Tactical Theorems and Frameworks '07

[Asmodeus]

Originally posted by frostrup71:

Thanks WW once again for a informative look into FM tactics.

However have created a few tactics based on your mentality / mirror instructions, some with success and some not..

But I allways run into the same problem. My players can't hit the f*** goal. Is there anyway I can improve their hit rate by adjusting some of the sliders?

Tempo?

Kev- I haven't really used baroows properly yet- must give them a shot!

[Guest]

Two quick thoughts of mine. First, on the Rule of Two/Global Mentality split. I've been trying to capture the best of both worlds by having wingers without farrows and fullbacks set to the same mentality, and everything else arrayed pretty much as it is in the RoT. With a reasonably pacy and smart fullback (Srna) set to run forward often, I've been getting some good overlaps. With Bouma on the other side, I've dialed forward runs down to "rarely," with the result that he usually manages to chug up into a supporting position.

Now for target men. I've employed two different ones at Villa: Angel and Agbonlahor. Angel is who I use in my standard system, and I like to keep him in the center of the park by giving him a pretty low CF. With a moderately attacking mentality, he lays off the ball to Petrov at AMC, or tries to play the ball wide to the other pacy striker (who has CF around 18, or even a free role occasionally if the opponent's back four is slow.)

I like to use Gabby as a target man in the counter-attacking system set out so well by wwfan above. With a sarrow moving him into a channel and high CF, plus a "run onto ball" instruction, passing at 15, and direction to play down one flank, he gets lots and lots of breaks down the line. Eventually the AI catches on and keeps the fullback back, so I go to a mirror formation, which works for a little while too.

[martin jol]

Originally posted by El Padre:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by frostrup71:

Thanks WW once again for a informative look into FM tactics.

However have created a few tactics based on your mentality / mirror instructions, some with success and some not..

But I allways run into the same problem. My players can't hit the f*** goal. Is there anyway I can improve their hit rate by adjusting some of the sliders?

Thats probably more an issue of training rather than your tactic. </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

imho i think tempo has an effect here too, if you play a high tempo you are more likely to rush a shot. if you play a slow tempo you are more likely to be too ponderous somewhere between 7 and 14 works best for me

[mr.rooney]

wwfan, is the 4-2-3-1 just the same as the away tactic, except with non-sarrowed FC's and farrows on the wingers? Also, what tempo do you play against the 3-3-2-1-1?

[LiverpoolSimplyTheBest]

Another 101/100 post from the great man. KUDOS

[fg]

rooney do you have some screenshots with your results > How did your team play in away games( with closing down 5 to all?) what is your average concerding goals? sorry for english.

[wwfan]

3-3-2-1-1

No particular shape. The key is getting the full backs forward. I used to defeat it with a slow tempo style, and slow tempo may well be the way to go to beat ultra defensive systems, whereas fast could work against more neutral ones. Needs some more testing.

4-2-3-1

Non-sarrowed FCs and long-farrowed wingers. I basically used to swap my FCd to be 2nd DMC, and keep him at mentality 14.

Tempo

In a fairly basic series of tests high tempo (15) was working well. However, Asmo suggests it results in snatched chances, so tinker around with it if your strikers are failing to score.

Forward Arrows

Long-farrowed wingers were devestating in '06. It may be back to the drawing board with a lot of testing to discover if they can work well in '07.

Changing Tactics In-Match

I would switch to the counter attacking systems if I thought the opposition would switch to a more attacking formation (4-2-4 etc). It could be a proactive or reactive switch. If you get three goals to the good stick with the attacking system as the AI tends to try to shut up shop to avoid embarrassment at that scoreline.

Notes

I like Gwalch's approach in that he is tweaking the standard framework to suit specific players. In terms of developing the system to really work that is undoubtedly the way to go.

@ Asmo: Thanks for the input. Please add any empirical findings you have to this thread as my hands are tied in that respect.

[Guest Smurf]

I can't express how much im looking forward to WWFan testing all this information on the new FM2007!!

[Mystz0r]

Where in Sydney are you wwfan, I can burn you a copy if you want.

[wwfan]

I have the game, just not a PC to play it on!!! For details, check the Off-Topic Thread.

PS Be careful about offering such things as you could well get yellow carded or banned! I wouldn't want anyone offering kindness to be punished for a little transgression!!!

