A confirmation pop-up for set pieces

So when a set piece situation happens for you on a match I think it would be a good Idea to have this so we could chose at that moment who is a best taker or what setup do we want. We could confirm the default that we have set up or we could change things. It will be good because of a different position problem for a free kick (a pass or a shot) or it could be useful to take indisposed or tired player off taking it. This is also realistic because managers IRL can do that at the given moment. I know that you can do this in tactics screen in any moment but who remembers this? Obviously it would be a good idea to have an option not to have this because someone may not like ti and it could be done with one checkbox. I think that this is a minor change and can be done in the patch even.

Actually you can't do it right now, because when a free kick is given by the referee the taker is locked before you can do anything, at the moment.

Yeah, wasn't clear enough in the post. Thanks for clarifying.

I think this is a good idea. Currently you have 1 preferential fk taker for all fk's. It would be useful to be able to select a taker based on the position of the kick etc etc.

The problem with this is, it's a tactics change, so the match engine would have to recalculate every time you changed it and to keep it fair the AI would need the same options, so you'd have a vast increase in processing time.

The AI already has those options... if you notice (by for instance picking no set piece takers) the AI is not constrained to always chose the same player for free kicks in the same position. If the AI uses this to pick the best free kick taker or not is a different question...

Recalculating the game each time a human selects a different free kick taker wouldn't take loads of time, look at the time it currently takes when you change tactics.

Don't want to sound too harsh but for me this is a bad idea and at the moment I think there is more pressing matters and even if i did like this idea there is many other small tweaks that would be better IMO. Why for me this does not need implementing:

1) We already have a preferred free kick takers in the tactics for left or right side- simple and easy.

2) Amount of free kicks in a game (guess 15) it would get too silly and just too stop start- take ages. Not only would you select a taker but you also suggest the type of free kick- pass, cross, and shot- take even more time.

3) Triedness and managers interfering- have never seen a manger say hey player x I want player y to take it and the manager is restricted to the technical area aswell. Its a decision down to the players. Also never really seen a clubs best free kick taker not take one becasue he is too tried.

4) FM has to reflect real life- set pieces practised in training- then that is all the manager does- the rest is left to the players- they decide how they will go about the set pieces in the match without the manager. After the game a manager can give his opinion but this would be quite rare and more for the training ground.

5) And how many different types of free kicks are there? There no need to over complicate something that does not need complicating. You have the best taker from the right and the same for the left and maybe a person who is good for long rangers and someone who is better on the edge of the box. But with a lot of teams there is one free kick spacalist and will take 75% of the free kicks.

Don't see how this would be a step in the right direction to be honest.

I wouldn't say that this level of detail would necessarily be needed, but definitely being able to pick which players take the free kick when it is a cross and when it is a direct shot would be a great plus that would add realism IMO.

I wouldn't say that this level of detail would necessarily be needed, but definitely being able to pick which players take the free kick when it is a cross and when it is a direct shot would be a great plus that would add realism IMO.

In the tactic screen with the preferred free kick takers have the type of free kick and frequency and tick what you want. A bit like withe the corner set up at the moment. But you say to add realism but for me this is going in the opposite way to adding realism.

IRL the manager has no influence over this so in FM we should not. IRL Ronaldo has a free kick - its up to him with a discussion with his team mates and not the manager about what they are about to do- he may have a blast or say to player y get in the box or shape to cross it or lay it off to another team mate.

The manager during a game has no control over this so how can having what people have suggested in this thread be a good thing as it does in no way reflect real life IMO.

I care to disagree. In the portuguese national team for instance, if we have a fairly far, frontal, free kick in the left side of the field, sure enough it will be ronaldo kicking it, while if we have a free kick sufficiently to the left that a shot is not viable, it will be deco putting a cross in the area. Such thing is not possible at present moment, unless we completely give up control of who takes the free kicks by picking no one (and when we do this some quite bizarre things happen, like center backs, with no particular free kicking quality, shooting free kicks).

I care to disagree. In the portuguese national team for instance, if we have a fairly far frontal free kick from the left side of the field, sure enough it will be ronaldo kicking it, while if we have a free kick sufficiently to the left that a shot is not viable, it will be deco putting a cross in the area. Such thing is not possible at present moment.

