Defending is NOT Impossible

[lurkingwithintent]

So, lots of people have been saying this year's defending has been crap and that it needs to change, they wont play until the patch, etc, etc. Hopefully I'll try to convince some of the doubters.

Now, I'm playing with a back 4 of:

Diego Renan/J Boateng (DL)

Shawcross, Stearman, Onuoha, C Davis (DCs)

Eboue (DR)

Which is not exactly world class and have managed to concede just 14 EPL goals in 25 games:

And went on a pretty decent run of games, in terms of defending:

How (I think!) I've achieved this:

I've found man-marking to be so much better than Zonal. Since switching I've noticed a massive increase.

Playing a DM in front of the back 4 (or, in my case, two) has given so much cover. I've always been a fan of DMs and I think in this version they are absolutely key. Even if I wanted to play a 4-4-2 I would drop someone back to DM.

Opposition Instructions - again certainly very important. I've managed to all but nullify the opposition aerial threat by setting their fullbacks to 'Closing Down - Always' and 'Show onto Foot: Weaker'.

Changing the role of the DCs from 'Central Def' to 'Limited Def' has also helped. Before, I would get so frustrated when my players would pass to the opponents striker, or delay their pass and get tackled. With the limited role, now they just hoof it out. May not result in as much possession, or as beautiful football, but that is out-weighed by the lesser number of mistakes that lead to goals.

[reece1973]

Good effort mate and its fantastic to see (no offence) your not managing a top team.

Nothing more annoying when people say how well they have done managing Chelsea,Man Utd etc etc

[Santa Cruz]

I've found man-marking to be so much better than Zonal. Since switching I've noticed a massive increase.

Thought people dropped man marking years ago. Don't your defenders get ripped to piece's by more fluid teams?

[lurkingwithintent]

Good effort mate and its fantastic to see (no offence) your not managing a top team.

Nothing more annoying when people say how well they have done managing Chelsea,Man Utd etc etc

Cheers reece I've never been one of the top 4 in the past 3 FMs, since I've started challenging myself more. When I was younger I would just be Man Utd and buy everyone

Thought people dropped man marking years ago. Don't your defenders get ripped to piece's by more fluid teams?

That's what I would have thought, but I believe my formation has a lot to do with it (HERE) (especially the two DMs).

Screeny of my formation if you don't want to click through:

I've beaten Chelsea 4-1, held Arsenal to a 0-0 (deserved, pretty much had no real chances to score against me), won 2-0 at Anfield and 3-1 at home to Man Utd. So on evidence it does not seem like the top, fluid sides (Arsenal being the model club there) do rip me apart at all.

[Santa Cruz]

Thats unbeliveable! you'd think Clichy/Arshavin would rip that right flank apart. Maybe they don't see the ball because with so many players in the middle you stifle the service?

[lurkingwithintent]

Thats unbeliveable! you'd think Clichy/Arshavin would rip that right flank apart. Maybe they don't see the ball because with so many players in the middle you stifle the service?

I used Opposition Instructions to close down the wingers/fullbacks and show them onto the weaker foot for both wingers/fullbacks. I do think the service is stifled but also when defending the AMCs will often just drop back to half way, following the opp fullbacks and attempting to show them onto the weaker foot. With there being so many players in the middle of the park, Arsenal can't pass it through, but if they go wide they get closed down. The only real way for them to score is from 30 yards or from a header from a cross. Both of which didn't happen.

[TheBetterHalf]

I used Opposition Instructions to close down the wingers/fullbacks and show them onto the weaker foot for both wingers/fullbacks..

I also show advanced wingers ( i.e pushed up MR/L or AMR/L ) inside or onto weaker foot if being one-footed when playing with a DMC ( crucial). But against a team playing a more controlling, fluid approach, using normal MR/L with supporting fullbacks, this can backfire as it drags my fullbacks out of position thereby making their fullbacks able to make overlaps.

BTW - I have stolen the name of your X formation and intend to upload a set in my thread with that formation

[SCIAG]

Interesting. You effectively have three players screening the defence. Despite that, you have the second best attack in the league. What settings have you given the front three, and where are your goals coming from? I would have thought such a defensive set up would have meant you weren't scoring at the other end.

[PJ123]

I can back this up as I have been using this guys tactic as well and heres ny results with Blyth..

[lurkingwithintent]

I also show advanced wingers ( i.e pushed up MR/L or AMR/L ) inside or onto weaker foot if being one-footed when playing with a DMC ( crucial). But against a team playing a more controlling, fluid approach, using normal MR/L with supporting fullbacks, this can backfire as it drags my fullbacks out of position thereby making their fullbacks able to make overlaps.

