Hall of fame - why is there no Don Revie?

Simple question - why is Don Revie not in the Hall of fame?

In my personal opinion Revie is in the top three of greatest English managers of all time; only Sir Alf from the top of my head can be classed greater than Revie - because he won the World Cup. Now, no doubt you'll make a common mistake and name Brian Clough - because you're brainwashed by the pro-Clough, anti-Leeds/Revie media.

From http://www.fansonline.net/leedsunited/article.php?id=326:

t’s just before five o’ clock, 25th October 1969. The referee’s final whistle sounds to bring the match between Leeds United and Derby County to a close. Leeds triumph 2-0 courtesy of two Allan Clarke goals. 44,000 witnessed United’s win, but this day marked something far more than just 90 minutes of football, it sparked one of England’s fiercest ever rivalries between two men; Don Revie and Brian Clough.

United went on to reach the semi final’s of the European Cup, the final of the FA Cup and finish second in the league, while Clough’s Derby finished fourth, that season. However, on a bigger scale the seeds had been sown for the next four years at least.

During Revie’s and Clough’s time at Leeds and Derby respectively, the record is highly in favour of Leeds and Revie.

Leeds and Derby clashed twelve times under the management of Revie and Clough, Leeds the victors on ten occasions, including the 5-0 thumping of then league champions Derby in 1972. Derby were league champions solely because of the FA’s refusal to give Leeds an extra 48 hours rest after the FA Cup final of 1972. Leeds defeated Arsenal courtesy of a diving Allan Clarke header on the 54th minute, then two days later had to compete against Wolves at Molineux in a league title decider.

There’s no denying that Clough was a great manager, no average Brian can win two European Cups. During his 28 year stint with a total of five clubs, his record was: One Division Two league title, two league titles, four League Cups, two European Cups and one European Super Cup. He also had a relegation on his CV, and you’d daren’t look at his record at Brighton & Hove Albion, or at the time league champions Leeds United for that. Fact is, without Peter Taylor, Clough was just another manager. Overall, throughout his career, Clough had a 45% winning percentage.

Revie’s record wasn’t half bad either. One Division league title, two league titles, one FA Cup, two Inter Fairs Cups and one League Cup; although his personal honours should have been far higher. The league title of 1971 was handed to Arsenal after referee Ray Tinkler refused to acknowledge his linesman, and two clear offside decisions which gave West Brom a highly unlikely win at Elland Road. The loss of these points gave Arsenal the league title. Incidents against Chelsea in 1967 and AC Milan in 1973 where United were unfairly treated, or in the last case, robbed due to a bribed referee don’t help Revie’s managerial record. Overall, Revie had a 52% winning percentage, 7% higher than Clough.

One thing both managers have in common is the feat of taking a small Division Two club into First Division champions.

In 1974, Revie left for the England job, ending his 13 year tenure at Elland Road.

Once Leeds had gained promotion to the old First Division, United never once failed to finish outside the top four. League champions twice, runners up five times, third in 1973 and two fourth placed finishes in 1967 and 1968. Derby and Forest under Clough were far more inconsistent.

At Derby, it consisted of League champions once, one fourth placed finish, seventh and ninth place. At Brighton, he managed to record 19th place in Division Three, and while moving onto Forest, upon promotion Forest’s top flight record consisted of one league title, runners up once, third place thrice, fifth placed twice, seventh place, eighth place four times, ninth place twice, twelfth place and twenty second place.

Clough had spent 15 more years than Revie in management, yet Revie had tallied the same amount of major honours in the game, with Leeds being the focus of many great injustices to referees over the years.

Revie also won the ‘Manager of the Year’ award on three seperate occasions, 1969, 1970 and 1972. Something Clough never achieved. Unlike Clough, Revie has the name of ‘England National Team’ on his football management CV. One of the rare things these two managers do share is an OBE.

So despite the football myth that Brian Clough of Derby County and Nottingham Forest was the better manager than Don Revie of Leeds United, the stats quite clearly point Leeds’ Don Revie as the far better manager.

Don't get me wrong, Clough was a very good manager, but the public perception that Clough was a far better manager than Revie is quite clearly wrong, and a myth that needs to be put right.

Who’s the better manager? Don Revie.

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Now, let's look at things realistically.

Revie took Leeds out of the old Second Division, at one stage under Revie's stewardship we were 90 minutes within dropping to the Third tier of English football. There was no Leeds United before Revie.

He changed the club's kit, changed the club's mentality and in our first season in the top flight we finished 2nd on goal average to Man United, and lost in extra-time at Wembley in the FA Cup final to Liverpool 2-1.

In that 1965 FA Cup Final, only four of those players had commanded fee's (Giles, Peacock, Collins and Storrie) - the rest were all developments through the Leeds ranks. He drove all the way to Wales, Scotland to sit on parents' doorsteps before charming them to let their son join Leeds. Sprake, Gray, Bremner, Lorimer etc etc, all greats of their countries were persuaded this way .

We finished runners-up five times under Don, (1965 on goal average, 1966, 1970, 1971 (when United were robbed of the title due to the infamous incident vs West Brom and Jeff Astle) & 1972 when the FA refused to let Leeds have an extra 48 hours rest after a gruelling FA Cup final with Arsenal, which Leeds won 1-0 - had it been Manchester United of today, permission would have been granted). We should have had at least four titles under Don, but instead we only had two - 1969, where we set the record for most goals scored, highest points, and longest undefeated run (34 games), in 1974 we set the benchmark for all English club's playing the most attractive brand of the football the country had seen to date. We were the most watched team away from Elland Road - more so than the usual crowd pleasers Manchester United in those days... in fact, we were a bigger club back in them times than Manchester United.

We won every major honour in the game except for the European Cup, a trophy in which the great Bill Shankly didn't win, but he's (rightly) in the hall of fame. Shanks always said to win the title you needed to finish above Leeds. In the 10 years in the top flight under Revie, we never once finished outside of the top four (1st twice, 2nd five times, 3rd once, 4th twice), we appeared at Wembley at six times in major cup finals and paved the way for modern football.

Revie was the first to incorparate sponsorship into the game. He single-handedly secured a deal with Admiral in 1973-74 in which Admiral paid Leeds to wear their kits... before that, you had to buy your kit off umbro. At the time there was rage at Revie and Leeds for doing this... everyone followed suite mind.

We were the first ones to invent such tactics like placing your central defender next to the goalkeeper and swinging in the ball under the crossbar (Jack Charlton), running the ball into the corner to waste time and such things like that, a tactic which everyone had followed suite with.

So, the question has to be asked SI - why is there no Don Revie in the hall of fame? Does his face (Leeds United) not fit your bill?

Oh, and only post on this thread if you've got something constructive to say - if not, please keep away. ta.

I imagine it's because he only managed to win the top division once.

Like the saying goes first is first second is nowhere. Don't get me wrong what he did was tremendous but hall of fame is based on awards won and he simply didn't win enough.

I imagine it's because he only managed to win the top division once.

Like the saying goes first is first second is nowhere. Don't get me wrong what he did was tremendous but hall of fame is based on awards won and he simply didn't win enough.

Twice, actually - though it should have been four times, perhaps five if luck would have been on our side... If I remember rightly, Revie used to be in the old CM hall of fame.

Edit: Revie won the same amount of trophies as Clough, despite Clough having an extra 18 years in management than Don. Clough also has a relegation on his CV, Don doesn't.

It's simply a matter of points that count for the hall of fame. There's no bias - Revie doesn't have enough points.