Playing against the high press / counter press - some help please

[MaskedReferee]

I'm after some general guidance on how to play against teams who press high and / or counter press. Often in these games I find myself constantly under pressure and unable to avoid or play through the press.

I've found that removing the 'Play Out of Defence' instruction helps avoid getting caught too deep in the press but as soon as the ball gets into the midfield I'm finding myself under immediate pressure and very quickly lose possession.

Generally, I'm playing on a positive mentality, with a slightly higher tempo, shorter passing and fairly narrow width.

How should I be adjusting the counteract the press? Would adopting a more direct passing style with a quicker tempo help? That feels like I'd be playing into their hands though as the press is trying to rush my players so upping the tempo seems like it would just give up possession quicker. Likewise slowing the tempo down will just draw the press.

I understand I won't always be able to beat the press all the time...I just want to beat it some of the time!

[Bahnzo]

I always have this problem, too. The answer, for me anyways, is to go more direct and play wider. Generally with a higher tempo, counter attack and Playing into space. You'll have to live with not having the lion's share of possession, but that's the price for playing more route one. You want to bypass the midfield altogether and get the ball upfield and either hit them on the counter, or get a set play/throw in which allows you to setup your offense in their half, for a little bit anyways. 

Eventually, you'll get better players which are better on the ball, more composed and can deal with the press better and you won't have to play this way as much. But even then, I still do now and then when teams are very good defensively. 

Edited January 30 by Bahnzo

[Dr Naysay]

No context in your OP, like your tactic or what Club you're managing etc. If you need help we need some context please.

[ultrAslan]

 

[whatsupdoc]

In 24.2, "playing out" will cost you a lot more goals than it usually does. 

[Mst82]

On 29/01/2024 at 18:14, Dr Naysay said:

No context in your OP, like your tactic or what Club you're managing etc. If you need help we need some context please.

I don’t think context is always required, there is some generic advice available.

I would say replay the game over and over to understand how the mechanics work. Keep your current system and keep slightly tweaking and see how it affects things.

I would never use a positive mentality if you’re getting swamped by the press, and make sure you’ve got a high def line or you will get penned in.

Try to outnumber the oppo in midfield so you’ve always got a spare man to pass to - however, make sure the roles are right - you don’t want too many players on attacking duties in centre mid or too far away from everyone else. I use an anchor, DLP and CM in a 4-3-3 in such games for example. With my wide players the attacking threat.

Try a BPD on cover as he drops a bit deeper and can find a bit of space  

Try playing with a balanced or cautious mentality. Try playing with a target man on direct passing.

I don’t think there is one easy answer. Suck and see would be my advice - it’s very rare I use anyone’s tactics on here as every team is different and every game is different. It’s an old cliche on here but don’t put round pegs in square holes. Play to your strengths  

Your in game tweaks are more important than how you start the game, in the more recent FM’s, in my opinion. So adapt to how the game is unfolding. Watch full games. 

Edited February 4 by Mst82

[Dr Naysay]

On 03/02/2024 at 11:00, whatsupdoc said:

In 24.2, "playing out" will cost you a lot more goals than it usually does. 

You need to stop this bud, from what I have read from you in the last few days you aren't looking at the complete picture with regards to your tactics and you seem to think hitting tactical buttons are magic panaceas to resolving problems. Every single one of my tactics has play out from the back but with a careful analysis of the whole tactic, the players involved in that tactic and the mental side of where the players are both in terms of morale and the cohesiveness of the players. Honestly, it seems to me like you're frustrated(and I am not sure why considering how well you did with Fulham) and spamming threads with your discontent and it doesn't help people who need help.

 

[whatsupdoc]

1 hour ago, Dr Naysay said:

You need to stop this bud, from what I have read from you in the last few days you aren't looking at the complete picture with regards to your tactics and you seem to think hitting tactical buttons are magic panaceas to resolving problems. Every single one of my tactics has play out from the back but with a careful analysis of the whole tactic, the players involved in that tactic and the mental side of where the players are both in terms of morale and the cohesiveness of the players. Honestly, it seems to me like you're frustrated(and I am not sure why considering how well you did with Fulham) and spamming threads with your discontent and it doesn't help people who need help.

 

I'm fairly certain there's too many goals coming from mistakes in possession in deep areas, regardless of attributes. Feels like a ME issue as I definitely have the players/team to do it. 

[Dr Naysay]

18 minutes ago, whatsupdoc said:

I'm fairly certain there's too many goals coming from mistakes in possession in deep areas, regardless of attributes. Feels like a ME issue as I definitely have the players/team to do it. 

You're wrong, and I can provide evidence if you want, but personally I feel so many people come on here for validation rather improvement. Trust me when I say this because I am you from the future in that I was like this at lot longer than you have been. Until you put the legwork in to working it all out you will keep veering from this plug and play tactics to blaming everything on the match engine.

Edited February 4 by Dr Naysay

[whatsupdoc]

7 hours ago, Dr Naysay said:

You're wrong, and I can provide evidence if you want, but personally I feel so many people come on here for validation rather improvement. Trust me when I say this because I am you from the future in that I was like this at lot longer than you have been. Until you put the legwork in to working it all out you will keep veering from this plug and play tactics to blaming everything on the match engine.

Sure I'd love to see the evidence. Everything I've witnessed has led me to believe that player attributes are very secondary issues at the mo.

[Dr Naysay]

9 hours ago, whatsupdoc said:

Sure I'd love to see the evidence. Everything I've witnessed has led me to believe that player attributes are very secondary issues at the mo.

I'll put it together at some point today. Any particular stat or action you would prefer to see?

[whatsupdoc]

10 minutes ago, Dr Naysay said:

I'll put it together at some point today. Any particular stat or action you would prefer to see?

Cheers, you're welcome to just upload the save and I'll take a look if you like. 

[AzrulMaulud]

you can always try hoofing the ball forward. and watch them coming back or u might get lucky with flick ons.

or take the risk to experiment with working from the back. i think if you want to build from the back you need to have passing options. so player role or PI is important. this is what i use when fiorentina up the tempo and push higher up the field after we scored the equalizer.

i have both my strikers on roam.

after we scored the fluke own goal, fiorentina started to push high up the filed, upping their tempo with counter pressing. so i change to the tactic above, low block so all my players are compact together, mezzala and b2b roams. they drop deep or move into spaces to provide passing options. when we get near the halfway line my libero starts moving and create a box in midfield (2 boxes) , more passing options available. by this time if the attacking players, including the complete wingback on the right is in a good position, one of my midfields (usually the libero and the DLP) will start passing the ball direct, starting the counter attack. this created chaos as fiorentina players scrambling back. we got the 3rd n 4th goal on lower tempo. building from the back.

maybe its luck. but that's football

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i didnt start the game with the tactic above. was using the one for opponent who builds from the back. that one is high pressing and man markings. still haven't got it right.  i'm still learning how to adapt to how my opponents play. 

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Edited February 13 by AzrulMaulud