Tactics Help Request

[ExiledRogue]

I'm now in my second season managing Arsenal. I had good success last season with a possession tactic little different from the default Control Possession one, but it became less effective late in the year and early this season. After some experimentation, I've come up with the one shown here, which has done OK in the three games I've played with it. My concept is that the DLF drops deep to create space, and the AML, AMC, and runner from CM (I've used either BBM or CM(A) so far) move into the space. The FB(A) moves into the space vacated by the AML to provide width. On the right, I've been experimenting with different roles for the AMR and the DR to find a combination that offers some offensive threat while supporting the other attacking elements; currently, I'm using IF(S) and CWB(S), but I haven't yet found a truly productive option.

My TIs are based on the ones I used for the old C-P tactic, modified by trial and error. I've used both Higher and Standard DL/LOE, and I'm not sure about Be More Expressive, Get Stuck In, and WBiB. I've found that the combination of Attacking mentality with Shorter passes and Standard tempo seems to work well, producing some impressive attacks on the rare occasions the opposition gives me some space while giving a reasonable combination of directness and patience against more defensive sides, and its done fairly well defensively so far. However, I still struggle to actually score against them, with most of my goals coming from either set pieces or defensive errors.

Can any of you see anything I'm obviously doing wrong? If not, do you have nay suggestions for any changes I should make, especially in regard to the right side of my formation? (Note: don't pay too much attention to team selection; injuries and fatigue mean that I'm not currently using my first-choice side.)

[herne79]

If you are struggling for goals, why do you want a support duty striker with an AMC who also has a support duty?  Consider where the space is being created and who is attacking it.

[Experienced Defender]

Looking at your tactic, my guess is that your idea is to create space for Ziyech to attack from the left wing and be your main goal-scoring threat. But the problem here is - among other things - you seem to have failed to take into account your players' characteristics when assigning them to their respective roles. For example, Aubameyang as a DLF on support. In fact, Aubemayang on support duty as such can hardly hold water IMO. I mean, you have probably the fastest striker in the game, with great movement and anticipation, pretty good finishing and - on top of that - able to score not only by feet but also head. 

Btw, I would be extremely concerned from the defensive point of view if my 2 CMs in a system such as 4231 were Xhaka and Ramsey. But that's another pair of shoes, and I guess you are much more interested in attack than defense.

Now, to cut the long story short, I'll tell you what would be my basic setup with your starting 11:

DLFat

Wsu         APsu         IFat

DLPde    BBM

IWBat     CD    CD     WBsu

SKde

The bolded parts represent changes in roles or/and duties compared to your setup. Also, Zaiyech is now moved to the right flank (but his role and duty haven't changed), while Traore's been converted into a winger on the left with support duty. That's the first important change.

Sessegnon has become an IWB on attack duty - which is pretty much risky defensively given that Xhaka is supposed to cover for him, but gives you another attacking dimension in the final third, making it harder for the opposition to defend now that the threat is coming from multiple directions. 

Ozil as an AP on support is the most logical and pretty much self-explaining choice for such type of player in this setup. In a different kind of system - or with somewhat different type of players around him - he would be a perfect trequartista, but in this particular case the AP on support is more appropriate.

The next thing I would consider is lowering the mentality by just one notch - to Positive. The players will still be attack-minded and willing to take risks, but would do that in a more measured manner, without needlessly rushing play too much. And after all, that's what allows you to have a couple more attack duties without additionally compromising the overall defensive stability and balance (which is not ideal though, but that's mainly due to your selection of players).

Team instructions I would remove:

- wide attacking width (on a high-risk mentality, your width is already relatively wide by default, so there is no need to widen it further from the start; you can always do it later in a match if there's a need to stretch the opposition defense a bit more)

- low crosses may remain, but not sure if that's necessary (I would leave them on default/mixed and let the players decide what type of crossing to use in a given situation)

- counter-press makes your already fragile defense even more unstable and vulnerable to counter-attacks

- more urgent pressing and get stuck in are an absolute overkill - and further increase defensive risks - when you play on a high mentality with high DL and LOE

The rest is more or less okay.

Any questions?

 

 

[ExiledRogue]

Experienced Defender - Thanks, that's the sort of detailed feedback I was hoping for. As I noted, this isn't my first choice lineup, but I've had a couple of injuries recently.

