optimusprimal82
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Posts posted by optimusprimal82
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6 hours ago, priority76 said:
The next game is against Scarborough who are having a storming season and I think a result is unlikely. The other four teams are all around the bottom of the table and so should be there for the taking.
Unlikely buuuuuut...
We did it!
Phew, that was a tough game with not much quality from either side sadly - stats overall were far too even for my liking but a) they always skew more towards the AI towards the end of the match when it starts getting desperate and b) as you suggested, this was against the league leaders so doubtful we were going to dominate them!;
This is the lineup I went with for the game;
I based selection largely on the AM's team report - noticed though that you've been preferring other players to some of them though (you know your guys better than me of course!) but I decided - like a new manager - to give everyone a crack which meant a couple were/are lacking in match sharpness but i decided to risk it anyway!
Looking at Guilfoyle, he is by far and away your best player I reckon - for this division, his speed and finishing are incredible! Notice the coach report suggests he's inconsistent which is annoying, but depending on just how inconsistent I'd say it's a risk worth taking if you can keep him in good morale? Although you may have tried this and he's a 1 in 20 kind of guy?
As for the game itself, this is roughly how it went/my thought process;
Team talk - morale really low, told them to get revenge for last game, wasn't effective enough so passionately told each area (def, mid and attack) I had faith in them - ten of 11 went 'green'!
Tactic - went with my base FCU modified version of Knaps TIME 442. Started on cautious, changed up to balanced at 15 mins. Took the lead, scored again but scarborough pulled one back shortly after & just before half time so I changed to cautious mentality.
Half time Team Talk -told them not to get complacent, with specific 'passionate/I believe in you BS' to the non-responders, 9 out of the 11 were green again. Changed to my FCU CTRL TIME 442 variant to play more cautiously/prevent further goals.
Second half was pretty uneventful, I made three substitutions at 72 minutes (that took five minutes to take effect) and then changed to my SUS at 84-85 minutes to protect the lead completely. All of the above was sprinkled with liberal use of the 'demand more' shout!
Couple of other things I've noted - and apologies if any of this reads as patronising/condescending, absolutely not my intention, just trying to get this stuff down whilst it's in my head!!;
Both of your best DC's are on the slow side (Dowsett especially) - might be why you get caught by long balls so often (especially against speedy strikers) worth finding a guy with better physical stats to cover the other (see below about ignoring technical stats in favour of mental/physical stats at this level)? I noted when I was in the Vanarama and getting caught by long balls, it was often the DCL who was caught out so that's why I played King on that side as he's slightly the quicker of the two. Dowsett does have good anticipation & amazing positioning thankfully which no doubt help him out overall.
Overall, I think the squad 'Determination' is really towards the low end, with over half of the team below 10;
People have varying opinions on Determination and how effective it is but for me it's paramount and the big 'FM Equaliser' - I don't expect a guy in this division to have 20 for finishing, passing or technique, but there's absolutely no reason why he can't be as Determined as a Keane/Vieira? It's tough to find decent players down in these leagues but you've got a good level of scouting in place already so after a quick look, there are definitely one or two you could bring in with decent Determination who'd also hopefully be good mentors for the rest going forward.
Down in this division you're never going to get awesome all round players so i tend to focus on one or two key stats (such as pace & work rate for strikers, pace, positioning and concentration for defenders etc) but also make sure they have as high Determination as I can get (14 is my preferred minimum, but obviously at this level some concessions have to be made), and also look at work rate and aggression (aggression doesn't mean whether they'll get into fights/sent off!) - it plays such a big part of how your team reacts to going a goal down/conceding late on which may explain some of your struggles? Quick example; this guy looks ordinary at first glance, but his bravery, aggression and work rate may be enough to offset some of his other stats?
His trait could be a double edged sword and he's not the fastest or tallest, but he's certainly more of a warrior than the current best option at RB (Connor Roberts);
this is another guy interested too, all of them are available for free (teams down here accept 0 bids for a lot of their guys weirdly - probably due to wage bill etc)
I'm scouting the first/last guy to be sure as obviously with a lower league budget you have to be wary of clogging up the wage budget/taking too big a risk, but I reckon sometimes getting better mental & physical stats can make a huge difference!
Will leave it there for now and go and play out the rest of the season - Marine drew in their last fixture so the gap is down to 5 points... Think it's going to be a step too far with only four games to go and looking at their fixtures (3 of their 4 matches are against teams in the bottom half, the other is against 8th position) - although maybe their form is just starting to wane after a great run so fingers crossed?
EDIT: Oh, hadn't realised the xfer window was still open - have gone ahead & signed a couple to help bolster the bid!
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Wow, sympathy flying from over here dude, that is a pretty horrible run of form...!
Out of curiosity, where were you predicted to finish this season, and more importantly, (roughly) what position were you in when the wheels came off the wagon?
