Few questions about tutoring

Well I have no idea how tutoring works; and having recently read that it is important for developing good youngsters I have a few questions

1. Do the hidden attributes of the player being tutored rise so as to mimic the hidden attributes of the tutor; or they just randomly increase?

2. When either of the players get injured; does tutoring continue? If it doesn't, does it resume automatically when the player comes back from injury?

3. Personalities must be similar. Does that mean that a temperamental youngster can't be tutored since most of the leading players don't have temperamental personalities?

4. I usually just only take the tutoring suggestions given in the backroom advice screen. Is it enough or do all youngsters have to be tutored?

5. Except Determination; do any of the other visual attributes change on tutoring?

1. They increase, not sure if random is the correct term, but not really to the full extent of the tutoring player. You'll often need to tutor players several times to get them to where you want to be.

4. Be more careful. Depending on the qualities of your staff, these recommendations can be way out.

3. Personalities aren't important, it's totally random.

5. No visual attributes change, the tutoring is used to learn new moves for your player (more the tutor have preferred moves, more the tutoring will be successful). I remember I had a regen who learn from Trezeguet, Fred and another and finally had 15 favorites moves thanks tutoring

Well I have no idea how tutoring works; and having recently read that it is important for developing good youngsters I have a few questions

1. Do the hidden attributes of the player being tutored rise so as to mimic the hidden attributes of the tutor; or they just randomly increase?

The hidden attributes move towards those of the tutor so they could rise or fall depending on what the tutor's hidden attributes are.

2. When either of the players get injured; does tutoring continue? If it doesn't, does it resume automatically when the player comes back from injury?

I presume they continue as normal, I haven't seen anything to suggest otherwise but I can't say for sure.

3. Personalities must be similar. Does that mean that a temperamental youngster can't be tutored since most of the leading players don't have temperamental personalities?

No, personalities don't have to be similar. One of the main reasons to tutor a youngster is to improve their personality.

4. I usually just only take the tutoring suggestions given in the backroom advice screen. Is it enough or do all youngsters have to be tutored?

The advice given isn't always right, you need to look at the players involved and make your own decision. I tend to look at my squad twice a season (July & December) and set up any tutoring I want.

5. Except Determination; do any of the other visual attributes change on tutoring?

I heard it helped to improve mental attributes quicker but I don't think this has ever been confimed.

Regarding injuries. I've seen tutoring stopped due to longer term injuries - can't remember if it mattered which of the two players it was though.

I've always been a bit oblivious to the benefits of tutoring, and this seems to explain why.

How (other than by cheating) can we identify the hidden attributes in order to set up tutoring? Then how do we monitor/judge the effects of the tutoring afterwards?

I've always been a bit oblivious to the benefits of tutoring, and this seems to explain why.

How (other than by cheating) can we identify the hidden attributes in order to set up tutoring? Then how do we monitor/judge the effects of the tutoring afterwards?

Well its certainly not obvious and you need to put some effort in which doesn't suit everyone.

StormenDK updated Lyssien's original personality guide for FM10 and also included the new media handling types: thread

Now this this alone won't tell you everything but it guides you in the right direction eg Spirited tells you he has >14 Pressure, 11-17 Professionalism & >9 Temperament, All in all a fairly good personality to have. On top of this you can view his determination on his profile and then say he had a media handling or "Reserved". It doesn't tell you anything you didn't already know about professionalism or temperament but you now know he has controversy <5 as well.

Looking at the coach reports strengths, weaknesses and if he fits in or not with your squad personality gives you further information.

Ok you don't know everything but you have a good idea of what he is like and whether he is a good, bad or somewhere in the middle.

Thanks for the link, but it really does look like a feature that is suited to the people who use external scouting tools.

Personally I prefer to play without any tools like that, or any tips of that nature. I guess tutoring will always be a bit hit and miss for people like me.

Thanks for the link, but it really does look like a feature that is suited to the people who use external scouting tools.

Personally I prefer to play without any tools like that, or any tips of that nature. I guess tutoring will always be a bit hit and miss for people like me.

I think its unfair to lump it in with scouting tools.

I would be one of the first to speak out against their use and have never used one in my saves. In fact I also disagree with the use of the player/staff search which I think you could say it was much closer to.

