combo also works as some of my players have a switching flank trait and I have seen this catching the opponent by surprise sometime. 

About the IWB thing, I will admit an overlap will be getting defenders away. I was hoping IWB will give more control in the central of the midfield and might even break down opponent’s attack. Can’t really say it had been working though because I have been rock solid in defense this season unlike my attack so I mostly look for offensive phase of the highlights.

In isolation the reasons look fine, but you need to look how they combine.

Using Shorter Passing "for control" makes sense but not when your spreading your team out as much as possible width wise plus have 2 of front 3 on attack duties so stretching it vertically with AP-At and BBM-Su only really getting forward later on.  Where your trying to add control is actually limiting options and if they do decide to play it longer then its am riskier pass since theres more distance and chance the defender could intercept it.  Width doesn't make a huge difference to "stretching" opponents compared to roles.

Focusing the middle doesn't just focus them, it makes them riskier.  The AP and DLP already get focused due to being a playmaker, how much more should they get the ball? And have the opponents actually been "stretched" so they have space or does this extra focus just mean the players are trying to force the play through the middle where opponents might be strong?  It will also affect that ST increasing his mentality which as an attack duty could isolate him even further.

Personally i'd remove Width, Play for Set Pieces, Focus Middle and change the DL to FB/WB-At and then reassess.   Maybe also turn Counter Press off so opponents at least try to push out a bit to create space for your forwards early runs.

[Fatkidscantjump]

I feel like the attacking roles arent suited for possession, but rather for a more direct style, through balls from the AP into space for the IF and AF. 

However DLP will slow the play, shorter passing will slow it even more, and your super high LOE will make space for those runs hard to find.

So I feel like you need to make a choice, either play a possession style and in that case tweak attacking roles and remove pass into space and width instructions.

Or play a more direct style and change dlp to something else, remove shorter passing and drop down the loe a notch to give more space to the runners upfront.