Not saying it's exactly the same issue or it's in any way an exact science (it's pretty maddening tbh), but as a lower team you will nearly always hit a wall I've found after a period of success as the other teams will change their approach to you. In every season bar my first, there's been a point where all of a sudden I struggle with the 4411 as teams become more defensive and counter attack. You'll get a few warning signs that this is happening - you'll suddenly start missing a lot more chances and struggling to score, your possession stats will drop overall, and the AI scores even more frequently. The obvious human reaction then is to attack more which in turn is counter-productive as it means the AI can then counter attack you to death. Have learned over these many saves that in those instances it's better to change to a more attacking formation on a lower mentality'' but again, this isn't an exact science and will depend on the strength of your team overall relative to the league;
My first season in the Vanarama national I had a comparatively strong squad (despite being tipped for relegation), it took me a while to figure out what was happening after a great run using the 4411, but changed up to a 4231 and didn't lose a league game for the rest of the season. In the following seasons I knew myself that my squad wasn't relatively as strong so I started out with the 4411 again, watched for the change, and when it came I went 4-2-4 at home, for away games against bottom sides and went with the 4411 away against more difficult opposition.
This season is a new learning experience as I haven't got the players for the 4411 so switched to the 442 but regardless, my team is much weaker relatively so I'm having to go with a lower mentality as a default and even then i'm losing more than in other seasons (still 5th right now which after b2b promotions isn't too bad) - what i'm thinking is that the change in AI approach will still come at sometime, but i'm expecting it maybe a little later as my form is a little more up and down - exactly which direction i change up will depend on how i view my team with a few new formations, but likely i'll try the 424 at home only and go from there.
Back to your guys, I'm not sure if that's exactly what's happening, if it's overall your team is playing to their ability (as in they're not good enough for the league - i don't think so based on your earlier results), or perhaps you've tweaked the tactic(s) so much you've lost the essence of what made it work? Are you still dominating possession in games? Generally outshooting the opposition? If so then it suggests a mentality issue, if not then I'd look at overall tactics/players first.
The other thing you need to bear in mind on a run like that is morale - makes such an annoyingly big difference (watch how well an unhappy player doesn't play after you reject a bid for them - had to leave my start winger out for almost half a season last year!). What's their body language mid-match (do you have that window open)? If you're losing consistently then don't batter them in team talks (or if AI handles them then check he's not being ultra aggressive). Might be worth taking them over for a few games if he is (some people will disagree with this advice) and work on getting your guys to 'go green' before games and at half time - it makes such a difference (I let AM do them for the first two seasons but took them over in my third when my guys were constantly complacent and we were playing like idiots.
Last of all, if you wanna upload your save for me to take a look at/have a quick blast at to try and see if there's an obvious issue then more than happy to take a look!
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Still my favourite tactic set overall the TIME ones - if anyone is struggling with Beo (my other faves) then you'd do well to check these out, especially if you're an underdog/llm.
For the non-Discord-ers;
Been playing with the TIME 442 as opposed to the 4411 (as one of my two best players the board forced me to sell was my AMC and his backup is average), actually think it might be better overall...?
Have tweaked it (very) slightly for 'lesser teams and players', also made a control version and an SUS for anyone that would like them;
FCU_19.2.1TIMEKnap442P110_v1.0.fmf
FCU_19.2.1TIMEKnap442P110CTRL_v1.0.fmf
FCU_19.2.1TIMEKnap442P110SUS_v1.0.fmf
I use the control one when I feel my team losing the initiative and changing down mentality hasn't done the trick. It stops the pressing as much but does still counter and defaults to cautious mentality, still scoring a few goals against an attacking AI.
It's worked really well, but rest assured it won't stop every single attack - there are times when the AI just WILL score, same as with an SUS.
I also reworked my SUS a little too, now on ultra def. Haven't conceded a goal with it yet, but I've only played 6 games with this formation so 1) there's plenty of time for it to happen and 2) Now that i've said that i expect to concede at least 2 in the next match.
Forgot to add; the CTRL DOES still have the default corner settings, the SUS has four players designated as 'SB' to guard against the AI
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Agree on the 424 P112 - Only about 7 or 8 games in so far but my team is very average for the league (newly promoted in League two) and won all but one of them (that one saw me get a red card and the AI used the corner exploit I posted yesterday)! Should add I was already top of my league, but I was having to manage them through each game a lot, much less so with this so far.
Anyone struggling with closing out a game, feel free to have a go with my SUS;
FCU_19.2.1BEO424KnapP112SUS_1.1.fmf
Obviously if you switch to it from a non 424 formation then it might screw player positions up.
If I'm winning, I switch to cautious mentality around 65-75 minutes, then turn this on around 80-82. You could try it earlier if struggling,/really close game and the AI are attacking, but think you're inviting pressure if so.
