[FM11] Heathxxx Lower League Management Approach

[heathxxx]

Well, I could use a 4-2-3-1 with more simplified roles, not too dissimilar to those I'm using with the 4-4-2, but it just wouldn't be the same for me. That's probably my stubbornness when it comes to my approach of building squads around a tactic, rather than the reverse though Jenko_EFC.

I would certainly agree that insofar as shape and the way they can play in the ME, there's not too much difference between a wide 4-2-3-1 and an attacking 4-4-2. Certainly not when I'm playing a forward who drops deeper in the 4-4-2. It's just that in my own mind, I have specific roles I like to employ in a 4-2-3-1 that I think need better players than I currently have available, for such a tactic to be as effective as I would like. For example, I would like to use two deep-lying playmakers in the MC slots. One on "defend" and the other on "support". Players available to me neither have high enough "key" attributes, or sufficient quality I would look for in any additional or overall attributes. Likewise, in my own mind either with the wide or narrow 4-2-3-1, I like to employ inside forwards. The narrow variant then plays more like a 4-3-3 depending on how I setup the AMC position if he's more of a support player, or a 4-2-4 if he's more attacking.

Although you can indeed do anything with any formation (I tend to thing of them as platform, rather than an ideology of shape), I'm never satisfied unless I have just the right players, or combination of players. That said though, I've always got my eyes open for the right players, for a number of different strategies. You'll always find me spending a lot of time browsing the "Transfers" list in different countries, looking for those players who've been released by their clubs, especially the older players with better mental attributes.

As I said though, I'm also a little stubborn in that I want to see if at the very least, I can go unbeaten in the league for the season, using this basic 4-4-2 approach. I've got really good players that suit each position and role, which is what's driving it at the moment, along with the additional aid of observations regarding opponents strength or weakness.

Really enjoying this save though. Perhaps that's because I'm using a system I had neither planned or had the desire to use initially.

[SgtPepper]

When would you be willing to go 4-2-3-1? I mean what figures are you looking for to try and create that tactic?

I've been following your advice and I made promotion to league 2 tonight. I had to play playoffs but I used the OP's and shouts to really make a difference and I could really see them reflected in the game. Still learning though so every advice you give is good for me.

[heathxxx]

It would depend entirely how successful I am in attracting the right players at this stage. The additional problem that I'm finding will clearly influence my decisions, is the weather and pitch conditions.

I have to admit, that most of my time with FM10 was spent playing with Spanish teams. Pitch conditions weren't often a major factor, but in the English lower leagues, they noticeably are I'm finding.

The roles within the 4-2-3-1 I have in mind, are more conducive to attractive, passing football, with a slower tempo that I might use with a Spanish team. On a boggy English pitch in February with heavy rain, that sort of "style" isn't likely to get very far. It would work well when the weather conditions are good, so it's something I can keep in reserve, so long as I have the players capable of performing in the roles properly.

The players I would need in either of the MC deep-lying playmaker roles in my 4-2-3-1, would need good attributes across the board. Technical, mental and physical. The inside forwards would preferably be comfortable using either foot, or at least good with the left foot if playing on the right and vice-versa, to cut inside and either shoot or lay off killer passes with their stronger foot. My solo forward would probably be a complete forward. If you look at the attributes of the complete forward role, they have to be pretty much proficient in nearly all attributes.

So, in the lower leagues, the specific system of the 4-2-3-1 I would want to employ would be difficult. Both playing conditions and availability of the right sort of players would make it difficult to work. That's why I'm sticking with the 4-4-2 I'm using at the moment, but I'll review things more at the end of the season.

Still unbeaten in the league and FA Trophy, though I did manage to earn a replay against Crystal Palace in the FA Cup 4th Round, with a 2-2 draw at home. Unfortunately, they stuffed us in the replay. It was one of those games that I doubt any tactical tinkering could have salvaged anything from. My players decided to have an off day and nothing I tried was getting anywhere. I think what surprised me most about the superiority Crystal Palace showed, was that they're currently 19th in the Championship and doing poorly, whereas Millwall were hovering in either top spot or second, at the time we beat them. The FA Cup is always something else...

As a learning tool though, a good drubbing by a superior team is something to draw experience from I think. It's definitely much clearer who the weaker players in your team are. Mine were glaringly obvious unfortunately, but served to reinforced doubts I've been having about some of them throughout the season. Indeed, I've already drawn up my shortlist of players who will be "moving on" at the end of the season!

[heathxxx]

Well, just one key change to my original tactical roles that I've been trying out recently, but only really because I have a player who's well suited.

I have Australian forward Danny Allsopp, who I brought in towards the end of November 2010. I've been playing him as a poacher and he has been scoring plenty of goals in that role. However, with defences tightening up, it's harder for a poacher to find space to get on the end of crosses and through balls.

So, I've been trying him out in the target man role, though without additionally selecting him as as such, or as a focus of passing, in the team settings check boxes.

As you'll see from the above image, what particularly stands out from the key attributes for this role, are his strength and determination. They're both exceptional for this level of football and clearly give him a good edge. His other key attributes are also pretty decent though too.

In his first full game starting with the target man role, I played Newport County from the Blue Square Premier, in the FA Trophy 4th Round. I was delighted with his more central positioning that was evident, along with the way he linked up much better with my deep-lying forward, Lilian Laslandes, who is excellent in his role. Two roles and two players who complement one another really well, within my overall tactical setup.

Here's the PKM from that match: http://www.filefront.com/17615355/Newport Co v AFC Telford.pkm

I recommend at least watching extended highlights, paying attention to the positioning of Allsopp, his movement and also his interplay with Laslandes.

Going by this result and his performance, I'm happy to adapt my system a little to use the target man role with Allsopp from the start. I'm also going to see how my veteran Brazilian Viola gets on in the role too.

[tigerhgrrrrrr]

My 451 Mourinho tactic is devloping all the time. Up to Xmas I used fast a SC as Att Poacher, now I have realised I have a quality DLF/Trequrista anda great TM so that is the avenue I currently explore. The possible trouble is I want the the following set up:

MCd Sup

MCa Att

AML + AMR Att

SC Sup

With a poacher you have the SC restricted to Att, so if like me you are hung up about the balance you have to change 1 AMR/L to support, but my latest theory, as yet un tested, is to have both MC's as Supp and the "Packet of 3" (LOL) all on Att. I guess thats something for the weekend ;-)

[Jenko_EFC]

Just started as Hampton & Richmond in the BSS heathxxx.

If it's alright, I'll update you guys on how it's going. With my tiny database (40,000 ) I haven't got too big a selection to pick from but I prioritized key attributes and searched for them and scouted clubs as much as I could. I'll make a more thorough post later on about Tactics and the players I've signed.

I can't get high fees for friendlies like most. At max I get ~£10K for playing Championship level teams at home. If I play a foreign team I pay £10K and get £500 for the Gate reciepts but if I play them away, they pay me £10K. I seen from your screenshot you get much more than me so I'm playing lots of them to hopefully gel my team, test my tactics and get a bit more cash, still confused as to why though.

[heathxxx]

tigerhgrrrrrr - a little experimentation with the options and players you have available, is always a good thing. After all, if you don't try something, you'll never know if would have been wonderfully successful, or a spectacular failure

Jenko_EFC - Good stuff!

Anyone can contribute whatever they want to the thread. That's what it's here for. Although I started the ball rolling with "my" approach, I'm happy for anyone and everyone to contribute their thoughts, suggestions and "approach". If people want to post their own tactical preferences, married with the sort of player attributes they marry them with and why, then they're more than welcome to do so.

