2-1-3-1-3 formation

I've been deliberating about posting my 2-1-3-1-3 tactic here for a week or two, so while I have a little time this Sunday, I thought I'd throw it open to the other posters. If I were to post it, would anyone be interested in discussing this tactic, and why it seems to work in FM 2010?

I've just finished the Serie A season with Milan unbeaten using the tactic (same tactic, home or away), which is something I've never even been close to doing with other tactics. Unfortunately, Real Madrid put me out of the Champions League on away goals. Damn you Ronaldo.

Anyway, if there's enough interest in discussing it, I'll post it. So leave some comments here to encourage me!

2 CBs, 1 DM (anchorman?), wide midfield, AM, 3 strikers?

Sounds similar to some of the "Ajax" tactics that Zico and a few others have developed to quite some success, and I for one would like to see it.

I is intrested, i am looking for a tactic that does not require to

have a team full of superstars.

2 CBs, 1 DM (anchorman?), wide midfield, AM, 3 strikers?

Sounds similar to some of the "Ajax" tactics that Zico and a few others have developed to quite some success, and I for one would like to see it.

Almost.

2 CBs, 1 DM, 3 CMs, 1 AM, 3 ST

Any problems with opposition wide players? Usually when lacking fullbacks, the match engine has your wide midfielders tracking back. Or do you have the CMs flanking the other on defend?

Still very interested in seeing and possibly trying this.

Any problems with opposition wide players? Usually when lacking fullbacks, the match engine has your wide midfielders tracking back. Or do you have the CMs flanking the other on defend?

Still very interested in seeing and possibly trying this.

Aside from my two centre-backs, I have everyone closing down quickly, so even those wide midfielders in the opposition are closed down well enough.

The one problem I had was against Real Madrid, when Ronaldo burned me from the right wing. But that was probably more down to Ronaldo than anything too wrong tactically.

I want to see it . It reminds me of one of supertactics from CM .

post it up mate

Here you go: http://www.megaupload.com/?d=QIBBCY5L

Explanation to follow.

NB: This is an old FM-style tactic. I didn't use the Tactics Creator in FM 2010.

I fell into this tactic a little by accident. With AC Milan, I had been using a 4-1-3-2 formation to some success, but then I had an away game in the knockout stages of the Champions League and got beaten 3-0. Faced with going out, I decided to overload the attack at home, and got rid of my full-backs in exchange for a couple of extra attackers. I won 4-1 and went out on away goals, but was encouraged enough to keep playing around with the tactic. Last season (2013-14), I went through the league unbeaten using the tactic, winning 32 out of 36 games, scoring 107 goals.

Here's the team I used in 2013-14:

GK: Adler

CB: Mamadou Sakho or Felipe

CB: Thiago Silva

DM: Sandro or Moussa Sissoko

CM: Cesc Fabregas, Joao Moutinho, Steven Defour

AM: Yoann Gourcuff

LS: Artem Milevsky

ST: Pato

RS: Alberto Paloschi

For you centre-backs, you'll need players who are dominant in the air, and who mark well. Pace helps too.

Your defensive midfielder should have good marking and tackling, and should be able to pass the ball well. Once again, pace helps.

Your central midfielders should all have excellent passing and creativity, and should be able to finish too, since they are required to get into the box a lot.

Your strikers should be fast, with very good shooting and dribbling. They should also have a good off-the-ball stat.

The basic theory behind the tactic is that that your CBs and your DM mark your opponent's attacking players tightly, do all the dirty work in winning the ball, and then move the ball onto the midfield, who get forward to support the attackers as much as possible. With your highly creative CMs and AM, when the ball is with those players, the wide strikers will make runs inside the full-back, causing chaos for their defence as they are also trying to deal with the movement of your central striker.

The version of the tactic I have uploaded is actually a 2-2-2-1-3 formation. This is to be used when your opposition is playing with an AM. If they are playing a simple 4-4-2 formation, move one of your DMs into central midfield, to make it a 2-1-3-1-3. My basic rule of thumb for how many CBs and DMs I need is that you match the number of STs they have, and then add a DM to your formation for a little extra help. Therefore:

Opposition plays 2 STs: You play 2 DCs and a DM

Opposition plays 3 STs: You play 3 DCs and a DM

Opposition plays 2 ST and an AM: You play 2 DCs and 2 DMs.