If anyone wants to make their own with respective tactics, I usually;
- set mentality to defensive (occasionally ultra if im being hammered)
- move defensive line and LOE back two notches each
- change goalie distro to 'slow pace down'
- change when lost possession to 'regroup'
- change when win possession to 'hold shape'
- change full backs to 'no nonsense'
- if my DC's are having bad games I may change them to 'no nonsense', but that's an in-game decision rather than every time
- remove 'get stuck in' from tackling to avoid conceding free kicks0 -
@priority76 Very very early days, but i've started testing Knap's new Beowulf tactics - specifically the 424 P112 - and so far so good;
Yep, it's only four games, but the most interesting thing so far is that I haven't had to tweak anything. Having watched the Colchester and Vale games I definitely need to switch to cautious after 70 miutes and SUS after 80 (which i did to Plymouth) but despite giving up a few too many chances (which on attacking is to be expected?) I'm controlling games very well, equally as good as with my usual 4411 where I manually move between mentalities a lot.
Note that the Vale equaliser was in the last 4 minutes and due to a defensive issue with the attacking corner setup (I've posted about it in Knap's two most popular tactic threads and is something which you can negate in the SUS) so should really be 4 wins out of 4. 4 games is hardly a great test, I'm well aware, but considering my 4 best players are unhappy and consequently playing/training like chimps (that'll teach me for not selling them) the signs are still so encouraging that I'd be surprised if it goes too far south, I'll surely tweak it a little as I go too.
The other thing in it's favour is passing is a little more direct (suits lower league) and the striker roles are pressing forwards which also suits lower league strikers a bit better. My defence is much weaker in this season as I only had limited funds so had to focus on a specific area (midfield) so i'm surprised still how well i'm holding my own, especially as mentioned with my 4 best guys effectively downing tools (why can't you criticise poor training on unhappy players btw? Seems ridiculous).
Cautious about giving you fifty different things to try as it can tempt you to keep swapping things which also doesn't help but it might be your guys suit this better.
EDIT: Forgot to add that I also had a guy sent off against Vale which no doubt helped contribute to the result!
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1 hour ago, priority76 said:
I'll just keep plodding on then. I'm using your TIME4411 at the mo and one thing that frustrates me is I'm conceiding a lot of goals from balls hoofed over my defence due to the high line. Has this been a problem for you and do you think dropping it deaper is the answer? Doing this also seems to invite the pressure on so maybe not the best solution.
I conceded a lot of those in the Vanarama too (using TIME 4411) - not a lot of solid, pacy defenders around, but an irritating amount of pacy forwards. I found turning offside trap off helped (as my back 4 kept messing it up), but otherwise I went for a ‘Man Utd-esque we’ll score more than you’ to overcome it which was made easier by everyone having written us off as relegation candidates!
Have you noticed if there’s a pattern as to when you concede these types of goals? Anytime? Late on in games? Only after you take the lead?
Only other tip I have for the lower leagues is I always put a lot of focus on mental stats - determination especially, but also work rate for high pressing tactics. You can still get a lot of players in the lower leagues with high determination and - just my opinion - i think it takes you a heck of a long way. I avoid anyone lower than 14 determination if I can, although also can’t be too fussy down there and will still take someone with a lower stat but throw them into a mentoring group surrounded by higher determination players if necessary. That and abuse loans. Stupid good players available around that level.
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Just posted this on the Discord so sorry to anyone who lurks in both zones for having to read my waffle twice - you may have spotted there are one or two Knap tactic threads so you may spot this in one or two others just to spread the love and help prevent people chewing their dogs face off having conceded yet another late goal!
"Anyone using Knap's tactics with the later corner routines may want to bear this in mind, especially so when setting up an SUS as it's far more prevalent later in the game when the AI is going gung-ho. Been studying more and more how I concede goals - lots are direct free kicks, far too many worldy strikers, but otherwise I get alot of 2 on 1's, may of which are coming from my own set pieces it turns out;
My guy misses his header unsurprisingly, ball breaks and notice AI has 3 guys up top against just ONE of my guys - glimmer of hope that maybe it'll be flagged as offside;
Ruthlessly irritating AI knows what it's doing though - I'd argue he's interfering with play as a 2 on 1 but referees i guess! Rest is inevitable;
Note that this example happened with mentality set to very defensive and all my SUS options turned on. Done some testing and it's consistent across mentalities and with different tactics. Doesn't always happen ofc - an ultra defensive AI is never leaving 3 attackers up the pitch, they don't seem to try it as much if you're multiple goals ahead either, but be wary and maybe - if leading - think about swapping your attacking corner routines for something more defensive. Haven't observed it with throws as yet, nor have I tried it with a top level team so maybe doesn't happen as much with them (although possibly they'd more ruthlessly exploit it?).
Hope it helps!
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Just posted this on the Discord so sorry to anyone who lurks in both zones for having to read my waffle twice - you may have spotted there are one or two Knap tactic threads so you may spot this in one or two others just to spread the love and help prevent people chewing their dogs face off having conceded yet another late goal!
