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Spurs Brazillian tactic

gordon_comstock

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gordon_comstock

gordon_comstock

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long time champ fan - 1st time poster.

There seems to be a concensus that effective tactics on FM09 are difficult to come by. I would concur with this having had a couple of difficult games with Liverpool (Torres didn't score in 13!) and Athletico (Sergio Aguero out for 14 months after he got injured at the olympics.)

However I'm having a rather different experience managing spurs. I'm about 10 games in and flying and it is all down to what is at 1st sight a ridiculous (at least to my eyes) tactic. So I thought I would share.

4-2-2-2. Clearly it has a long history in brazillian football but I have never seen it played by an EPL team. Nonetheless it appears to be working. I'm undefeated. and currently sitting in 3rd. Joint top on points with Chelsea and the Arse.

Team

GB: Gomes (Cesar)

RB: Hutton (Belletti*)

LB: Bale (Gilberto)

CB: Woodgate (King)

CB: Caceres* (Dawson)

DM: Jenas (Zocora)

DM: Huddelstone (Belletti*)

AM: Modrick (Dos Santos)

AM: Arshavin* (Bentley)

ST: Pavlucheko (Bent)

ST: Balottelli* (Frasier Campbell)

Essence of the tactic.

Individual

LB/RB are played in the normal position but preset as wingbacks rather than full backs to ensure they swashbuckle and provide the width. Hitting the byline.

DM's both play sitting role (defensive mentality/few forward runs) but with through balls set to often to ensure they set up the play.

AM Modrick and Arshavin given free role behind the strikers - plenty of forward runs. To run amok.

ST: Ballotteli/Fraiser played as traditional strikers lots of forward runs to get behind the last man. Pavlucheko played as target man.

Team

Attacking mentality (2/3 of the way up) - reined in away from home against tough opposition

Creative mentality (slightly more than the amount of attacking) reined in away from home against tough opposition

Short passing

The rest mixed depending on opposition

Target man - Pav

Counter attack: home and away.

I hoped I was on to a good thing when in my first game I demolished Newcastle 6-0 (Fraiser hat-trick)

Since then - apart from the odd frustrating draw things have continued to go well.

2-1 away at ManU being a highlight.

I have conceeded 4 scored 14. I'd love to hear if anyone else is finding success with a similar tactic?

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Strankan

Strankan

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Haven't tried the 4222 in 09 yet, but it worked really well for me on 08. Couple of questions:

Are you having any trouble getting overrun down the flanks when you play like this?

How's the midfield working for you? Do you get enought pressure on the playmakers of other teams? Mainly thinking of this considering the two free roles on the AMs.

Where are you scoring from/conceding from? Crosses or linkup play through the middle or screamers from outside the box?

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gordon_comstock

gordon_comstock

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TBH I haven't conceeded enough goals to really be able to analyse where the majority have come from.

If pushed I would say that most have come on the break while my full backs were committed up field. Where a winger with a lot of pass has bombed it into the space then crossed to their CF.

(I'm thinking specifically of against Middlesboro where Belletti bombed on put a good cross in from the byline - it was cleared: they released downing who scremed down the wing and crossed for Alves to nod in)

I guess your always going to leave yourself vulnerable to that playing this system - you've just got to hope that your 2 defensive mids can cover across. Personally I think its worth it for the solidity and dominance it gives you down the middle.

The time I really came unstuck was against United away. I was feeling pretty good and stuck with the system but they were playing two attacking midfields (cristiano et al) plus attacking full backs (evra etc)

The change I made seemed to work well. I pushed up the full backs to wing back position. Pulled off Pavluckenko and put on Ledley King allowing Woodgate to play as a sweeper. so a 12421 (or something!) Came back to win 2-1 so I was chuffed as anything. Balotelli is ridculously good though which no doubt played a role.

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RuDi

RuDi

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hi just set up my man city team with this and played liverpool at anfield and was 2-0 up at 35mins but srna got sent off so i put my team quite defensive and managed to hold off till 80 mins when babel scored but i still won 2-1 in the end. its a good tactic, my assistant manger said we were dominant throughout match even when a man down.

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RuDi

RuDi

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Gk: Joe Hart(Kasper Schmeichel)

RB: Srna,18m (onuoha)

LB: Bale, 14m (Guilherme 2.8m)

CB: Richards(Kompany)

CB: Dunne(Ben-Haim)

DM: Veloso, 12.5m (Gelson Fernandes)

DM: Palombo, 12.25 (Kompany,Johnson)

AM: Matias Fernandez, 13.5m (Johnson)

AM: Van der Vaart, 2.5m loan and 10m future fee(Real Madrid put him on transfer list for 12.5 mill so got him as i sold elano to ac milan for 10 mill)

FC: Robinho(Owen, only wanted 3.1m so had to sign him)

FC: Cardozo, 6.75m(Jo)

Players Out:

Elano(10m to AC Milan)

Petrov((9m to Everton)

Ireand (sold for 5m cant remember who to though)

Basically i just rebuilt team, Cardozo has doing well has 4 goals in 3 game sbut is now out for a month so ill have to try Jo and hope he can actually kick the ball)

Shoulldnt have sold elano as now i only really have robinho and johnson as backup for the AM's as shaun wright philips is not good at AMC so he is basically useless.