[Mystz0r]

If you swore to purchase it anyway, I actually dont thing it would be illegal under Australian law. But anyway, I appologise if my post was inappropriate.

[wwfan]

I appreciate the kindness. I had the game sent over from the UK (purchased by a family member and posted day of release). However, my PC is fooked in a very large way. Thanks again for the offer.

[wwfan]

I appreciate the offer. I hope my theories have been of help to you. Good luck and play well. I live on the Lower North Shore, so if you ever wanna go out for a drink and FM chat, mail me! The Oaks is a great pub.

[Guest]

Maybe I'm being thick but what are farrows, sarrows and barrows and what is the difference between them. Are they the arrows you put on players for where they should run to?

Sorry I'm new to the game!

[wwfan]

Originally posted by normanph:

Maybe I'm being thick but what are farrows, sarrows and barrows and what is the difference between them. Are they the arrows you put on players for where they should run to?

Sorry I'm new to the game!

Farrows = forward arrows

Barrows = backward arrows

sarrows = sideward arrows

darrows = diagonal arrows

[kevinhinnells]

don't forget bdarrows - backwards diagonal arrows.

Was trying these last night with a striker dropping back to AMC. Worked well in helping defend a lead.

[alex0811]

i was beaten by arsenal 0-3 at home with man utd

i use the 4-4-2 diamond home

why???

[Stephanie McMahon's Secret Lover]

Does anyone actually base their tactic on playing the AI rather than playing football? (If you know what I mean)

I've always taken advantage of certain things the AI does (or doesn't do) in the past.

Has anyone noticed any little quirks that the AI does that we can all take advantage of?

[LichR]

question:

FCa and FCd

which one is FS and which one is TS?

my guess is FCa is TS? since he stays up the field and holds the ball until he gets more support?

[horseman_Plague]

i love this theory but i'm never able to implement it into a 433

what was that 05 tactic called ... total football i loved that all those triangles : D brilliant

[mr.rooney]

Originally posted by fg:

rooney do you have some screenshots with your results > How did your team play in away games( with closing down 5 to all?) what is your average concerding goals? sorry for english.

I'm going to start a new game, and post results with that. On my old game I switched between home and away, and got a bit annoyed because I wasn't beating teams I would expect to beat (especially with the away tactic).

I'll start again instead using the 4-2-3-1 for away games, and I'll post my results.

As for your english, I think it's fine! It's better than most people who post on the forums, especially the ones who ask "what isn d"

[mr.rooney]

Sorry for that, I was in a rush, and I didn't realise that I couldn't edit my own posts anymore!

[balloch_guy]

Used this system with Celtic using 4-4-2 Diamond formation and the overall mentality of 112.Also using the frameworks of Creative freedom v Closing down and Mentality v Passing.Had some very good results which i will post up later tonight.The away Tactic has let me down though i have used the 5x5 defensive line playing narrow and slow.Might be a case of my 2 CB'S not being up to scratch though.Will post team and tactics tonight for all to see.

[El Padre]

Originally posted by mr.rooney:

<BLOCKQUOTE class="ip-ubbcode-quote"><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-title">quote:</div><div class="ip-ubbcode-quote-content">Originally posted by fg:

rooney do you have some screenshots with your results > How did your team play in away games( with closing down 5 to all?) what is your average concerding goals? sorry for english.

I'm going to start a new game, and post results with that. On my old game I switched between home and away, and got a bit annoyed because I wasn't beating teams I would expect to beat (especially with the away tactic).

I'll start again instead using the 4-2-3-1 for away games, and I'll post my results.

As for your english, I think it's fine! It's better than most people who post on the forums, especially the ones who ask "what isn d" </div></BLOCKQUOTE>

If you have any success with your 4-2-3-1 could you post it up on FM Downloads for me so I can give it a go?

Cheers 'n' that!