Ok but in what way IRL would the manager be able make the decision? It is up to the players to use thier expertise and judgement to come up with the best possible scenario. In the tactics scree you could have the following.

Close free kicks- player x

medium-'' ''

Long rangers-

left touch line-

right touch line

Half way line maybe defender log ball

In own half- short pass rather than punt up field

And then there could be a frequency setting or say at the touch line e.g. deco cross and other places shoot and on the odd occasion pass.

But this is making set pieces too important IMO- yes they are important in the game but the managers expertise come in the training of set pieces and improving thier skills in that discipline and not telling them what to do in the game.

Well, but we cannot really influence much their expertise in set pieces at the moment, so meanwhile I would be happy to not be forced to choose between having drogba crossing from the byline (if I pick him to take free kicks) and see Terry taking free kicks sometimes (if I pick no one to take free kicks).

And set pieces ARE very important in real football. I don't know the exact stats, but I suspect that at least 20% of goals nowadays come from set pieces, and I'm probably being conservative.

Well, but we cannot really influence much their expertise in set pieces at the moment, so meanwhile I would be happy to not be forced to choose between having drogba crossing from the byline (if I pick him to take free kicks) and see Terry taking free kicks sometimes (if I pick no one to take free kicks).

And set pieces ARE very important in real football. I don't know the exact stats, but I suspect that at least 20% of goals nowadays come from set pieces, and I'm probably being conservative.

Regaring set pieces you miss read what i said. I said what you and this thread want would make set pieces too important rgarding their standing in FM. I said they are important in the game ( both FM and real life) but the ability of a manger has no influence on how these set pieces are done in the game. As I have said the manager/coaches do the training and then the players try to implement this as best they can in the match - with no interference from the manager.

Managers do not have this control IRL so why give us this opportunity in FM???????

Because if you forfeit control, and pick no set piece takers, at the moment, the AI gives us players with very poor set piece skills taking set pieces way too often... and I also don't buy your argument that a manager has no say on who takes a free kick in real life. I might not be able to change the set piece taker during a real game if a player disobeys my instructions, but if players do not follow direct instructions from their manager, a manager can bench them!

Because if you forfeit control, and pick no set piece takers, at the moment, the AI gives us players with very poor set piece skills taking set pieces way too often... and I also don't buy your argument that a manager has no say on who takes a free kick in real life. I might not be able to change the set piece taker during a real game if a player disobeys my instructions, but if players do not follow a managers direct instructions, a manager can bench them!

Ok lance I think the following saying is applicable here ' lets agree to disagree.' We have both put our points forward and had a good debate. Lets hope that other people come onto this thread and voice their opinions regarding set pieces!

nev147, do you really think that 1. manager cant change the set piece taker in the game, or are you 2. disagree just for the sake of disagreeing. Actually the second one is better because the other one would mean that you know so little about football and yet post here and play the game and I assume watch a game now and then. This had to be saying something about your intellect.

Therefor I hope you disagree just for your personal amusement.

Then again you r maybe very young and that would be good too.

I'd like to be able to appoint seperate direct and indirect free kick takers. Would do wonders I think.

nev147, do you really think that 1. manager cant change the set piece taker in the game, or are you 2. disagree just for the sake of disagreeing. Actually the second one is better because the other one would mean that you know so little about football and yet post here and play the game and I assume watch a game now and then. This had to be saying something about your intellect.

Therefor I hope you disagree just for your personal amusement.

Then again you r maybe very young and that would be good too.

First of all Erik I think you are very much out of line. Let's start from the top. You have made a suggestion in order to improve (in your eyes) the set pieces in FM, which is absolutely fine. As seen from the above posts I do not think it is a good idea for the reasons stated above- and I have had a discussion with lance regarding your proposal which I believe was not constructed in an aggressive nor forceful manner in relation to my arguments regarding set pieces.

You have made many assumptions, including accusing me of disagreeing for the sake of an argument, if the previous statement is not correct then you allude to the fact that I know very little about football and you also make a critical judgment concerning my intellect. You then make a rather condescending comment that seeks to suggest that I could be excused for my comments based on the fact I may be very young.

