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WhyMe

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  1. If he is young enough you can tutor with someone more professional.
  2. The Raumdeuter is one of those roles that there is a CA minimum for it to be a recommended role (I think 130) much like the complete forward, but that doesn't mean that a player with less CA can't play the role effectively at an appropriate level. The trick is getting a player with the appropriate distribution of attributes including off the ball, work rate and finishing. Such a combination can be hard to find at the lower levels but it is possible.
  3. No tested this but in theory the following roles would do what you want (from left to right) WB-a DC-d DC-d FB-d DM-s (PI hold position) DLP-s* CM-a** IF-a*** W-s DLF-s**** Alternative roles *CM-s if you don't want a play maker but might need hold position PI ** BtB-s with get further forward PI *** Raumdeuter if you have the player **** Defensive forward which you can PI to play how you want essentially will need hold up the ball You might need to give either the DLP or DM a defend duty but with the full back on defend this will hopefully not be needed with the hold position PI's, you will need to experiment You could also bring the wide players back to ML/MR and PI a wide midfielder to be an inside forward but it might well leave the forward a bit isolated, though you could just drop the winger back It won't be a perfect 3-5-2 but hopefully it will get close. Let me know if it works as I am now curious.
  4. On my first save on this years FM I used a 3-2-2-1-2 WB formation for about 7 or 8 seasons before I started a new save and have since used 4-3-1-2 and a 4-1-2-2-1 asymmetric. I had a lot of success with it, especially defensively where I conceded the least goals all season for like 5 or 6 in a row. Not quite as potent offensively but still pretty good.
  5. To be fair Chelsea's duties are just asking for a beasting. No midfield cover and Fabregas isn't exactly good defensively and if that is the Bayern Munich Thiago neither is he, If I were the opposition I would sit deep and counter hard and that is probably exactly what they did.
  6. Inverted Wing Backs

    I'd never used one until recently either and DLO's summary is a good one. I recently have been using a 4-1-2-2-1 asymmetric with DMCR MC ML AMR AMCL. I have the inverted wing back on the left behind the ML who is a winger on attack. It can be an incredibly effective role and mine has got a fair few assists and even goals in the position. Basically you need a similar player to a roaming playmaker particularly with good passing, decisions, vision, work rate, stamina and at least decent pace/acceleration in order to recover his defensive position. What mine does is provide me an addition man in midfield giving me 4 midfield men with the winger on attack still providing some width. On the other flank I have regular wing back on attack behind a Raum (a very attacking flank covered by the DM (DLP-d)). It doesn't work against all strategies and can struggle a bit vs a high press but I really enjoy how it plays and the strategy as a whole scores ALOT of goals. All in all I would use it if you want an extra man in midfield to dominate possession and create chances.
  7. Supporting BWM doesn't have hold position hard coded and indeed can have get further forward added as a PI, but even so Jorg is absolutely right on his summation of your problem. just a single support BWM is not enough of a runner in such a system.
  8. Like you I'd only been playing narrow shapes until recently, but I've come across this as well using an asymmetric 4-1-2-2-1 with the winger in the ML position often positioning himself very wide on defense. This is fine if the opposition is playing a winger as well but against someone playing any sort of player that comes inside it can cause defensive issues. Unfortunately, the only solution I have found to this is to tell my winger to man mark the opposing wide man. It does work but it isn't ideal obviously but it might help you when you are having a similar issue. It does break the 2 banks of four plan though
  9. Well the good news is I went back to the drawing board and I was able to produce something that actually works and is based on my original principles! I took your advice about the AMC potentially getting in the way of the Raum so I moved him to the AMCL slot and moved the striker back central. I also didn't feel I was getting enough support to the forward players from the two DMCs so I moved the central one forward to the MC position and made him a box to box CM, again central so as to be close enough to the Raum to provide him with passes but not so close as to get in his way. Finally, I gave my winger an attack duty to make sure he was getting close enough to the opposition box as to whip crosses in from around the D rather than deep and very wide. This gave me a more standard looking asymmetric 4-1-2-2-1 as seen below: GK standard - distribute to fullbacks LB - Inverted WB - shoot less (lack of options was causing long shots, so probably not necessary if I get the tactic right) - this role moves into midfield to create the left hand midfield player of the diamond 2*CB defend - pass shorter for possession RB - WB-a - overlaps the raum to create scoring chances for him which is precisely what I wanted RDCM - DLP-d, covers for the WB-a and can start attacks from the back. CM - BBM ML - W-a - AMR - Raum-a AMCL - AP-s draws the ball and thus the opposition to the left side of the pitch (as suggested by Rashidi in another thread) to give the raum space and provides the pass either to the winger or the wing back to put in the ball for the raum, hasn't got a direct assist yet but has got a couple of goals. STC - CF-s - the problem position as while in the 3 games I have played he has got an assist, he hasn't managed a goal or even had much in the way of good chances. I also switched to standard fluid to close the gaps between the symmetric positions which seemed to be a key difference after I observed it during the match. Team instructions wise I kept close down more but added shorter passing and dribble less for the possession my board want. The good news is that I am now getting the sort of football I was after and have created some glorious chances, but I do still get a few more longshots than I would like even after adding some shoot less PIs to the most guilty players which suggests a lack of options sometimes. My main concern so far is that the AP-s hasn't had a direct assist yet and the striker doesn't seem to be getting good chances. I am considering trying some different roles for the striker, probably DLF-a, CF-a and AF-a as I feel this will give the AP-s something more to aim at right in front of him. The downside is it might limit the chances for the Raum so I will have to see how it goes. The other thing I am considering is to go the whole hog and go very fluid to potentially get the players closer together to give them more passing options. Anyone have any thoughts? Quick update: I tested the alternative striker roles and much to my surprise the AF-a combined best with the rest of the setup and indeed my striker is now scoring at almost a goal a game as is my Raum. I am scoring an average of over 3 goals a game and my defense isn't too bad either. It is a bit vulnerable against the better sides, for example I beat Real Madrid 4-3 at home in the group stages of the champions league and then lost 1-0 to them away from home. Mainly this vulnerability comes down the flanks. However, this might in part be due to the players I have in the middle of the pitch not being that great defensively, ideally I need a better DLP and BBM from a defensive perspective but still it is generally going very well now. I do need to learn about my system a bit more as I am not sure what changes I can make to make it more solid defensively when things aren't going so well without compromising the system as a whole. I have added a few PIs to add some better marking and closing down to the BBM, AP-s and W-a which has made a bit of a difference but bigger changes might be necessary occasionally.