"Anyone using Knap's tactics with the later corner routines may want to bear this in mind, especially so when setting up an SUS as it's far more prevalent later in the game when the AI is going gung-ho. Been studying more and more how I concede goals - lots are direct free kicks, far too many worldy strikers, but otherwise I get alot of 2 on 1's, may of which are coming from my own set pieces it turns out;
My guy misses his header unsurprisingly, ball breaks and notice AI has 3 guys up top against just ONE of my guys - glimmer of hope that maybe it'll be flagged as offside;
Ruthlessly irritating AI knows what it's doing though - I'd argue he's interfering with play as a 2 on 1 but referees i guess! Rest is inevitable;
Note that this example happened with mentality set to very defensive and all my SUS options turned on. Done some testing and it's consistent across mentalities and with different tactics. Doesn't always happen ofc - an ultra defensive AI is never leaving 3 attackers up the pitch, they don't seem to try it as much if you're multiple goals ahead either, but be wary and maybe - if leading - think about swapping your attacking corner routines for something more defensive. Haven't observed it with throws as yet, nor have I tried it with a top level team so maybe doesn't happen as much with them (although possibly they'd more ruthlessly exploit it?).
Hope it helps!
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17 minutes ago, Dan_987 said:
I'm finding b2b promotions aren't always a good thing in FM19. A few years of stability and slowly moving up the divisions, can almost be a blessing in disguise if the side/facilities aren't ready for step up.
3rd year in my simulated save, FC United are still in Conference North (went from 18th -> 12th -> 5th).. however with decent attendance of 2,500 (for that level) and cups runs, they now have over 2 million in the bank and a huge wage budget compared to other clubs at that level. Catch is the board are now demanding a minimum expectation of Promotion by Winning the League in the 4th season.
I actually like that there may be a bit of a halt put on the progress if i'm honest - makes it more realistic for sure, actually like i'm helping shape/build the club as I go, I like the way I can discuss with the board what areas i'd rather focus the funding on for example - it's a bit simple and arbitrary sure, but much better than it was in ye olden days!
It's just the expectations that suck really as I've got what I feel is proportionately my smallest budget so far (especially as agents are far more prevalent at this level) and I've been hit with a pretty unrealistic expectation with no way to negotiate it etc. Won my first two games (by a single goal each) despite being the heavy underdog, albeit the 1st game saw the AI's 88th minute equaliser disallowed which made a nice change!
From the sounds of your save it'll definitely be beneficial for me to stay put for a year or so in terms of finance, just not sure i'll be able to keep hold of my star guys though sadly - what's more infuriating is their abysmal value despite stellar performances and the measly 30k offers i keep getting! Such is life for the minnows though, still far more fun than buying the same wonderkids ad nauseam!
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Just some general feedback for anyone with the power to look at these things/collecting the feedback for general improvements etc;
Good: I managed to get b2b promotions with FC United (now heading into League Two)
Bad (but ok, stuff happens): Due to league requirements the board had to improve the stadium at a colossal cost of 1.7 million. Luckily I drew Man City away last season in the FA cup so goodbye cup run, hello windfall. An additional loan the board took out also covered this off so i thought. Wage & transfer budget was budget was increased by a miserly 4.5k p/w (wages) and 105k for
agentstransfers. Thought maybe it's because of FFP but nope, we're still 28k p/w under that threshold (not that i'm suggesting for a minute we should play chicken with that) with 700k in the bank and season ticket cash still to come in.The worst: (the board have hurt my feelings): We didn't have any discussion at all over this seasons expectations, instead of the usual 'pick your destiny and we'll adjust the budget accordingly' I instead got an early one of the 'polite reminder' mails telling me that minimum expectation is to finish top half of League Two. Now I have and will abuse the heck out of the free xfer and loan system (although I can't recruit lawn ornaments to do a job in this league like I could the Vanarama) to try and do that, but even then it seems ever so slightly unfair? My manager rep started as bottom too (about 90% of 1 star atm) so don't think that is the reason, I'm actually curious if it's because I'm >ahem< slightly over my wage budget, as in I'd already spent the budget they'd have allocated if i'd picked the current expectation levels? Still seems silly that they couldn't/wouldn't discuss with me or even give me a choice saying "finish here or reduce the wage bill" etc, or failing that, even explain why they suddenly think we're automatic promotion material? Realise the owner himself could be a bottom face, but last season after promotion we had the usual convo and all they wanted was to avoid relegation etc.
Not world ending, not as unrealistic as the pinball vid above, but I will be sad now if I get the sack and never get to prove my scouts wrong about the useless young striker they keep telling me is one to watch...
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Oh wow, you're really down in the lower league doldrums - anyone with finishing over 8 is a god!
I think creating a save point and then replaying the same game is a great idea - you can learn a lot from doing that!
