SD
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15 minutes ago, themadsheep2001 said:
Firstly equality isn't political, its fundamental. Secondly Football Manager can be whatever SI want it to be. Last time I checked there was no requirement for games to be apolitical. Just because you might want that doesn't mean that's how it should be. Also entirely irrelevant to women's football
That you think equal outcome(equal preeminence, in this case) are a moral imperative is very much a political stance, I don't find anything morally wrong with women's football being a lot less popular than the men's sport - nobody's wronging women's football by not supporting it, people are simply voting with their wallets and with the eyes against it, the same thing your mod colleague @XaWsuggest we do with FM if we don't like it, ain't it?
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20 minutes ago, santy001 said:
You have to be very careful how you word things because this isn't at all what Miles has said from what I can see.
His comments to the athletic were that those who believe the addition of women's football (something which will be entirely optional to their playing experience) will ruin the game for them then they are not wanted.
There is a huge difference between what you think on it being implemented in the game and stating/believing it will ruin the game for you. If, by its mere inclusion, it will ruin the game for a person then that means there has to be a direct opposition to womens football somewhere. Which leads down a path where the only viable conclusions are those ultimately aren't the people you want to support you and be backing you.
Most people will poorly convey their point on the basis of developmental resources and conflating that with concerns about how development could go. That's an area we've been discussing a lot. No one knows the state of the FM22, and subsequent versions, in terms of bugs/features/graphics etc. But if everything is magically fine and dandy with SI knocking it out of the park and yet the game is still ruined for people by the thought or eventual inclusion of women's football then that's a problem they have.
I'm the Stoke Researcher and its not been the case that someone has said to me "Hey, you need to pick up the research for the Stoke Women's team" because there will be a person who comes along to do that. Someone for whom it is a genuine interest. Logistically for me it would be no different between SI saying I need to research the Stoke Women's team, Port Vale, or Crewe. They could ask me but my answer would be no because I don't have an interest or passion in them irrespective of the Men's/Women's status. I can't feign the interest or passion for those, I have no memories of walking away from those respective grounds with my dad week in, week out 25+ years ago. No history of the wall charts of fixtures, the pictures of squads up on my bedroom wall and everything that followed. The people involved will be those who want to make it happen.
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Women's football is not a political issue, it is football. What FM is doing is ultimately looking to further reflect, in more depth, the reality of the sport in which it exists and that so happens to help further other things from an equality perspective.
I was indifferent to the original announcement on Friday, but with the stances it took since SI has lost any presumption of good faith with me.
I am skeptical that the women's football will be entirely optional and I will be able to disable it from the gameworld entirely, and furthermore I am skeptical this newfound woke fervor won't lead to further gameplay compromises at the expense of realism and immersion.4 -
17 minutes ago, Wolf_pd said:
You are allowed to have an opinion about it, worry about whether it takes away from the main part of the game. That is all understandable. The line is drawn at making sexist remarks however and several (now hidden) posts were going on in a manner we do not want to see on the board.
Well according to SI director Miles Jacobson that line isn't drawn at abuse as you claim, but mere concerns and criticism. I've already crossed that line and apparently the game is no longer for me.
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My concerns with the announcement are two-fold.
1. By all indications it's not as simple as adding a custom league - new animations, ME tweaks, AI, perhaps entirely new mechanics(Miles was hinting about the effects of periods on women athlete performance). I wouldn't be surprised if for the next couple editions a sizeable portion of the flagship new features are going to be related to the women's game - so yes, those of us who have little to no interest in women's football have every right to be concerned if that development effort is going to be at the expense of the main game. Ok, there's a chance that my concerns turn out to be unfounded, but that kind of righteous entitlement from Miles recent "we don't need that money" statement lost a lot of goodwill points with me.
2. There's an undeniable political undertone not as much to the announcement itself but mostly to the way SI handled the ensuing criticism, I've seen plenty of other game developers making that shift from politically agnostic to activist, and people are correctly intuiting this shift - it's not like you're the first developer to take their fanbase for granted and start treating them like unwashed masses in need of educating.8 -
1 hour ago, NotSoSpecialOne said:
Mileage may vary, but I personally ignore at least 90% of the advice my AssMan offers (or whomever happens to be assigned to provide advice/feedback) as it vary rarely makes sense within the context of everything else going on in the save.
The OI advice during a match is particularly grating, like when he identifies a particular player as "pulling the strings" just because he has a high rating owing to a 40 yards 1 in 100 shots worldie.
But there's just enough useful advice for me to not disable them from the settings.1 -
24 minutes ago, yolixeya said:
I had a player with that trait earlier in the save when I was still in the Swedish league. Played him as a wide TQ and he did dribble a lot. Maybe he does other things as well, it's hard to tell from limited graphical engine.
His Attacking mentality and Dribble More PI will make him dribble a lot regardless of Traits, but you are correct that this particular trait is one of those things where the graphical engine makes it hard to notice it in action and we're left "trusting" the devs that it does what it claims to do.