There's no one way of approaching things and no "one size fits all" tactic. So different angles of approach gives readers broader options they can try to work with.

[tigerhgrrrrrr]

tigerhgrrrrrr - a little experimentation with the options and players you have available, is always a good thing. After all, if you don't try something, you'll never know if would have been wonderfully successful, or a spectacular failure

Jenko_EFC - Good stuff!

Anyone can contribute whatever they want to the thread. That's what it's here for. Although I started the ball rolling with "my" approach, I'm happy for anyone and everyone to contribute their thoughts, suggestions and "approach". If people want to post their own tactical preferences, married with the sort of player attributes they marry them with and why, then they're more than welcome to do so.

There's no one way of approaching things and no "one size fits all" tactic. So different angles of approach gives readers broader options they can try to work with.

Im sure you are right about experimenting with options. I hate change, in FM and life generally, so will usually in FM games stick with my current sytem & settings as long as possible (ie until they no longer work, and clearly AI's do work you out if you dont change, that is as it should be). The Tactic creator/wizard makes it so much easier to make easy changes that can make a big effect to your play. Which leads me on to my point, ww fans excellent T&TT submission for FM09 (from which I believe the Wizard was derived in part) gives relatively strict duty asignments & spreads, eg my 451 uses:

DC x 2 both Def

DL/DR both Auto (Support I imagine being the mid setting so I treat auto as support for this purpose of duty assessment)

DMC Def

MCd Sup

MCa Att

AML & AMR Att

SC Sup

So that is:

Def x3

Sup x 4

Att x 3

Or "Duty theory 343"

If I change my SC to Poacher but make no other change, that means Poacher must be Att duty I end up with "Duty theory 334". What difference does it make? (No Smiths pun intended). Am I too hooked up in that duty "thing"? I will experiment but I just wondered how much the "Duty Theory" should be followed slavishly.

[merak43]

Hello!

Well i finally migrated from Fm 09 to FM 11 and are using your tactics as i talked about in the pm.

i did actualy search through many clubs to find good amatuers and did find some but mate, your must have a patience like iron becase if i contacted 100 guys for signing 1 would be interested in joining my team and they demanded too much money

after three days of that i finaly i just searched for the players you had and aproched them most accepted right away even throuth i cut the salary in half, aswell as aperence bonus and i have the same reputation as you have on the manager.

I do have a couple of question though.

1. i made the req to change the staffing on coaches and they refused i already tryed to get a bunch of coaches and the one i got way the GK coach you have and martin porter (i think he is named) then they refused to accept any more of them so now i have 1.5 in all but GK with is 4 and attacking defending and the last one that is 2 stars as i have quite big quality of the players is that enuff?

2. do you any special traning program of the player or do you use the default one?

3. i have plyer that is mainly suted to one role (for example middfielder with the role defence is there any way so at a glance i can see who is better at what. (rename the person to mcd heathxxx) or anything easier?

4. is it possible to get the game to create a filter for the transfercenter using the player roles (so STCL get automatic the attributes that is better for for that role. (already done the filters just wanna know if i can do this as i can do for the players it self)

thanks for a great thread!

sorry for bad english not my native languese

[heathxxx]

1. i made the req to change the staffing on coaches and they refused i already tryed to get a bunch of coaches and the one i got way the GK coach you have and martin porter (i think he is named) then they refused to accept any more of them so now i have 1.5 in all but GK with is 4 and attacking defending and the last one that is 2 stars as i have quite big quality of the players is that enuff?

Unfortunately requests for anything can depend on the board and chairman of your club. I try not to use the "will attract better quality" type request, as unless the chairman is highly ambitious, this isn't likely to win them over. I think from memory, I went for the request that suggested extra coaches would benefit the players abilities more, get more out of the players.

2. do you any special traning program of the player or do you use the default one?

Thus far, I have been using the default full-time schedules, as I always sign players on full-time contracts. Something I would recommend anyone does with a part-time club. When you get the inevitable fixture congestion over Christmas and New Year, it's harder to keep players fit on part-time schedules.

I have to admit though, I never delve too deeply into training schedule settings, as I just don't think it's particularly a strong point of the game. Players will improve quickest through first team action and although you can shape how players develop to a degree, with a smaller club and poor facilities, I just don't think it's worth spending that much time on setting up individual or tailor-made schedules for players.

That said though, I've just decided to download and try FM11: Ahoj Training Schedules. The schedules look logical, so I'm taking a look at how they do. Otherwise though, the standard default full-time schedules for Defence, Midfield and Attack, have been fine so far.

3. i have plyer that is mainly suted to one role (for example middfielder with the role defence is there any way so at a glance i can see who is better at what. (rename the person to mcd heathxxx) or anything easier?

I just simply swap players around and look at how well they match with the highlighted position/role in the tactics screen. For me it's just a case of familiarising myself with the names of the players and the roles I prefer to use them in. After a few games, I pretty much "know" who my team is and what positions/roles they can play.

Other than that, I often have a pen and some paper handy.

4. is it possible to get the game to create a filter for the transfercenter using the player roles (so STCL get automatic the attributes that is better for for that role. (already done the filters just wanna know if i can do this as i can do for the players it self)

Not that I'm aware of, other than the filters already available in the player search menus, though someone might have created a tool to help with that. Again, I usually "know" what attributes I want to look for when either manually searching through teams, or using the player search filters, or failing that, pen and paper again!

Good to see you made the leap from FM09 to FM11 though. Let us know how you get on with everything.

[merak43]

thank for the answer i will do let you guys know (i have a laserjet printer that just aking to print out alot of stuff

[heathxxx]

Save the ink... use a sheet of paper and a pen!

[Jenko_EFC]

I tend to use Notepad with every save. I type in their Name, Role(s) their good at and a little bit about their Attributes. Then I Ctrl + F to find a player's name and can easily see his Strengths and Roles he is useful in. Or I search for the Role I want and get the players who can fulfill it. No ink and paper wasted and not in my scruffy handwriting!

[SgtPepper]

Why did you choose for zonal marking? I have the feeling that my players don't have the attributes to really perform well in zonal marking. I have yet to experimend with zonal or man mark but somehow I have the feeling that man mark would be more suitable than zonal. Whats your take on it?

[Gazza56]

WooHoo..........just won the BSP by 10 pts with Woking!!!

My tranfer budget for the new season in League 2 is £35!!!!..........should get alot for that. I have managed to sign a few good 18-20 year olds, time for them to show what they can do i think lol.

First game of the new season was Gillingham at home, drew 1-1 and then the first round of the League Cup was Peterborough at home and won 2-1, drawn Stoke at home in the next round, keep you posted!

[heathxxx]

I've always preferred zonal marking over man-marking. I prefer to issue more specific man-marking instructions via the opposition instructions if need be. I think there's also a great quantity of variables to consider with man-marking, which it's fair to say, the dynamics of will change from match to match and for different opposing players. For example, it's no good having a sluggish player with poor anticipation and concentration, man-marking a lightning fast winger, with technical skills that'll keep the ball glued to his feet.

I also think that zonal marking, tends to offer a form of "approach" and "cover". That's to say, you'll have your first player approaching an opponent to make a challenge or jockey an opponent into a cul-de-sac, but as the opponent moves towards another zone, you'll often have some cover from the defensive player who's responsible for this next zone.

Combined with the way I set up my defence, plus either a DMC anchor man if in a suitable formation, or the MC defend I'm currently using in the 4-4-2, things are usually tight enough. In 31 league games so far, we've only conceded 17 goals.