Are you keeping your mentality the same for the entire game? You need to change/adjust as you go through the game else the AI WILL adjust accordingly? 15, 60, 72 and 82 minutes are my most common 'checkpoints' for when to change, so maybe start with cautious and go from there? Check the stats as you've posted above at each of those time markers, and also keep an eye on the opposition formation and watch for your AM telling you "they look like they're playing more cautiously" or "they look like they're attacking a bit more". Golden rule is not to fix it if it isn't broken - too often when things are going well I think it can be tempting to change things, however at the FIRST sign of trouble then be pro-active!
I'd be loathe to change the defensive line from what Knap had them set to if i'm honest - it affects the whole tactic if you do that? Maybe try the default tactic with the tweaks I made () and see how you go for a few games?
Also take note of the mentality your ass man suggests - doesn't mean you have to listen to him (am curious to see if the recommendations become more accurate as my staff get better), but may give a good indication of how the game/opposition view your team.
Failing that, happy to take a quick/stab look at your game if you wanna upload it etc!
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Uh-oh...
A time variation of my current favourite tactic!?
Only got one game left this season so not really enough time to judge it against Blue Matter - if we do ok next season then i'll maybe try this one given my guys seem to play nicely with the TIME variant, just naturally will start out with the 4411 in the higher div etc.
Cheers Knap (again!)
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2 hours ago, priority76 said:
Hi optimus, I've been trying to use your 'system' and so far some improvement in results but some games the opposition just hammer us no matter what. You say if the opponent is outshooting you then you need to make 'drastic changes', what sort of thing do you suggest?
Hard to say for sure without knowing what team/level you're playing at, but if you're getting that outplayed then two places I'd start;
1.) What's the possession? What's your passing stat? What formation are the opposition playing? Is anyone having a stinker on your team (poor left back against a mini-ronaldo etc)? Check your ass mans in-game analysis/feedback - don't react to everything he says but can be a good hint as to where to start looking. If possession is high but passing low then is 'pass into space' enabled? Are your crosses working ? If playing on a small pitch or against a very defensive team, it might be that there is little space to pass into so your guys just keep giving it away? Are you crossing and no-one is in the box? I don't advocate changing passing settings often, but if a poor performance is a one-off, they can/do make the difference.
2.) If you're struggling more consistently then my main question would be "Is the tactic/formation the right tool for the current job"? Not just talking about does it fit the players/system, but does it fit the nature of what you're trying to do? Playing a defensive 4-5-1 as Man United is a bad fit (take notice Jose!), likewise, playing an expansive 4-2-3-1 as Maidstone away is likewise looking for trouble. I was using this 4-4-1-1 to great effect until the AI times started seeing me as a threat, brought the proverbial bus into their starting 11 and my goals dried up as I kept getting hit by late game long ball counters as i pressed more and more for the win; consequently I changed my main formation to a 4-3-2-1 and started overwhelming teams more easily. The one issue with this is occasionally you'll come across teams that don't fear you, possibly because of a higher reputation (or in my most recent case, it was a cup game) and will come out to play - this happened to me in a recent cup semi-final; I wasn't expecting it, was maybe a bit complacent and went with my 4-3-2-1. After being 2-0 down and being outplayed everywhere I realised that my formation/tactic was overall far too attacking and changed down to my 4-4-1-1 and instantly retook control. I pulled the game back to 2-2, but still got stung irritatingly late on which was more my own fault for chasing a winner (leaving higher mentality) rather than going more cautious, settling for a draw - notice the possession, passing and shot stats for both sides are pretty similar, meaning the game could - as it did - have gone either way in the end;
Contrast that to the second leg; having seen that Leyton obviously don't rate me and will attack, I went with the 4-4-1-1 and as you can see from the stats I had a MUCH better time of it. Unsurprisingly, they still scored first, typically with their first shot of them game, but I bossed it after that and actually brought the tie level - as you may spot though, the FM gods bizarrely decided to hit me with 2 red cards in the same game so despite a valiant ET effort we couldn't hold out;
Hope that helps - otherwise tell us a bit more about who you are/what style you're playing and i'm sure me/someone can help you out a bit!
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No probs!
If you are adjusting the mentality then it'll take a while to get used to knowing when to change etc - you kinda get a feel for it, although it's never an exact science and can still be plenty irritating. 15, 60, 72 and 82 minutes are my most common 'checkpoints' for when to change as a guideline but some games just go completely off the rails.
I haven't had any problems with get stuck in until literally the last ten games (after i won the league) - got 7 reds across 5 games which is bizarre as 2 over the rest of the season? Suspect player mentality stats play a part, that and the fact I reckon the game got tired of me winning (sent two guys off in the cup semi of course!
)
EDIT: Forgot to say, i always think I concede a lot too - looking at the table above it appears relatively that I don't really. No matter how good you get at juggling the mentality, sadly the AI will always score (and you'll second guess yourself) - player quality for sure makes a difference though!
Good luck!