I think this tactic will be perfect for my team if i can get better back up for AM's which i plan on doing in january market by selling wright philips, vassell etc.

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gordon_comstock

gordon_comstock

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RuDi, interesting to see you bring in Cardozo. I haven't looked him up on FM09 yet. I'll definetley take a look. I had a play about with City and was really looking forward to the Robinho - Jo combination but was pretty disapointing. Jo especially was very poor. Still I wasn't using 4-2-2-2 so maybe the blame lies with me rather than that pair of Brazillian bums!

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gordon_comstock

gordon_comstock

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My apologies on the lack of uploads but I have literally no idea how to. I tried pressing the screenshot button while in the game and nothing happened. My lack of computer skills is only made up for by the continued impresiveness of my spurs team using this tactic. I'm still joint top after 24 matches [with Arsenal and Chelsea although Chelsea have a game in hand.] I've lost once all season. 2-1 away at Stanmford Bridge.

If anyone can give me detailed instructions on how to show you guys it would be much appreciated.

p.s. Martin Caceres is magic

[Talk about tempting fate - next game go away to wigan and get beat by an 87th minute valencia blockbuster. Gutted

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urbanjunkie

urbanjunkie

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Hi mate. You need to locate your tactic file (which has the .tsc extension). Its located in the tactics folder. I have a Rapidshare account, so if you want I can host it for you, you just need to email it to me. Let me know, and I'll PM my email address.

By the way, I've tried creating this tactic from your first post. How long did it take for your team to settle?

Fellow Spurs fan here ;)

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gordon_comstock

gordon_comstock

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End of season update:

Well here's the verdict on my wee experiment: Really rather happy.

I finished 4th on 67 points. I only lost 5 (2nd lowest in my league behind the eventual winners Chelsea) However I drew far to many games. 17 wins - 16 draws.

I believe that the real problem for my team was a general lack of goals. 59 in the league. Not a bad return but not enough to be challenging for the EPL. It remains to be seen whether this is down to the personnel or the tactic. My gut feeling is that it is the personnel. Pav and Fraiser don't really cut the mustard at this level, bent was shocking and Ballotteli was injured for too much of the season. When I brought in Huntelaar in Jan things changed for the better.

The tactic evolved over the course of the season. (the upload link provided is the May version) Basically having read some of the threads on here about global mentality I modified the amount of individual pre-sets I used. Now the front 4 all play with the same attacking/creative mentality. and that has helped ensure a more cohesive team performance.

Also I started using Modrick as a playmaker and getting rid of the target man. The only changethis meant was that instead of both my attacking midfielders making 'often' forward runs. Now one was mixed thus more inclined to sit deeper and pick the ball up.

There is still some work to do and I look forward to letting you guys know how the second season goes. I would love to upload some screen shots but that unfourtunatley remaisn beyond my technical ability. (advice welcome.)

More importantly I would be really interested to hear some storied form anyone else using this tactic especially with a different team. Would this work for a newley promoted side? a Championship side? Intriguing thoughts.

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displaced_seagull

displaced_seagull

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Just a theory on this - would playing the offside trap be wise? Especially if the fullbacks were asked to play as Wingbacks instead?

In theory, the wingbacks would move up, and as a long ball is played in from the opposition, the centre halves would move forward, putting the striker offside.

It's a good basis for a tactic, certainly - I've been trying to develop this with Spurs with mixed, but generally pleasing, results - the best a 4-2 win over Liverpool last season where Darren Bent got all four. Now in the second season - 2 wins, 1 draw, 2 defeats.

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edwinteo

edwinteo

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End of season update:

Well here's the verdict on my wee experiment: Really rather happy.

I finished 4th on 67 points. I only lost 5 (2nd lowest in my league behind the eventual winners Chelsea) However I drew far to many games. 17 wins - 16 draws.

.

Hi,

i've started with Everon and have massive overhaul on my squad, use to MAn City buying my star players for insane amounts of money i could not refuse.

