Tactics FM14

[HUNT3R]

Did I say anything about winning? I was talking about how badly they generally play. In FM it is just easy to put Torres into "Advanced Forward"-role and see him dominating most of the AI defences. In real life none Chelsea striker has scored goals for fun since Drogba's 09/10 season. And they have had some quality strikers... Sturridge is scoring loads of goals in Liverpool but didn't manage to do that in Chelsea (when playing as a striker, on the flank he was excellent when playing at his best). It isn't a coincidence.

In real football management you run into these kinds of problems, like Fellaini being too slow playing in two man midfiled and not being good enough to play in attacking midfielder position. In FM you can escape these by being big enough team to "scare" smaller opponents trying to play at their best against you and your players are likely to have high enough CA to perform in most of the games.

After thinking about it a little more, I see what you're getting at. It still isn't a tactic/role issue really. It goes a little deeper. Chelsea have changed managers quite a bit. Some would have asked him, in FM terms, to play as a CF/A... others AF/A or CF/S or whatever. He hasn't always had a good run of games and the 3 players behind him change constantly. This can't be easy, getting to know exactly how to perform according to the instructions he receives and to get to know how the 3 behind him think and how to be in the best positions. He's missing open goals, so confidence is an issue, too.

In FM, only the formation, philosophy (Rigid/Fluid etc) and style (Defensive/Counter/Attacking etc) matter. Swapping players in and out of the first team, doesn't matter (I don't think so anyway). You can change roles all you want and the tactical familiarity won't drop. This is the problem. There needs to be a familiarity bar for roles too in the tactical familiarity section. There needs to be a familiarity bar of some kind for players too. You shouldn't be able to switch Torres from DLF/S to AF/A from one match to the next, without any penalties. They are very different roles.

Are we thinking along the same path now?

[Guest El Payaso]

Didn't Rafa also rotate the team quite a lot in Liverpool and it didn't matter that much?

If I remember right Mourinho also said that the reason why Juan Mata is behind Oscar in the team sheet because he isn't doing the things that he wants him to do on the pitch? Oscar is helping the Chelsea defence more from attacking midfielder's position. So you could think that José has different kind of vision for his "advanced playmaker" than some pther managers. You can't set the advanced playmaker help the defence with this new tactical system, can you? This is once again one of the bad things with the new system and I still also think that it's quite stupid to think that every manager in the world has the same opinions about different roles...

[HUNT3R]

Didn't Rafa also rotate the team quite a lot in Liverpool and it didn't matter that much?

If I remember right Mourinho also said that the reason why Juan Mata is behind Oscar in the team sheet because he isn't doing the things that he wants him to do on the pitch? Oscar is helping the Chelsea defence more from attacking midfielder's position. So you could think that José has different kind of vision for his "advanced playmaker" than some pther managers. You can't set the advanced playmaker help the defence with this new tactical system, can you? This is once again one of the bad things with the new system and I still also think that it's quite stupid to think that every manager in the world has the same opinions about different roles...

He didn't drop Torres much. The odd game here and there, but not anywhere as badly as at Chelsea right now.

I'll be guessing if I were to think about what Mourinho wants him to do on the pitch. To try and put it in FM terms, maybe the PPMs of Oscar and Mata cause the differences in how they play? If he is talking defensively, it could be the atrributes Work Rate, Aggression etc?

It could also tie into my idea of a role familiarity being introduced for players. Oscar might have been used to playing as an AM/s or AP/s or whatever Mourinho gives him, but Mata isn't? Mata is now good enough for the first team after the weekend's game, so maybe his familiarity is now at a level where he adheres to the instructions better? I can see attributes like Off The Ball and Positioning taking a heavy hit if a player isn't tactically familiar with the role he is supposed to play.

[Frank27]

I think the changes are good. Turning the "shouts" into instructions that you can give before as well as during the match makes it a lot easier to costumize the tactic, especially because there's now individual shouts too. There used to be the problem that you could tell your team to drop deeper in the TC, but then because you changed it, it wasn't possible to tell them to push up with a shout anymore. And being able to give different players different instructions for the same position before the match is very very welcome.

It's also probably going to be easier for more people to get into the whole tactics stuff. Using the sliders is pretty abstract for people who aren't really into it.

I'm still wondering what the difference is between a trequartista, an advanced playmaker and an enganche is but I'm happy we now have the halfback role in the game. Especially because you couldn't create that role with sliders. Now we can finally properly recreate barcelona. I also hope that wide frontmen in a 4-3-3 become a bit smarter. That's understandable though, as most wide forwards aren't entirely sure of what to do themselves (Theo walcott?).

Somebody in this thread said that this would make the game more player centric and less tactics centric, and maybe that's good too. Because that's how it works in real football. In older FM's players were too much like robots that you could tinker to the minute detail. There has yet to be a goal scored with a piece of chalk.

[RollnRock]

I can't bring myself to read these incredibly long pages, but tactics for different phases of play is vital. The transition play would be half instructional and the rest done as a training option by the coaches.

So, basically: we need off the ball setup and on the ball setup, and specifics for inbetweens.