Tweaking tactics for away games

[dan_bre_1988]

Just curious what changes, if any, you make when playing away from home? 

I'm Man United on FM touch, playing 433 like irl with a DM. At home I'm blowing teams away, as you can see in the screenshot. Beating Bayern 3 0 in a friendly (both put out a near full strength team) Chelsea 5 1 and Everton 5 1 but away I'm grinding out results. I don't change anything other than maybe dropping defensive line/engagement line a notch.

Should I be looking to keep player roles the same and tweaking team instructions or looking at, say, changing my WBs to FBs instead (reluctant to do as I rely on them for width in the final third)



[afailed10]

Depends on the opponent. With the home advantage attribute boost its wise to be a bit more cautious.

 

There are multiple things you can do like taking advantage of their more attacking fullbacks. Generally it's dangerous to give them too much space so I prefer to pin my wingers forward to give them more to think about.

[OJ403]

Personally I don't no for one simple reason: I don't believe in it making any difference.

If my players are good players they'll be good at any venue, home or away.

Take a side like West Ham for example. Recently Felipe Anderson has been their best player, difference maker and top performer. He's just as likely to do this home or away. Say their playing Huddersfield or Fulham, two of the worst Prem sides, you'd back Anderson to perform brilliantly both home and away but if they were playing City or Liverpool you wouldn't necessarily back him as far.

I make changes based on opponent. If I'm playing a better side I might be more cautious and take fewer risks or try and stop the opposition from playing they're game. Or if I'm playing a weaker opponent I'll either take my game to them or simply trust our superior quality will prevail.

[dan_bre_1988]

1 hour ago, OJ403 said:

Personally I don't no for one simple reason: I don't believe in it making any difference

if I'm playing a weaker opponent I'll either take my game to them or simply trust our superior quality will prevail.

I think it does make a difference personally. I regularly find my away form is worse than home nearly every year.

As Man Utd, you would say Crystal Palace, Newcastle and Leicester are weaker opposition yet I have struggled in them games. Conceding five, drawing 2 and narrowly edging 1.

Normally I'd pin my full backs back a bit but the way I'm trying to play relies on width from them in the final third. I tend to play a controlled possession style at a slow tempo but might try more quick counter attacks for away games.

[optimusprimal82]

Mentality is by far the biggest change i make away from home, even as United I'd be very wary of going away from home in the PL and outright attacking (not saying you are doing that but just a common theme I read). Those teams you're struggling against are the definition (irl) of defensive counter-attacking sides (albeit of varying quality) so I'd always be wary of going higher than 'positive' against them unless the stats were telling me otherwise. With United I don't think you should need to be dropping down to cautious, but it never hurts for the first 10-15 if you need to suss out exactly how the opposition are approaching the game.

[dan_bre_1988]

7 hours ago, optimusprimal82 said:

Mentality is by far the biggest change i make away from home, even as United I'd be very wary of going away from home in the PL and outright attacking (not saying you are doing that but just a common theme I read). Those teams you're struggling against are the definition (irl) of defensive counter-attacking sides (albeit of varying quality) so I'd always be wary of going higher than 'positive' against them unless the stats were telling me otherwise. With United I don't think you should need to be dropping down to cautious, but it never hurts for the first 10-15 if you need to suss out exactly how the opposition are approaching the game.

Every game I go into is with a 'positive' mentality. Perhaps I need to try balanced. Initially at least, anyway. I rarely go higher than positive unless I'm chasing a game as I want controlled over frantic

[summatsupeer]

It appears you have a defensive issue.  I'm guessing when teams come to old Trafford they're so defensive they don't really even threaten on the counter, but if they're at home they might not be so defensive and exploit an issue.

Changing things blindly just because your home/away is pot luck and not really fixing what is likely a specific tactical issue. What's your tactic and how do you typically concede?

[OJ403]

17 hours ago, dan_bre_1988 said:

As Man Utd, you would say Crystal Palace, Newcastle and Leicester are weaker opposition yet I have struggled in them games. Conceding five, drawing 2 and narrowly edging 1.

Personally I see the fact you've struggled against them away as much of a coincidence of venue. I'd say they are weaker than you so are trying to sit deep and preserve a point at all costs because your superior. They'd be likely to do this even at their home as your much better at them at football.

Alternatively consider the sides you've steam rolled at home: Chelsea and Everton. They're sides that aren't a million miles away from your level so they are much more likely to go for the 3 points against you anywhere. As a result you have more space to play your football in as they are showing less discipline and being more purposeful. So in actual fact they are easier games to play and win your way than ones where a (weaker) side sits and fustrates you.

[dan_bre_1988]

5 hours ago, summatsupeer said:

Changing things blindly just because your home/away is pot luck and not really fixing what is likely a specific tactical issue. What's your tactic and how do you typically concede?

I definitely have tactical issues and concede goals/chances generally from set pieces and wide areas (crosses/cut backs)

Below is the tactic I use except Shaw is actually WBa and Matic I change between DLPd and HB (trying to figure out what works best really) I'm also tempted to change the CMs to something more defensive to keep 4 behind the ball for counter attacks.

