Ajax System for FM2011 onwards “AFC Ajax“ 1990s (Discussion)

[crazyscotsman]

Marz:

Thanks. I have my initial tempo set on the last notch of slow and usually play this way when at home. I take into account the scout reports and adjust tempo and dline if playing away or during a game if needed. As for width I have it set to max at all times. I do this as the 343 is reall a narrow formation?

How do you react/change when your opponent has teh majority of the possession?

[Marz]

Marz:

As for width I have it set to max at all times. I do this as the 343 is reall a narrow formation?

I have reduced the teams’ width setting to the highest normal setting. As team width affects players positioning (trying to play wider within their own position). But it also affects the players passing.

So if you formation is:-

SL--------SC--------SR

----------AMC---------

--------MC—MC-------

----------DMC---------

------DC—DC—DC------

The ME will only see the SL/SR as wide players.

The fact that you have tempo set to slow might be an advantage in terms of the 7 central players having more time to get wide in build-up.

How do you react/change when your opponent has teh majority of the possession?

They normally do not against my team, because I play with 2 real wingers and a centre forward. Who can because of their advanced positions disturb the opponents’ build-up.

There are a few causes for this happening to you:-

Players attributes

Formations

Team-talks (even media interaction before the game)

Game-plan against opponents in game

[crazyscotsman]

marz:

will you be posting your current tactic anytime soon?

Also, I have found during a game with a downpour that I have to change my teams passing from short to direct - do you do this also?

[crazyscotsman]

Marz:

On training if you have a player for example Ballack who playes as AMC/DMC and equally good as MC with preferred position AMC do you keep his training at AMC only or do you tend to change his training from AMC to another position after a certain length of time?

[KGCasals]

I've been trying to replicate Ajax 3-4-3 in FM since 2006, but I'm having a hard time in this edition.

Currently I'm playing like this:

----------SC----------

-AML---AMC-----AMR-

--------MC—MC-------

----------DMC---------

-DL------DC—---DR--

I don't like at all how the players position themselves on SL and SR, in fact I hate it. Not that the AML/R positions are optimal, but I find them better. They even seem to hug the touchline and open up the pitch better and more often.

Worst part seems to be the defense. There's no way to get the DMC to a DC position when defending, or having the full backs play narrower (or the DCL and DCR play wider on posession). I tried to set the back four like that

-DL----DC---DR-

-------SW-------

with the DC/DMC with RFD and RWB often and roam from position ticked, but he stays too deep and doesn't get involved in the game as much as needed, not even setting him as playmaker.

On the good side, I like how the MCs are playing. With roam from position, RFD mixed and move into channels I was able to break the stupidly narrow diamond, and now they seem to play wider and on the correct position. Tried "hug touchline" but I'm pretty sure it had no effect.

[crazyscotsman]

KGCasals:

I currently have my defense set up as follows when playing against a 4-4-2:

----------DM----------

DC----------DC

----------SW---------

Against formations with a single striker I move the DC's out wider to DL & DR

[crazyscotsman]

Marz:

I am having trouble competing against teh bigger clubs in Europe _ Barcelona etc> Are you keeping with 3-4-3 in Europe? I am thinking maybe go to a 4-3-3 making the DM a DC - thoughts?

[Marz]

marz:

will you be posting your current tactic anytime soon?

In terms of my own tactic I ‘am currently still tweaking. Currently playing like this:-

SL--------S--------SR

------------------------

-----MC-MC-MC------

----------DMC---------

DL--------DC--------DR

Main thing is that I moved the #10 from AMC to MC. And decreased the tempo and width as described in previous threads.

marz:

Also, I have found during a game with a downpour that I have to change my teams passing from short to direct - do you do this also?

Yes short passing is not ideal in those kind of conditions. Currently only the #9, #8, #6 and #1 are on short passing under normal conditions.

Marz:

On training if you have a player for example Ballack who playes as AMC/DMC and equally good as MC with preferred position AMC do you keep his training at AMC only or do you tend to change his training from AMC to another position after a certain length of time?