I can attribute some of that to the fact I like my team to close down opponents more, with the "press more" option selected in team settings, plus I look at opponents that I can instruct to close down with the opposition instructions. If my team can win the ball more often higher up the pitch, or keep play in the opponents half, then that's always going to be less burden on my defence. I do like my teams to retain possession as much as possible, whilst if they lost the ball, they're looking to get it back and recycle play into the opponents half.

One thing I notice a great deal in these forums, is that a great many people don't seem to bother with using OI's. I think that's partly to do with people not being entirely sure, or understanding what different player attributes offer during matches. If they don't have a real grasp of how a player's attributes dovetail into different roles within a tactic, then they're certainly not going to see the benefits of using opposition instructions. There's also no magic formula to OI's, though there's often some common sense usage that you can take from one game to the next.

For example, the majority of times at this level, opponents are playing 4-4-2 of one variation or another. Probably more than 90% of the time, the left winger or wide midfielder is left footed, the right winger or wide midfielder is right footed. Therefore I usually instruct to "show onto weaker foot", or the opposite foot they're going to be strongest crossing, passing and shooting with. So, for a right footed right winger, I would show them onto their left foot, especially if their footedness tells me "Right Only".

Some people can feel more comfortable with their tactical settings, that they won't pay much attention to detail when it comes to team-talks, OI's or the media. I am too sometimes and don't always go to town with these three aspects of the game. However they can make a big difference, if you're a little observant. If you've a really good assistant manager though, you can also rely on their suggestions with more confidence.

I've loved the OI's since they were first introduced. I think they're a great way to make specific additional instructions when facing an opponent, that don't detract hugely from your overall tactics and strategy.

[heathxxx]

WooHoo..........just won the BSP by 10 pts with Woking!!!

My tranfer budget for the new season in League 2 is £35!!!!..........should get alot for that. I have managed to sign a few good 18-20 year olds, time for them to show what they can do i think lol.

First game of the new season was Gillingham at home, drew 1-1 and then the first round of the League Cup was Peterborough at home and won 2-1, drawn Stoke at home in the next round, keep you posted!

Don't spend that budget all at once now!!

I don't particularly worry about the transfer budget much at this level to be fair, unless I have some that I can convert into extra wages, via "edit budget". There's always a plethora of decent free agents around.

Can be frustrating though sometimes. If you have no wage budget, can't edit the wage budget to give you a little, then you spot a player you want to sign for a measly couple of grand, but you cant because you're unable to edit the budget and you can't squeeze it out of the directors!

[nmwaldron]

Heath, do you ever leave your OIs up to your assman?

[nmwaldron]

To add another question if I may; how to you make the leap when you get promoted? Obviously you may look for more quality players but do you tend to play more defensively (I know you dont like to do that) or do you make other changes? My Crewe side just got promoted to league 1 and we're struggling. I bought in a few players but to be honest it was hard to find anyone better than I already had ratings wise.

[phnompenhandy]

The problem with bringing in new players is that they need time to gel. You should resist that urge. I tend to plan for one season to get to know the players and get them to know each other, then the second season to push for promotion, and even then try to keep the core of the squad steady with maybe 4 changes to the regular first team max.

[heathxxx]

Heath, do you ever leave your OIs up to your assman?

Occasionally, but my current assistant doesn't have particularly high tactical knowledge attribute. It's only 10, which is enough to make a few reasonable suggestions, but not enough to cover things as fully as I might myself. That said though, I don't tend to apply OI's for every opposing player, as I feel that then begins to detract from my own teams freedom to play to its strengths. For example, if I decided to man mark every opponent, it would severely restrict my own players movement into space, particularly off the ball.

However, the higher the tactical knowledge attribute and to some extent, judging player ability, the more confident you can be in the OI recommendations they provide. When I'm playing as a big club, it's much easier to get someone with around 18+ in both. When I have someone like that when playing as a big club, I'm often quite happy to just "ask assistant" and then go with his recommendations, unless I want to pay particular attention to one or two players.

To add another question if I may; how to you make the leap when you get promoted? Obviously you may look for more quality players but do you tend to play more defensively (I know you dont like to do that) or do you make other changes? My Crewe side just got promoted to league 1 and we're struggling. I bought in a few players but to be honest it was hard to find anyone better than I already had ratings wise.

Well, as you've already guessed, my first principal is to improve the squad where I can. I'll review every position and role and see if I can improve, by bringing better players in.

You've also assumed correctly that I don't particularly favour a more defensive approach. I always feel that playing defensively, especially with a weaker team than an opponent, you're inviting teams to attack you more and find/exploit any of your defensive frailties more often.

So I'm a firm believer that the best form of defence is attack. I would rather have an opponent occupied with containing my team, than my team theirs. I like to pressure opponents with the team instruction "press more", along with use of OI's to close specific opposing players down, and/or the "press more" shout during matches. Obviously this isn't without it's own risks, so mostly I like forwards and advanced midfielders to do most closing down higher up the pitch, while more defensive players stray less from their zonal marking positions.

My starting strategies therefore is usually "control" or "attack", even against apparently stronger opponents, or those rated favourites to finish high in the league, or in the pre-match odds. This is where I differ quite a lot to some of the other known strategists on these forums, who may switch between multiple strategies, including more defensive options like counter attack, defend or contain.

I don't particularly pay a great deal of heed to club reputations or match odds to influence my own starting strategies. However, I am mindful that it's often the case that most opponents will be considered favourites against my team. I consider this to be beneficial to my more offensive preferences, because I know that most of the time, my opponents will fancy their chances and be more likely to play offensively themselves. This provides more space in matches, which a more offensive approach will look to exploit. It's arguably much easier to plan a way through a more open defence, than against defensive teams who "park the bus".

That's pretty much the logic behind why I still play attacking strategies against stronger teams

Ultimately, it depends on how confident you are in your squad. We're much better at choosing players to suit positions and roles than our AI counterparts though (hopefully we are anyway... ). Therefore even if I have players who might appear inferior on paper to an opponent, chances are, that I'll be using them more effectively, utilising their attributes better, than most AI opponents are ever likely to. Now that might not seem realistic in the context of real football particularly (though there's probably plenty of similar real life examples), but it's something that obviously I'm always mindful of in an "FM game" sense.

If I were to pick one player who's proven this to be the case, it would be Óscar Pérez in my Granada CF saves with FM10. He was pretty average in every respect with his attributes. He had one or two strongish attributes, but nothing exceptional. I placed him in a simple midfield role that made best use of his strongest attributes. On paper, this guy was never likely to be any more than a Liga adelante squad player at most. I took him through the Segunda B4 (Spanish third tier), Liga adelante (second tier) and La Liga (highest tier), to play at the highest levels, competing at the top of La Liga and continentally. He never dropped below a 7.8 average rating, right up until he eventually retired.

He did the basic and simple tasks of his role exceptionally, because he was never asked to do anything he wasn't capable of doing. As such, he over-performed and often performed better than supposedly superior quality players, as I really did look to dislodge him from the team often enough for players who looked better.

Essentially, if you can get better players, it can be a big help. But don't be frightened to simplify things to suit the strengths of players you do have, or can get, to maximise their performance levels. Look to have players with good determination in every position. Higher determination can often signify that they have good associated hidden attributes. This can often help with man-management and how they respond to praise or criticism. The easier it is to manage players mentally, the easier it is to manage them tactically.

I'm waffling now, but you probably get the idea

[heathxxx]

The problem with bringing in new players is that they need time to gel. You should resist that urge. I tend to plan for one season to get to know the players and get them to know each other, then the second season to push for promotion, and even then try to keep the core of the squad steady with maybe 4 changes to the regular first team max.