[Guest]

same problem here, using fiorentina, in 38 games, record 24-9-5, 81 points, ranking third, 4 pts behind Inter. Few transfer made, using mostly originally Fiorentina squad. Great improvement here. The result from adopting wwfan's thoery is, low possession, more through ball, very few defender mistakes. Scored 59 and conceded 23. Win almost all battles against mid-tables, except a draw with Palermo. But constanly losing points on sides like Verona, Messina... I think it's the problem that those teams played very defensive and compact system. I adopt wwfan's suggestion, using very aggresive tactics on away matches even, long Farrows for side midfielders, short ones for side defenders and MC(a), even give +2 to mentality and -2 to passing to all players. Help a little. Tight marking for defenders, CD high, D-line at 10, a little help too. Still hard to score. But agaist more prestigious sides, results are almost perfect, played some very efficient games, even against Milan and Inter.

Any way. My friends using his original tactis playing the same game on another machine set a nice comparison with mine, his Fiorentina got 70 pts by the end of season. I believe wwfan's suggestion has been really great. But still hope to get more advice on how to beat those teams that u'r really supposed to beat

[Siren]

I'm into my second season playing as Roma and i'm really struggling. I get outplayed in every game, even at home by much weaker teams which didn't happen in my first season. I tried some of wwfan's suggestions for the second season but it didn't help.

Most teams play a defensive 442 or 451 and spend the whole game camped out in my half, and i can't get the ball. I still win in most games because they can't score and i have Totti, but its very frustrating to watch my team get outplayed by Ascoli.

[mr.rooney]

into my second season playing as Roma and i'm really struggling. I get outplayed in every game, even at home by much weaker teams which didn't happen in my first season. I tried some of wwfan's suggestions for the second season but it didn't help.

Most teams play a defensive 442 or 451 and spend the whole game camped out in my half, and i can't get the ball. I still win in most games because they can't score and i have Totti, but its very frustrating to watch my team get outplayed by Ascoli

I'm getting a bit frustrated with it as well. The case with me thought is that in away games there isn't many chances, and I either win by one goal, or draw. At home, I outplay the oppoisition, but generally win by the odd goal. I've followed your frameworks for tactics, and I find that I'm not having much sucess.

wwfan, is there any tips you can give me that will make me enjoy FM for the first time in a while? I really want to enjoy this game, I didn't enjoy 06 at all, and I really want a proper game where my tactics work fine, and I don't get frusrated by drawing with teams that I should beat.

Thanks for the help in advance.

[Stella_Fella]

I have uploaded these tactics from 2006 - does anyone know if they work for 2007?

I haven't got round to getting into the game yet, so wanted to check as these were created by this thread last year by wwfan.

Thanks

http://fmdownloads.net//index.php?

[Stella_Fella]

Sorry link is here > http://fmdownloads.net//index.php?&direction=0&order=&d...ry=FM%202007/Tactics

[wwfan]

Attacking Systems

This is where my ability to give decent advice begins to come unstuck as I still can't play the game. It took me a fair few seasons to start coping with the more defensive systems in the game, with a lot of testing and tweaking. However, I'll attempt to offer a few theoretical hints and tips and see where that gets you.

Closing Down & Defensive Line

I used to have my d-line at 10 for more attacking systems with a CD of 17/15 for the DCs/FBs. Asmo suggests that d-line influence has changed between '06 and '07, so dropping it to 5 or so may work. This will spread the play out and give your players more time and space on the ball to make quality passes. You may well add CD to the MCd/DMC too so he pressures the opposing FC as soon as he gets the ball.

Closing Down & FCs

Upping the closing down for your FCs may work as it will force more hurried clearances from the AI. I haven't tried it myself, but it would be well worth testing.

Width & Tempo

Early '07 testing suggested a 15/15 split was the way to go here. It may be that you need to play a more possession friendly game against defensive systems, so 15/5, or 17/3, could work. I had a lot of success with the 15/5 in '06, but tweaking it further may work wonders.

Tight-Marking

Reduce tight-marking settings so only the DCs are employing it. This will give your other players more space and time. Alternatively, against a 4-5-1 system, specific mark the opposing FC with your MCd, which allows the DCs to pick up the ball in space and start new attacks.

Forward Runs

Could be well worth making the FBs FR often to provide more overlaps.

Through Balls & Crossing

In '06 I had everyone playing through balls to mixed and it proved very successful. It may be worth toning it down for the DCs and GK against defensive sides, so they focus on easy lay offs that keep possession and allow more creative players more opportunity to play killer balls. FBs should have mixed TB and Crossing, ML/R mixed TB, often Crossing.