If a player becomes accomplished, I tend to look at other positions that he could play in. With certain players I try to train them to become natural at the desired position.

On a side note I would not sign Ballack as he lacks dribbling, this would hinder him playing in the Ajax system at positions #11, 9, 7, 8, 10 and 6. In my game he is an accomplished DMC, I would train him in that position and adjust his training schedule to make him more suitable for the DMC role.

I've been trying to replicate Ajax 3-4-3 in FM since 2006, but I'm having a hard time in this edition.

Currently I'm playing like this:

----------SC----------

-AML---AMC-----AMR-

--------MC—MC-------

----------DMC---------

-DL------DC—---DR--

I don't like at all how the players position themselves on SL and SR, in fact I hate it. Not that the AML/R positions are optimal, but I find them better. They even seem to hug the touchline and open up the pitch better and more often.

The problem with the #11 and #7 playing from AML /AMR is that they are too deep in terms of pressing the opponents’ full-backs. I do have some reservations about the SL/SR default positioning, particularly in defensive phases, in the opponents half.

In terms of attacking phases of play I do not have problems with them. I think an absolute must is for them to be on RFD (runs from deep) rarely. There are few exceptions to this rule, such as when you are forced to play counter attacking football (leading in a game against an equally strong opponent).

In terms of them hugging the touchline I do not have a problem with that aspect. Worthwhile noting that they should not practically be hugging the touchline at all times. An example is when the opponents back 4 play narrow and ignore your wingers.

Worst part seems to be the defense. There's no way to get the DMC to a DC position when defending, or having the full backs play narrower (or the DCL and DCR play wider on posession). I tried to set the back four like that

-DL----DC---DR-

-------SW-------

with the DC/DMC with RFD and RWB often and roam from position ticked, but he stays too deep and doesn't get involved in the game as much as needed, not even setting him as playmaker.

Yes particularly the defence is a problem as the current match engine lacks options; this will hopefully change with FM11.

As for the #4 playing from DC, grimness and I have tried that to, and it just does not work in the ME.

Zico came up with the solution of putting the half-backs on roaming. Those instructions with a defensive mentality make this style somewhat more playable.

I also prefer the #10 to play from MC in defensive phases, as the #8 & 6 also have to cover the wide areas.

[grimness]

I don't like playing no.10 from MC position as he drops deep in defensive phase. Even with high closing and mentality he is always deeper then 6 and 8.

[KGCasals]

crazyscotsman:

How well are you dealing against opposition wingers playing with 2 DCs and a sweeper? Also, are the DCs getting to wider positions when on possession?

I am having trouble competing against teh bigger clubs in Europe _ Barcelona etc> Are you keeping with 3-4-3 in Europe? I am thinking maybe go to a 4-3-3 making the DM a DC - thoughts?

I'm currently playing a mid table club in Spain, so I've played a few times against big clubs like Barcelona and Madrid. I've had relatively good results playing with the back three, just tweaking the tactic as you will usually do against stronger teams (lower mentality, mixed passing, normal-high tempo, counter-attack, etc). Thing is, in Ajax system the DMC should be the second DC when defending, but AFAIK there is no way to correctly reproduce this in the ME. Maybe moving the DMC to DC position with RFD and RWB often and roam from position will give you more defensive consistency while still having the DMC 'flavour'. I tried something similar but wasn't too happy with the results; looked good on defense but didn't work well when attacking.

[crazyscotsman]

KGCasals :

I have no problem dealing with wingers. As I mentioned previously I play a DC, DC with a SW behind them against a 4-4-2 and mover the DC's to DL and DR with teh SW behind them against opposition with single strikers. I find with my current settings the DM drops back to fill the open DC spot.

If you want to email me privately I am happy to set you my current tactic.

The only real issue I am currently having (and I am waiting on a response from Marz) is competing against the bigger clubs in European Competition _ Barcelona etc> I am thinking maybe go to a 4-3-3

[Corkey]

KGCasals :

I have no problem dealing with wingers. As I mentioned previously I play a DC, DC with a SW behind them against a 4-4-2 and mover the DC's to DL and DR with teh SW behind them against opposition with single strikers. I find with my current settings the DM drops back to fill the open DC spot.