It's actually going to be very interesting to see how much of an impact the new match preparation, along with its visual "gelling" indicators, actually effects things with the game.

In previous releases, every summer has always been a transfer merry-go-round at my clubs. As my teams rise up the divisions, it's not been uncommon that I might only retain a couple of the first team players from the season before. Obviously the quality of the players, compared to those of their opponents makes a big difference, but I've never really suffered as much as I perhaps should have done, getting results from a squad that hasn't gelled properly together in the first half of a season. It's the overall quality of the players I try to bring in, that has often counter-balanced any gelling issues and also, ties in with what I've said before about my offensive confidence against higher reputation sides with more favourable match odds than my own team. If I "know" my players are better or more suited to my tactics, I consider any match odds or club/media reputations rendered irrelevant.

This is FM11 though and a newer view on things. I'm actually hoping that I am penalised for making wholesale squad changes, because I think it will actually reflect things more realistically in most respects. That said though, who can forget when Blackburn Rovers beat Man Utd to the Premiership title? That was, albeit rare, an example of a team that made big changes, with much better players that didn't have a great deal of time to gel, but went on to be successful.

On the other hand, you Manchester City over the last couple of years. Nuff said

Being more "sensible" though, sweeping changes to squads aren't generally recommended, but sometimes, it can work.

[wylergnu]

Im normally a lurker here but I just have to say "thanks" for such an informative thread. I did wonder why my assman never gives OI's. Now I do. Both his tactical knowledge and jugding player ability are below 5!

I agree with alot of your recent comments. IMO the best (and most fun) form of defense for weaker teams is attack. For the last few FM releases Ive done the same thing. Started as a League Two team, bought or loaned a few decent strikers and played 3 up front direct football for an easy promotion into League One.

I also agree with your gelling issues comments. Ive never really encountered it with previous versions of FM but it has hit me hard in my current game. After winning League Two easily in my Oxford Utd game I was frothing at the mouth to get my new squad on the field with 12 new first team players. The result was 4 points after 9 games and out of both the minor cups! This was not helped by pre-season money spinning games which killed the morale of the squad. Good to see some realism here. Plus being a Swindon supporter, watching Oxford lose gives me a laugh even when I manage them.

[nmwaldron]

I don't knoe. We're shipping goals like crazy. 3-5 a match. The most annoying ones are when the opp stroles into to my penalty area makes a simple pass and gives someone a tap in. I mean, what the F are my defenders doing? On the playback they seem to just stand back and watch. The trouble is, my CBs are probably the best rated ones in my league.

[phnompenhandy]

I don't knoe. We're shipping goals like crazy. 3-5 a match. The most annoying ones are when the opp stroles into to my penalty area makes a simple pass and gives someone a tap in. I mean, what the F are my defenders doing? On the playback they seem to just stand back and watch. The trouble is, my CBs are probably the best rated ones in my league.

That might well be a mental thing. When you say your CBs are the best , do you mean in terms of their tackling, marking, jumping, strength attributes? Pay close attention to their mental ones - remember that at this levels, many players are STUPID - they need telling to do the most basic things, e.g. tight mark, close down, move onto weaker foot.

Also, it might be a confidence thing. I'm getting great pleasure from observing the opposite sight. I see opposition players who are nervous, lacking confidence (according to the widget) and who lack bravery. I see my lads whom i told to 'get stuck in' going for 50-50 balls and winning them with crunching sliding tackles that are wonderfully animated in the 3D. So if your defenders are lacking confidence, aggression, bravery (all mental traits) they might hesitate to make that key tackle.

[nmwaldron]

I just saved my game ready for bed so I'm not sure of their eacact stats I have Calvin Davenport and a french player I was able to pick up from scouting france. I'll have to check on their menta; stats in the morning. Like I said, on my asm's team report they're marked as our two strongest players.

What kind of OIs would you give given a scout report on your upcoming opposition that says their defenders might be prone to fast attack etc.

With the singleing out, do you just target the play and tell all your players to hit them hard?

[nmwaldron]

Just took another look. For division 1 they seem to be where they need to be where attributes are concerned; both are very similair and have

Composure: 13

Concentration: 12

Decisions: 13

Determination: 11

Positioning: 11

Jumping: 15

Strength: 13

Those are devenport's stats I thought most relevant. He plays the "cover" Position. His counterpart; Gharzoul is almost the exact same. He does have a 9 in composure though.

[tigerhgrrrrrr]

Im sure you are right about experimenting with options. I hate change, in FM and life generally, so will usually in FM games stick with my current sytem & settings as long as possible (ie until they no longer work, and clearly AI's do work you out if you dont change, that is as it should be). The Tactic creator/wizard makes it so much easier to make easy changes that can make a big effect to your play. Which leads me on to my point, ww fans excellent T&TT submission for FM09 (from which I believe the Wizard was derived in part) gives relatively strict duty asignments & spreads, eg my 451 uses:

DC x 2 both Def

DL/DR both Auto (Support I imagine being the mid setting so I treat auto as support for this purpose of duty assessment)

DMC Def

MCd Sup

MCa Att

AML & AMR Att

SC Sup

So that is:

Def x3

Sup x 4

Att x 3

Or "Duty theory 343"

If I change my SC to Poacher but make no other change, that means Poacher must be Att duty I end up with "Duty theory 334". What difference does it make? (No Smiths pun intended). Am I too hooked up in that duty "thing"? I will experiment but I just wondered how much the "Duty Theory" should be followed slavishly.

I think my Post must have been invisible! LOL

Tried Ngo Baheng at Adv. For, seems to work a treat, such a difference from Poacher. Will test more in match.

[tigerhgrrrrrr]

It's actually going to be very interesting to see how much of an impact the new match preparation, along with its visual "gelling" indicators, actually effects things with the game.

In previous releases, every summer has always been a transfer merry-go-round at my clubs. As my teams rise up the divisions, it's not been uncommon that I might only retain a couple of the first team players from the season before. Obviously the quality of the players, compared to those of their opponents makes a big difference, but I've never really suffered as much as I perhaps should have done, getting results from a squad that hasn't gelled properly together in the first half of a season. It's the overall quality of the players I try to bring in, that has often counter-balanced any gelling issues and also, ties in with what I've said before about my offensive confidence against higher reputation sides with more favourable match odds than my own team. If I "know" my players are better or more suited to my tactics, I consider any match odds or club/media reputations rendered irrelevant.

This is FM11 though and a newer view on things. I'm actually hoping that I am penalised for making wholesale squad changes, because I think it will actually reflect things more realistically in most respects. That said though, who can forget when Blackburn Rovers beat Man Utd to the Premiership title? That was, albeit rare, an example of a team that made big changes, with much better players that didn't have a great deal of time to gel, but went on to be successful.

On the other hand, you Manchester City over the last couple of years. Nuff said

Being more "sensible" though, sweeping changes to squads aren't generally recommended, but sometimes, it can work.

Tut-Tut regarding the City dig! One could suggest that your adventures in LLM are just mental preparation for the reallity of where the Trafford Park Trading Estate Reds may end up if the Glazers persist as they have done! ;-), but I would not say that!.

I digress, I too often change around the whole team (prettty much) in close seasons. Every club I managed in CM0102 had a 20-40 bed Bosman Hotel errected in the Stadium vacinity - it was how I did things back then, but this time with 38 signings pre-seson in season 1 (a record even for me!), I am hoping to not have to bring in many more in close season (especially as I am heavilly in debt now!).

Could be interseting season 2 with a settled team, especially if L2 teams really are only a touch better than the BSP teams.

