Batigoal__

March 9

Hello everyone,

Since the arrival of Jean-Louis Gasset at Olympique de Marseille following the sacking of Gennaro Gattuso, Illiman Ndiaye has found his best role.
His numerous calls and ball grabs make him a real free electron who disrupts defensive lines.
In a 433, what roles will you see to achieve the result in the screenshot ?

The role of F9(s), DLF(s), CF(s) in this 433 organisation seem the most suitable and creative, but the drop-off dynamic doesn't seem to be as marked as the role given to the player in real life.
The addition of a PIs Roam from position and TIs Focus play through the middle does not accentuate a more seated position.

I'm sharing the video from which the capture is taken : https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zJch_23He8E

Thanks for your contributions

February 20

It's official : Gattuso is no longer coach of Olympique de Marseille.

February 19

Le 18/02/2024 à 12:45, Batigoal__ a dit :

Hello everyone,

Considering the options and capabilities of the current game engine, is it possible to position an axial midfield at the sideline as shown in the screenshot ?

Carrilero's role seems to be a choice to offer him which seems limited. The activation in the TIs of "Focus Play Down" does not encourage the player to move further out wide.
In this example of a move down the right flank, the central midfielder moves off-centre to the touchline, the winger moves inside and the right-back triggers the sequence when the ball is given, making an appeal as high up the pitch as possible.

Thank you for your suggestions/ideas

Gattuso has been sacked. Gasset has been called in until the end of the season.
For their first match in the Europa League, the team returned to a 3-5-2 formation.
In this formation, too, the central midfielders played off-centre, sometimes very high up the pitch.
This movement is more noticeable on the right, where the right-back plays an attacking role.

February 18

Hello everyone,

Considering the options and capabilities of the current game engine, is it possible to position an axial midfield at the sideline as shown in the screenshot ?

Carrilero's role seems to be a choice to offer him which seems limited. The activation in the TIs of "Focus Play Down" does not encourage the player to move further out wide.
In this example of a move down the right flank, the central midfielder moves off-centre to the touchline, the winger moves inside and the right-back triggers the sequence when the ball is given, making an appeal as high up the pitch as possible.

Thank you for your suggestions/ideas

February 15

A change of programme, or at least that's to be expected given the last few games.
Gattuso's press conference yesterday before the Europa League play-off match :

Citation

G.G.: "When I switched to three, I saw that the team needed more defensively, I didn't like the way they occupied the pitch, we were pierced too quickly. But I'm not a coach who likes a line of five and three midfielders, and who plays on the counter. I have to do what I feel and, of course, put the team in the best possible position. When I saw that the team was suffering before the first leg against Lyon, I switched to five at the back, but that's not my style of football. If you want that, you'll have to change coach."

The message got through. Forget 352.

February 6

Le 04/02/2024 à 21:23, Cloud9 a dit :

Could work! I think any combination of two spearheading forwards would do the trick.

Thank you

February 4

Le 03/02/2024 à 09:11, whatsupdoc a dit :

The central midfielders:

Don't use any "playmaker" role as it will suck them toward the ball.

In a 4-3-3 try mezzala (Attack).

Or try them starting higher with an AM (s) role.

I wouldn't get your hopes up though.

The striker. Not really. Pick a role with moves into channels. Perhaps try roam from position. Teach them player traits to get them to move wide.

Le 03/02/2024 à 09:28, Cloud9 a dit :

On the striker try a Poacher without options via proper support Auba is a classic poacher IRL!

On the midfielders...they are two 8's in a 5-3-2 yes? You could try distribute to the 6 w/comes deep to get ball on him to get this kind of interaction. Keeping the line of engagement high might help as well.

Thanks @whatsupdoc @Cloud9 for sharing your ideas with us

In the 352 proposed by Gattuso, it seems that the two out of the three are number 8's. In all the roles currently proposed in the opus, without getting too far ahead of myself, the only role likely to have a high positioning is Mezzala. Unless the height of the line of engagement could allow other roles to be positioned high up in the middle ? There is one particularity to note regarding the positioning of the central defender in this match, playing the role of libero in support of the third midfielder.

As far as the striker is concerned, I read something interesting in @Rashidi Daljit's guide (The book of roles), in a line of two strikers, each with an advanced attacking role, there is an automatic alternation, with one dropping back to play off-centre and the other positioning himself deeper, on the alert.