If you want to email me privately I am happy to set you my current tactic.

The only real issue I am currently having (and I am waiting on a response from Marz) is competing against the bigger clubs in European Competition _ Barcelona etc> I am thinking maybe go to a 4-3-3

If you make a good one, let me know!

[Marz]

Marz:

I am having trouble competing against teh bigger clubs in Europe _ Barcelona etc> Are you keeping with 3-4-3 in Europe? I am thinking maybe go to a 4-3-3 making the DM a DC - thoughts?

If you think your team is not going to dominate the game, play with the extra defender instead of the extra midfielder.

As for my team I have not faced any big teams yet. In my pre-season I did beat AC Milan and At. Madrid but they were not in the same physical shape as their seasons started later; so not really a major test.

I don't like playing no.10 from MC position as he drops deep in defensive phase. Even with high closing and mentality he is always deeper then 6 and 8.

Have you made sure that the #8 & 6 have closing down instructions that are less than the #10? I also make sure that RFD (runs from deep) are set to often for the #10, with #8 & 6 in a mixed (more attacking player) and rarely (more defensive) combination.

I also play the #8 & 6 on team mentality which I normally leave at the highest normal, with the #10 on a similar mentality to the Striker (who is normally on 17/18).

[Marz]

Just a quick update on the way I choose to defend. Gone back to playing the #5 & 2 from the DC positions. I then use opposition instructions to compensate for them not being at full-back positions, when the threat is on their wing. Closing down will also have to be increased (but still needs to be 1 or 2 notches less than the #8 & 6 CD), with the #4 closing down being decreased to almost match the #3 CD.

[Marz]

Some people previously said they struggled against the defensive 433 formation:-

---------S---------

AML---------AMR

----MC--MC----

------DMC------

DL DC DC DR

The opposition wingers (in a DEF 433) can press the half-backs (#5 & 2) earlier; so disturb your teams’ build-up. To counter that (with possession football) is to instruct the holding midfielders (#8 & 6) to ‘run from deep’ rarely and set their wide play option to normal from move into channels. This should give the system more strength in build-up, as this should pit 3 central players against 2 MC.

This however means that the wingers (#11 & 7) will have less support; which is normal provided by the #8 & 6 + half-backs. To solve that problem the #10 should be asked to move into the channels and play from the AMC position.

In effect both sides of the formation drop back, I also tend to move the wingers back to AML & AMR positions from SL & SR.

[Marz]

Has anyone tried playing 3 defenders centrally in the FM2011demo? Do they provide any width in initial build-up play (being close to defensive full-back position when the GK has the ball)?

[crazyscotsman]

Marz:

Are you playing the 2011 demo. I am curious to know if you are using the shouts? Also, the way you have your team set up which players and what attributes are you leaving on team settings?

[Marz]

Downloaded the demo and had a quick look at the various changes. I’am hoping to get some playing time in this week.

I don’t use the shouts as I feel that they conflict with the way the Ajax System works.

I will probably start of where I finished in FM2010 in terms of tactics:-

SC

AML AMR

MCL MC MCR

DMC

DL DR (both on man-marking)

SW

I will post more in the coming days.

[crazyscotsman]

look forward to your take on the 2011 demo

[Menz]

I've been experimenting with a similar base system to yourself Marz. A back 3 of RB, CB, LB seems to be working better than a central 3 man backline.

Also experimenting with the wide positions at the moment as well. Keep flicking from AMR/L to FR/L.

[Marz]

By the way might be worth while watching Barcelona matches, for anyone who is not already. They clearly started the 2nd half against Zaragoza playing 343.

Has anyone tried playing 3 defenders centrally in the FM2011demo? Do they provide any width in initial build-up play (being close to defensive full-back position when the GK has the ball)?

[larrie]

Marz how do you do at FM2011?

[hamzinho]

Currently using these two variants :

3-4-3 default

http://img258.imageshack.us/i/screenhunter01.jpg/

3-4-3 for away matches or against better teams

http://img837.imageshack.us/i/screenhunter02.jpg/

so far is working like a charm, altough I am managing Red Star (one of top two teams in Serbia).