I have my midfielders and strikers set to do various things, such as lots of through balls, lots of dribbling etc. These are in line with the players in my team, and will need to be changed for yours. There is no point, obviously, in asking a striker to dribble if he doesn't have that skill. Only ask a player to do lots of dribbles, for example, if he has a good dribbling stat.

I am sure I am forgetting something, so please feel free to ask questions on the thread. And let me know how you get on with the tactic! I'd really like to discuss when it works (for me, anyway) in FM 2010.

I assume you move the left-sided DM up to CM? Giving this a spin.

I assume you move the left-sided DM up to CM? Giving this a spin.

Yes. Although I'm not sure if it really matters which of the DMs you move up.

it's sad a tactic like that works.. really doesn't add to the realism. I guess it will stay that way until they make wideplay work better and the super narrow-overload-center is made less efficient.

it's sad a tactic like that works.. really doesn't add to the realism. I guess it will stay that way until they make wideplay work better and the super narrow-overload-center is made less efficient.

The formation sounds more exploitative than it actually is.

In any case, it's difficult to talk about the "realism" of the tactic, when no team lines up like this IRL. I make no bones about the fact that I'm Milan, and have accumulated a great squad over the past few game years; contrary to your point, I'd almost expect a team with this much talent to be pretty dominant.

For all I know, the tactic could be a disaster without exactly the right type of players.

Looking good so far, any thoughts on asking the wingers to swap?

Feel bad dropping my wingbacks, but maybe I'll see how they perform as the flanking CMs.

Looking good so far, any thoughts on asking the wingers to swap?

Feel bad dropping my wingbacks, but maybe I'll see how they perform as the flanking CMs.

If you have players with similar abilities, by all means have them swap positions. However, it is important that your central striker has good dribbling.

For example, in my latest season, I've signed Sergio Aguero. Both he and Pato have excellent pace, dribbling, and finishing, so I've set them up to swap positions. I've just sold Pavel Pogrebnyak after using him as a backup player last season - I wouldn't have had him swap positions with Pato during a game!

Indeed.

Am wondering if it would be at all worthwhile to try and drop the AM into the CM role, and then have two DMs, allowing the central striker to drop deep.

But like I said, otherwise looking very nice indeed, after a few games. Have had my wingbacks as the flanking CMs in the last two to good effect, though I did tweak some of the instructions very slightly, and also changed the keeper sliders to make him more sweeper-ish, but that's only because I have a rather nice newgen Sweeper Keeper.

That formation is remarkably like PB3 (I think it was PB3) from CM 01/02, which did tear up the place.

That formation is remarkably like PB3 (I think it was PB3) from CM 01/02, which did tear up the place.

Odd that you say that; I used to use a very similar formation in 01/02, but never thought it would work it any other game.

Am wondering if it would be at all worthwhile to try and drop the AM into the CM role, and then have two DMs, allowing the central striker to drop deep.

I find that the AM is vital for providing through balls to the strikers. Helps when you have Gourcuff to do it, though (!), so your mileage may vary.

Odd that you say that; I used to use a very similar formation in 01/02, but never thought it would work it any other game.

I used a 2-2-2-2-2 (all central) to moderate success. You'd be surprised what works really!

I find that the AM is vital for providing through balls to the strikers. Helps when you have Gourcuff to do it, though (!), so your mileage may vary.

Yep, noticed that too.

And have been using Gourcuff too, actually

Anyone have any more initial feedback? Of course, you won't see the best of it until a few game months along.

Well, quite a few people have been downloading this...how are you finding it? It really like to discuss why it works, because it's hardly a conventional tactic.

Well, I have tried creating something similar through the tactics creator. I manage low level teams (trying this with Hyde, BSN). Very early days but seems to be extremely promising.

One feels that it ought not to work, really. I suppose it's because the ME isn't very good with wide play.

Obviously the players I have aren't any too brilliant technically. But that doesn't seem to matter too much. Certainly the opposition seem to get very few CCCs against this.

Will see how it goes.