Time Wasting

If, as suggested, its influence has been increased, reduce from 5 to 3.

Half Time Team Talks

If your side isn't performing as expected in may be worth while throwing a few tea cups at half time to knock them out of their stupor! They should be beating poor sides, so make sure they know it.

Scoring Goals

In '06, the long-farrowed wingers and short-farrowed FB system produced chance after chance, as the combination worked space on the flanks, so each cross was delivered with very little pressure on the crosser. As four players were attacking the ball in the box, the FCs, the AMC and the other winger, one invariably got on the end of it. It was a very satisfying way to score, and a little tweaking should recreate this in '07.

Possession

I need to know possession stats for matches against defensive systems. You should, at half-time, be leading possession 55%-45%. If not, something is going very wrong. If you can tweak the tactic towards achieving that figure against poorer sides then you will start seeing results.

Target Man

Limits attacking options against poor sides so don't use it.

Playmaker

Likewise.

Focus Passing

Mixed to open up a multitude of angles. This is why I used to give all players TTBs, as an attacking pass could come from anywhere at any time.

Please report back with some match stats so I can try to see what, where & why things are going wrong. It shouldn't take too much tweaking to solve this.

[wwfan]

In addition to this, if anyone would like to do some testing, I would be grateful in hearing about the effectiveness of arrows. I would suggest using El Padre's RoT Solid for this as it seems to be working very effectively. However, I would like to hear about the success of farrowing and sarrowing on all RoT systems, as their influence seems to have changed. Thanks in advance for anyone who runs this test.

Testing Scenario

Ideally, you should pick two matches against mid table sides, one home, one away. This is taking into consideration that you are doing well yourself and near the top of the division. I would like you to repeat the two-match sequence four times.

Test One

Play with the standard RoT Solid systems as is.

Test Two

Add short farrows to the wingers and remove sarrows for FCs

Test Three

Add long farrows to the wingers and remove sarrows for FCs

Test Four

Play the wingers as AML/R with barrows to the ML/R positions. Remove farrows for the FCs.

Testing Report

This will be both qualitative and quantitative. I would like to know which system you 'felt' was best in terms of quality and beauty of play. I would also like to see the match stats, such as possession, shots on targets, successful crosses etc. A combination of the two is likely to give us an idea of how well arrows, sarrows and barrows work, and see if, as suggested, farrows have lost their effectiveness and barrows have gained in usefulness.

I hope this isn't going to be too frustrating or boring for you. I remember watching Maidenhead play Harrowgate and Cambridge City circa 40 times whilst working out how '06 played and going to bed with the worst headache. I'm hoping that isn't required in '07 and that this approach suffices.

[Rashidi]

Attacking Systems

This is where my ability to give decent advice begins to come unstuck as I still can't play the game. It took me a fair few seasons to start coping with the more defensive systems in the game, with a lot of testing and tweaking. However, I'll attempt to offer a few theoretical hints and tips and see where that gets you.

Closing Down & Defensive Line

I used to have my d-line at 10 for more attacking systems with a CD of 17/15 for the DCs/FBs. Asmo suggests that d-line influence has changed between '06 and '07, so dropping it to 5 or so may work. This will spread the play out and give your players more time and space on the ball to make quality passes. You may well add CD to the MCd/DMC too so he pressures the opposing FC as soon as he gets the ball.

Asmo is right, a lower D-Line does tend to spread out play a bit more but I'm more inclined to reduce it to around 8. Having one DMC on high closing down in the centre works pretty well. Two possible approaches. First one, have a DMC closing down 12 and an MC or AMC closing down at max...what you will see is the DM hold his line, the MC does the closing down, passes it to the DMC who plays a through ball to the flanks. The better the side the more lethal this partnership.

Closing Down & FCs

Upping the closing down for your FCs may work as it will force more hurried clearances from the AI. I haven't tried it myself, but it would be well worth testing.