My score so far is 9-5-0 [37:17], but not quite satisfied with defense, currently tweaking that segment of play...

One question for Marz, which attributes are you looking for your players...?

[crazyscotsman]

marz:

how are coming with the demo?

[crazyscotsman]

marz:

what oi are you currently using?

[Luke200046]

Is anybody still working on an Ajax tactic? I started one with Atletico Madrid and I started off well but I soon realized that no matter what I did, I could not deal with a 4-2-3-1 with MC's. I had it set up with LB SW RB with a DM in front, and I had the DM man marking the AMC with the SW man marking the ST. I got killed 5-1 and on every single one of the goals the AMC made a run from deep with the DM just left him and he made wide open runs past the SW marking the striker. Now I'm trying something like this with my DM playmaker as one of the CM's:

----------------------GK-----------------------

LB----------DC-------------DC-----------RB

-------------CM-------------CM--------------

---------------------AMC---------------------

FL------------------ST--------------------FR

It's defending better but I was wondering if anybody else had a better option...When I face a 4-4-2 my normal formation is doing great. One tip is if I find my self leaving a wing open at the far post a lot when I cant keep the ball I put my cm's CD lower and man mark the wings with them.

--------------------GK------------------------

--------------------SW-----------------------

--------------DC---------DC-----------------

--------------------DM-----------------------

-------------CM---------CM-----------------

------------------AMC-----------------------

FL----------------ST---------------------FR

[Marz]

Sorry I have not been playing FM at all, waiting for the December patch to try FM11. I will reply to posts over this coming week.

Just found a new resource recently that might help a few people to understand the Ajax System of the Van Gaal era a bit more. It describes the victory over Milan in the group stage of the European cup.

http://timhi.wordpress.com/2010/09/14/ajax-1995/

[Marz]

A lot of my thoughts are based on the FM10 engine, just started to play FM11.2.1 . But reading the features and change/patch logs I do not think that the issues have been worked.

I've been experimenting with a similar base system to yourself Marz. A back 3 of RB, CB, LB seems to be working better than a central 3 man backline.

Also experimenting with the wide positions at the moment as well. Keep flicking from AMR/L to FR/L.

I would recommend using a SW instead of the CB. In the Ajax system the #5 & #2 (fullbacks) should be marking the front two. If the opposition plays with a front 3 (AMRL & S), then the #5 & #2 should be marking the wingers (AMRL) with the #4 (DMC) marking the oppositions lone striker.

I have moved to playing the #11 & #7 (wingers AMRL), as training them to strikers would see them getting played in the central striker role in the Under 18s and reserve teams by the AI assistants.

The positioning (without/with ball) is also incorrect when playing them from SRL.

So instead I will play them as very attacking AMRL.

(The problem is that 3 defenders, positioned in FM as 3DCs do not provide any width [when the team has position]. This is why I think SI should code new positions of SWLC, DLC, DMLC, MLC, AMLC, SLC (& SWRC, DRC, DMRC, MRC, AMRC, SRC ) into the match engine.)

but not quite satisfied with defense, currently tweaking that segment of play...

One question for Marz, which attributes are you looking for your players...?

The goal is to build a first team (preferably through the academy), were in theory players are well rounded in terms of skills/attributes; so around 14 for all attributes. As it is a passing system, the aim is for all players to have Mental Attributes (14+):-

Anticipation, Composure, Concentration, Creativity, Decisions, Determination, Off the Ball, Teamwork and Workrate

With Technical Attributes (14+):-

Dribbling, First Touch, Passing, Technique

And Physical Attributes (14+):-

Agility, Balance, Stamina

The above attributes would ideally be 18+ for the #8 & #6 (MCl & MCr).

Then it is just a case of looking at the individual roles, players play in the system. Example being the #9 (Striker) would ideally have a Finishing attribute of 18+, while the #3 (Sweeper) should not have his ability/potential wasted on that attribute.