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Apologies for anyone on the Discord having to read this twice, but just given the BM 4321 a big thumbs up for the lower leagues (when teams go defensive). Started the season with a 4411 but had to change it up when teams brought their bus onto the pitch - this worked wonders;
Note that because of the division i'm in i made the following tweaks - not saying you have to do this, but my star midfielder all the big teams want has a passing stat of 7 soooo
;
- removed focus passing down middle
- removed offside trap
- added pass into space
- start every game with 'cautious' mentality and changed as appropriate (read around this board for more on that from me if interested)
- added work ball into box
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Yep, removing the 'play through middle'!
This was all in the TIME 4411 thread - I also added this which may or may not help;
Glad it's helping - principle applies to any team/division really, just obviously adjust the starting/other mentalities for ones that better suit the standard of your team - I'd be much less likely to start games on 'cautious' as United, Barca etc.
One thing I forgot to mention in my first post is that there are occasions where being bold pays off - had an game last night where I took the lead and started being penned in (possession dropped, opposition starting shooting more frequently), but it was way too early/the other team were not so superior that I felt defensive was an option. First thing I check in that situation is passing accuracy - if lower than (finger in the air) 78-80% then I'll maybe enable/disable passing into space/check passing focus/see if a player is having a particularly bad game/giving lots of passes away, otherwise I'll increase mentality a notch to try and relieve the pressure and play more in the oppositions half.
The 3D match being played can be maddening with how little feedback it offers, paying attention to the numbers underneath saves a lot of frustration, although even watching them like a hawk I still often concede from the other teams first shot on goal etc, but sometimes there's nothing you can do, you are always going to concede some time!
In addition to all this, I did have to change it up in the next season; after the first 8 games the AI saw me as a threat and started to adapt and play more defensively. I switched up to Knap's BLUE MATTER 4321 and it's worked wonders. I still use the 4411 for tough away games and i've just got my second promotion on the bounce (with FC United);
I imagine next season in league 2 I'll have to start with the 4411 again as I'll be an underdog no doubt tipped for relegation!
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Just as a final follow up on my earlier post about playing time - not convinced there still isn't something slightly amiss behind the scenes having just seen this;
Might clear up in a game or two, have played him a bit more but player is still listed as unhappy - wonder if there is just a conflict/clash of perceived status, current status, playing time and some of the changes I made in contract talks playing a part? This particular player has a few promises too (none around playing time - yet) and have noticed a few blips with promises elsewhere in my games (spotted a few reports on the bug thread too) so wonder if there is some funny business going on. No majors regardless, just interesting/observations
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44 minutes ago, themadsheep2001 said:
You mentioned some were new signings and that they agreed to the status. When you first opened negotiations, what was their opening team status request?
I *think* they picked rotation, but not 100% on all of them - I rarely change the status if I'm being honest as it suggests I'll have issues with them down the road, but I remember I did change a couple that wanted 'key' down and that would certainly fit with them being easily irritated etc?
43 minutes ago, phnompenhandy said:To be honest, the new mentoring system is the one thing I haven't got to grips with in FM19, and I'd appreciate some feedback from SI on my thoughts about it.
What has happened with me putting players into mentoring groups is that everyone's determination has clustered around 10. I assume this is due to the specifics of my academy challenge. All my players are young - I'm five years in and my oldest and most highly influential players are now 20, so the mentoring system was not designed for them, I assume. Secondly, by moulding my academy intake, every year the average determination attribute is higher, so in mentoring groups older players with lower determination drag down the younger ones. I'd like to know if the loss in determination is being compensated with increases in professionalism and ambition but I can't tell.
For all that, academy challenge is he only way to play the game - I love it!
It's definitely a big change for me; on the one hand I prefer it over the old method where I always found it a bit haphazard and could cause problems, but I'm also pretty early into it and not entirely sure how well it's going as yet. I'm not restricted by my academy (yet!) so I can abide by my 'only buy if Determination > 14 unless desperate' philosophy (sadly not always possible in lower leagues!) and having set up 4 different mentoring groups I can see determination across the first team is trending up however for a few of my players, the feedback in the training update mails has been that some of the more negative traits have been passed along - as a lot of those stats are hidden it's hard to be 100% sure if i'm going about it in entirely the right way?
EDIT: I always ALWAYS 'remove and exclude from negotiations' the annoying wage increase. Can't always get rid of the 'after x league games'ones but holy heck do i try!
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4 minutes ago, HUNT3R said:
It seems a low amount of games to give them. If you consistently have a problem with Rotation players, this points to you not giving Rotation players enough starts.
Ok ta, I'll up my thresholds and see how I go - haven't played since 16 and I don't remember them being quite this precious!
3 minutes ago, phnompenhandy said:Indeed, hence my managerial style is to be a brutal dictator. I demand loyalty and professionalism and anyone who's attitude is out of line with me gets the chop.