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On a related note, I see that everyone has Dribbling high up their list, but my understanding is that Tries Tricks does not necessarily refer to dribbles and a trick could also mean a flick, a trick pass or a fancy finish.
For me personally the three key attributes in order of importance are Flair, Technique and First Touch.0 -
Looks promising, player interactions were long overdue a re-work, but it appears that the Tactics Creator work they hinted at about a year ago got pushed back for FM22.
By no means I am disappointed, my expectations for this edition have been toned down, SI is not the only game studio whose development work was disrupted by covid.
To be honest, the only reason I'm bummed about FM21 is that just about every single one of my go-to wonderkids has moved this window
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I'm not too worried about features. I'd gladly pay for a polished version of FM20, with an improved match engine and an updated database.
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On 23/09/2020 at 01:32, LeeWHU888 said:
the game does everything it can to stop you winning (constant late goals, equalisers from 20-30 yards late on, giving silly penalties away, opposition GK saving everything)
As a Spurs fan, this sounds to me like an excellent representation of real world football.
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I think that is an excellent representation of real world football.
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I will likely still buy the FM21, even though I've barely played 20, because at the end of the day I think SI remains one of the few good guys in gaming. The last thing I'd want is for them to change their design philosophy from a sim that tries to be as faithful as possible to real football, to some micro-transactions fueled arcadey nonsense to appease as large a demographic as possible.
But you can tell from recent editions that the lack of a competitor is making them complacent when it comes to QA.
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@Welshace A couple requests if you don't mind.
Erling Haaland
Japhet Tanganga
Emi Buendia
Fede Valverde
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I'm at work so haven't fired up the game yet, but I'm willing to bet Haaland is a -10 or 185+ PA.
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- Improvements to newgen generation with more realistic number of Inside Forwards and Ball-Winning Midfielders
- Newgens more tailored for specific positions with better logic for player developmentOf all the changes this is what I'm most hyped about. Newgens were a big turn off for me for many editions and it was the main reason I lost interest in a save after a couple seasons.
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5 hours ago, Jaydenoren said:
First of all, thanks for your advice. I've now constructed a new tactic which has the same formation but a different style of play.
Would appreciate any tips on how to make this tactic better before going to any matches and reviewing it myself.
I think you're on the right track in terms of getting your TIs in sync with your formation and roles, but your tactic still lacks a clear identity. I would recommend trying out one of the pre-made setups, gegenpress or fluid counter appears to be what you are aiming for, in fact you can train both since they suite the same type of squad - physical forwards, pacy wingers, hard working midfielders. For me personally it's not uncommon to switch between a high block and a low block setup depending on the scoreline and what I want out of the match.
These pre-made tactics are better than people give them credit for and offer a good foundation to build on. Watch a few matches in full, or at least the first 20 minutes and look to understand how the tactic plays out on the pitch. Again, you could be successful at the game on pre-made templates alone, there are of course plenty of edges to be gained by making tweaks to suit your personnel or the opposition you're against, but making tweaks before first understanding the basics will more often than not be counterproductive.
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I think your striker struggles to perform because you gave him an attacking role that looks to push up, but you are using a medium tempo, short passing tactic. By the time your team works the ball up to him he'll usually be up against 2-3 defenders who've already completed transitioning into defensive formation. Personally I would experiment with CF(A) or DLF(A) instead, it won't turn him into a goal machine but at least he'd be offering more to the team.
Somewhat unrelated to your question, but one thing I notice about many people's tactics is ample usage of the Be More Expressive TI. From experience, I've had a lot better success using the opposite Be More Disciplined and it makes sense - if you are putting a lot of thought into setting up a well rounded tactic, you want your players to stick as much as possible to it and to the roles you've assigned them. Even looking at IRL football, modern-day successful managers like Pep or Klopp drill their players into rigid tactical systems rather than entrust them with loads of creative freedom.
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6 hours ago, zlatanera said:
That’s just the game’s description of the role. I think it’s a verbal way of expressing that Roaming + Move Into Channels may leave them poorly placed to recover. As you can see though it can be customised to work harder. Those are Müller’s attributes too, as you said he’s not exactly going to slack off with 18 Work Rate!
Oh, I know that's the in-game description, it wasn't criticism aimed at you.
This is another one of those things where the UI is sending players on the wrong track.
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52 minutes ago, zlatanera said:
This can result in quiet periods during which the Raumdeuter may neglect his defensive duties, therefore adequate cover and a strong team shape are key in order to fully utilise his attacking prowess in the final third.
This is something I don't agree with. Real life players who can be categorized as raumdeuters(Muller, Mane, Dele) are typically very hard working defensively - pressing and running a lot to deny passing lanes, tracking back, man-marking opposition deep lying playmakers.
Even in-game, a Raumdeuter is not going to be any more of a defensive liability than an IF(A) or a IW(A).
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There's a problem with this paragraph on page 12.
"The Half Back is an inversion of how a Sweeper plays. The Half Back sits in front of the defence whilst in possession, being a passing outlet to keep recycling the ball. When the team loses possession, he drops between the centre back pairing, and splits the centre backs wider, creating a back three."
