Preset tactic enjoyers assemble

[allyc31]

Morning everyone, 

As someone who struggles with the tactical side of FM more and more, leading to frustration, leading to struggling more etc etc and so on, I was thinking about starting again and following my assistant mangers advice when selecting a tactic (bold I know. Doing what the game suggests)

So started a new save in fm23 with said AM suggests I have the players most suited for a 4-2-4 Gegenpress, so I guess defending is nothing something we're going to care much about this year. 

This is the standard tactic as suggested 

Spoiler

And this is the tweaks I made to better suit my team
 

Spoiler

I didn't change any instruction, just some of the roles around in an effort to create some depth and space. 

So I guess, first thing is do the above changes look sensible? They do to me but at the same time, ive already admitted to being frankly awful at this game so what do I know 

Secondly, and the main thing I wanted to ask;

What do you guys do, if using a present and things go wrong? One of the oldest bits of advice on here from the times before presets was that you should make your own tactic as, if it goes wrong you'll be in a better position to understand why.

But as the presets are effectively a middle ground between creating your own and downloading a tactic, im wondering if that logic can apply here? 

There has been a few good threads on here about the presets, most notably the one around the 4231 fluid counter but didn't really answer my question. 

Hope we can get a bit of discussion going on this. Im at a place in my life where, I dont exactly want FM23 to turn into a Press Continue fest but want to focus more on developing players and less on the tactical side of things (as I truly think I'll never understand it)

Thanks everyone, Take care

[CJ_Randell]

The preset Gegenpress instructions are a really solid base to start from. 

I use something very close to these. 

What I will say is the RPM will venture forward a lot, and with 2 wing backs and 4 attackers you're likely to be left with only 3 players back when you're attacking, leaving you open to a counter. 

My DM pairing is usually DLP-De BWM-Su to provide a bit more stability. 

But I also play with a 10 so you might want some who's going to break into that open space in the attacking midfield area. 

Maybe something to consider against tougher sides though. 

Edited February 6 by CJ_Randell
Spelling Error

[Andros]

1 thing I have noticed is playing with the defensive line.  In some games, especially if the other team is strong, I notice that nothing is happening for my team and most of the highlights are for the other team.  By dropping the defensive line down 1 point, especially with a geggenpress tactic, i find that it reduces the effectiveness of the other team.  

[allyc31]

So, update time I guess

Ended up moving away from the 4-2-4, dropping the DLP into midfield to form a 4-2-3-1. Not entirely sure why but with the 4-2-4, the chances were falling more to the DLP instead of the Advanced Forward and, when the AF was getting a chance it was high xg but tight angle and going across the goal. I suspect it would have been solved if I had of switched the advanced forward to the left hand side so that hes got more of the goal to aim at but I dont have the players do that as the right and left players are both very suited to their current roles. So added the AMC so I could push the Advanced Forward more centrally. 

Also didn't have the player to play as a Roaming Playmaker and changed to the Defence Midfielder on Support. 

Finally the left handside Inside Forward was doing my head in so changed to an Inverted Winger on attack and asked both the Left and Right Winger to stay wide. 

With regards to team instructions, I dropped the High Line to mid block in an effort to create space in behind for the advanced forward. 

Tactic now

Spoiler

Overall seeing some improvements in chances and types of chances as well as who they fall too. Still not perfect to be honest but might be down to quality of player making poor decisions

 

In the below, changed after the Villa match. I know results were decent before but, like I said, wasn't happy with how it was working

Spoiler

 

[allyc31]

3 hours ago, CJ_Randell said:

The preset Gegenpress instructions are a really solid base to start from. 

I use something very close to these. 

What I will say is the RPM will venture forward a lot, and with 2 wing backs and 4 attackers you're likely to be left with only 3 players back when you're attacking, leaving you open to a counter. 

My DM pairing is usually DLP-De BWM-Su to provide a bit more stability. 

But I also play with a 10 so you might want some who's going to break into that open space in the attacking midfield area. 

Maybe something to consider against tougher sides though. 

One thing ive found about playing a holding midfielder deep as the playmaker is that they always seem to get pressed of the ball. I think it's because they're always, or seemingly always collecting the ball of the defenders with their back to goal meaning that they really only have 1-2 passing options (assuming the other pivot is marked properly). I think maybe a half back as a single pivot would work better as they drop in between the defenders, are facing up the field and have more passing options (two centre backs, fullbacks on either side then two (or more))

Spoiler

In the above, no 6 is the DLP in a double pivot and is something similar to what ive seen when I've played with one. 

 

Spoiler

Now that's the 6 but as a single pivot (either as a HB or DLP-D as I think they both split the centre backs?) making the red opposition players having to work harder to press him/cut off passing lanes etc

What's your experience with this? 

[CJ_Randell]

15 minutes ago, allyc31 said:

One thing ive found about playing a holding midfielder deep as the playmaker is that they always seem to get pressed of the ball. I think it's because they're always, or seemingly always collecting the ball of the defenders with their back to goal meaning that they really only have 1-2 passing options (assuming the other pivot is marked properly). I think maybe a half back as a single pivot would work better as they drop in between the defenders, are facing up the field and have more passing options (two centre backs, fullbacks on either side then two (or more))

  Reveal hidden contents

In the above, no 6 is the DLP in a double pivot and is something similar to what ive seen when I've played with one. 

 

  Reveal hidden contents

Now that's the 6 but as a single pivot (either as a HB or DLP-D as I think they both split the centre backs?) making the red opposition players having to work harder to press him/cut off passing lanes etc

What's your experience with this? 

I haven't really noticed any issues with my current set up. 

With the much higher tempo my DLP doesn't tend to take long before the ball is moved on to someone else. 

[DownTheFrank]

On 06/02/2024 at 12:19, CJ_Randell said:

I haven't really noticed any issues with my current set up. 

With the much higher tempo my DLP doesn't tend to take long before the ball is moved on to someone else. 

Could that also maybe be due to his attributes. 

You two could post your DLPs and the leagues you play in for comparison. 

my high agility, high balance DLPs seem to get dispossessed far less compared to his understudy with weaker attributes. Something to consider.