I can really only get away with that 'Cloughie'/early Sralex Fergie' approach by running an academy challenge. All my players have come through my youth system, nurtured by a Head of Youth Development who is selected on the basis of his personality over and above attributes. The kids tend to idolise the staff, club and myself so they're easier to control. The first thing I look at to decide whether to give them youth contracts or terminate their trials is their personalities. That way I take preventative measures to avoid a lot of the player-management issues that plague modern managers.
I definitely like that approach, I used to be big on the mentoring/mental aspects - only recently come back to FM and getting to grips with the new mentoring system! Do you notice a tangible difference when you're dealing with the players?
You're the second person i've seen mention an academy challenge too - it's got the little itch inside me going as it fits my preferred playstyle of favouring youth; will have to look into that after I finish up my current save I think, far too tempting!
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46 minutes ago, HUNT3R said:
That sounds low. Rotation players will expect to be rotated. Playing less than half the matches only means they're not being rotated in much. Even those with 5 out of 10 (which still sounds a little low) it'll depend on when they played. If, for instance, they played 5 of 5, but then were dropped for the last 5, they'll want to know if they're still going to get game time as it appears their playing time is reducing lately.
Just clarifying - do you mean the amount of games I've given them seems low, or it's a low number of games for them to be complaining about? I've always aimed for a 50/75/90% starting rate for rotation/first team/key players respectively, (admittedly falling short of that with a few of them in this example due to it being early in the season and match sharpness not quite being there etc) but if others aim higher/think that's a bit low then fair enough, will adjust my parameters a little and be wary - it's only really the rotation guys I have a problem with (and even then assume sometimes mentality stats like professionalism play a part).
7 minutes ago, phnompenhandy said:There is 'squad status' which is visible and chosen by you, and there is 'perceived squad status' which is hidden and unknowable. It's how the player perceives himself. YOU might have given him 'rotation' status, but HE might regard himself as a key player! In other words, you have players with an attitude problem!
Ah ok, I didn't know that's a thing, interesting to know. Weirdly 4 of the guys were new signings in July (and thus agreed to rotation), but guess it's possible something is working in the background and now they're at the club they're like "nope, I should be first team as I'm way better than this lot!"?
Will keep an eye anyway, it's irritating having to constantly speak to the needy children rather than anything else (obviously the hit to morale can be more annoying), but if others think it's ok then fair enough I guess, maybe i'll have to start using 'backup' more often!
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Don't know if this has been mentioned here (or anywhere else) or if it's just me - does anyone have issues with players becoming unreasonably unhappy over playing time, incredibly quickly? I find it happens with key players after as few as two games (common after injury when i'm waiting for them to get match sharpness back), but the biggest problem for me is 'rotation' players, from my experience maybe the threshold is set a little low? Ten games into the season and I've got 5 rotation players with the slight complaint who've played between 5-2 games each? It's not world ending, just often ends up with me ignoring them and making them unhappy rather than rely on promises they either don't believe or sometimes reset (believe that's logged as a sporadic bug?)
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4 hours ago, QuickZombie said:
This is genius!! Been following this advice and doing scandalously good
Glad it's helping - principle applies to any team/division really, just obviously adjust the starting/other mentalities for ones that better suit the standard of your team - I'd be much less likely to start games on 'cautious' as United, Barca etc.
One thing I forgot to mention in my first post is that there are occasions where being bold pays off - had an game last night where I took the lead and started being penned in (possession dropped, opposition starting shooting more frequently), but it was way too early/the other team were not so superior that I felt defensive was an option. First thing I check in that situation is passing accuracy - if lower than (finger in the air) 78-80% then I'll maybe enable/disable passing into space/check passing focus/see if a player is having a particularly bad game/giving lots of passes away, otherwise I'll increase mentality a notch to try and relieve the pressure and play more in the oppositions half.
The 3D match being played can be maddening with how little feedback it offers, paying attention to the numbers underneath saves a lot of frustration, although even watching them like a hawk I still often concede from the other teams first shot on goal etc, but sometimes there's nothing you can do, you are always going to concede some time!
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Anyone lower league-ing on the lookout for a tactic should seriously hit up the TIME 4411. Played around with a lot of different styles, roles, formations and full tactics (self and downloaded) and whilst I was still having a 'good' season I didn't have that lovely 'confidence' going into a game where you know roughly what the result should/will be, felt very much like a lottery. I avoided 442/variants like the plague as I had no suitable MR/ML players (seriously struggle to believe how few natural wingers are even competent there?) but just sucked it up & changed individual training and voila!
I did make a few tiny tweaks (removed passing focus in possession, disabled offside trap, changed default mentality to cautious & increased attacking width by 1 notch) for anyone interested, and for SUS I change all backline to no-nonsense, move the MCL to DM as an anchor, set time-wasting to full, goalie in possession to slow pace, when possession has been lost to regroup & won to hold shape and then move both defensive line and LOE down two notches.
One thing to note is that it's often not 'pick tactic and win' even then, so for anyone struggling my general rule of thumb when playing with this team/tactic is;
1.) Start game with 'Cautious' mentality. Ass man often told me differently. Ass man was being true to his name (and is now sacked). Conceded first far too many times when going with attacking.
