newmanagergotrekt Posted August 2, 2017 Share Posted August 2, 2017 He just joined United this winter. How is he eligible to be a club trained? I thought you have to train at a club for 3 years when you are 15-21? PS I did not buy him partly because I thought he would never be a club trained for my club... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
michaeltmurrayuk Posted August 2, 2017 Share Posted August 2, 2017 If you join in Winter it gets back dated to the start of the season, so that half season counts as a full season, and as he only turned 19 in the August his next two seasons should count for him to complete the three seasons requirement. Though if they'd signed him in August and then loaned him out in Jan he wouldn't qualify (depending on where he went on loan) because the loan time is counted. Generally if you sign a player in the season he turns 19 he should become Homegrown. (Though some players can sometimes miss out as the cutoff dates seem a little fuzzy some seasons). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
newmanagergotrekt Posted August 3, 2017 Author Share Posted August 3, 2017 On 02/08/2017 at 19:19, michaeltmurrayuk said: If you join in Winter it gets back dated to the start of the season, so that half season counts as a full season, and as he only turned 19 in the August his next two seasons should count for him to complete the three seasons requirement. Though if they'd signed him in August and then loaned him out in Jan he wouldn't qualify (depending on where he went on loan) because the loan time is counted. Generally if you sign a player in the season he turns 19 he should become Homegrown. (Though some players can sometimes miss out as the cutoff dates seem a little fuzzy some seasons). Wow that is not quite 15-21 but thanks for the explanation When does the season start in England though? June 9th? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
alanschu14 Posted August 3, 2017 Share Posted August 3, 2017 Hmmm, I wonder if the cutoff is the date listed for things like the league's U19 team. I notice that at least in Norway that it's January 1. As long as a player is still 18 on New Year's Day, they can play for the U19 team, even if they aren't technically "Under 19" anymore. This makes sense to me then! I recruited a 17 year old out of year old out of Wales. Brexit happened so Wales is an import and I can't do the transfer until he is 18. To make matters better his birthday is June 6, and the transfer window didn't open until July 15th! So I figured I was screwed and going to miss him as home grown and was curious if it was a bug that he was slated to get it in July despite being past his 21st birthday. The start of the season is some time in the early year so I could see it being either the same analysis they use for youth teams or the start of the year. In any case it makes me a bit more optimistic about buying players outside of the EU that are young to make them home grown! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
michaeltmurrayuk Posted August 4, 2017 Share Posted August 4, 2017 I've found as long as the player joins in the first window after turning 18 (i.e. you have agreed the transfer before they turned 18) then they always have a HG Due Date. It's when they are close to their 19th birthday that it can be a bit hit and miss. Also the end period isn't their 21st birthday it's the end of the season in which they turn 21 so your player should be fine. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ermant Posted August 5, 2017 Share Posted August 5, 2017 On 02.08.2017 at 21:19, michaeltmurrayuk said: If you join in Winter it gets back dated to the start of the season, so that half season counts as a full season, and as he only turned 19 in the August his next two seasons should count for him to complete the three seasons requirement. Though if they'd signed him in August and then loaned him out in Jan he wouldn't qualify (depending on where he went on loan) because the loan time is counted. Generally if you sign a player in the season he turns 19 he should become Homegrown. (Though some players can sometimes miss out as the cutoff dates seem a little fuzzy some seasons). I have an Argentinian player who is 18 and below due date it says "nation". Why is that? I signed him before he was 18 but he didn't have work permit when he joined. He got it after a while, he is still 18 now and he can only gain trained in nation. Nation and club rules are different? Like you said i have signed players who turned 19 and they were able to get " trained in club". But some players are 18 but can't get "trained in club". Really complicated issue. I would like to read the rules. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
alanschu14 Posted August 5, 2017 Share Posted August 5, 2017 14 minutes ago, ermant said: I have an Argentinian player who is 18 and below due date it says "nation". Why is that? I signed him before he was 18 but he didn't have work permit when he joined. He got it after a while, he is still 18 now and he can only gain trained in nation. Nation and club rules are different? Like you said i have signed players who turned 19 and they were able to get " trained in club". But some players are 18 but can't get "trained in club". Really complicated issue. I would like to read the rules. Which club/country are you in? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ermant Posted August 5, 2017 Share Posted August 5, 2017 1 minute ago, alanschu14 said: Which club/country are you in? I am in English Premier League. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