Areta for 23 Mil, his value was only 10

Cahil for 25 mil, his value was only 9

Yakubu for 20 mil, his value was 12 (but i sold to Real MAdrid instead, they offered same amount)

with that cash, i brought in, Matias Fernandez, Miguel Veloso, Goran Pandev, L Diarra, Ruben da la red, Juan Mata

lots of quality midfield players together with wonderkid Fellanini, i was thinking of using a midfield based tactic, with James Vaughn as the lone striker.

how would u line up my squad based on ur tactic?

my guess would be as follows:

GK Howard

DL Baines

DR L Diarra

DC Yobo

DC Lescott

DMC Fellanini

DMC Veloso

AMC M Fernandex

AMC Goran Pandev

ST James Vaughn

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obirpinar

obirpinar

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Hi,

i've started with Everon and have massive overhaul on my squad, use to MAn City buying my star players for insane amounts of money i could not refuse.

Areta for 23 Mil, his value was only 10

Cahil for 25 mil, his value was only 9

Yakubu for 20 mil, his value was 12 (but i sold to Real MAdrid instead, they offered same amount)

with that cash, i brought in, Matias Fernandez, Miguel Veloso, Goran Pandev, L Diarra, Ruben da la red, Juan Mata

lots of quality midfield players together with wonderkid Fellanini, i was thinking of using a midfield based tactic, with James Vaughn as the lone striker.

how would u line up my squad based on ur tactic?

my guess would be as follows:

GK Howard

DL Baines

DR L Diarra

DC Yobo

DC Lescott

DMC Fellanini

DMC Veloso

AMC M Fernandex

AMC Goran Pandev

ST James Vaughn

this game playing with 11 player

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gordon_comstock

gordon_comstock

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Thanks for the advice displaced_seagul. That makes sense to me so I think I'll give it a go. I'll let you know how I get on.

Steve, when I get home from work tonight I'll email you across the tactic. If you wouldn't mind hosting it for all those who are interested I'd appreciate it.

Getting back to the tactic itself I have developed a quite successful [more]attacking alternative. Basically when Im a goal down I push the DM to CM (helps if you have players capable of making that transition) push up the fullbacks to the wingback position and increase the team attacking mentality a few notches.

Wham bam thankyou maam you have yourself a comeback. It's not rocket science but it has been effective. a 1-2 win at Arsenal being the best example

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Steve Thorpe

Steve Thorpe

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Hi Gordon

You have playmaker ticked. Who should be the playmaker? and you mention using Pavluychenko as a target man yet no target man ticked. Which of the two strikers should be a target man type if so? Or could you get away with two pacy strikers.

You may want to tweak the corner cheat from 08 into this potentially as well

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edwinteo

edwinteo

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Thanks for the advice displaced_seagul. That makes sense to me so I think I'll give it a go. I'll let you know how I get on.

Steve, when I get home from work tonight I'll email you across the tactic. If you wouldn't mind hosting it for all those who are interested I'd appreciate it.

Getting back to the tactic itself I have developed a quite successful [more]attacking alternative. Basically when Im a goal down I push the DM to CM (helps if you have players capable of making that transition) push up the fullbacks to the wingback position and increase the team attacking mentality a few notches.

Wham bam thankyou maam you have yourself a comeback. It's not rocket science but it has been effective. a 1-2 win at Arsenal being the best example

i'm outstationed at the moment so cant try the tactic as yet... could i ask, how does the defence of this tactic work?

without wide players, except the forward running fullbacks, how would the back 4 square (DCs + DMCs) stop attacks down the wing?

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gordon_comstock

gordon_comstock

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Steve; I played Modrick as the playmaker. Less forward runs than Arshavin. Your right, formally I played with a targetman (Pav) and it was quite effective but I changed it to two pacy strikers. I think it's important if they are allroundish players (ballotelli and huntelaar are both pretty quick and pretty good in the air.)

Edwinto; Your right, attacks down the wide channels does look like it should be a problem with this set up. But with the two DM's 1 can cover across quite effectvely. Plus I have recently been using displaced_seawing's idea of playing offside (as well as pushing up depending on whether the strikers were quick or not.) with some success

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edwinteo

edwinteo

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Steve; I played Modrick as the playmaker. Less forward runs than Arshavin. Your right, formally I played with a targetman (Pav) and it was quite effective but I changed it to two pacy strikers. I think it's important if they are allroundish players (ballotelli and huntelaar are both pretty quick and pretty good in the air.)

Edwinto; Your right, attacks down the wide channels does look like it should be a problem with this set up. But with the two DM's 1 can cover across quite effectvely. Plus I have recently been using displaced_seawing's idea of playing offside (as well as pushing up depending on whether the strikers were quick or not.) with some success

do u play whole team on zonal with loose marking? what about closing down levels?

i was thinking, because the opposition has to be closed down by the strong side players with the weak side offering cover, how to u duplicate this in FM?

thx for the response earlier

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Steve Thorpe

Steve Thorpe

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Set CB with best jumping and heading to challenge GK, the centre back with next best to attack near post, striker with good heading to attack ball from deep. Some people also use another player with good heading for near post flick on. Have other striker attack far post. All corners into 6 yard box. All other players outside of area or short option etc just not in the box

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