2.) After about 12 in-game minutes, monitor possession, if you're not >5% then drop mentality (that should be rare on cautious early on unless playing team from higher division). Monitor shots. If you're outshooting opp by a large number then change mentality up. If close/even change down, if being outshot then drastic change needed as you WILL concede. Don't go more attacking unless you need to - you can and will score goals with cautious, balanced and positive!
I usually don't need to change mentality after the original assessment (deciding if cautious is the sweet spot or change up etc) until the second half unless i score a lot of goals and 'poke the bear'. Some teams a re a bit more aggressive but generally i won't need to change too much until 60-75 minutes; If i'm playing badly i'll change/make subs early 60's, otherwise i'll wait until early 70's and take off anyone tired/on a yellow. If a close game i'll SUS if needed from 82-85 minutes.
3.) Only ass man instructions i listen to is reducing tackling for anyone carded.
Won the Vanarama North in Season 1 along with the FA Trophy (the latter of which was against a team that finished 2nd in the league above!) and going gangbusters again in Season 2 with a vastly reinforced team!
Season 1;
Season 2 (so far);
Thanks Knap!
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Just posted this on the Discord, but have been testing this new one (the argus KNAP 41131 P108 a few posts above) with FC United (1st season) and great results so far (played 7, won 7) - my squad is far from amazing too, most pre-game predictions go against my team (was 4th when i started testing, now 3rd).
As suggested, so much variance with stats so low in general but it's by far the most solid tactic i've tried in this division (have conceded 32 in 29 games, but only 1 in the last 7 using this tactic). I would describe my guys as 'creatively challenged' - the trend has been lots of chances but few clear ones/conversions, but they've been making and scoring a lot more regularly with this too. Appreciate 7 games isn't a great sample, but such is the turnaround it's worth noting.
EDIT: Played a couple of the top teams in my league and found that playing 'offside trap' was causing me some issues with the dreaded long ball over the top so disabled it to good effect. With better players naturally I think i'll turn it back on.
2nd Edit: Had a few issues next day weirdly - the change was like night and day so moved across to Knap's 4411 and had GREAT success! If any llm wannabe's are interested then head across for details!
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FM 19 Time 424, 442 Beowulf 4420 Knap
in Tactics Sharing Centre (Upload/Download)
Posted · Edited by optimusprimal82
Thanks Knap
Second game;
Added Cameron Summers & Henry Muggeridge (new signings) to starting XI at DL & DR respectively.
Observations - AM notes that Summers & Muggeridge (unsurprisingly) need more time to blend in. Morale is much better for this game overall. Hartley is still lacking match fitness.
Starting XI;
Team talk - Assertive; Ashton have lost last 4 of 5 etc, no greens, lots of 'listened keenly's, again told each area (def/mid/att) passionately that "think there's a lot more to come from you", changed to 7 greens.
Starting tactic; TIME 442 - Started on cautious.
AI score in 1st minute. Awesome. Equalise in 3rd minute. This game is going to be crazy, can tell already. Win penalty in 5th minute. We (surprisingly) score penalty. 2-1 after 5 minutes.
15th minute, possession dominated, AI not shooting, passing accuracy > 80%, changed to balanced mentality.
17th minute, we score.
30th minute, completely against the run of play, AI score through our GK own goal. Game doesn't even count it as a shot on target. Awesome.
AI attack dangerously again, obviously changed their approach (thanks for not noticing Ass Man!) - switch to CTRL and cautious mentality.
41st minute, we have goal disallowed.
44th minute, we still have majority possession (58%) but AI is shooting relentlessly. Change mentality down to defensive and add 'get stuck in' to tackling in order to see out the half. Hopefully.
Half time (3-2 for Sheffield) - Team talk; Assertive - don't get complacent, 7/11 greens. Interestingly AM notes that Gascoigne is "getting skinned all too often today" despite him currently having highest rating. He scored so rating is artificially high, may actually not be playing that well.
Half time stats;
Second half; Left tactics unaltered for first 5-10 to gauge how attacking AI starts the half.
52 minutes, no AI attacks, change up to cautious.
57th minute. AI scores. As predictable as it is annoying.
65th minute, change to my base TIME 442 & attacking.
72nd minute, substitutes.
75th minute, we score. Change to CTRL & cautious.
85th minute, change to SUS.
FT: We win. Phew.
Post-match observations: Defence and goalkeeper need improving, pace in the centre especially. Goalkeeper is distinctly average, signed a young guy who has potential and may be a replacement, but at the moment those three seem to be the weakest part of the team. ML and CM would be the next areas I'd focus on (bearing in mind I've already replaced the fullbacks). Not saying any of that is possible right now but just my quick assessment after two matches (overall goals conceded suggest it's a big weakness too).
The real kicker?
That was their hardest game on paper too.