BTW - I have stolen the name of your X formation and intend to upload a set in my thread with that formation

I copyrighted the name hehe, look forward to seeing your version! I like your ideas there about OI, certainly food for thought. I still think OIs are underestimated by many FM players.

Interesting. You effectively have three players screening the defence. Despite that, you have the second best attack in the league. What settings have you given the front three, and where are your goals coming from? I would have thought such a defensive set up would have meant you weren't scoring at the other end.

Thanks SCIAG! To be picky it's the 3rd best attack in the league, not that it matters This is my team's scoring:

As you can see it relies a lot on the AMCs and the ST. Gourcuff is on fire! One of the AMCs is an 'Advanced Playmaker' whilst the other is 'Attacking Mid'. I have them switching position - mainly because before the Attacking Mid was not getting involved, but also to try and bamboozle the opponents defenders Sounds stupid but I'm 100% confident if Gourcuff/Dzeko both were out for a season, we'd still be scoring goals. Probably not so many from the AMC and ST but although from the outside it seems I rely on those two, like Liverpool with G+T, I don't think I do.

Thanks for all your comments

(Anyone has any specific questions regarding the tactic feel free to PM me or ask in the tactic thread itself)

Cheers, J.

[WelshDragonZ]

Any chance of a link to the tactics before I snap the game in half?

[lurkingwithintent]

Any chance of a link to the tactics before I snap the game in half?

Yep

Any probs WDZ feel free to ask in that thread or PM me

[Santa Cruz]

Just about to ask myself.....will try this with my awful Blackburn team, if it works for them it must be good.

[Magnakai Haaskivi]

I think maybe your awesome skin is part of your success; what is that?

[DeathSpawn]

with new tactics system: it's impossible to me to have good defense cause of the counterattacks

with old system: easy to defend, opponents instructions and fullbacks helping the centerbacks solves those counterattacks if you have fast fullbacks.

[fatalfury833]

actually, I don't think defending is broke in this game generally. I have loads of 1-0 win with a 4-5-1 with man marking. Must remember that man marking in this game is 'more aggressive zonal marking". And the man marking we are referring to is actually specific marking in this game. (i.e old school catenaccio style)

I do think there are too many goals from counterattacks at corner kicks though.

[psilord80]

Do I put all the players to man-marking or just the DL, DR, DC's and the DMC'S?

[lam]

Not to take away from your tactic as I beleive you are really on to something there, however, I think one of the KEY things you have implemented here is to conjest the centre of the field.

With the introduction of the narrow formations and the single man striker with AMLR in this version of the game, we are seeing a huge amount of play being focused through the centre of the field (Yes, I beleive you will find most of those AMLR, FC combo's are all narrow)

I personlay play as Spurs and have set up with a wide 442 diamond, however I always play with the 'narrower' shout in effect and have just won the league in season two with the 2nd lowest goals conceded (at work now, so cant check how many).

I dont beleive that defence is broken, but you are doing a much finer job of proving it!

[higgins]

No, defence is not broken, you just need to find the right asset to fit the players you have, as Jack did.

[lurkingwithintent]

Not to take away from your tactic as I beleive you are really on to something there, however, I think one of the KEY things you have implemented here is to conjest the centre of the field.

With the introduction of the narrow formations and the single man striker with AMLR in this version of the game, we are seeing a huge amount of play being focused through the centre of the field (Yes, I beleive you will find most of those AMLR, FC combo's are all narrow)

I personlay play as Spurs and have set up with a wide 442 diamond, however I always play with the 'narrower' shout in effect and have just won the league in season two with the 2nd lowest goals conceded (at work now, so cant check how many).

I dont beleive that defence is broken, but you are doing a much finer job of proving it!

I agree. My decision to play like that was taken purely on the fact that the squad I inherited with Sunderland did not have good enough players to play wingers, in my opinion. But I do think narrow formations are slightly easier to perfect, due to the packing of the midfield. This thread was mainly to prove people who are convinced it's impossible to defend that it's not that simple.

Thanks for your comment lam

[AnalcoolicA]

Defending certainly isn't impossible. I've played three seasons so far (league 2 and 1 in England) and every season my team has had the best defensive record in the league.

My defense is quite different from yours though. I use zonal marking with quick, ball playing, aggressive defenders and a sweeper keeper (I can't remember conceding a single goal from a one-on-one yet:D). I only use a DMC when I really need someone to win headers against tall teams, as none of my back line can head a ball properly. The only downside is that I concede a lot from corners but I hope to sort that out once I find a tall keeper that likes to punch things.