Once you've played for a while you forget about the numbers underneath the titles and you get an understanding of what are good/bad/neutral personalities. All the thread does is put some numbers in which is what attributes are at the end of the day (Should we have numbers for them?). Some descriptions are more ambiguous than others and looking at the thread would help you understand them. Professional, Determined, Unambitious are all straight forward but what about Iron Willed, Light Hearted or Driven. Most people have an idea what a driven person is but how does that work in the game? Storman's guide just clarifies it.

Its really just about getting to know your players, you can also see it on the pitch if you watch matches. Which players raise their game? Which fold under pressure?

For instance I have a striker currently who scores 10-15 goals a season but he is a confidence player that lacks consistency. He'll easily score a hattrick one match then go a month without scoring. All his goals come in patches and he struggles when not on form.

EDIT

Not really putting that very clear

I'll try again - Scouting tools give you access to information you aren't supposed to have.

Whereas the game is giving you all this information (Profiles, scout/coach reports, watching games etc) its just Storman's guide helps you to translate it into something you understand.

I've always been a bit oblivious to the benefits of tutoring, and this seems to explain why.

How (other than by cheating) can we identify the hidden attributes in order to set up tutoring? Then how do we monitor/judge the effects of the tutoring afterwards?

I'm still on FM10 so check the appropriate areas in FM11 for the following; Look at the players Personality and Media Handling. Look at coach reports for personality how they compare it to that of you squad e.g. Professional squad, Coach report 'player is Ambitious, you have a Professional squad and he fits in well'. Is he happy with his training schedule.

You can see if tutoring is working, Determination will move towards the tutors, PPMs will be transferred, personality will change due to hidden attributes moving towards the tutor (e.g. started 'Fairly Professional' becoming 'Spirited'), Media Handling can become less extreme or calmer, he is suddenly happy with his training schedule.

The tutee tells you how successful it was for him on completion (what does he know!) and any success in tutoring will provide a boost to their friendship, which is good for the team.

I may be forgetting something important but there are plenty of pointers in the game.

I'll try again - Scouting tools give you access to information you aren't supposed to have.

Whereas the game is giving you all this information (Profiles, scout/coach reports, watching games etc) its just Storman's guide helps you to translate it into something you understand.

That really gets to the point I wanted to make, I think it is my personal choice of how I play the game that is making it difficult.

I prefer to play the game without reading any guides at all, I prefer to work things out for myself. Tutoring seems to be quite a tough one to work out, especially in terms of the hidden attributes and the personalities.

I'm still on FM10 so check the appropriate areas in FM11 for the following; Look at the players Personality and Media Handling. Look at coach reports for personality how they compare it to that of you squad e.g. Professional squad, Coach report 'player is Ambitious, you have a Professional squad and he fits in well'. Is he happy with his training schedule.

You can see if tutoring is working, Determination will move towards the tutors, PPMs will be transferred, personality will change due to hidden attributes moving towards the tutor (e.g. started 'Fairly Professional' becoming 'Spirited'), Media Handling can become less extreme or calmer, he is suddenly happy with his training schedule.

The tutee tells you how successful it was for him on completion (what does he know!) and any success in tutoring will provide a boost to their friendship, which is good for the team.

I may be forgetting something important but there are plenty of pointers in the game.

The PPMs is an obvious one to see the benefits of as they either gain them or they don't, I think it is the personalities that I find difficult to understand (without reading up on them).

If I have an older player who is 'professional', and a younger player with the same personality, how do I know which player is 'more professional'? How am I suppose to work out how the personalities compare against each other and which ones will compliment each other? Is it just a case of matching up similar personalities and assuming the older player will be 'better'?

That really gets to the point I wanted to make, I think it is my personal choice of how I play the game that is making it difficult.

I prefer to play the game without reading any guides at all, I prefer to work things out for myself. Tutoring seems to be quite a tough one to work out, especially in terms of the hidden attributes and the personalities.

You don't need guides to see that players with certain attributes and personalities excel in certain areas of the game (e.g. Professionals tend to have longer careers), use these types as tutors.

If I have an older player who is 'professional', and a younger player with the same personality, how do I know which player is 'more professional'? How am I suppose to work out how the personalities compare against each other and which ones will compliment each other? Is it just a case of matching up similar personalities and assuming the older player will be 'better'?