  10. The roles and duties you suggested on standard flexible for 3 or 4 games on a dummy save (FM touch to avoid familiarity issues). Only TI was close down more to start with but I also tried it with shorter passing and other possession instructions as that is how the board want me to play. Created no quality chances from open play and the only goal was a corner.
  11. I tried it last night and unfortunately it was just as bad as my old system. No good chances created and no goals. Defense was still fairly solid but offensively it was again totally ineffective. Back to the drawing board it seems.
  12. Thank you for your suggestion, sorry for the slow response. I have considered such a formation, although I've never been fond of 2 wide players in the AM strata for defensive purposes. I might give it a go though and experiment with the winger in both the ML and AML slots. What mentality/shape and team instructions would you suggest playing with that? Bearing in mind I need at least decent possession to keep my board happy.
  13. The situation The year is 2020, I have been playing in another league and doing exceedingly well with a 4-3-1-2 tactic but I was getting bored at the club and I needed a new challenge and I was offered the position at Bayern so I took it. The problem is Bayern have quality wingers and a top draw Raumdauter as their best players and I haven't used such players in this version of FM. However, I thought lets give it a whirl and see if I can get it to work. As I am writing this I am suspect you can guess the answer to that question! The plan Well I looked at the players and I thought maybe I can make a slightly lopsided 4-2-3-1 that attacks like a 4-4-2 diamond. So I set about choosing the roles that would create the movement I wanted and low and behold I got it! Unfortunately, it turns out the movement I thought would be really effective actually isn't, at all, in fact it sucks It simply doesn't create chances and loses the ball ALOT which is a problem since my board expect me to play possession football. Now I wasn't too bothered about possession as long as I was getting enough to stop the board getting fed up with me I would have been happy, anything around 52%+ would have been enough as long as I was creating chances and winning. Unfortunately neither of these things is happening. So this is how I set up: GK standard - distribute to fullbacks LB - Inverted WB - shoot less (lack of options was causing long shots, so probably not necessary if I get the tactic right) - this role moves into midfield to create the left hand midfield player of the diamond 2*CB defend - pass shorter for possession RB - WB-a - no pi RDCM - DM-s - get further forward (this was to move him towards the right sided midfield slot of the diamond DCM - DM-d the holding player also the base of the diamond ML - W-s - get further forward - on attack this is supposed to represent one of the attacking wingbacks in the diamond, in defense he covers the left wing ahead of his fullback AMR - Raum-a - the other key part of the system - he is supposed to be one of the main goal threats and of course on attack when he gets more central he is supposed to represent one of the strikers in the diamond AMC - AP-s - the tip of the diamond in attack but also gets back to help in defense STR - CF-s - this chap was supposed to be a goal threat but also to move around to create space for the Raum (also tried him in the left STR spot but that didn't work either and also tried as DLF-a) I started on simply standard flexible with no TIs to see what happened but since it went so badly in terms of chance creation etc I didn't really know what to try. I did try adding possession instructions like shorter passing and less dribbling but it didn't help so there must be a fundamental flaw with my plan. What I am hoping for I am hoping to be able to keep the inverted wing back, winger and Raum if at all possible but I am completely open to all other positional and role changes and also to pushing the winger up to AML and/or giving him an attack duty. If it is not possible to get such a system working then fair enough I will have to try something else but that is what I was hoping to do. I look forward to the discussion and advice.
  14. My apologies, I had indeed missed them. *goes to check your other threads for PIs too as it appears I am half blind
  15. Out of curiosity, your threads tend to leave out player instructions and I find this one of the more interesting aspects of a tactical system as it tell you which aspects of the roles you are trying to exaggerate and which you are trying to reduce. You mentioned the shoot less instruction on the Raums in your last post. Are there any others? Any for any other players?
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