Citation

While a lone AF will be the focus of attacks for his team, a side that is playing two AF will normally see one occasionally drop deep to receive the ball when that ball is progressing down his flank.

When using one striker the AF will be the focal point of attacks. In two striker set ups the use of 2 AFs is interesting, since one might drop back during the progression phase, leaving the other in an advanced position. (page 122 in the guide)

Citation

Movement of the DLF and the PF are not dissimilar the biggest difference is generally the way his pressing instructions can affect his starting point in the buildup to attacks.

Supports play in the build-up phase.

A pressing forward supports play like a false 9 and a DLF by moving to the areas of the pitch he is needed. (page 134 in the guide)

The pressing forward can also offer support on the flank, helping to build play, as can the false 9, deep lying forward and complete forward (creative strikers).
In this scenario, would it make sense to have two AFs ? That is a good question

January 29

Hello everyone,

Currently on opus 24, is it possible to reproduce this position example concerning the central midfielders in the capture below ?

Also, is it possible for a striker to go off-centre as in the image below ?

Thank you for your contributions

January 24

Gennaro Gattuso's analysis after Rennes vs. Olympique de Marseille in the French Cup gives an indication of one role, that of the left central midfielder in the 352 scheme.

Wasn't your team unbalanced in the second half ?

Citation

G.G.: "I didn't notice that. It's true that when Luis Henrique has to play as a mezzala (an axial midfielder who shifts to one side) when that's not really his position - he's a winger - there are young players too and new ones... I didn't see that imbalance."

Luis Henrique came on for Bilal Nadir. He replaced Jordan Veretout, who played as a left-sided central midfielder in the starting 11.
Veretout scored OM's only goal, from inside the opposition box.
Mezzala has a role to play as left central midfielder in this 352.

For the record, after the Olympique de Marseille vs. Lille match, Gattuso said :

Citation

Veretout wasn't in the starting 10, we've been playing him like that for a few games now. He was supposed to start the first attack when the opposition had the ball. He plays as Mezzala, as we say in Italy.

It's a good start for the tactical recreation of the 352, only 10 roles left

December 22, 2023

The first half of the season is over.
In the last few games, Gattuso has not let go of the 352.
This winter mercato period and the choice of target positions will determine the tactical plan for the second half of the 2023-2024 season.
Will they respect Gattuso's DNA and credo with his 433/4231 or the 352 'adopted by default' ?
It's not that, but I'd love to play this new FM opus

December 12, 2023

Thank you @Dr Naysay for this message and encouragement, it's true that I feel a bit alone. It would be nice to have more exchanges and sharing of ideas

December 7, 2023

Against Lyon yesterday, Gattuso came up with a surprise 352.
Although it's not a system he's very fond of, the players felt they were playing in roles they like, simply in their best positions.
Without going into too much detail about the match, Aubameyang-Vitinha proved to be decisive partners.
Will this tactical move be repeated in future matches ?

November 22, 2023

It's a shame, your work is incredible. Thank you so much @Rashidi. I hope you change your mind soon

November 22, 2023

Le 23/04/2019 à 19:22, Cleon a dit :

It's confusing too sometimes writing stuff down about combinations and trying to find the right wording.

Are you doing video versions of this btw? I think it would look pretty cool in a video format. As you can hammer home the differences then and maybe even do a side by side comparison

Le 23/04/2019 à 19:23, Rashidi a dit :

Yeah i plan to...need to finish writing the headache roles. All the attacking ones with move into channels.

Admittedly a little old, but so exciting and interesting for the whole community here. Has this project fallen into oblivion @Rachid ?

Thanks.

November 19, 2023

Le 17/11/2023 à 21:40, Poison a dit :

@Batigoal__ You are looking for simply more direct /slightly more direct passing? They attempt them but it takes time and cohesion too, I think the limitation isn't there from what I've seen so far.

Thanks @Poison for your reply. More direct passes, yes, which are played on the ground and not over the lines, while maintaining a fairly short game.
The BDP must keep in mind that its passing game must be short but direct, with passing intentions in sniper mode.

November 17, 2023

Watching a few games to try and feed the thread on Gattuso's tactical recreation, I noticed that a lot of line-breaking passes from central defenders are attempted.

Aside from the risk-taking involved in passing in the IPs, the possible traits that a player can acquire (with or through mentoring), or even certain roles such as BPD, what would be the recommendations for increasing this type of 'quick' 'flash' 'laser' passes to the ground ?
It may not be possible, as the ME limits the possibilities.