There have been many threads recently that have been closed because they have deviated from the topic and also because there have been many personal attacks from people that seem quite abusive at times. I could defend my self vigorously in retaliation of your last post but this is not the place neither do I believe I should be required to do so.

But I would like to know where your beliefs stem from, that I seem to be lacking on both an intellect and football front?

Don't want to sound too harsh but for me this is a bad idea and at the moment I think there is more pressing matters and even if i did like this idea there is many other small tweaks that would be better IMO. Why for me this does not need implementing:

1) We already have a preferred free kick takers in the tactics for left or right side- simple and easy.

2) Amount of free kicks in a game (guess 15) it would get too silly and just too stop start- take ages. Not only would you select a taker but you also suggest the type of free kick- pass, cross, and shot- take even more time.

3) Triedness and managers interfering- have never seen a manger say hey player x I want player y to take it and the manager is restricted to the technical area aswell. Its a decision down to the players. Also never really seen a clubs best free kick taker not take one becasue he is too tried.

4) FM has to reflect real life- set pieces practised in training- then that is all the manager does- the rest is left to the players- they decide how they will go about the set pieces in the match without the manager. After the game a manager can give his opinion but this would be quite rare and more for the training ground.

5) And how many different types of free kicks are there? There no need to over complicate something that does not need complicating. You have the best taker from the right and the same for the left and maybe a person who is good for long rangers and someone who is better on the edge of the box. But with a lot of teams there is one free kick spacalist and will take 75% of the free kicks.

Don't see how this would be a step in the right direction to be honest.

I definitely agree with this post. It's too time consuming to do this every time.

And maybe managers tell players before a game who is to take what, but I don't believe that. Take Chelsea for e.g, Lampard, Ballack, Drogba, Deco - they seem to rotate depending on who had the last one, and whether or not it was any good. But managers certainly don't tell players what to do durng the match regarding free-kicks!

I can see where the OP is coming from though, and I think all is needed is more options in the Tactics section.

So for freekicks, we could have a simple:

Pass

Shoot (short range)

Shoot (long range)

This then means before the match (I usually set up my kicktakers every pre-season and January due to new players coming in)you can decide who will do what in each situation.

But I would like to know where your beliefs stem from, that I seem to be lacking on both an intellect and football front?

The main reason would be that I am finding it very hard to believe that you think, and you seem absolutely positive about it, that manager would never change a simple thing like fk taker just before the fk. It is sooo obvious to me that in a real life game a manager would prefer to let players decide who will take the fk for most of the time because IRL players are not bunch of 0 an 1 and as reasonable human beings, some less then others, best know who is best fit to take that one fk or corner. Also it is not that rare to see manager shouting something end things get changed.

I clearly remember this one event: Mourinho was shouting like mad for a reason apparent only to him because everyone seemed confuse with what he is talking about and in all this confusion Robert Huth is listening what he is saying from there with a weird expression on he's face and eventually takes a position on one of the posts. The strange thing is that a ball from a corner header hit him in a face.

The other reason for it would be that I had a lot of various forums experience in my time with ppl disagreeing just for the sake of it without even having a clear idea what was at hand in the given discussion. Most of the times because not taking the time and reading right. In your case, I'll illustrate:

2) Amount of free kicks in a game (guess 15) it would get too silly and just too stop start- take ages. Not only would you select a taker but you also suggest the type of free kick- pass, cross, and shot- take even more time.

We could confirm the default that we have set up or we could change things.

3) Triedness and managers interfering- have never seen a manger say hey player x I want player y to take it and the manager is restricted to the technical area aswell. Its a decision down to the players. Also never really seen a clubs best free kick taker not take one becasue he is too tried.

You never responded to this:

This is also realistic because managers IRL can do that at the given moment.

4) FM has to reflect real life- set pieces practised in training- then that is all the manager does- the rest is left to the players- they decide how they will go about the set pieces in the match without the manager. After the game a manager can give his opinion but this would be quite rare and more for the training ground.

Where do you play professionally? I mean you have to be, claiming this and that so certain.

