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WhyMe

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  1. I would be interested in this too.
  2. The reason you aren't doing so well is that tactic is set up to cram the middle of the pitch, it has no width and no variety to its attack as both side are symmetrical. I am not a fan of or an expert at the 4-2-3-1 but IMO you need to change on of the inside forwards to a winger (probably Candreva) and one of the inverted wingbacks to a regular wingback (probably on attack). This will give you a bit of variety on the flanks and some width on both sides for breaking defensive teams down. However, your biggest problem in terms of roles and duties is the central midfield 2, with one on support and the other on attack they are crowding the centre of the pitch and not providing any cover at all to the defense. Providing defensive cover and an option for recycling the ball in their primary job and they won't be doing it. The one on the side of the attacking wingback needs to be on defend and the other at the most aggressive needs to be on support. You might get away with a BBM or RPM if the inverted wingback provides enough cover but it would be risky. However, by far your biggest problem is the number of TIs you have as they simply don't make any sense. Look for overlap isn't going to work in that setup as inverted wingbacks aren't going to overlap anyone so it simply does nothing useful and should be removed (still true if you make my suggested alterations above). Play much narrower is counter productive as you will meet lots of defensive teams playing as Inter and you will need to break them down. To do that you need width rather than narrowness so that should be replaced with play wider or even much wider, especially if you stay on defensive. Much higher tempo while on defensive might be ok but with the narrowness it is probably just causing you to lose the ball a lot as your players try to ping it around in a cramped space. Close down much more and get stuck in is risky and will likely just lead to lots of cards unless your tacklers are exceptional. It looks like you want to play a high pressure short passing game and if that is indeed the case I would have a look at Cleon's possession thread. For now I would just start with shorter passing and dribble less see how it goes. You may need to add others such as roam from position, lower tempo or work ball into box if it isn't quite working as you want. If you are not after this sort of football then you need to review your team instructions for that purpose. Finally, I would review personnel as your striker, Icardi, is a fantastic poacher/AF but your tactic isn't exactly playing to his strengths. Either bring in a forward more appropriate to a CF-s role or change your tactic to take advantage of his strengths. For example you could have a front four of AF-a AP-s - AM-s - W-a Alternatively, you could swap the AP-s for an IF-s and see how that goes. Have something fairly solid in the midfield 2 and experiment with an attacking wingback behind the AP-s and either a support wingback/fullback behind the W-a or an inverted wingback and see what happens. Obviously there are loads of other combinations that could work and this is just an example as I can only guess at how you want to play but it should give you a starting point to experiment when you see the reasons why it is currently not working. Hopefully this helps, good luck
  3. Hi DesertRed, I think your problem is currently you have a number of team instructions that either don't do anything with the formation you have or are unhelpful for the type of football you want to play and the team you are. This means you will lose the ball more often than you should and thus invite pressure. Firstly, the look for overlap instruction doesn't do anything when you don't play 2 men on the flanks, it is totally redundant for formations with wingbacks. Secondly your formation is already narrow so by telling your team to play narrower you are constricting the space making it harder for your team. This is exacerbated by the fact that you are playing as Man United so you can expect a lot of teams to play defensive football against you which means you need to create space not restrict it. Your midfield formation combined with roles and duties is probably unbalanced as well depending on whether or not you have any PIs for the central two but the DMC is certainly a problem. Firstly, both the two central mids are on support duty as are both the wingbacks and so your forwards are probably getting a bit isolated. Either give one of them an attack duty or at the very least a PI to "get further forward". Ideally, I would give the left hand mid an attack duty (or PI) and the right hand wingback an attack duty as well to get your forwards more support. Finally I would make the DLP a support duty as well. A support DLP will still stay behind the ball (due to his hold position PI) but he will provide a more effective possession recycling option due to his slightly more advanced position and might even get the odd assist as well. Last but not least the defense, change your 3 CBs to a ST-C-ST combination with the central cover defender being your best defensive physical specimen (i.e. good height and speed along with defensive attributes), add to this a close down less instruction to your wingbacks and you should become more solid defensively. This will mean that when your wingbacks get ganged up on two on one the centre back on their side will come to help at least some of the time. There are a few things that you might want to bear in mind if you still struggle. If you are struggling for space against defensive sides then changing the forward combo might be useful e.g. change the DLF to a CF-s or the AF-a to a CF-a/treq. I wouldn't do this all the time necessarily but it can be worth a go when you are struggling for chances. Hope this helps.
  4. I totally agree with both the previous two guys in regards to the problem with crossing to no one. I think it is Bigpapa that makes a key point though. Both of those players are fairly well rounded and could easily be retrained as wing backs which would allow you to play two strikers possibly with an AMC. This would give you plenty of targets to cross to and as long as you have two players that are good defensively in MC behind the front three you should be able to get away with their slightly weaker defensive qualities. Personally I would play the one with 12 tackling on support and the other guy on attack on the same side as a support striker. If you want to play them as wingers then I feel you will need to switch to a back 4 to get another man central to get on the end of the crosses. Personally I would go with a 4-4-1-1 with an AMC on attack behind a CF-s. There may be some mileage to playing around with at least 1 inverted wingback if you have the player but that would be a more difficult system to set up.
