Irn Rvd
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Posts posted by Irn Rvd
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Brilliant idea!!
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On 05/01/2021 at 21:00, ACKCHYUALLYSOCCERCOACH said:
DLF(S)
IW(A) IF(A)
DLP(S) CAR(S)
HB(D)
WB(A) BPD(D) CD(D) CWB(S)
SK(D)
Mentality: Attacking
Offensive Organisation: Narrow, Pass Into Space, Play Out Of Defence, Slightly Shorter, Low Crosses
Transitions: Counter Press, Counter
Defensive Organisation: Higher DL, Higher LOE, More Urgent Pressing, Prevent Short GK Distribution
Options: Midfield is very open to interpretation depending on personnel, add "Play Down Wings", whipped/mixed crosses, DL and LOE can be altered, pressing can be altered.
These team instructions look very promising. Do you think the dlp and hb will demand the ball too often? Might slow down the transitions. Not sure if the game classes hb as playmakers. Also do you think klopp plays with a dlp? Is this with Thiago in irl possibly?
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On 05/01/2021 at 19:54, Jean0987654321 said:
I'm not big on using a flat front 3. It's not even the closet realistic shape in defense (if we're talking about Liverpool's 433 shape) and that could well smoke you on the counter. I believe using two wingers with narrower instructions and PPMs could get the job done better and not have you skinned in defense
I tested a few games with formation. It definitely is the closest to the real klopp shape on fm as you can get with and without possession but as you said it can lead to devastating counter attacks from both sides. Main issue defensively was actually the oppositions centre midfielders peeling wide and crossing it. Our midfielders and fullbacks get done by the overloads and the opposition midfielders just play beckham like crosses. Doesn’t seem to matter if the striker is marked or not. Wingers with narrow could be an interesting choice but they will defend pretty wide? As the narrow pic is only for when we have the ball.
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49 minutes ago, Novem9 said:
What about PI 'get further forward' ? Is it collibrate IW? Btw in my last tactic I used Winger role and he was good in balance between wide play and cuts inside. So you can check W for Mane too. I dont like use two IF , but in the end you need to change a tactic as you see and as you think it could be better
Glad to know
upd - or even try IW/W (a)
I will give it a shot. Thank you!
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5 hours ago, Experienced Defender said:
Everyone probably has their own version of the potential Klopp/LFC repication, but mine would be something like this, at least as a starting point:
F9 TQ AF
CAR DLPde BBM
WBat BPDde CDde WBsu
SKsu
Attacking - PoD, slightly shorter passing, run at defence, slightly narrower width, pass into space - counter, counter-press & distribute quickly - higher DL, higher LOE, defend wider & offside trap
Possible role tweaks - BBM into CAR and/or CAR into BWM support.
Any suggestions on how I can get the three forward players to work a little harder off the ball? They are rarely pressing and still have green stamina (if you get what that means) by the end of a match.
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5 hours ago, Novem9 said:
I didn't, but if, I would start with this
Problem I am having with this is the left winger is dropping a little too deep for my liking. Overall play is very nice though.
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Just now, Irn Rvd said:
Haaland is an actual beast in this game. He’s like a cheat code. I tried to use him in a deep lying role but he’s just so effective when on the last man as a AF. He so great can score all types of goals.
Not unlike real life to be fair!!
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34 minutes ago, retrodude09 said:
This is interesting because I've thought about using something similar for Liverpool when starting out with them however mine was in a 4-3-1-2 with Firmino as the 10 behind Mane & Salah. I never really tried it though & now have Haaland in my team so unlikely to.
Haaland is an actual beast in this game. He’s like a cheat code. I tried to use him in a deep lying role but he’s just so effective when on the last man as a AF. He so great can score all types of goals.
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1 hour ago, Katsuo10 said:
I'm going to try to be different with another formation.
Classic 4-2-3-1
I still have doubts about the 2 cm in middle, i've had better results with BBM and DLP. (which surprised me)
With a slightly more stable approach, DLP(s) + CM (D), the results were less convincing especially defensively.
Not sure also with the choice of pass into space and work ball into box, i might be tempted to remove "Work ball into box" to look more like Klopp.
I can see what you are trying to do. This is similar to klopps secondary tactic he uses with salah as AF and firmino at cam. I have been finding that it’s easier to put the opponents back line under pressure with a 4231 rather than a 433 as the CAM starts higher up and is generally closer to the opponents deep lying playmaker.
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2 hours ago, Experienced Defender said:
For defending the flanks by the outer strikers, I would rather tell them to specifically mark respective opposition FBs/WBs (positions, not players). Defending wider can help somewhat in that respect, but that was not the primary reason I opted for it.