[Marz]

Is anybody still working on an Ajax tactic? I started one with Atletico Madrid and I started off well but I soon realized that no matter what I did, I could not deal with a 4-2-3-1 with MC's. I had it set up with LB SW RB with a DM in front, and I had the DM man marking the AMC with the SW man marking the ST. I got killed 5-1 and on every single one of the goals the AMC made a run from deep with the DM just left him and he made wide open runs past the SW marking the striker. Now I'm trying something like this with my DM playmaker as one of the CM's:

Make sure that “Roaming from position” is allowed, it frees the player from his default position in both attacking and defensive situations. I only have the wingers sticking rigidly to their position. Mentality and closing down might have to be lowered too.

It could also be that your player in the #4 role (DMC) is not a very good man to man marker.

When in possession the key players (if everyone else does their job correctly) will be your #8 & #6 (MCl & MCr) and 10 (MC) against their two MC. Normally in a 4-2-3-1 the 2 MC will drop very deep to protect the space in front of their back 4. What I tend to do is drop the #8 & #6 back a bit so they link up more with the DMC. This help strengths the build-up, but also means they can play the ball more easily towards the wingers. The other benefit is that the #10 will receive more space if the oppositions two MC’s press your #8 & #6.

If you have a #10 who is good at running with the ball, the initial space (in front of the oppositions’ back 4) could be exploited.

[crazyscotsman]

marz:

any update on fm11? have you been playing Also, Can you please advise the best setting you have found for width? I am currently messing with the Tactics Creator and while I have my starting strategy as control with set width of 20. I usually start the game as defensive while using the shouts pass to feet to keep things tight then after I score move to counter. I am considering not setting the width and allowing the TX contol it as I move throught the strategys. I currently have my winger width setting as fixed to hug touchline.

[Marz]

marz:

any update on fm11? have you been playing Also, Can you please advise the best setting you have found for width? I am currently messing with the Tactics Creator and while I have my starting strategy as control with set width of 20. I usually start the game as defensive while using the shouts pass to feet to keep things tight then after I score move to counter. I am considering not setting the width and allowing the TX contol it as I move throught the strategys. I currently have my winger width setting as fixed to hug touchline.

I’am just in early pre-season. As for your question, I will use the team width to try to control the attacking behaviour of the #5 & #2 (DL & DR). In theory those 2 roles require the players to play less forward (runs from deep on rarely, with defensive mentality). And also narrower than modern day full-backs, here team width could be used to tweak. Wingers like you said hugging the touchline, then its just a case of seen the effect of team width on the #8 & #6.

From what I know of the ME, this setting does not just affect positioning though. But also how much your team will try to use the wide spaces.

[crazyscotsman]

Marz:

Are you still playing your back 4 as SW, DR, DL?

Will you be posting your tactic?

[Marz]

Marz:

Are you still playing your back 4 as SW, DR, DL?

That is the plan, against 2 strikers it will be more of a back 3 with SW, DR and DL. Against 1 striker and two wingers (AML & AMR), it will be a back 4 of SW, DR and DL + DMC.

Marz:

Will you be posting your tactic?

I ‘am not sure how a downloadable tactic will help, the one size fits all downloadable tactic is pretty much a thing of the past. Maybe we could go through the different tactical options; this might also help people understand the system a bit more.

[crazyscotsman]

did you use the tactics creator to build your tactic?

[Basile Boli]

I ‘am not sure how a downloadable tactic will help, the one size fits all downloadable tactic is pretty much a thing of the past. Maybe we could go through the different tactical options; this might also help people understand the system a bit more.

Marz, if this is something you are considering then I would be happy to try and contribute in some way. No doubt your knowledge of the system surpasses mine but I've still been a very keen observer of van Gaal over the years and especially his time at Ajax and Barca.

I think it would benefit others more if we discuss the tactic and the various options within the ME than just providing a downloadable tactic as much of the system relies on how you react to certain in game situations also.

Let me know your thoughts

[Basile Boli]

Did you make any DB changes Marz? I'm just about to set up my Ajax career game and I'd be interested to see what, if any, changes you may have made.