Mentality is control possession-positive. I have shorter passing at slightly lower tempo. Pressing set to slightly more urgent with a standard def line/engagement. Attacking/defensive width both set to standard. I have 'work ball into box' and 'exploit the middle' I have 'counter press' when ball is lost and nothing for when it's won. No player instructions are set other than role specific.

I'm a more casual fm player so my ideas are quite possibly not being transferred into the coding so I'll explain my thinking behind the set up.

I want to dominate possession, with the IF both coming inside to link up with CMa/AFa. I want to see 1-2s with through balls to runners. For teams that sit deep and narrow, that's where my WBs come in. Want them overlapping, giving the team width and crossing for the front 3/late runs from CMa.

In terms of build up, I'm looking for my BPD to help get the ball between the lines to my CMa/WBs (I'm now thinking as I write this that maybe this role is too aggressive and goes against the style of play?) I also want the DLPd to dictate the tempo/game from deep. A ball magnet with the ability to switch the play/feed good passes to those in front. The CMs duty is basically to be an outlet in possession and help break down opposition attacks.

Out of possession I'm looking to be aggressive, especially at home. I don't want teams to settle on the ball (Man Utd don't have the most effective players for this in general, which I'll look to correct in the market/youth set up)

[summatsupeer]

Not bad. Since currently you seem to be scoring i'll focus just on the defensive side.  Counter-Press is okay though an alternative is to add Opposition Instructions to press opposition back line and GK to try and get them to do something with it and not just pass it around at the back. 

Young isn't great defensively and his legs will be going (valancia + dalot injured at start I think?) so even if he is kept back he might still get beaten, plus Pogba is attacking on that side and your using AMR rather than MR so there will be space around him. Personally I would make the RB more conservative (FB-S to start with) to keep one side covered. Make the AMR a W-S to keep width and give the CM-A more space inside, main issue here is Lingard has the comes inside trait even though he's right footed.  LB can still be attacking with a good defensive and team player in Herrera on that side.  I think the main thing here as well it so get a FB whos better defensively, maybe even a mobile CB or BWM midfielder type of player. You could maybe use Jones like Sir Alex did or use Lindelof as a wider BPD by adding PIs to the FB-S role.  You have tactic and personnel options here.

Alternatively, if playing Dalot at RB so want that FB to be the more attacking of the two, the LB can be more conservative but cos the MCL isn't attacking there might still be space for the IF-S without making him a winger since I don't think any utd wide forwards are left footed (chong/gomes for future though maybe).  Plan A and B depending on your personnel but also consider the opponents weakness / strengths to cover the correct flank. 

Whilst your talking about personnel for the future, consider your style and the 4 most attacking players you have currently.  There best attributes are technical and physical, they're more quick attacking players rather than patient thinks picking best option and finding space in tight areas.  Your scoring currently so clearly things aren't bad, I just think not of them are ideal for the possession style.

[dan_bre_1988]

14 minutes ago, summatsupeer said:

Not bad. Since currently you seem to be scoring i'll focus just on the defensive side.  Counter-Press is okay though an alternative is to add Opposition Instructions to press opposition back line and GK to try and get them to do something with it and not just pass it around at the back. 

Young isn't great defensively and his legs will be going (valancia + dalot injured at start I think?) so even if he is kept back he might still get beaten, plus Pogba is attacking on that side and your using AMR rather than MR so there will be space around him. Personally I would make the RB more conservative (FB-S to start with) to keep one side covered. Make the AMR a W-S to keep width and give the CM-A more space inside, main issue here is Lingard has the comes inside trait even though he's right footed.  LB can still be attacking with a good defensive and team player in Herrera on that side.  I think the main thing here as well it so get a FB whos better defensively, maybe even a mobile CB or BWM midfielder type of player. You could maybe use Jones like Sir Alex did or use Lindelof as a wider BPD by adding PIs to the FB-S role.  You have tactic and personnel options here.

Alternatively, if playing Dalot at RB so want that FB to be the more attacking of the two, the LB can be more conservative but cos the MCL isn't attacking there might still be space for the IF-S without making him a winger since I don't think any utd wide forwards are left footed (chong/gomes for future though maybe).  Plan A and B depending on your personnel but also consider the opponents weakness / strengths to cover the correct flank. 

Whilst your talking about personnel for the future, consider your style and the 4 most attacking players you have currently.  There best attributes are technical and physical, they're more quick attacking players rather than patient thinks picking best option and finding space in tight areas.  Your scoring currently so clearly things aren't bad, I just think not of them are ideal for the possession style.

I've just hammered Monaco at home. I made the aforementioned changes in my last post and restricted them to just the 5(2) shots. The only negative really is the 42% possession. 

I'm going to take your points into consideration, particularly away games and make 1 full back more conservative depending on opposition strengths. 

Valencia and Dalot are injured at the start but they are back now. Valencia is my first choice for now. I was hoping Dalot would but disappointed with his in game stats. Hopefully he will improve to be my regular rb. I've also agreed a deal to sign Ghoulem from Napoli in January to compete with Shaw. Better stamina and crossing ability will hopefully suit the role more.