Don't you think that they practice more then one setup? That the first obvious person to choose a setup in real time and put say 3 fingers up is a manager? Him being the architect of a setup, unless you believe that someone else at a club does this and maybe all other tactical things.

5) And how many different types of free kicks are there? There no need to over complicate something that does not need complicating. You have the best taker from the right and the same for the left and maybe a person who is good for long rangers and someone who is better on the edge of the box. But with a lot of teams there is one free kick spacalist and will take 75% of the free kicks.

There are for me a total of 9 types of them, depending on a position ball is at. There are areas in between so could be more, easy:

1. on the left but too wide for a shot

2. the same on the right

3. area outside the box for a right foot

4. the same thing for a left foot

5. area outside the box in the center

6. 25+ meters shot zone from the left

7. the same from the right

8. the same in the center

9. 40+ meters, too far for a shot but good for a pass in the box

This is not about me defending my views. I had warnings from SI before and wasn't about my threads or responses to my posts. I can be harsh I know this but if you knew me personally you'll know that I don't mean bad and am not disrespecting u just so you feel badly. I guess I am giving myself the freedom to try to educate other ppl sometimes when I feel the need to do so. I don't care that much for certain rules and don't like much this setup of parenting kind of admins we have here.

Ok... I originally jumped on the OP bandwagon but since then, and having read some very well put points from nev147 my mind started to change. Then I had a new idea based on set pieces.

Some of you may remember on older versions of the game (circa cm3) there was a positioning option for with and without the ball. For those of you new to the game, it is basically the player positions screen in the tactics but when you select an area of the pitch it showed you where you wanted the players to be both if your team had possesion and when the opposition had possession. For reasons unknown to me this was removed and that's fine - this isn't about that (for now ).

Now my idea is (I think) fairly simple - A Set Piece creator.On the right hand side of the screen you have the opponents half of the pitch divided up into 10 sections (one either side of the box, and then 2 rows of four in front of the box) as you select each section it gives you the option to select the kind of freekick you want to use (shot, cross, short pass etc.) on the left hand side of the screen.

Your preferred set piece takers could then be divided into the following:

LF Shot (Short)

RF Shot (Short)

LF Shot (Long)

RF Shot (Long)

LF Cross

RF Cross

Of course for people who cannot be bothered with this you'd have one of two options:

Assistant manager handles set piece.

Or (like with the tactics create)

Use classic set piece setup.

What are peoples thoughts on this?

Seems no-one has any thoughts on my idea...

Well it is a one of many ways to do it. Yours is good enough or better then any other. The problem is that it takes large amount of programming to do such a thing. I hope that this very setup you mentioned will be introduced in next fm but I doubt it. It'll be great just to have those options without the graphic setup.

Thank you for your feedback, any more from anyone will be much appreciated. I will try and knock something crude up on paint or something when I get home from work to try and give people a better idea.

Gunner86: I like your ideia, it is a definite big step up from the current system! And better than a simpler version I hinted before in the thread. For instance, it also bothers me that players too often like to cross the ball from the byline about 45 yards out... As a manager, I would like to be able to limit that to the last 5 mins of games I am losing, but in the game it is the default free kick from that area.

I think a direct and indirect taker option would be great.

I also think maybe to pick a penalty taker as that happens. This is because if you are cruising and a player is on a hat trick or a striker is going through a dry patch it could be a great opportunity to boost some morale (or destroy it!!) As the OP says, sometimes you forget to change stuff like that in the tactics screen during a match.

I agree that this option for all free kicks, corners etc would be excesive - but i definately think penalties would be a good addition.

I think a direct and indirect taker option would be great.

I also think maybe to pick a penalty taker as that happens. This is because if you are cruising and a player is on a hat trick or a striker is going through a dry patch it could be a great opportunity to boost some morale (or destroy it!!) As the OP says, sometimes you forget to change stuff like that in the tactics screen during a match.

I agree that this option for all free kicks, corners etc would be excesive - but i definately think penalties would be a good addition.

SI have already added it this year that if you are winning and you have a man on two goals, who isn't your current penalty taker, he will take the penalty to try to get his hat-trick. A good addition I think.