[Marz]

did you use the tactics creator to build your tactic?

I use the wizard as a base, it also seems to be more beneficial for the AI assistants managing Ajax Reserve (treated as U21 by me) and Ajax U19 (treated as U18 by me).

Marz, if this is something you are considering then I would be happy to try and contribute in some way. No doubt your knowledge of the system surpasses mine but I've still been a very keen observer of van Gaal over the years and especially his time at Ajax and Barca.

I think it would benefit others more if we discuss the tactic and the various options within the ME than just providing a downloadable tactic as much of the system relies on how you react to certain in game situations also.

Let me know your thoughts

I think we are moving in the right direction with this. There are 17 (individual) instructions, 7 (team) “specific instructions” and then the 6 set-pieces instructions.

My suggestion would be to tackle them in blocks, as some tie in with each other; rather than going through them 1 by 1. Let me know how this order sounds.

• Run From Deep, Mentality, Roaming From Position
  
• Creative Freedom, Passing Style, Try Through Balls, Run With Ball, Long Shots
  
• Cross Ball, Cross From, Cross Aim, Wide Play
  
• Closing Down, Tackling, Marking, Tight Marking
  

Did you make any DB changes Marz? I'm just about to set up my Ajax career game and I'd be interested to see what, if any, changes you may have made.

Last time I checked, SI would not officially support people who edited the DB. In terms of my career game set up; please bear in mind your own PC specs:-

Database used is “11.2.0 Update”

All 51 nations/leagues, with all “lowest actives leagues”, which are all on “Playable” Mode

Game Start Date is “Australia (June 2010)”

Database Size is Custom, which is Database Size Large. And “Players of nationality” (continents) Africa, Asia, Europe, North America, Oceania, South America.

All Advanced Options ticked

Should give you 117 leagues with around 307000 players.

[Basile Boli]

I think we are moving in the right direction with this. There are 17 (individual) instructions, 7 (team) “specific instructions” and then the 6 set-pieces instructions.

My suggestion would be to tackle them in blocks, as some tie in with each other; rather than going through them 1 by 1. Let me know how this order sounds.

Run From Deep, Mentality, Roaming From Position

Creative Freedom, Passing Style, Try Through Balls, Run With Ball, Long Shots

Cross Ball, Cross From, Cross Aim, Wide Play

Closing Down, Tackling, Marking, Tight Marking

Sounds about right. I was thinking about how best to deal with this myself and came up with a similar base. Tackling it by those blocks would make sense and would keep it as simple and as organised as possible.

Database used is “11.2.0 Update”

All 51 nations/leagues, with all “lowest actives leagues”, which are all on “Playable” Mode

Game Start Date is “Australia (June 2010)”

Database Size is Custom, which is Database Size Large. And “Players of nationality” (continents) Africa, Asia, Europe, North America, Oceania, South America.

All Advanced Options ticked

Should give you 117 leagues with around 307000 players.

Quite a few leagues then! I try and load as many as possible, but my PC won't be as powerful as yours. I think I have somewhere around the 200k mark with regards to players loaded.

How far in are you? In terms of in-game days?

I'm still on Day 1 at the minute, spent the last 2 hours or so organising all 3 teams, into a core group with 2 or 3 (give or take 1 or 2) 'utility men' for each group. Relatively happy that the core structure is in place now and I'm about ready to start looking around for staff. (I doubt the playing side of things needs improving at all atm, all seems perfectly weighted with regards to positions)

[Marz]

Still on day 1 myself, I tend to be quite structured in the way I manage. So I literally manage all areas on day 1:-

Set-up Basic System/formation

Form squads

Set all players to rest (Started game in June)

Check backroom Staff and

Assign scouts

Rearrange pre-season/fixtures

All contracts (players and staff), Ajax have to much staff so it is a case of seeing over the course of the season who is improving.

[Basile Boli]

Still on day 1 myself, I tend to be quite structured in the way I manage. So I literally manage all areas on day 1:-

Set-up Basic System/formation

Form squads

Set all players to rest (Started game in June)

Check backroom Staff and

Assign scouts

Rearrange pre-season/fixtures

All contracts (players and staff), Ajax have to much staff so it is a case of seeing over the course of the season who is improving.