Thanks.

November 16, 2023

Thank you for this message @WhyMe

Tactical designers, wake up, to satisfy everyone

November 15, 2023

Thanks for your contribution @寸身辛木
At this stage of the season, Gattuso is proposing a flat 442 defensive organisation.
It appears to be his preferred defensive system, used in particular during his time at Milan and Napoli.
Didn't he go against the grain at Valencia ? That remains to be confirmed.

November 13, 2023

I haven't abandoned the thread, nor have I forgotten about it - quite the contrary.
I was hoping for a little more interest and participation so that together we could try to define a tactic that is as close to reality as possible.
Since Gattuso's arrival, we've been offered two schemes: in attack, a 433 with the Veretout/Rongier/Kondogbia trio in midfield, and a 4231 with Harit in a creative role. In defence, a flat 442.

A few analyses from the web.

Offensive organisation
Width : Width is important, as is the number of players projected into the area.

Construction : The construction starts from the goalkeeper, with a tendency to take the ball out to the left to exploit the space on the opposite side for Clauss, a profile that likes to attack the space left free (same picture above).

Depth : Space is attacked behind the defenders.

Leaning point : In order not to slow down the transition and the projection of his team-mates, the attacker drops back, drawing a defender to his back and creating space for one of the off-centre players.

Defensive organisation

Opposing build-up phase : Make it difficult for the opposition to build up in the central area of the pitch, as the mobile team block (fairly compact, with players grouped together and close together) can quickly move the ball carrier to one side. The idea is to manage a large part of the pitch while being able to occupy as many corridors as possible (blocking passing lines).

Defensive transition : Seek to lock the ball carrier to one side, while maintaining numerical superiority in the area where the opposition's transition takes place.

Coordinated pressing : Collective pressing, with the whole team moving towards the ball carrier. The aim is to isolate the ball carrier on one side in order to make a mistake or clear in coordination with pressing on all potential receivers.

Don't be shy, come and add to the discussion

Révélation

Sources :

https://x.com/_SamuelAS/status/1710698856315228208?s=20

https://youtu.be/DFVd11fOW8I?feature=shared

November 6, 2023

Thanks for the suggestion @Rashidi, I've opened a thread here

November 6, 2023

Hi guys,

It would be interesting to be able to "extract" the particular attributes of the roles that are coded by proposing them in the PIs to be activated.
For example, a Segundo Volante could very well remain eccentric during the construction phase by forming a line of 3 in defence by activating the attribute in the PIs that is originally associated with the halfback role. Segundo Volante's role would remain that of an explosive midfielder, but would have the special feature of being able to have a mechanism linked only to the halfback role, rather than all of it.

All the features of all the roles would then be available in the PIs.

Thanks for reading.

November 5, 2023

Le 29/10/2023 à 12:39, Rashidi a dit :

I did a halfback video on my channel where I explained the few ways a halfback can move in the game. If he is playing as part of a double dm system he will drop back and act like a wide centreback in build up play. With the right roles like a WM with sit narrow or an IW who will play narrower in midfield. With the halfback dropping Deép a WM IW or a WP in the central midfield could all come inside.

Le 29/10/2023 à 18:36, Batigoal__ a dit :

Thank you @Rashidi

In addition, I had forgotten. I don't know if it's possible for Football Manager in the future, but it would be interesting to be able to "extract" the particular attributes of the roles that are coded by proposing them in the PIs to be activated.
For example, a Segundo Volante could very well remain eccentric during the construction phase by forming a line of 3 in defence by activating the attribute in the PIs that is originally associated with the halfback role. Segundo Volante's role would remain that of an explosive midfielder, but would have the special feature of being able to have a mechanism linked only to the halfback role, rather than all of it.
I don't know if that's clear.

October 29, 2023

Thank you @Rashidi

October 29, 2023

Thank you @Rashidi for another great piece of work and for all that you have to say here and elsewhere.
It's interesting to see the halfback stall in the build-up phase on the left or right in a double-pivot system.
Can this positional movement be reproduced with another role solely in this build-up phase ?
In Olympique de Marseille's last Europa League match against AEK, Rongier and Kondogbia dropped back to set up 3 defenders, allowing Lodi and Ndiaye to make inside calls.