[heathxxx]

@tigerhgrrrrrr

I'm one of those United fans that's actually from Manchester. Born at Withington hospital, which I believe has been mostly turned into posh flats now Incidentally, on my dad's side of the family, half of them are City fans. Always good fun on derby days. Must say though, that having spent many years growing up in an area populated mostly by Liverpool and Everton fans, seeing both United and City at the top end of the table, with Liverpool and Everton... well... is quite satisfying

But I digress too...

The "duty thing" I wouldn't be too pre-occupied with. If what you're doing works effectively, then keep using it. When I used to play with the sliders, although I liked "rule of one" and "rule of two" setups, I would often use hybrid systems, or stray completely from some of the recommended setups. Simply a case of both preference and the players you have to work with really.

With regards to player gelling, it's really something I'll have to find out with FM11. Was never an issue I suffered from in previous versions. Although coaches and my assistant would say things like "player x isn't used to as much closing down" or "player x isn't used to playing at such a high tempo", it never really made a great deal of different to my results particularly.

Indeed, I actually hope that with the new match preparation interface, that under the hood, gelling is factored more strongly into the game. There's always exceptions to the rule, but it really should be more difficult to be immediately successful with so many player changes in a short space of time.

As a real life example, I'd point at the club I research, Granada CF in the Liga adelante in Spain. Although there's several players who participated in the promotion and overall Segunda B winning campaign the season before, the club made around fifteen new signings in the summer. Most of them came on loan contracts from Udinese in Italy (though in actuality it's a bit more complicated than that, but that's an entirely different matter...). They're currently hovering mid-table, but I still recon (without being biased), that they have a superb quality squad, capable of making the play-offs. The quality and style of football they're playing is already drawing many plaudits here and has already been branded "Fabri-Taka", being a hybrid reference to their manager Fabri and the "Tiki-Taka" style of play, usually associated with the Spanish national team, or FC Barcelona.

As such, I was in heated debates with the other Spanish researchers about the overall starting reputation for the club, as in their opinion, because the club hadn't been in the top-flight divisions for over twenty years, they should be considered one of the favourites for relegation. That's what's been implemented in the game (I lost the debate at the time...), but will be rectified come the final FM update patch early next year, now that I've been proven right.

The thing is, the club has made major changes to its playing staff. They have a squad of sufficient quality which in my opinion, easily makes them a promotion contender on paper. However in reality, the squad is still gelling very much, as their inconsistent performances highlight clearly. The unknown quantity at this stage, is how long it will take for them to gel fully. This is why they're currently 11th in the league, though they're only actually a few points outside the play-off zone. They are for me, a superb example of a club that's made many changes, which have still to bed down properly. At the very least, I expect them to be there or thereabouts this season if they can gel quickly enough. Sections of the media are already referring to them as a "Caballo Obscuro" (dark horse) for promotion. Otherwise, I think they'll very much be a team to keep an eye on next season.

So, I'm really hoping that the game is more intuitive when it comes to gelling now. Squads of many different personalities should take longer to gel and results should ultimately be affected as a result of that. Squads with players of more balanced or similar mentalities, arguably should gel more quickly. Squads which although might have undergone many changes, but overall have more determined individual players, should be able to overcome gelling issues to a certain extent, because of strong individual performances helping to drive the whole team forward.

These are all factors that should be part of the game, but have perhaps been too easy to overcome just by signing better players en-masse, in previous releases. Insofar as my own experiences with this thread and my AFC Telford side go, I guess we'll see, because certainly at the end of this season, I plan to make many changes and improvements to my squad. If I'm lucky enough with some of my acquisitions, I'm also leaning towards perhaps using the 4-2-3-1 wide or narrow system with the types of roles I've already expressed a preference for. They're something I use with great success in Spanish games, though it will be interesting to see how I would need to adapt them to suit pitch and weather conditions often encountered in the English lower leagues. I might actually be able to directly import the tactic I used so successfully with Granada in FM10, but if not, I can re-create it easily enough.

We shall see...

[nmwaldron]

Well heathxxx, I think I'm going to give your 4-2-3-1 a try. We're about mid-season, not doing to badly so now's as good a time to throw in a new tactic and mess things up totally, right??

Seriously, I think I have the players who can fit the roles pretty well so hopefully we'll see an improvement in how we play.

[Gazza56]

Don't spend that budget all at once now!!

I don't particularly worry about the transfer budget much at this level to be fair, unless I have some that I can convert into extra wages, via "edit budget". There's always a plethora of decent free agents around.

Can be frustrating though sometimes. If you have no wage budget, can't edit the wage budget to give you a little, then you spot a player you want to sign for a measly couple of grand, but you cant because you're unable to edit the budget and you can't squeeze it out of the directors!

I have never spent a penny on bringing players in, so the budget doesnt bother me, i just thought £35 was funny. I am £3000 over wages budget though, but i guess as long as i keep getting promotions i am safe for now lol.

Current League 2 season: played 23 games and 2nd in the league, through to the final of the JPT, knocked out in the 2nd round FA Cup, had a really bad December regarding results, but still staying in touch!

[heathxxx]

Well heathxxx, I think I'm going to give your 4-2-3-1 a try. We're about mid-season, not doing to badly so now's as good a time to throw in a new tactic and mess things up totally, right??

Seriously, I think I have the players who can fit the roles pretty well so hopefully we'll see an improvement in how we play.

Here's the base of the two 4-2-3-1 systems I have in mind then. One wide with wingers, one narrow with inside forwards. Both made with the Tactics Creator, so you should be able to continue using shouts, or adapt settings easily to suit your players if required.

As you'll see when you take a look at the roles and settings I've used, they're clearly both more suited to more technical players. With the right attributes, they'll both produce some superb quality football. The narrow variant is pretty much what I used in FM10 with great success in my Spanish saves.

Narrow Inside Forwards

Wingers Wide

I accept no responsibility however, if they fail miserably with lower level English team, especially on boggy pitches when it's lashing it down with rain.

Note that with either, using a single striker, you should go with whatever you prefer and suits the players available to you. In those two downloads, the striker is set to deep-lying forward. In FM10 I had a couple of the best forwards you could possibly ask for, so used complete forward. At lower levels, I suspect a target man might be a good choice.

[heathxxx]

I have never spent a penny on bringing players in, so the budget doesnt bother me, i just thought £35 was funny. I am £3000 over wages budget though, but i guess as long as i keep getting promotions i am safe for now lol.

Current League 2 season: played 23 games and 2nd in the league, through to the final of the JPT, knocked out in the 2nd round FA Cup, had a really bad December regarding results, but still staying in touch!

Sounds good so far then.

Keep an eye on the weather and pitch conditions over the winter though. If you're a passing side, it can wreak havoc on you your style of play, leading to the need to consider a more direct and longer approach. Also known as "bring in the howitzers".

[nmwaldron]

I accept no responsibility however, if they fail miserably with lower level English team, especially on boggy pitches when it's lashing it down with rain.

haha...I'll take a look. The one I set up is doing okay. I have both wingers set as inside forwards and the striker as and adv forward attacking. IF the damn tactics screen doesn't keep forgetting to save my damn changes, especially with the set piece creator.

If mine does especially well, I'll upload a version and you can take a look.

[nmwaldron]

Striker-wise, I actually got gifted with a really promising youth talent this year. He's only 16 but has crazy stats. He's already rated as my best striker, in the first team (for now, don't want to tire him too much) and Roy Hodgeson comes a couple of matches a month to 'monitor' him for Liverpool.

Worried about losing him to some low fee though. Liverpool's interest says 'tribunal' next to it and I've never seen that before. I set his asking price at 3 mill and signed him on a precontract as soon as I could.