It's the other way around, the HB drops between the CBs in possession, creating a back three. This behavior primarily occurs during buildup, once the ball progresses into the final third he can take up more advanced positions similar to an Anchorman. Out of possession he sits in front of the backline and acts like a regular DM.
That is what the role does in theory, in practice the HB has two major issues that for me make it entirely unusable. The behavior I described only works as intended with the wide defenders played from the WB strata. If played from the FB strata the HB will still drop deep, but the CBs will not spread as much and resulting back three will be significantly narrower than a regular back three. This narrow positioning makes it largely ineffective at getting past a 2 man press, which is primary reason why the role evolved.
And second, even when used "as intended" with the wide defenders in the WB strata, when the HB steps out from the backline because the ball is high up the pitch, the CBs will keep their wide positioning thus leaving a huge space right in the middle of the defence.
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1 hour ago, PequenoGenio said:
it's going good but me main problem is the strikers.. Low ratings and barely scores
I feel that a lone striker is naturally going to struggle a bit against formations that use a DM - so 4141, 4231 DM, 442 diamond, some of the most common formations in modern football.
This is particularly true for roles that drop deep, since the main reason for that movement is to lose his marker and make himself free for a pass, which happens a lot less when he just ends up being picked up by the opposition DM.
You can try to give your striker a roaming PI, but what I've found is that often he'll just end up attacking less dangerous zones of the pitch while also leaving you without a focal point up front. Overloading the opposition fullback doesn't do much if there's nobody in the box to receive the ball or give centrebacks a decision to make.
Right now I'm using a Klopp inspired high tempo system with wide forwards, static midfielders and wingbacks pushing high up the pitch, but before I used a setup similar to yours and overall I was content with how my striker did.
My advice is to experiment with roles other than DLF for your striker.
Personally, which striker role I am using depends on the opposition formation - I may use a DLF against a flat 442 or a 4231, but against most formations I am picking a role that attacks the box and rely on the movement of other players to create space and leave him in 1v1 situations with his marker. That ends up being either a plain ol AF or a Poacher, or my personal favorite TM(A) - which does the two things I want him to do, attack the box and hold up the ball.
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17 minutes ago, Grateful Dead said:
I'm wondering if it's working as intended that the AI coaches load players with PPMs that sometimes are contradicting but also make them unsuitable for roles they're good (just because the stats are good for certain PPMs). Just took over a team in my 8th season, pretty much every MC has "gets forward whenever possible", also many DR/Ls got it. Also one player has "runs with ball down right" AND "cuts inside from both wings". Not to mention the amount of players who seem to be particularly good at "trying killer balls often"...
That is very likely due to mentoring.
Until a few editions ago the AI was not bothering with PPMs and re-training positions, but since last year's edition it goes way overboard.
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AI managers will obsessively retrain every player to play the maximum number of positions the game will allow for him.
Any ST will be retrained to play all three of AM C/L/R, without fail. Any FB will be retrained to play WB/wide M/AM. Any DM/MC will be retrained as CB. Sergej Milinkovic-Savic often ends up being retrained both as a DM and CB, sometimes even ST.
I can understand a mid-season cover situation due to bad luck with injuries or if a player has an attribute profile that is really suitable for a new position, but this is something that happens with an absurd frequency. Retraining players as anything more than emergency cover is something that happens very sparingly in real football once you get past developmental years.
Using Spurs, the team I follow closely, as an example, I can count on one hand the instances where in recent years a player was fully retrained to a new playing position - FM equivalent of accomplished or better. Dier from CB to DM comes to mind. Winks from MC to DM. Lucas Moura from AMR/L to ST. And we're talking about adding just one position. Meanwhile in FM, left in the hands of the AI, by the time a season or two passes someone like Harry Kane is invariably retrained to play at AM C/L/R.
FM19 suffered from the same issue, and looking at real world football a season and a half past game start, I can't see any of the retraining that in-game was happening with 100% frequency, save after save. I'm willing to bet that a season and a half from now we will see barely any of the retraining that right now in-game is happening with 100% frequency.
Not only this is incredibly unrealistic and immersion breaking, but because of the way positional rating interacts with CA, players close to their peak with often decline or at best stagnate in the hands of the AI. All else being equal, any player developed by the AI is almost always going to be worse than if he was developed by the human player, as if the AI wasn't already bad enough at player development.
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7 hours ago, Ronaldo Beckham said:
How is Japhet Tanganga on FM2020, I am tempted to do a youth only Spurs save soon and was just curious how he is rated on FM.
He's rather poor right now, Championship level at best.
Personally I think he should be a -9 this update, he's athletic, composed, comfortable on the ball, tactically versatile, great mentality, he really looks to have a high ceiling.
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How we're introducing women's football into Football Manager
in Football Manager General Discussion
Posted
You can't disable Brazil because it's an integral part of men's football ecosystem, but there's very little overlap between the men's and the women's sport when it comes to the things that are within the scope of the game - player pools, staff, development infrastructure, finances.
And yes, it's well possible to disable countries from the gameworld, Japan from example.