Yes it does work like that now. However maximum closing down may not be ideal as the players are not well positioned sometimes for the break. If they are set to closing down in own half it's usually good enough, they harass players when they are in the opponents half but leave themselves free when the ball enters the mids zone. Presently I consider this to be almost a requirement for any tactic home or away. The hurried clearances are a boon if picked up by your side. Especially relevant for LLM. Danger - I'm not sure, but the increased closing down may contribute to higher injuries more common with LLM sides

Width & Tempo

Early '07 testing suggested a 15/15 split was the way to go here. It may be that you need to play a more possession friendly game against defensive systems, so 15/5, or 17/3, could work. I had a lot of success with the 15/5 in '06, but tweaking it further may work wonders.

I'm not too sure about this, I would think tempo and passing are directly related, but my testing on this was not intensive enough

Tight-Marking

Reduce tight-marking settings so only the DCs are employing it. This will give your other players more space and time. Alternatively, against a 4-5-1 system, specific mark the opposing FC with your MCd, which allows the DCs to pick up the ball in space and start new attacks.

Tight marking works well if the players have the right attributes, if they have low OTB now they lose out big time. TM needs to be employed judiciously and cannot be a general rule. Specific marking requires you to keep a split screen open for formation changes

Forward Runs

Could be well worth making the FBs FR often to provide more overlaps.

True for good sides, for other sides, the use of the width sliders also add to the increasing incidence of overlapping runs

Through Balls & Crossing

In '06 I had everyone playing through balls to mixed and it proved very successful. It may be worth toning it down for the DCs and GK against defensive sides, so they focus on easy lay offs that keep possession and allow more creative players more opportunity to play killer balls. FBs should have mixed TB and Crossing, ML/R mixed TB, often Crossing.

Formation specific I think, but yes it appears properly deployed with FWR its a killer for a good tactic..the interplay betweeen fullbacks DMs and mids is a joy to watch when the crosses and TTB works. Various options exist on how to play balls into space,down flanks. I think the attributes of decisions, passing and crossing determine the variety at your disposal and how you want to play it. I can see my LLM side trying to achieve the complicated passing patterns I'm trying to make.

Time Wasting

If, as suggested, its influence has been increased, reduce from 5 to 3.

Half Time Team Talks

If your side isn't performing as expected in may be worth while throwing a few tea cups at half time to knock them out of their stupor! They should be beating poor sides, so make sure they know it.

Scoring Goals

In '06, the long-farrowed wingers and short-farrowed FB system produced chance after chance, as the combination worked space on the flanks, so each cross was delivered with very little pressure on the crosser. As four players were attacking the ball in the box, the FCs, the AMC and the other winger, one invariably got on the end of it. It was a very satisfying way to score, and a little tweaking should recreate this in '07.

Possession

I need to know possession stats for matches against defensive systems. You should, at half-time, be leading possession 55%-45%. If not, something is going very wrong. If you can tweak the tactic towards achieving that figure against poorer sides then you will start seeing results.

ditto

Target Man

Limits attacking options against poor sides so don't use it.

ditto

Playmaker

Likewise.

Focus Passing

Mixed to open up a multitude of angles. This is why I used to give all players TTBs, as an attacking pass could come from anywhere at any time.

Please report back with some match stats so I can try to see what, where & why things are going wrong. It shouldn't take too much tweaking to solve this.

[Cerritos]

Originally posted by rashidi1:

Target Man

Limits attacking options against poor sides so don't use it.

ditto

Playmaker

Likewise.

Just to clarify for us lesser lights: are you against the idea of target men and playmakers, or just against the idea of choosing them in your team instructions? As I see it, it's OK to have two forwards, one more target-mannish and one more of a striker, but not necessary and perhaps even counterproductive to use "Target Man" in the team instructions ... same thing with a playmaking midfielder. Do I understand you correctly?

[Rashidi]

Playmakers seem to be easy to nullify in the game, and to some extent targetmen. I know people have successfully used them in the past. But its just as possible to make a tactic and create the effect of targetmen and playmakers just like you do with counterattacking.

[Siren]

My performances have been improving a great deal as the season has gone on. Im finding that playing a targetman is working really well when i set target man supply to run onto ball. Also lowering the defensive line to 5 when against defensive sides is working much better than before when i used 10. Lowering the tempo from 15 to 6 seems to be working quite well although in most games i have less than 50% possession, regardless of the opposition. Anyway i shall do wwfan's test in my next two games, Torino(5th) and Chievo (11th)

[alex0811]

In my second season i even cannot beat Wolfves at home with Man utd

i use the Rot Solid tactic system

My ball possession is 46%

why???