[nmwaldron]

This is him

[heathxxx]

He's an excellent prospect for the lower leagues. Crewe are well known for producing talented young players over the years though, plus Liverpool have often bought players from them in the past.

At the very least, I hope you're able to keep hold of him for a while or get a decent fee should he inevitably move. I've not seen "tribunal" next to a player before either.

[nmwaldron]

Yeah, the tribunal thing just dissapeared but now tottingham and aresnal are interested in him aswell. Would you keep a hold of him or offer him out to get as much now as possible? I was thinking of asking 3 mill with incentives and see where they go from there. We're not doing too well overall financially and this would really turn things around there. I'm just afraid if I offer him and they counter really low I'll be forced to sell him because of his age or because my chairman jumps in licking his lips at 500k

[heathxxx]

Always a tricky one, though if I were fortunate enough to have either signed or produced a prospect like that, I would try to keep hold of them as long as possible. Irrespective of finances, unless forced to sell by the club.

[cragswfc]

Always a tricky one, though if I were fortunate enough to have either signed or produced a prospect like that, I would try to keep hold of them as long as possible. Irrespective of finances, unless forced to sell by the club.

i agree with that,but if you could could get what you want for him in a recitalist vale you could strengthen your team in some more postion's

[Jenko_EFC]

Damnit heath, you got me addicted to a Lower League save. I don't have much time to go through my players, tactics and the match yet but I played my first match. At first things were terrible but we pulled it back to 4-1! Don't have time to go through it but here's a PKM. I'd reccommend you give it a watch, it was a great match and I loved it because it was my tactical changes that made the difference in the end. Here it is: http://www.mediafire.com/?q76iqqa52ev86vq I think I've done the link right.

[heathxxx]

i agree with that,but if you could could get what you want for him in a recitalist vale you could strengthen your team in some more postion's

Well, there's that too. Sometimes though, it's better to have the player if they're happy enough to stay. If they start being unhappy though, then that's when I would look to move them on.

In a Granada CF save I played in FM10, I managed to find several great newgens/regens whilst in the Segunda B4. They soon drew a lot of attention, but I managed to coax them into staying, even when they wanted to move to a "bigger club". Indeed, I managed to keep them through from their late teens, right until they retired.

It will depend on their character, how they're treated and how their hidden "ambition" attribute fares against other hidden attributes like "professionalism" and "loyalty".

Damnit heath, you got me addicted to a Lower League save. I don't have much time to go through my players, tactics and the match yet but I played my first match. At first things were terrible but we pulled it back to 4-1! Don't have time to go through it but here's a PKM. I'd reccommend you give it a watch, it was a great match and I loved it because it was my tactical changes that made the difference in the end. Here it is: http://www.mediafire.com/?q76iqqa52ev86vq I think I've done the link right.

Ahh... another addict. Just wait until you start an FA Cup run, beating a big club with your minnows is FM crack at it's most potent

I've downloaded the PKM and will have a look at it.

Edit: Looked at it... particularly liked the "cross" by your full-back for the fourth goal

[Jenko_EFC]

Ahh... another addict. Just wait until you start an FA Cup run, beating a big club with your minnows is FM crack at it's most potent

I've downloaded the PKM and will have a look at it.

Edit: Looked at it... particularly liked the "cross" by your full-back for the fourth goal

I figured it would be your cup of tea, both teams kept possession well, we counter-attacked superbly. I think my forwards are really good; hard-working and a few decent finishes. One player I'm really not sure about is the Right-Winger Bullock (Not with an "O" a "U" ), one minute he plays brilliantly like the cross for our first goal and then at times he won't pass the ball and keeps dribbling with it until he loses it; I love hiim one minute then hate him the next!

The Fullback "Cross"! The Super Sub! Bacchus was brought on for a more defensive approach because the player he subbed was an 18 attacking wingback who was playing awful, kinda did the opposite didn't he?! Cracking "goal" though, one to show the grandkids!

[heathxxx]

I have a young full-back who's hard to work with. Defensively, he wins lots of tackles and is getting decent match ratings. The only problem though, is he's often caught out of position, or drifts towards the middle too much. Fortunately, on his side is a very good centre-back, who often gets across to cover in his absence, when he's gone "wandering".

Although he's done pretty well this season, he could be a liability against stronger opponents, so unfortunately he's already made my list of players to "replace" come the end of the season.

[tigerhgrrrrrr]

@tigerhgrrrrrr

I'm one of those United fans that's actually from Manchester. Born at Withington hospital, which I believe has been mostly turned into posh flats now Incidentally, on my dad's side of the family, half of them are City fans. Always good fun on derby days. Must say though, that having spent many years growing up in an area populated mostly by Liverpool and Everton fans, seeing both United and City at the top end of the table, with Liverpool and Everton... well... is quite satisfying

But I digress too...

The "duty thing" I wouldn't be too pre-occupied with. If what you're doing works effectively, then keep using it. When I used to play with the sliders, although I liked "rule of one" and "rule of two" setups, I would often use hybrid systems, or stray completely from some of the recommended setups. Simply a case of both preference and the players you have to work with really.

With regards to player gelling, it's really something I'll have to find out with FM11. Was never an issue I suffered from in previous versions. Although coaches and my assistant would say things like "player x isn't used to as much closing down" or "player x isn't used to playing at such a high tempo", it never really made a great deal of different to my results particularly.

Indeed, I actually hope that with the new match preparation interface, that under the hood, gelling is factored more strongly into the game. There's always exceptions to the rule, but it really should be more difficult to be immediately successful with so many player changes in a short space of time.

As a real life example, I'd point at the club I research, Granada CF in the Liga adelante in Spain. Although there's several players who participated in the promotion and overall Segunda B winning campaign the season before, the club made around fifteen new signings in the summer. Most of them came on loan contracts from Udinese in Italy (though in actuality it's a bit more complicated than that, but that's an entirely different matter...). They're currently hovering mid-table, but I still recon (without being biased), that they have a superb quality squad, capable of making the play-offs. The quality and style of football they're playing is already drawing many plaudits here and has already been branded "Fabri-Taka", being a hybrid reference to their manager Fabri and the "Tiki-Taka" style of play, usually associated with the Spanish national team, or FC Barcelona.

As such, I was in heated debates with the other Spanish researchers about the overall starting reputation for the club, as in their opinion, because the club hadn't been in the top-flight divisions for over twenty years, they should be considered one of the favourites for relegation. That's what's been implemented in the game (I lost the debate at the time...), but will be rectified come the final FM update patch early next year, now that I've been proven right.

The thing is, the club has made major changes to its playing staff. They have a squad of sufficient quality which in my opinion, easily makes them a promotion contender on paper. However in reality, the squad is still gelling very much, as their inconsistent performances highlight clearly. The unknown quantity at this stage, is how long it will take for them to gel fully. This is why they're currently 11th in the league, though they're only actually a few points outside the play-off zone. They are for me, a superb example of a club that's made many changes, which have still to bed down properly. At the very least, I expect them to be there or thereabouts this season if they can gel quickly enough. Sections of the media are already referring to them as a "Caballo Obscuro" (dark horse) for promotion. Otherwise, I think they'll very much be a team to keep an eye on next season.

So, I'm really hoping that the game is more intuitive when it comes to gelling now. Squads of many different personalities should take longer to gel and results should ultimately be affected as a result of that. Squads with players of more balanced or similar mentalities, arguably should gel more quickly. Squads which although might have undergone many changes, but overall have more determined individual players, should be able to overcome gelling issues to a certain extent, because of strong individual performances helping to drive the whole team forward.