Ah ok. Thanks for your insight!
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Interesting take. Do you think the defend wider will get the AF and f9 to defend the flanks a little better?
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4 minutes ago, Novem9 said:
I didn't, but if, I would start with this
This looks like a good start. Thank you! Do you think the DLP will become a ball magnet in the transitions?
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What roles/duties/team instructions would everyone use to recreate Klopp's Liverpool tactics in FM21? Has anyone had any success with this?
Here are is my initial concept that has worked to a certain extent. The Roles and duties will be different irl but trying to get a tactic that can work on FM21.
DLP(s)
IF(a) IF(a)
BBM BBM
DM(d)
WB(s) BPD(d) CD WB(s)
SK(s)
Mentality: Positive
In possession:
Pass into space
low crosses
work ball into box (Players were shooting from range too often)
Be more expressive (to counter the negative impacts of using WBIB)
Overlap Left/Overlap right (to push the IF into the half spaces more often)
Higher Tempo (Extremely High tempo was too direct when playing Park the bus teams)
Fairly Narrow
In Transition:
Counter
Counter Press
Out of Possession:
Higher Defensive Line
Much Higher line of Engagement
More Urgent
PIs:
BBM (stay wider) have changed these roles against park the bus teams. Have used Mezzelas in certain circumstances against specific teams.
Thoughts:
- RB is probably a CWS but i find that with this current setup unless the CWS is a top player he is really wasteful in possession and also drifts inside too much. This could be because of the Be More expressive instruction too.
- DM(d) i have found that having a player with playmaking player traits really helps the build up to the attacks. Not sure if this is the correct role though.
- Striker should be false nine but was finding that he was being passed by in the build up. Not sure if this is because of the roam from position and BME team instructions. DLF(s) gets the ball to feet more often. Drop deeper payer Trait works a treat.
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5 hours ago, josel15 said:
Sorry, @Rashidi, but where is your replication?
Just found this on Rashidi's youtube:
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Ah OK. That makes a lot of sense. Lower tempo + more direct passing seems to be the bus breaker doesn't it?
Jose Juan Macias how much you pay?
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12 hours ago, crusadertsar said:
Just had this performance in the league.
But what's more significant, we went into the game, facing this type of formation from Moreirense. I guess they threw in the towel early and just wanted to draw this one. Luckily my guys had a different idea.
Will see if I can upload one or two nice goals from this one later tonight.
oh my word!! Tremendous result since they completely parked the bus.
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Brilliant post!! Excited to see how the Napoli game turns out.
Not really on topic but how good is Resende?? He plays for Hertha Berlin in my save and has fired them to the top of the league. 27 goals in 24 games. Madness.
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Looking forward to it!!
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How did you get on with this playing style in your season? I am very interested in how you got on in Europe. This post is very well done. Thank you!!
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This is awesome great work.
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3 hours ago, crusadertsar said:
He actually is and it's great, we are getting some nice underlaps on that side with Odegaard often making unmarked runs into final third before passing or crossing. He even has 5 goals from open play. And he greatly contributes to overload on that side. My only concern with him is his inconsistency which is in the red. Not sure if that was set or unlucky random draw. So I actually already acquired his replacement, Hannes Wolf from Leipzig for when Odegaard's loan finishes this summer. He is a great young player so hopefully he does as well.
He knows plays one twos already which is great.
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17 hours ago, crusadertsar said:
So it turns out being stuck at home due to the pandemic sometimes is not so good on the morale. Those who read my last thread and saw me vent on FM20 might wonder if I would still continue this project. So I just wanted to reassure you that I'm not giving up
I just had a temporary lapse of morale. I did a team talk with myself and now I feel more confident about it. And most importantly having fun playing the game and excited to write about my experiences again.
My quest to find the magic Total Football formula continues ... with The Royal Society. My longest ongoing series since Young Devils. I'm almost finished my latest article where I will be giving some background to this save and explaining a little about how I'm trying to build a Total Football-focused club from the ground up. My tactic is also being rebalanced. This is my latest version.
Looking forward to the follow up.
Odegaard at IWB!!. He must be a ball magnet.0 -
2 hours ago, AceAvenger said:
It was meant to be.
Look at the state of those 2 weeks. It's either going to be two very good or very very bad weeks for me.
I'm rushing through this final season, just trying to get it finished so I can get started in the lower leagues again and develop the tactics from the lower leagues up.
oh my word lol. Let us know how you get on!!!