[El Padre]

No idea Alex, I'm into my third season and still going strong. Maybe its your training?

[alex0811]

Training???

i use the defeat training system.

can u upload your training system ?

[El Padre]

I'm road-testing this one at the moment

http://community.sigames.com/eve/forums/a/tpc/f/1519717/m/1932088662

Your team also might not be suited to the tactic, who knows? Read through the advice threads here and see if they help.

[wwfan]

My take on alex's difficulties is undoubtedly the re-ranking. I think that re-ranking is hugely important for those managing a top club in their second season. In the first season, you will come up against neutral systems as your personal manager ranking is low even though team ranking is high. However, once you have had success both your ranking and team ranking is high. You need to make a massive shift in tactical approach to deal with this, as over 70% of divisional teams will employ very defensive systems against you. It is tough to manage and a lot of people fail to adapt.

El Padre started with Aberdeen, so built his knowledge and ranking level up more slowly. That way he is less likely to encounter mega-defence systems too early and before his tactical competence is enough to cope. As he progresses through the game, now with a big club and a biggish personal reputation, he will have to tweak a little more to continue success. By then he will have the tactical nous to cope with the change as he will understand his system pretty well by then.

To succeed, alex, you will have to tweak the home system, and use it for most matches, so it has lots of FWRs, low time wasting, low d-line and lots of width. Personally, I would reduce tempo as well to ensure you keep possession. Good luck.

[wwfan]

@ Rashidi: Great advice re Closing Down and D-line. It's fantastic to have someone of your calibre contributing to TT&F.

[El Padre]

may well add CD to the MCd/DMC too so he pressures the opposing FC as soon as he gets the ball.

I think I'm going to drop the D-Line in RoT solid to 5 for a while and see how that goes, it worked well against Hibernian who were my bogey team in Scotland.

[alex0811]

i have reduced the tempo and played 2 games

i still cannot keep the possession.

charton 1-2 Man utd

Man utd 2-2 Chelsea

[wwfan]

You'll need to keep tweaking. It must be tactical as possession won't dry up over one season. Keep on lowering the d-line and tempo and increase width until possession sorts itself out.

[wwfan]

Also, how many new players have you bought? If you have hugely changed your squad performance will drop for a while, no matter how you adjust your tactics.

[Siren]

I did the test proposed by wwfan and below are my results. To clarify, i'm playing as Roma and we are sitting 13 points clear at the top after 21 games (season 2). For the sake of the test i did not change settings during a game when normally i might. Also the stats listed are the ones i considered relevant for the test. The team used for both games is as follows:

Gk Curci

DL Chivu

DR Rosi

DC Mexes

DC Woodgate

DMC De Rossi

ML Nani

MR Lennon

AMC Kerlon

ST Totti

ST Owen

Game one: Torino vs Roma (Torino are 5th)

Torino played an attacking 4-5-1 formation, and would change to 4-3-3 quite early on.

Test one: Standard RoT

Torino 0-2 Roma

Shots 11-16

On target 3-10

Possession 50%-50%

Corners 4-7

Passes completed 67%-65%

Crosses completed 17%-26%

Tackles won 61%-65%

Headers won 50%-58%

Very good performance limiting Torino to long shots. Strikers played the channels very well which created alot of chances.

Test 2: Short Farrows on the wingers.

Torino 1-2 Roma

Shots 3-11

On target 2-6

Possession 47%-53%

Corners 2-4

Passes Completed 68%-66%

Crosses completed 20%-22%

Tackles won 48%-56%

Headers won 56%-54%

Dominated the game, Torino managed to score a penalty late on but we played some good stuff and were camped out in the torino half. Wingers did a good job and the strikers were not as effective this time.

Test 3: Long farrows on the wingers

Torino 1-2 Roma

Shots 14-11

On target 7-8

Possession 53%-47%

Corners 5-2

Passes Completed 73%-67%

Crosses completed 25%-17%

Tackles won 57%-75%

Headers won 48%-62%

Played awful and Torino should have won really. Wingers were very tired in the second half and did very little during the game. By far the worst performance of the 4.