Not at all but you need to think why you want to tutor them.

For instance in your example you know both players are professional which is good and I wouldn't be trying to work out what the actual figures were. It might be that the younger player has lower determination or that you know/suspect that the older player has high levels of temperament/pressure. In which case you are trying to improve these other attributes without harming the professionalism of the younger guy. Or even you just want the younger player to learn a particular PPM without harming his personality.

The other way to view it is you can try to alter the personality tag so tutoring a "fairly professional" youngster to improve him to "professional"

You don't need guides to see that players with certain attributes and personalities excel in certain areas of the game (e.g. Professionals tend to have longer careers), use these types as tutors.

So is it just a case of matching 'good' sounding personalities of older players with 'bad' sounding ones of younger players?

How do I work out whether something like 'resolute' is 'better' than 'driven'?

Not at all but you need to think why you want to tutor them.

For instance in your example you know both players are professional which is good and I wouldn't be trying to work out what the actual figures were. It might be that the younger player has lower determination or that you know/suspect that the older player has high levels of temperament/pressure. In which case you are trying to improve these other attributes without harming the professionalism of the younger guy. Or even you just want the younger player to learn a particular PPM without harming his personality.

The other way to view it is you can try to alter the personality tag so tutoring a "fairly professional" youngster to improve him to "professional"

I guess I'm just hearing on this forum about how many people are making great use of tutoring and I'm wondering what I'm missing out on.

That last example is exactly the sort of thing I have been doing, and the PPMs. I think I'm just a bit wary after the number of clashes between players I caused on older versions

So is it just a case of matching 'good' sounding personalities of older players with 'bad' sounding ones of younger players?

How do I work out whether something like 'resolute' is 'better' than 'driven'?

You look at Storman's guide

For the record both are good:

Driven is Determination = 20 & Ambition >9

Resolute is Determination 15-17 & Professionalism 15-17

Driven can have weaknesses depending on temperament/pressure but Resolute is a solid one to tutor with.

That sort of information is pretty hard to find in the game though. The coach reports give hints, but they are very short and vague.

I guess tutoring would be a lot easier if the hidden attributes were not hidden, but that's an entirely new debate!

The PPMs is an obvious one to see the benefits of as they either gain them or they don't, I think it is the personalities that I find difficult to understand (without reading up on them).

If I have an older player who is 'professional', and a younger player with the same personality, how do I know which player is 'more professional'? How am I suppose to work out how the personalities compare against each other and which ones will compliment each other? Is it just a case of matching up similar personalities and assuming the older player will be 'better'?

Sorry, we're out of sync here. Re 'more professional' - Determination can be an indicator, I have noticed that a player's description swaps between 'Professional' and 'Determined' when determination moves beyond 17, when determination reaches 20 the description becomes 'Very Determined' (IIRC) but can become 'Model Professional', this suggests to me that Professionalism takes preference over Determination and leads me to the conclusion that a player with 18 Determination has 18 or 19 for Professionalism if described as a 'Professional'.

The reason I can gauge this is I assumed that 'Model Professional' is the best it can get and so used one with 20 Determination as a tutor and observed the effects on the youngster it went like this: >Determination=18, Personality=Determined< >Determination=18,Personality=Professional< >Determination=19, Personality=Determined< >Determination=19, Personality=Professional< >Determination=20, Personality=Very Determined< >Determination=20, Personality=Model Professional'.

(OK, that last bit was like doing a press conference, it is a pretty long winded explanation and hope you managed to stay awake.)

Now that's just one small area of one aspect, and I had to make two assumptions, but i believe it is possible to work out some of this stuff from what is visible in the game.

It isn't a case of matching personalities, the main point of tutoring is to improve younger players personality, attitude and approach. If both your professional players have determination less than 18 the above scenario isn't of much use, so you have to decide using other criteria, such as the difference in their Determination attribute, their style of Media Handling, how they cope with training, outbursts to the press, getting upset by certain things done or said, there's lots of it, and there could possibly be more indicators in FM11. The younger player might well be better in these areas than the older player, if that was the case then I wouldn't tutor him.