These are all factors that should be part of the game, but have perhaps been too easy to overcome just by signing better players en-masse, in previous releases. Insofar as my own experiences with this thread and my AFC Telford side go, I guess we'll see, because certainly at the end of this season, I plan to make many changes and improvements to my squad. If I'm lucky enough with some of my acquisitions, I'm also leaning towards perhaps using the 4-2-3-1 wide or narrow system with the types of roles I've already expressed a preference for. They're something I use with great success in Spanish games, though it will be interesting to see how I would need to adapt them to suit pitch and weather conditions often encountered in the English lower leagues. I might actually be able to directly import the tactic I used so successfully with Granada in FM10, but if not, I can re-create it easily enough.

We shall see...

I like that in this forum it is not about City v Utd, Arsenal v Spurs or Celtic v Rangers – it’s all about YOU v the AI ! :-)

I always hated the sliders. FM05 I used a basic un-tweaked 442, FM06 I used wwfans RO2 slavishlyin a 442 – that was as fun as it got. After that and until the wizard/tactic creator introduction I was turned cold by the slider tweaking required. I used to just buy the best players I could, then bob up and down mid table until I got bored and started a new save game. FM09 was good though, but mainly as I got hooked with a St Etienne save for nostalgic reasons . Sliders still annoyed me a lot then. Post creator though, well...It’s more like real football nowadays!.

Gelling should be an issue, I agree. Not sure the City example was a good one, their problems are more to do with other factors I suspect (!), but I’ll drop that avenue for now. It’s true though, and especially at lower levels, some managers bring a lot of trusted new faces in with them and this where gelling really should be a factor.

In part due to this FM11 thread of yours I am being turned on to OI’s. I used to hit the “Ass Man recommends” button but he’s poor at AFC Wimbledon, and there are very few matches where I am actually allowed to do this !!! (presumably due to his lack of ability?), although in FM10 the Blyth Ass Man was competent on OI recommendations after Xmas in season 1, any thoughts on this?. Anyway, now I use the 1 or 2 recommendations from the pre match scouting team’s report, BUT I am now thinking of major match by match assessment of opponents individual strengths & weaknesses and using OI’s to suit.

My 451 Mourinho tactic is built around default settings on the creator for everything. I should like to up the pressing as standard to “more, all over” but as the Technically “best” team in every match that feels counterproductive (good teams press, poor teams drop off & playsurely – or perhaps not?). Of the few goals that I do concede they seem to originate from non-pressed players waltzing a little too far into my half unopposed. Another issue, why not “show to weaker foot” any player with a “x” foot only preference? I know you may want to show someone inside or outside specifically tactically, but the weaker foot option seems a no brainer, for everyone – is that fair?

If you could Heath, would be interesting to see a single match assessment of your opposition showing all opposition players full attributes and your recommendations for all OI's to suit. Would be a bit of a task but it would help with the understanding a bit. I suspect that the obvious will not be so when experience is applied! I am going to try my FA Trophy tie using the obvious OI's for all players concerned. It could be overkill, it could lead to imbalance of my well crafted (!) tactics but I am keen to see if I can demolish an unfavoured opposition by tactical "bullying" - and to what degree (8-0, perhaps!)

[heathxxx]

@tigerhgrrrrrr

I didn't mind the sliders and could do pretty much what I wanted with them, once I got to know what I was doing and as always, taking advantage of the right player attributes. Of any implementation that's entered the FM series though, I have to say that the Tactics Creator has been amongst the best of them. The ease of creating a tactic from scratch, both visually and descriptively, really consigns the sliders to a thing of the past for me. I haven't touched them since FM09, though I have on occasion used some of the check boxes for one or two specific tasks.

OI's I've been a fan of since they were implemented. I just find them to be a really good tactical aid. Combined with the way you're able to pinpoint potential "weak links" via the media now, these two aspects can make a real difference during matches. However, there's still always the chance they might not work, especially pinpointing weak link opposing players. I think it's arguably easier to look at opponents in the lower leagues and the weaker attributes are glaringly obvious. At the highest level though, where most half-decent players might have 12-14 for composure, bravery or determination, it might not be as effective. You likely have to look at other combinations of attributes or the overall attributes of the player more. Perhaps even look at if a potential "weak link" is unhappy, low morale, prone to collecting bookings, or even seemingly negative character traits. Of course, it all depends how deeply you want to delve.

As for doing a run-down of a match to show what I would use for OI's and why, it certainly would be a task to produce something like that, as you say. Suffice it to say it really is a case of common sense when looking at what OI's to use with opposing players, at least I believe it is anyway...

"Weaker Foot" or showing a player onto their left foot if predominantly right footed or vice-versa is for the most part, a no brainer to decide upon. Or so it would seem... because you might need to consider the opponents position or apparent role, especially with more central players, but also with wide players. Unless you particularly know what roles an opponent is using at positions within a tactic (which you don't see), you're not going to know from the off, if an AML or AMR, or even an AMC in a narrow system, is a winger, inside-forward, playmaker or a simple attacking midfielder. Sometimes, if you've got top quality staff advice hinting at such roles, you already know how an opponent plays, or you happen to notice a team with wide men playing on opposite sides to their footedness, you might not always know for sure.

So even for what might seem like the most simple OI, can be more complicated than initially expected. Granted though, with experience, you'll often be able to judge certain opponents and certain formations, regarding opponent role usage.

"Tackling" has quite a few things to consider. Even if you spot a player with low bravery and generally poor strength or other physical attributes, it doesn't mean it's a foregone conclusion that you should instantly use hard tackling on a player. Consider which of your players are likely to be tackling said individual most often. If they're no better for bravery or physical attributes, then they' could nullify one another in strength of tackling, your player could run the risk of injury himself, or even pick up needless bookings if he's not the best tackler and can't time his tackles well enough, or has a mixture of high aggression but low composure. Again, not as straightforward as some might assume.

"Closing Down" is a little easier I would say. Firstly and perhaps most importantly if using this OI, is weighing up if you want one or more of your own players to be preoccupied closing an opponent down, or looking for space, should you regain possession of the ball. Alternatively, if playing an intensive pressing game, you may want to close down most or all of your opponents and really restrict the space and time they have to play with. As a rough guideling, I use closing down OI's on players I want to particularly force into errors. These opponents will usually have poor composure primarily, but also I'll look to see if their other mental attributes are poor overall. Pace and acceleration is something I may consider too, as it's no good having a slow player trying to chase down someone with a lot of pace particularly, as they may just keep your man running after shadows all day.

"Tight Marking" is something I mainly tend to use with opposing forwards. Although again, it can depend on their attributes compared to those of my own players who are likely to mark them. It may also depend on the depth of my defensive line. It's perhaps one of the harder settings to judge, especially perhaps with opposing forwards I think. I still struggle sometimes to decide if I want to tight mark a particular forward or not, especially given I use zonal marking in my overall tactical strategy.

Something that I have used a few times, which I think other people have gone into a little more detail about in different threads before, is having a striker set to tight marking an opposing defender. Not a bad idea if you want your forward on the shoulder of an opponent, but can restrict their overall movement and space they have to receive the ball. I've only used this at times with a target man set to tight mark a weaker central defender, that their likely to win aerial encounters against. The aim being that they'll win most aerial challenges anyway, so I'm having my physical forward pressurise a defender, combined with closing down "often", so he's a constant thorn in their side and maybe opens up options for a second striker or attacking midfield player.

So they're a few of my thoughts about opposition instructions and a few things I would take into consideration. Other than that, it really is something that's done on a match by match basis and/or in conjunction with my tactics, along with any influence I've had over the morale of opposing players in the media.