Last season, I played a short-passing tactic on Positive mentality with Aubameyang as mostly a DLF(A), and he scored 30 goals. I went with DLF(S) here as I was concerned the combination of attacking role and mentality would be too much; however, I think you're right, and I'll go back to DLF(A).

I usually use Iwobi as the IF(A) in my tactic, and he's been effective at times (he had two hat tricks earlier this season against less defensively minded teams), but he's currently hurt, and I'm discovering I don't have a backup for that role on that side. I think your suggestion that I should reverse the AMs is a good one.

In CM, I usually use Guendouzi, but he's also hurt right now. I have definitely noticed the defense has fallen off without him. Against more dangerous teams, I also use Torreira as the BBM, which also helps defensively.

For Ozil, I go back and forth between AP and AM. Obviously, I like him as an AP, but there's so much traffic in the AMC area, and taking the playmaker role away from him does seem to spread the ball out more, and so gives him a little more space. I did try moving him to AMR as an AP, but that didn't really work.

I'll try the TI changes you suggest. Most of the ones you mention are either left over from the default Control Possession tactic or added after my AssMan kept suggesting them, so I can't say they reflect a lot of thought on my part.

One question I do have, as I've been wondering about this myself: I had the BBM on the opposite side of the formation from the IF(A), as I figured he would be able to run into space created when the defense moved to cover the IF's move into the box. However, your suggested formation puts him on the same side. Is there a reason you prefer that alignment?

Thanks again for the detailed response.

[Experienced Defender]

1 hour ago, ExiledRogue said:

I went with DLF(S) here as I was concerned the combination of attacking role and mentality would be too much; however, I think you're right, and I'll go back to DLF(A).

I agree it could be too much with attacking mentality, but the problem is that Auby isn't quite suitable for a support-duty DLF. Lacazzete would be a better choice. And after all, on positive mentality the striker on attack would be less of an issue.

 

1 hour ago, ExiledRogue said:

I think your suggestion that I should reverse the AMs is a good one.

Because if you play Ozil in that position, a playmaking role is the most logical choice for a player like him. As I said, he could also be a TQ, but in a bit different system.

 

1 hour ago, ExiledRogue said:

In CM, I usually use Guendouzi, but he's also hurt right now. I have definitely noticed the defense has fallen off without him. Against more dangerous teams, I also use Torreira as the BBM, which also helps defensively.

If I played a 4231 with Arsenal, either Guendouzi or Torreira would have to play in one of the two CM positions (or both of them), because they have good defensive characteristics, which is extremely important for a top-heavy system like 4231. These two positions are key in 4231, so you have to pay particular attention to whom you play there.

 

1 hour ago, ExiledRogue said:

For Ozil, I go back and forth between AP and AM. Obviously, I like him as an AP, but there's so much traffic in the AMC area, and taking the playmaker role away from him does seem to spread the ball out more, and so gives him a little more space. I did try moving him to AMR as an AP, but that didn't really work.

I would tell him to roam from position in his player instructions, so that he would have maximum freedom of movement. Btw, the same player can play the same role totally differently in terms of performance in two different set-ups. So it's always important to consider those around him as well (how his role interacts with others). People often make mistake believing that a player's performance depends entirely on his role/duty. The whole system needs to be set up in the right way in order to work.

 

1 hour ago, ExiledRogue said:

One question I do have, as I've been wondering about this myself: I had the BBM on the opposite side of the formation from the IF(A), as I figured he would be able to run into space created when the defense moved to cover the IF's move into the box. However, your suggested formation puts him on the same side. Is there a reason you prefer that alignment?

I always take care to consider all aspects of a tactic, including defensive ones. In this case, a BBM playing on the same side (and essentially behind) the IF on attack is logical IMO, because the IF on the right gets more direct support and an additional passing option in the final third when he gets surrounded with opposition defenders. And Ozil also has more options with a Sessegnon as an IWB on attack, which should allow for some interesting interaction in the final third. Honestly, my biggest concern in this tactic is defense, because neither Xhaka nor Ramsey are defensively reliable. So maybe Bellerin could be changed into a standard FB on support (instead of WB), in order to make him slightly more conservative.