Bust the net did a video on recreating Marco Biesla tactics yesterday on youtube but I cant seem to find it now. The video shows how you can press really high while using specific man marking instructions. Very interesting. I tested against a few weak teams last night and their midfield could not make a pass.
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On 04/04/2020 at 08:16, AceAvenger said:
Heidenheim: 2022/2023 Update
Another season has passed, another year trying to develop the perfect gegenpressing squad. How did we do?
Pretty poorly actually.
As you can see from the above screenshots, some of the attributes I highlighted previously increased, while others decreased. Acceleration, stamina, anticipation and teamwork increased to 5th, 2nd, 3rd and 4th respectively; determination and work rate dropped to 7th and 3rd while we are rock bottom for aggression.
This is telling that I didn’t follow through with my squad building as I hope I would have. I’ll be looking to try and remedy this but honestly, in terms of ability, I’m happy with my squad.
How did we do in the league then?
We did one better than last season, both in terms of position and points, coming in 2nd and collecting one more point. However, we could have done better because we had a mini implosion after the Winterpause (winter break), were we were spanked 4-0 by a midtable Hannover and then lost two more after.
After that I went crazy trying to change the tactic to see what would improve the team, I tried having the IWs on support and removing the look for overlap, I tried having a Complete Forward (CF) on support upfront with a Shadow Striker (SS) behind him. I even went for a Very Attacking mentality, with everyone of support duties, just to see if fluidity was what the team needed. Nothing stuck, probably because they were familiar with the other set-ups.
I went back to the formation I started with; the only difference is I removed roam from position from my IWs because their off the ball (OTB) is nothing to write home about. Our form got better, we got to the quarter-finals of the Europa League after coming in 3rd in the CL, in a modestly tough group of Real Sociedad, Benfica and Liverpool. What really delighted me is that we got to the final of the DFB-Pokal, which meant we could finally get a chance to win our first piece of silverware.
We didn’t.
So, it’s onto next season. Honestly, I’m really thinking of starting another save, with a smaller team and really setting out a proper plan to building a team. The next year will be my 5th at Heidenheim, which is the longest I’ve been with a team since FM11 or 12 with Gladbach. I want to have a 10 year save, with a focus on youth development, which is difficult with Heidenheim as I don’t have a B team (or a II club as it’s called in Germany).
I will see how it goes, if I win something next year, I will definitely start a new save. Even though I wouldn’t have seen the new stadium come to fruition I would have at least set the building blocks as it is in the pipeline to be moved into in 2025.
Who would you guys like me to be, I have a few prerequisites for a club I’m going to jump into, it has to be:
- German.
- In the lower leagues, preferably 3. Liga but maybe 2. Bundesliga is it’s just been promoted or struggling with relegation.
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Has the following facilities:
- Minimum adequate, preferably average youth and training facilities.
- Minimum average, preferably adequate youth coaching (don’t ask me why this is inverted).
- Minimum fairly basic, preferably average youth recruitment.
- Has a II club.
If you look in the editor to find clubs with these specification, you will find this gives us 11 teams:
- VfB Stuttgart
- Hamburger SV
- Hannover 96
- 1. FC Nürnberg
- 1. FC Kaiserslautern
- SpVgg Greuther Fürth
- TSV 1860 München
- 1. FC Magdeburg
- FC Hansa Rostock
- SV Waldhof Mannheim
- FC Carl Zeiss Jena
From that list, Stuttgart and Hamburg are out from the get go. They’re massive clubs that are faltering at the moment, but nonetheless massive clubs. Hannover and Nürnberg are yoyo clubs between the Bundesliga and 2. Bundesliga and not struggling with relegation.
Of the teams we are left with, the one that stands out to me the most is Hansa Rostock. They’ve got the best facilities of the rest and they’re in the 3. Liga. They were giants of the DDR-Oberliga, although they won their only top flight title in the intermediate year before the former East German teams joined the Bundesliga but after the fall of the wall. I’ve wanted to play as a team from the former GDR for a long time, because it’s a joke that the only East German team in the Bundesliga is RB Leipzig. Red Bull, the company, only started 4 years before the fall of the wall.
What do you guys think, who should I be in the next save?
hansa rostock have good facilities? that sounds like a great save if they are in league3. I might jump on that bandwagon too lol. Hamburger SV looks like a really good potential save too.
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I just had a temporary lapse of morale. I did a team talk with myself and now I feel more confident about it. And most importantly having fun playing the game and excited to write about my experiences again.
Marcelo Bielsa's Tactical Philosophy in Football Manager 2017
in Tactics, Training & Strategies Discussion
Posted
This tactic. Wow. Brilliant recreation. Results are tremendous. Well done!