  5. Glad to hear it, good luck in the champions league!
  6. You have a couple of redundant team instructions and one or two that are a bit iffy. Look for overlap and prevent short keeper distribution will do nothing with your formation. Overlap only works when you have two wide players on each flank otherwise it does nothing. Prevent keeper short distribution in my experience only does anything when you have enough players in forward positions in your formation, usually AML, AMR and STC at the least, whenever I have tried to use it without players in those positions the keeper just pops it out to whichever player is unmarked, either fullback or centre back. Playing narrower will work in your formation but as you are already using a narrow formation it often puts the players too much on top of each other and can lead to your attack being shut down far too easily. Work ball into box does reduce the number of crosses but that can be a good thing as your players will still cross if they get into a good position and they decide that the chance of a successful cross is high. In other words there are less hit it and hope crosses which is good. The bad news is that without an attack duty on one of your wingbacks the chances of them getting into such good positions is less. Normally I would have the wingback on the same side as my support duty striker on attack as the link up play is more effective that way. I do however disagree that you should play a stopper in the middle of your back three. I prefer to play stoppers on the outside and a cover player in the middle, because if the central player charges forward to close down the ball if he doesn't win it then he leaves a huge gap in the middle of your defense for an opposition runner to exploit.
  7. Interestingly I had this exact problem recently when playing a 4-1-2-2-1 asymmetric system. It was particularly tricky against teams playing either 4-2-3-1 or sometimes 4-4-2. For me I ended switching to a 3 at the back system so I had more passing options further back in order to dodge the press. I used 3-3-3-1 wide with DM/WB and AML/AMR players in the same formation to that used by Ozil to the Arsenal in his Bielsa thread (though not quite the same roles). However, I am still playing possession football and indeed haven't greatly changed my team instructions from my standard system which struggled badly against the same press. The only change I made was to push up my defensively line a bit and add the offside trap. I'm even still using the raumdeuter that is the corner stone of my primary system. The raum gives me a ball over the top option which even on short passing the players will still happily play if it is on (especially with pass into space also on). So I suppose my main advice is more deep passing options and make sure you have an option for a ball over the top when it is on.
  8. If he is young enough you can tutor with someone more professional.
  9. The Raumdeuter is one of those roles that there is a CA minimum for it to be a recommended role (I think 130) much like the complete forward, but that doesn't mean that a player with less CA can't play the role effectively at an appropriate level. The trick is getting a player with the appropriate distribution of attributes including off the ball, work rate and finishing. Such a combination can be hard to find at the lower levels but it is possible.
  10. No tested this but in theory the following roles would do what you want (from left to right) WB-a DC-d DC-d FB-d DM-s (PI hold position) DLP-s* CM-a** IF-a*** W-s DLF-s**** Alternative roles *CM-s if you don't want a play maker but might need hold position PI ** BtB-s with get further forward PI *** Raumdeuter if you have the player **** Defensive forward which you can PI to play how you want essentially will need hold up the ball You might need to give either the DLP or DM a defend duty but with the full back on defend this will hopefully not be needed with the hold position PI's, you will need to experiment You could also bring the wide players back to ML/MR and PI a wide midfielder to be an inside forward but it might well leave the forward a bit isolated, though you could just drop the winger back It won't be a perfect 3-5-2 but hopefully it will get close. Let me know if it works as I am now curious.
  11. On my first save on this years FM I used a 3-2-2-1-2 WB formation for about 7 or 8 seasons before I started a new save and have since used 4-3-1-2 and a 4-1-2-2-1 asymmetric. I had a lot of success with it, especially defensively where I conceded the least goals all season for like 5 or 6 in a row. Not quite as potent offensively but still pretty good.
  12. To be fair Chelsea's duties are just asking for a beasting. No midfield cover and Fabregas isn't exactly good defensively and if that is the Bayern Munich Thiago neither is he, If I were the opposition I would sit deep and counter hard and that is probably exactly what they did.
  13. Inverted Wing Backs

    I'd never used one until recently either and DLO's summary is a good one. I recently have been using a 4-1-2-2-1 asymmetric with DMCR MC ML AMR AMCL. I have the inverted wing back on the left behind the ML who is a winger on attack. It can be an incredibly effective role and mine has got a fair few assists and even goals in the position. Basically you need a similar player to a roaming playmaker particularly with good passing, decisions, vision, work rate, stamina and at least decent pace/acceleration in order to recover his defensive position. What mine does is provide me an addition man in midfield giving me 4 midfield men with the winger on attack still providing some width. On the other flank I have regular wing back on attack behind a Raum (a very attacking flank covered by the DM (DLP-d)). It doesn't work against all strategies and can struggle a bit vs a high press but I really enjoy how it plays and the strategy as a whole scores ALOT of goals. All in all I would use it if you want an extra man in midfield to dominate possession and create chances.
  14. Supporting BWM doesn't have hold position hard coded and indeed can have get further forward added as a PI, but even so Jorg is absolutely right on his summation of your problem. just a single support BWM is not enough of a runner in such a system.
  15. Like you I'd only been playing narrow shapes until recently, but I've come across this as well using an asymmetric 4-1-2-2-1 with the winger in the ML position often positioning himself very wide on defense. This is fine if the opposition is playing a winger as well but against someone playing any sort of player that comes inside it can cause defensive issues. Unfortunately, the only solution I have found to this is to tell my winger to man mark the opposing wide man. It does work but it isn't ideal obviously but it might help you when you are having a similar issue. It does break the 2 banks of four plan though
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