Test 4: Wingers in AML/R with Barrows

Torino 3-2 Roma

Shots 6-14

On target 5-8

Possession 49%-51%

Corners 1-3

Passes completed 71%-68%

Crosses completed 21%-29%

Tackles won 61%-65%

Headers won 50%-58%

The result looks bad but we actually played really well. 2 of the Torino goals were 30-yard strikes. Created so many clear cut chances we should have scored more. Lots of chances created down the wings from counter-attacks, Lennon in particular had an excellent game.

Conclusion for game 1: I felt the standard RoT was the best here closely followed by the short farrowed wingers. The strikers in test 1 played very well and created problems down the channels. Test 3 was the worst by far, wingers played poor. I felt that the best football was played in test 1 and test 3.

Game 2: Roma vs Chieveo (Chievo are 11th)

Chievo played a defensive 4-4-2 and would change to the 3-3-2-1-1 after i scored.

Test 1: Standard RoT

Roma 2-0 Chievo

Shots 11-5

On target 4-3

Possession 50%-50%

Corners 1-2

Passes Completed 69%-63%

Crosses completed 17%-10%

Tackles won 66%-61%

Headers won 71%-39%

Decent performance but Chievo did have a spell where they had a few chances. Strikers again played very well but we could have passed it around better.

Test 2: Wingers with short farrows

Roma 3-0 Chievo

Shots 19-7

On target 13-1

Possession 51%-49%

Corners 6-1

Passes completed 71%-69%

Crosses completed 13%-35%

Tackles won 72%-65%

Headers won 47%-60%

Better performance than game 1, played some good stuff and created many clear-cut chances.

Test 3: Wingers with long farrows

Roma 0-0 Chievo

Shots 18-4

On target 7-2

Possession 55%-45%

Corners 2-2

Passes completed 74%-64%

Crosses completed 33%-28%

Tackles won 58%-67%

Headers won 46%-49%

Again i didn't like test 3. Wingers were relatively redundant and got very tired. Possession was nice though and passed it around quite well.

Test 4: Wingers in AML/R with barrows

Roma 2-0 Chievo

Shots 10-3

On target 5-1

Possession 55%-45%

Corners 6-2

Passes completed 73%-65%

Crosses completed 30%-25%

Tackles won 65%-65%

Headers won 61%-42%

Played some really good stuff but didn't really create much, wingers both played poorly but the rest of the time played well.

Conclusion for game 2: I felt that test 2 was probably the strongest and again test 3 was the weakest. Test 1 was also strong in terms of performance and test 4 was decent.

Overall Conclusions: Overall i though there was very little to choose between standard RoT and test 2. However test 2 did see the team keep the ball slightly better than test 1, where alot of long balls down the wings were played to the strikers. Test 3 was awful and i failed to score a single goal. Test 4 was interesting because it was effective on the counter and we did play some good stuff. In the awy game id did feel defensively weak. I did not think test 4 was quite as good as 1 or 2 but it wasn't bad at all and i would consider trying it again.

[Siren]

I can't edit my post but i realise i made a few typing errors. Also in conclusion to game 1 it should read "the best football was played in test 1 and test 4", not 1 and 3 as stated.

[Mighty Red]

Great advice from WWfan + rashidi, managed to get through my first season as Liverpool averaging just over 2 goals a game and 0.4 goals against. Not massively impressive, but was pleased with the defensive soundness given i'm playing 3 at the back.

Into my 2nd season, you do see the effects of the re-ranking - would add that whilst I agree with the two masters of tactics re: playmakers and target men, I have used Crouch as a TM to great advantage when against poor jumpers in really defensive set-ups. Playing with 3 up front, I can move him out to play against the fullbacks where there is often a mis-match. I would stress that I only do this for 1/2 hour at a time as the oppo will pick this up.

Also, to reinforce - dropping the d-line is the single most useful thing I've done to counter a defensive system. However, I have struggled against the 4-4-1-1 for some reason. The defensive 4-4-2, 4-1-4-1 and 4-2-2-2 are not really issues anymore.

[alex0811]

thanks so much to wwfan,i'll keep trying.

if you have time can u creat tactics and upload ???

[wwfan]

No tactics from me for a while I'm afraid for reasons beyond my control.

@ Siren: Thanks. Some interesting stuff there. I'll start to put some thoughts together when I've seen another few test results. The report was exactly what I wanted.