4231 Progressive Possession Football - Advice needed

[Irn Rvd]

I usually play 41221 in my saves but i was recently blown away by a young Ajax team using 4231 in the champions league. They played really entertaining football. The team defended and pressed well, created a range of different opportunities via different methods. I did win over the two legs, but only by scoring from set pieces but makes sense as they had a very short players, in an attacking lineup, with a poor young keeper in goal.

 

I would like to try create a progressive possession 4231 tactic or at least a base to use. 

 

Here is the tactic this Ajax team used below: (not sure about the mentalities of each role)

Scout report said vertical tiki taka.

               PF(a)

 

W(a)        AM(s)        W(s)

 

       DLP(D)  MEZ(s)

 

WB(s) CD(d) CD(d) FB(a)

              SK(s)

 

Team instructions in theory:

Mentality: Balanced

In possession: Short passing, Play out of defense, More expressive, work ball into box.

In Transition: Counter press? I was thinking nothing ticked here, possibly adding counter and/or counter-press depending on situation.

Out of possession: Higher defensive Line, offside trap.

Player instructions: Pressing more - Wingers, AM, PF(a) already in role. Split block.

 

Things I am not sure about:

- Wingers and FB/WB working together. These roles might get into the way of each other. 

- Does a Mezzela work with a winger and a FB? My head is telling me no. Im sure experienced defender said that Mezz or winger should be on different mentalities i.e. one on attack, one on support.

- Does AM(s) work well? from past experience, he doesn't seem todo a whole lot. Should this be AP?

- Im thinking im going to get spanked on the break, so is DLP + mez combination too weak defensively?

 

Please advise. Any feedback is appreciated. 

[Irn Rvd]

Ive actually found the type of style in a 4231 on this post now, if anyone is interested. 

 

[Experienced Defender]

6 hours ago, Irn Rvd said:

Here is the tactic this Ajax team used below: (not sure about the mentalities of each role)

Scout report said vertical tiki taka.

               PF(a)

 

W(a)        AM(s)        W(s)

 

       DLP(D)  MEZ(s)

 

WB(s) CD(d) CD(d) FB(a)

              SK(s)

 

Team instructions in theory:

Mentality: Balanced

In possession: Short passing, Play out of defense, More expressive, work ball into box.

In Transition: Counter press? I was thinking nothing ticked here, possibly adding counter and/or counter-press depending on situation.

Out of possession: Higher defensive Line, offside trap.

Player instructions: Pressing more - Wingers, AM, PF(a) already in role. Split block

Wait a minute... so this is not your tactic, but the tactic you presume your opponent (Ajax) used against you?

[Irn Rvd]

4 hours ago, Experienced Defender said:

Wait a minute... so this is not your tactic, but the tactic you presume your opponent (Ajax) used against you?

my description of this must have not been great. I played Ajax and they used this formation. They played amazing football, With average players. 
could this tactic with the roles and TI be used to play 4231 with a progressive possession style? I would really appreciate your feedback experienced defender if you have the chance. 
thanks for responding. 

[StabbyMcGinge]

Just a few tips I have been trying to create a tiki taka style and if you have pass into space ticked it completely breaks the tactic. Also using more expression means players more prone to making runs with the ball doing it more often which again isnt great for a possession style.

[Irn Rvd]

10 hours ago, StabbyMcGinge said:

Just a few tips I have been trying to create a tiki taka style and if you have pass into space ticked it completely breaks the tactic. Also using more expression means players more prone to making runs with the ball doing it more often which again isnt great for a possession style.

Thanks Stabby! So no "pass into space" and "more expressive". Will test this out. 

[Irn Rvd]

I have never really used "pass into space" this fm as I feel that they always pass into space when the opportunity arises anyway. Maybe im wrong but thats something ive noticed.

[Experienced Defender]

13 hours ago, Irn Rvd said:

my description of this must have not been great. I played Ajax and they used this formation. They played amazing football, With average players. 
could this tactic with the roles and TI be used to play 4231 with a progressive possession style?

I personally would never ever use such a tactic, regardless of the style of football. Playing an attacking fullback and a mezzala on the same side in a top-heavy system with no DM is a tactical no-no in my book. I guess you wrongly interpreted the roles and/or duties, because if they played in such kind of setup against me, I would destroy them on the counter 

On the other hand, of course you can play progressive possession football using a 4231, but with a lot more sensible setup. 

[Irn Rvd]

1 hour ago, Experienced Defender said:

I personally would never ever use such a tactic, regardless of the style of football. Playing an attacking fullback and a mezzala on the same side in a top-heavy system with no DM is a tactical no-no in my book. I guess you wrongly interpreted the roles and/or duties, because if they played in such kind of setup against me, I would destroy them on the counter 

On the other hand, of course you can play progressive possession football using a 4231, but with a lot more sensible setup. 

haha I bet. I must have. The players mentality on the roles is definitely incorrect.
 

Whats the best way to fit wingers into this system?
Would the left side of this formation work?
 

DLFsu

Wsu          SS             Wat

DLPsu  BBM

FBat    CDde  CDde  FBsu

[Experienced Defender]

8 minutes ago, Irn Rvd said:

Whats the best way to fit wingers into this system?
Would the left side of this formation work?

Can work, but this is not a setup for progressive possession football (or any possession style for that matter).