With regards to scouting:- Do you tend to scout certain area's more so than others? Also, will you only assign your scouts to look for players who already fit the system or have the Ajax qualities (TIPS), or is it a case of scouting as many players as possible then picking out the ones that fit the bill?

Interesting to gather your thoughts on this, as for me scouting doesn't play a major part this early on in the game. The A1 squad looks relatively strong and is very young so at the moment I see no need to change much, ofcourse for me, I will only aim to scout younger players (usually <18,19). That way they can be signed, if needed, and will have a few years at the club training before hitting peak.

[grimness]

For slow players loading all leagues shouldn't be much of a problem. I've set my initial tactic with TC and then only tweaked what I feel is needed except Mentality, Creative freedom, Passing and Closing down. I won't touch this settings for now in detail and will only tweak with TC.

Still in preseason but what is discouraging is that on my current save I have only three countries loaded and player pool is small. For that reason and due to me being slow player I will go as Marz with huge database. If I loose my best players I might not achieve board expectations so another option is to be patient and wait for my future youth to develop before going for recreation of Van Gaal's system and use somewhat generic 4-3-3.

[grimness]

Marz which players from initial squad you would use in first 11?

Also AZ might be interesting to watch this season http://11tegen11.wordpress.com/2010/08/10/new-on-11tegen11-verbeek’s-az-showing-off-with-a-dynamic-three-man-defense…/

[Basile Boli]

Marz which players from initial squad you would use in first 11?

Also AZ might be interesting to watch this season http://11tegen11.wordpress.com/2010/08/10/new-on-11tegen11-verbeek’s-az-showing-off-with-a-dynamic-three-man-defense…/

Interesting read that

I've watched Barca an awful lot this year and many times I've seen them play with more or less a 3-4-3, with Busquets usually dropping in to form a Back 3 and allowing the 2 FB's to push on to make up the wide players in the midfield.

This article is interesting in talking about the attacking benefits of such a change in system: http://www.zonalmarking.net/2010/09/20/atletico-madrid-1-2-barcelona-busquets-takes-modern-centre-half-role-a-little-further/

[crazyscotsman]

marz" do you have a training schedule for FM!!?

[Basile Boli]

So just completed my first pre-season friendly (still on day 1 btw) and it was a healthy 3-0 defeat of Neuchatel Xamax. Still getting to grips with the current ME, although early impressions are good. The wide players seem to be staying wide, especially the wingers. In fact 2 of my 3 goals came as a result of the wingers staying so wide that it allowed my central midfield 3 to overrun their 2 CM's and play some neat one-two's between them and slot in Suarez.

This I'm happy about as it was one of the main gripes I had last year with FM, that the wide players wouldn't keep the width and would constantly come inside looking for the ball. Still playing around with the base formation though, Vertonghen as SW seems a good fit as he has all the right attributes, but I'm still not 100% convinced that this system will work with a SW in the long term.

I'd be interested to see how you set your front 3 up Marz, as this is another aspect I'm still not 100% sure about. I'm not convinced that we need both Mido and El Hamdaoui in the A1, I may look to get rid of Mido in the next few days.

[crazyscotsman]

Basile Boli - do you have a training schedule set up?

[Basile Boli]

Basile Boli - do you have a training schedule set up?

Still working on them crazyscotsman. I was hoping that training schedules could become part of this discussion in here as they aren't as easy as they once were to build in accordance with the Ajax philosophies of van Gaal. Since they did away with the old system and introduced the sliders it is much harder to create schedules that shape the players the way I want them shaped.

I was hoping Marz might be able to shed a little light on how he sets his up when he gets chance.

[crazyscotsman]

marz and a chap named joop made some good schedules for Ajax in previous versions

[crazyscotsman]

joor _ not joop - sorry

[Basile Boli]

marz and a chap named joop made some good schedules for Ajax in previous versions

I think I remember seeing these at some point. Are you playing with Ajax too crazyscotsman?