michaeltmurrayuk Posted August 5, 2017 Share Posted August 5, 2017 16 hours ago, ermant said: I have an Argentinian player who is 18 and below due date it says "nation". Why is that? I signed him before he was 18 but he didn't have work permit when he joined. He got it after a while, he is still 18 now and he can only gain trained in nation. Nation and club rules are different? Like you said i have signed players who turned 19 and they were able to get " trained in club". But some players are 18 but can't get "trained in club". Really complicated issue. I would like to read the rules. If you loaned the player out then that time doesn't count (it will count towards the nation HG if he went to another English side). The Due Date columns/screen also only tend to show the first type due, so if the player wasn't loaned out then you'll likely find that he'll become Club grown on the same day (or the screen will update to show when he is due to become club grown if he was loaned out but can still get the three years). The screen in the players profile doesn't always show the full information as well, I've noticed a couple of players who are listed as Club Grown for a certain club and not Nation Grown but when you sign them the game correctly treats them as Nation Grown. Also the start date only starts when the play official signs for the club, so if you agreed a transfer when the player was 16 but he joins on his 18th birthday you don't get those two earlier years. (I've no idea if failed Work Permits affect the clock, as I don't tend to sign players who cannot get work permits) These are the rules (can be found on page 40 of the regulations pdf file at the bottom of this page: http://www.uefa.com/uefachampionsleague/about/index.html): Quote A "club-trained player" is a player who, between the age of 15 (or the start of the season during which he turns 15) and 21 (or the end of the season during which he turns 21), and irrespective of his nationality and age, has been registered with his current club for a period, continuous or not, of three entire seasons (i.e. a period starting with the first official match of the relevant national championship and ending with the last official match of that relevant national championship) or of 36 months. Though uefa say nothing about what happens for the players who are born in the off-season - are they counted as turning 21 in the previous season or the next season? And I don't know the exact date that FM counts as the cut-off period. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ermant Posted August 5, 2017 Share Posted August 5, 2017 1 hour ago, michaeltmurrayuk said: If you loaned the player out then that time doesn't count (it will count towards the nation HG if he went to another English side). Yeah, this is the main knowledge but i didn't loan him to an english side. He was loaned to France. I recalled him just after he gained work permit. Now he is still 18 but only can get "homegrown nation". There must be something different with the club and nation rules. He was outside england and can only get "nation" now. I have another player who is 18 and joined me in the 1st july. I didn't loan him at all and could get work permit just after he joined. Now he is also to gain only "HG nation". Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
michaeltmurrayuk Posted August 5, 2017 Share Posted August 5, 2017 3 minutes ago, ermant said: Yeah, this is the main knowledge but i didn't loan him to an english side. He was loaned to France. I recalled him just after he gained work permit. Now he is still 18 but only can get "homegrown nation". There must be something different with the club and nation rules. He was outside england and can only get "nation" now. I have another player who is 18 and joined me in the 1st july. I didn't loan him at all and could get work permit just after he joined. Now he is also to gain only "HG nation". Sounds like the game is just getting confused with the priority of which status is applied first, if you don't loan them out again then I expect they'd grab the club status when the game states they'll grab the nation one. Which screen are you looking it? In my game I've got a player where the Homegrown View on the Squad Screen shows he'll become Nation Grown, but the screen within the Players Profile states he'll become Club Grown (20 days later which is a little weird considering he is an academy player), the same with another player who I poached from Arsenal though with 10 days difference (as they loaned him out 10 days after signing him). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
ermant Posted August 5, 2017 Share Posted August 5, 2017 2 hours ago, michaeltmurrayuk said: Which screen are you looking it? Squad screen but i also checked profile>information screen. I found a player like yours: due date is nation but he has homegrown club date in information screen. But the second player i mentioned above also has "due date nation" in squad screeen and he gained work permit quicker than this player after he joined when he is 18 but he has no hg club date under information screen. If only we could know why this homegrown issue is not standart and stable. Why all these differ? There must be exact rules based on numbers or we are missing something here. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
alanschu14 Posted August 5, 2017 Share Posted August 5, 2017 2 hours ago, ermant said: Squad screen but i also checked profile>information screen. I found a player like yours: due date is nation but he has homegrown club date in information screen. But the second player i mentioned above also has "due date nation" in squad screeen and he gained work permit quicker than this player after he joined when he is 18 but he has no hg club date under information screen. If only we could know why this homegrown issue is not standart and stable. Why all these differ? There must be exact rules based on numbers or we are missing something here. It could very well be that the bug is that for some reason it's showing homegrown nation instead of home grown club, but that you will get both at the same time. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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