Apologies for the time taken to reply, but I am the slowest typer on the planet.

Cheers

xxx

Cheers for the reply.

I've had a closer look and there's a few obvious things I can go on to set up tutors that seem to make sense. I suppose I need to accept that without reading some of the 'behind the scenes' stuff I'm never going to get it perfect, but I guess that is how it is intended.

Cheers for the reply.

I've had a closer look and there's a few obvious things I can go on to set up tutors that seem to make sense. I suppose I need to accept that without reading some of the 'behind the scenes' stuff I'm never going to get it perfect, but I guess that is how it is intended.

I would say it is almost impossible to avoid getting to know some of what's behind the scenes if you come on here. Take my post #19, *how could you tell if I had done this using an editor? Some new players coming here for advice and to learn, find great stuff, but in time may feel a bit deflated when they find that what they had read on here was as a result of using an editor. Maybe more official info would help!

Developing young players is just about my favourite part of the game and I regard tutoring an essential part of that. So good luck with expanding it, in the meantime I will go and pray that SI reinstall FM10's tutoring system.

*It wasn't by the way, I was careful with the example I used, having respect for the way you play your game.

I would say it is almost impossible to avoid getting to know some of what's behind the scenes if you come on here.

Oh, definitely. I'm not that strict on avoiding tips completely, I just don't like having to read guides written by other people just to be able to understand things.

Oh, definitely. I'm not that strict on avoiding tips completely, I just don't like having to read guides written by other people just to be able to understand things.

Agreed, but with the lack official documentation and feedback, that's all there is outside of what we can work out from playing, but there too few certainties in the game on which to hang your hat and countless variables.

Thanks for the answers

One tip re: differing personalities is to use a less than ideal tutor as a 'bridge'. For example, my Unsporting 17 year-old Argentinian striker who would be a star if he sorted his attitude out might balk at being paired up with a greybeard, highly determined Model Professional, but would happily go along with a mid-career, moderately determined Realist. Once the latter tutoring is done, his personality has improved in enough ways that he will then be ready to listen to the veteran.

For dafuge, who doesn't want to know what the different Personality types and Media Handling styles 'mean': the best thing you can do is use your judgement as to what sorts of personalities you want to have based solely on the text. Your instincts should tell you that 'Resolute' is better than 'Fairly Ambitious', for instance, or that things like 'Volatile' or 'Temperamental' might be warning signs. And you can see Determination, which is probably the single most important thing to consider when choosing your tutoring relationships.

People always complain about the lack of documentation, but I am pretty sure one of SI's core design principles is to have the game be cloudy and opaque enough that the best decision or ideal strategy isn't always obvious. Tutoring is particularly hard to gauge, but there is still enough information for you to make smart gut decisions about who should learn from whom.

One tip re: differing personalities is to use a less than ideal tutor as a 'bridge'. For example, my Unsporting 17 year-old Argentinian striker who would be a star if he sorted his attitude out might balk at being paired up with a greybeard, highly determined Model Professional, but would happily go along with a mid-career, moderately determined Realist. Once the latter tutoring is done, his personality has improved in enough ways that he will then be ready to listen to the veteran.

For dafuge, who doesn't want to know what the different Personality types and Media Handling styles 'mean': the best thing you can do is use your judgement as to what sorts of personalities you want to have based solely on the text. Your instincts should tell you that 'Resolute' is better than 'Fairly Ambitious', for instance, or that things like 'Volatile' or 'Temperamental' might be warning signs. And you can see Determination, which is probably the single most important thing to consider when choosing your tutoring relationships.

People always complain about the lack of documentation, but I am pretty sure one of SI's core design principles is to have the game be cloudy and opaque enough that the best decision or ideal strategy isn't always obvious. Tutoring is particularly hard to gauge, but there is still enough information for you to make smart gut decisions about who should learn from whom.

It is something you can do, far better is to monitor the progress of each tutee and take note of the order of the changes that occur in each identifiable area of the players make-up. Without using editors or reading guides this is the only way to learn what supercedes what, and the only way to guarantee that you don't miss anything is to check all your players, every day.

The thing is, you could end up knowing all the possible personality types, and their relativity, but never actually know that you do.

wasn't it the championship manager series that had an offical guide book you could buy from the shops.