Does passing directness and tempo only apply to the middle third of the pitch?

[sifinnigan1]

How I understand it is that 'play out of defence' and 'work ball into box' has an effect on defensive and attacking player's passing and decision making. So if these two team instructions are used they should override tempo and passing directness depending on which player has the ball in either the defensive and attacking thirds. Could somebody clarify this?

[CARRERA]

No, they apply in all areas of the pitch. Instructions don’t override each other, they do always combine into a do more or less of something compared to the base modifier which is your team mentality and other (team) instructions.

[sifinnigan1]

If possible could you go into more detail on this? For example, how does the game combine the instructing players to remain patient and not force the issue whilst asking for high tempo, direct passing? These seem contradictory.

When play out of defense is used I can see the goalkeepers, defenders and defensive midfielders all have their passing sliders altered to shorter passing which does tell me it does have the ability to override the team's passing directness. It's a shame not to see exactly what the change in mentality or passing actually is when a player is in the final third with work the ball into the box being used.

[Aoyao]

Maybe it's a visual mistake.

[sifinnigan1]

what is a visual mistake?

[Cloud9]

8 hours ago, sifinnigan1 said:

If possible could you go into more detail on this? For example, how does the game combine the instructing players to remain patient and not force the issue whilst asking for high tempo, direct passing? These seem contradictory.

When play out of defense is used I can see the goalkeepers, defenders and defensive midfielders all have their passing sliders altered to shorter passing which does tell me it does have the ability to override the team's passing directness. It's a shame not to see exactly what the change in mentality or passing actually is when a player is in the final third with work the ball into the box being used.

Answer is no to your initial question. 

PI's take priority over Team instructions, although both impact how you'll play. If you want to create unique styles of play this is how it's done. 

Think of "play out of defence" and "work the ball into the box" as modifiers to your overall team instruction.

Edited May 11, 2023 by Cloud9

[CARRERA]

8 hours ago, sifinnigan1 said:

If possible could you go into more detail on this? For example, how does the game combine the instructing players to remain patient and not force the issue whilst asking for high tempo

I guess you refer to the "Work ball into Box" team instruction. Tempo is something entirely different compared to WBIB. Tempo is about how quick your players make a decision for the next move (whatever that may be), while WBIB just asks them to play for a good opening before trying to finish instead of rushing it.

8 hours ago, sifinnigan1 said:

When play out of defense is used I can see the goalkeepers, defenders and defensive midfielders all have their passing sliders altered to shorter passing which does tell me it does have the ability to override the team's passing directness.

Its important to understand, that there is nothing like short, direct, high or low (or any other instruction). Try to look at it as shortER or highER compared to your base layer of instructions, which automatically comes with your team mentality.
Let me try to showcase this by a game of numbers (never refer to it, the numbers are completely made up).

Think about passing risk on a scale from
1------------------20
The Team Mentality you set comes with a passing risk of 10
1---------10---------20
Player roles may of course also affect the passing risk, but for the sake of simplicity we'll leave them out
Now you add more direct passing via team instructions, which increases your teams passing risk to 15.
1--------------15----20
Adding Play out of defense will ask your defensive players to take less risks with their passing
Passing risk of the team --- 1--------------15----20
Passing risk of your defensive players --- 1----5--------------20
Whithout having more direct passing, the passing risk of your defensive players may be at 1 with Play out of Defense, for example.
1------------------20

 

Edited May 11, 2023 by CARRERA

[Aoyao]

@Jack Joyce        We need you to do something.

Edited May 12, 2023 by Aoyao

[Jack Joyce]

Instructions in FM tend to be modifiers on the existing level rather than overriding - e.g. if your team is told to play short, but you have a PI telling your DM to play more direct - they're still not going to play as direct as if your team was balanced passing directness with the same PI. PIs are assumed to be e.g. 'play more direct than the rest of the team is'.

The same applies to more or less any kind of instruction in the game, but I can't go into exact detail because we tweak/improve a lot of this every year and I don't want to give you any info that is then invalid in the future.

But generally, a team told to play short and carefully will behave differently when told to work ball into box compared to a team that was told to play direct and quickly.

[Aoyao]

When I set TI to Much More Direct,PI is Shorter Passing.

When I set TI to  Slightly More Direct,PI is Standard.

They can be so confusing. 

The same with TRIGGER PRESS.

Edited May 13, 2023 by Aoyao

[Aoyao]

from FM16

Edited May 15, 2023 by Aoyao