Just to throw a spanner in all of this though, there are odd occasions where I look at everything and then don't use any OI's whatsoever.

[phnompenhandy]

Sometimes using one striker to tight mark a Dc is a worthwhile 'sacrifice' of a player. For me there are two reasons to do this. One is, as you say, having a nippy striker tight mark a slow defender. Here, he's not sacrificed at all since with a good through ball he'll either burst past the defender and be in on goal or, as happened to me the other day, the defender will grab his shirt, deny a goal scoring opportunity and get his marching orders (so satisfying!). the other reason might seem less obvious. If the oppo has one very good DC and one mediocre/poor one, tight-marking the good one (maybe with your poorer forward who can be 'sacrificed') takes that Dc out of the game. Passes will go to the rubbish one who can be pressurised into making mistakes (close down, hard tackle) which your other striker can take advantage of.

About the weaker foot option. At higher levels many players are 'handy' with both feet, you have wingers who can switch sides, cut inside etc and it all gets a bit tricky. But at lower league level? Not really. It's my assumption that 99% of the time selecting weaker foot will be advantageous, so I laboriously click on the weaker foot for every player (subs inc) - wish there was a save or one-click function to do this.

And here's a question - do you think there is ever any difference at all between clicking 'weaker foot' and specifying, e.g. is he is mainly right-footed, is there ever any difference between selecting 'left foot' and 'weaker foot'?

[tigerhgrrrrrr]

@tigerhgrrrrrr

I didn't mind the sliders and could do pretty much what I wanted with them, once I got to know what I was doing and as always, taking advantage of the right player attributes. Of any implementation that's entered the FM series though, I have to say that the Tactics Creator has been amongst the best of them. The ease of creating a tactic from scratch, both visually and descriptively, really consigns the sliders to a thing of the past for me. I haven't touched them since FM09, though I have on occasion used some of the check boxes for one or two specific tasks.

OI's I've been a fan of since they were implemented. I just find them to be a really good tactical aid. Combined with the way you're able to pinpoint potential "weak links" via the media now, these two aspects can make a real difference during matches. However, there's still always the chance they might not work, especially pinpointing weak link opposing players. I think it's arguably easier to look at opponents in the lower leagues and the weaker attributes are glaringly obvious. At the highest level though, where most half-decent players might have 12-14 for composure, bravery or determination, it might not be as effective. You likely have to look at other combinations of attributes or the overall attributes of the player more. Perhaps even look at if a potential "weak link" is unhappy, low morale, prone to collecting bookings, or even seemingly negative character traits. Of course, it all depends how deeply you want to delve.

As for doing a run-down of a match to show what I would use for OI's and why, it certainly would be a task to produce something like that, as you say. Suffice it to say it really is a case of common sense when looking at what OI's to use with opposing players, at least I believe it is anyway...

"Weaker Foot" or showing a player onto their left foot if predominantly right footed or vice-versa is for the most part, a no brainer to decide upon. Or so it would seem... because you might need to consider the opponents position or apparent role, especially with more central players, but also with wide players. Unless you particularly know what roles an opponent is using at positions within a tactic (which you don't see), you're not going to know from the off, if an AML or AMR, or even an AMC in a narrow system, is a winger, inside-forward, playmaker or a simple attacking midfielder. Sometimes, if you've got top quality staff advice hinting at such roles, you already know how an opponent plays, or you happen to notice a team with wide men playing on opposite sides to their footedness, you might not always know for sure.

So even for what might seem like the most simple OI, can be more complicated than initially expected. Granted though, with experience, you'll often be able to judge certain opponents and certain formations, regarding opponent role usage.

"Tackling" has quite a few things to consider. Even if you spot a player with low bravery and generally poor strength or other physical attributes, it doesn't mean it's a foregone conclusion that you should instantly use hard tackling on a player. Consider which of your players are likely to be tackling said individual most often. If they're no better for bravery or physical attributes, then they' could nullify one another in strength of tackling, your player could run the risk of injury himself, or even pick up needless bookings if he's not the best tackler and can't time his tackles well enough, or has a mixture of high aggression but low composure. Again, not as straightforward as some might assume.

"Closing Down" is a little easier I would say. Firstly and perhaps most importantly if using this OI, is weighing up if you want one or more of your own players to be preoccupied closing an opponent down, or looking for space, should you regain possession of the ball. Alternatively, if playing an intensive pressing game, you may want to close down most or all of your opponents and really restrict the space and time they have to play with. As a rough guideling, I use closing down OI's on players I want to particularly force into errors. These opponents will usually have poor composure primarily, but also I'll look to see if their other mental attributes are poor overall. Pace and acceleration is something I may consider too, as it's no good having a slow player trying to chase down someone with a lot of pace particularly, as they may just keep your man running after shadows all day.

"Tight Marking" is something I mainly tend to use with opposing forwards. Although again, it can depend on their attributes compared to those of my own players who are likely to mark them. It may also depend on the depth of my defensive line. It's perhaps one of the harder settings to judge, especially perhaps with opposing forwards I think. I still struggle sometimes to decide if I want to tight mark a particular forward or not, especially given I use zonal marking in my overall tactical strategy.

Something that I have used a few times, which I think other people have gone into a little more detail about in different threads before, is having a striker set to tight marking an opposing defender. Not a bad idea if you want your forward on the shoulder of an opponent, but can restrict their overall movement and space they have to receive the ball. I've only used this at times with a target man set to tight mark a weaker central defender, that their likely to win aerial encounters against. The aim being that they'll win most aerial challenges anyway, so I'm having my physical forward pressurise a defender, combined with closing down "often", so he's a constant thorn in their side and maybe opens up options for a second striker or attacking midfield player.

So they're a few of my thoughts about opposition instructions and a few things I would take into consideration. Other than that, it really is something that's done on a match by match basis and/or in conjunction with my tactics, along with any influence I've had over the morale of opposing players in the media.

Just to throw a spanner in all of this though, there are odd occasions where I look at everything and then don't use any OI's whatsoever.

Excellent stuff Heath, as is Phnompenhady's point about taking out the "good" DC, didnt play a match last night (feet up in front of Ice Road Truckers on TV - its been a tough week or two!), but next match FAT away BS regional (Sth?) Thurrock. Have set up my team tactics using fast SC, they are slow at the back, and have assessed their squad for OI's. I have a plan which groups the oppo players for OI's as follows:

Neutral: No OI's - where no obvious OI suits and players are just OK but no morale issues (mainly suits those not covered by the 2 groups below)

Soft Targets: Any player with obviously expolitable weaknesses (as a guide only: Low Bravery = hard tackling, Low Composure = Close Down always, Foot preference "only" = weaker foot. NB. "Low" stats = 7/20 or less for that stat at BSP level). Any player with low morale/form issues.

Hard Targets: Any player not considered "Soft" but needing looking after! (any season average rating or last 5 game rating of 7.0 + or high morale, or any other indication that they are key to their team)

Am not too concerned about tackling aggression levels, I always use the shout "stay on feet" as my team is always the "best" except in FAC ties against higher level teams (may need to review this after promotion!), and there were a few too many sending offs early season when using no shout and normal tackling throughout (maybe a bug but it makes sense for my Gallacticos (Ahem!) to hold back on the GBH !).

Its a starting point anyway!

[phnompenhandy]

That's it tigerrrr. I 'd also advice to keep the opposition's motivation widget open during the match (I wonder how many people do that?). As soon as one of the players gets a red comment, 'shout' by aiming an OI at him.