What is SI doing to address customer complaints and frustrations ?

[themadsheep2001]

Is it time to expand the infraction for car analogies to all other forms of analogies? Some of the stuff in this thread has left ludicrous far behind.

I hope so.

[themadsheep2001]

Disagree completely , a shout is the manager on the sidelines barking out instuctions to his players in game and that is how shouts were promoted when they were implemented to the game.

They could be called purple ping pongs and they would still do the same thing. It's the concept that matters not the name, the name wont change that. You don't think a manager will give specific instructions before a game too?

[Jarmel]

They could be called purple ping pongs and they would still do the same thing. It's the concept that matters not the name, the name wont change that. You don't think a manager will give specific instructions before a game too?

Then why do we have names for anything ? Maybe if the thingy was alittle more spasmodic then eventually 4 will equal 16.

Oh crap i guess you know what i mean as i didn't use the right name/terminology but thats not important as long as you know what i does.

:/

[Rupal]

..... Some of the stuff in this thread has left ludicrous far behind.

Oh I wholeheartedly agree with that

[themadsheep2001]

Then why do we have names for anything ? Maybe if the thingy was alittle more spasmodic then eventually 4 will equal 16.

Oh crap i guess you know what i mean as i didn't use the right name/terminology but thats not important as long as you know what i does.

:/

Shouts was probably chosen because it would stick in someone minds about a manager. But when a manger shouts, he's giving instructions. Something he can do before game, or during a game. So limiting it to during a game makes no sense. If you know your opponent is weak down the flank, why would you wait till the middle of the game to exploit it, why not exploit from the start?

To say it should be limited to during a game because its called a shout is arbitrary.

[Svenc]

When i change between these shouts will that effect how familiar my team is with the tactic ? Its a question i dont know the answer. It should change it dramatically apart from the formation it will play totally different (well hopefully) . What im getting at here is if it doesnt then its a cheat , as if had made these two different tactics in the TC then it would take time for the team to learn them. If using shouts on a generic basic framework will allow you have allmost any tactic be very familiar for the team as long as you stay in the same formation. Considering my team can only learn three tactics , if using shouts by passes this and allows my team to know 18+ different tactics It kinda defeats the purpose.

I had no idea you could overcomplicate this so much. The shouts (and team instructions) are modifiers for your base tactics. They modify build-up play, closing down, distribution, what have you in certain directions. Safe for arguably the most extreme ones, such as "hassle opponents" maxing out closing down no matter the starting point, they don't completely turn sliders upside down, or a core characteristic tactics completely around. As such they usually don't hurt tactics familiarity this much. The AI is also utilizing them to an extent, and is likely adjusting more than many human players do anyway. Not to the extent of another conspiracy naturally, which has it that the AI immediately undoes your changes and shifts and turns around things like 90 times a match. If you're as comfortable with sliders as you claim, you can check out what each of the shouts does. (Talking about tactics and AI, I'm really curious how the ME, getting increasingly more robust against diablo tactics, would be perceived in online play. Seeing as the choices the AI makes are still limited and always will be, I reckon this would make for quite a fun online experience. As a simple example, the AI isn't able to spot slow as molasses defenders pushing aggressively all the way up and as such isn't able to royally exploit such, even if the tools are all available to it. A human player can do.)

Btw, I think the introduction of familiarity bars in the tactics screen, for all the good intentions, has ironically done as many harm as good. As did the red and green arrows in the team talks screen previously, or the CCC stat in the match stat screen. People tend to put too much of a sole focus on that. Sometimes because it is few, arguably sole black and white feedback in the game, or so it seems. Green arrows=good, red arrows=bad. Filled bars=great, empty bars=fubar. Sometimes, I reckon, players might cling onto them out of desperation. Say, someone who regularly concedes a late goal (and can't theorize why that could be), someone whose striker are never into space and the team always blasts it long (no possible solution at hand either), that someone at least has green arrows, 60% possession stats and fully filled bars to clinge onto as SOMETHING he's doing apparently "right". When in isolation it means absolutely naught.

Thinking about it, the same might apply to assistant feedback. Whilst it is obvious after longer play that all the assistant is is a fairly basic algorithm mostly counting events happening in the match (many fouls, many missed passes, etc.) and pointing you out on certain things (which can lead to contradicionts, naturally), there's also players who equally cling onto feedback as some kind of "mini-game": Try to correct as much of the bad assistand feedback, and you're set. Which all is naturally also SI's fault and their lack of documentation. This isn't a case of a developer wary of spoon-feeding it all. This is, to a large extent, a case of barely anything being communicated proper. The problem is, naturally, as FM is meant to be a simulation, that not all of the players will be out of the box familiar with footballing basics first (example: importance of movement and creating space), and then secondly how they're actually implemented into the game (the TC concept of "duties").

[Guest]

I've actually proposed adding a player specific TF display to help people understand where they might be weak, this would also see some players never achieving 100% familiarity as they are being asked to do something that is beyond their ability.

[Ackter]

I'm going to close this mess now. Barside et al, can you guys start a new thread to discuss your shouts ideas etc so it doesn't get lost in here?thanks.