Training improvements and player attributes!!

[sperlz]

Ok ive got two points i'd like to make here and would appreciate some feedback. First one is to do with training improvements and how rigid the system seems to be in improving an area of a players game. Heres an example, Wayne Rooney last season was'nt renowned for scoring headers and therefore the game gave him a 9 for heading and i think around a 10 or 11 for jumping. Certain pundits such as Andy Gray are now saying that he is one of the best at heading in the league which would be accurate considering how many times he has scored with his head this season. Now when im using Rooney on the game and his heading is down as 9, I dont think there is any way of acutally improving this to the level which he is at in real life. I would say he should be heading 19 and jumping 14. What I would like to see possible is that with a world class club like Man Utd and with the right coaches, you should be able to put a player like Rooney on an intense heading training and enjoy the benefits. This should only be possible for players who are excellent trainers and with coaches who are experts in the field that the player is trying to improve. I hope that all made sense.

The second point is that I am disappointed with a number of inaccuracies of players attributes on the game. This is of course something that can only be formed from opinions but a number of attributes are way off the mark. Tottenham for me are the most overated team and they seem to fight for the title regularly in the first season, rather than battle for 4th which would be the realistic scenario. Also their strikers goals to game ratio's are way to high with crouch and defoe hitting nearly a goal a game each in a season. Modric is overated with him often being voted as player of the season and world footballer of the year just a couple of seasons into the game, he is a decent player but hes shown nothing to prove that he can be better than players like arteta who is an example of an under rated player.

Ive also had an idea for a total revamp of the players ability system, i think that to give a player an exact rating out of 20 for an attribute isnt realistic. Im sure if you gave Martin O'Neill a task of rating each of his players in every area of their game then he would'nt know where to start. I think it should be totally different, without numbers involved but maybe a green and red bar where red would indicate a low level of ability for an attribute for the level a player is playing at and the green inicating a high level. The players would still have their values but this would'nt be visible but what you could see is a bar depending on performances in areas of the game. Like if a player has a high passing ratio then his green bar would be near the top and likewise for tackling, heading, shots to goal. I think this would make the game so much better because It is too easy with the stats which are given on which players to sign. In fact i think its such a good idea im going to submit a new thread just for that.

[Braenn]

Ok ive got two points i'd like to make here and would appreciate some feedback. First one is to do with training improvements and how rigid the system seems to be in improving an area of a players game. Heres an example, Wayne Rooney last season was'nt renowned for scoring headers and therefore the game gave him a 9 for heading and i think around a 10 or 11 for jumping. Certain pundits such as Andy Gray are now saying that he is one of the best at heading in the league which would be accurate considering how many times he has scored with his head this season. Now when im using Rooney on the game and his heading is down as 9, I dont think there is any way of acutally improving this to the level which he is at in real life. I would say he should be heading 19 and jumping 14. What I would like to see possible is that with a world class club like Man Utd and with the right coaches, you should be able to put a player like Rooney on an intense heading training and enjoy the benefits. This should only be possible for players who are excellent trainers and with coaches who are experts in the field that the player is trying to improve. I hope that all made sense.

The second point is that I am disappointed with a number of inaccuracies of players attributes on the game. This is of course something that can only be formed from opinions but a number of attributes are way off the mark. Tottenham for me are the most overated team and they seem to fight for the title regularly in the first season, rather than battle for 4th which would be the realistic scenario. Also their strikers goals to game ratio's are way to high with crouch and defoe hitting nearly a goal a game each in a season. Modric is overated with him often being voted as player of the season and world footballer of the year just a couple of seasons into the game, he is a decent player but hes shown nothing to prove that he can be better than players like arteta who is an example of an under rated player.

Ive also had an idea for a total revamp of the players ability system, i think that to give a player an exact rating out of 20 for an attribute isnt realistic. Im sure if you gave Martin O'Neill a task of rating each of his players in every area of their game then he would'nt know where to start. I think it should be totally different, without numbers involved but maybe a green and red bar where red would indicate a low level of ability for an attribute for the level a player is playing at and the green inicating a high level. The players would still have their values but this would'nt be visible but what you could see is a bar depending on performances in areas of the game. Like if a player has a high passing ratio then his green bar would be near the top and likewise for tackling, heading, shots to goal. I think this would make the game so much better because It is too easy with the stats which are given on which players to sign. In fact i think its such a good idea im going to submit a new thread just for that.

Both of your points seem to be getting at the same thing so I'll respond to them both at the same time. Your suggestion that player attributes be replaced by coloured bars is already in the game. You can tick a box in preferences to see players attributes as a bar instead of a number out of 20.

However, I do think you mean that these coloured bars would have some sort of subjective value on them, rather than the concrete value a number gives. I'm sorry, but that just isn't possible. Why? Because you're dealing with machines. Machines don't understand "Ehhh well sorta this good but not like really good y'know?". They need set values to input into the match engine scripts. That is how a computer works.

Now it IS theoretically possible to give a partly random value to the attribute. Say Mikel Arteta's Passing is 16 +/- 4. But this is also already modelled in game by all the variables that go into determining whether a pass is successful or not (Creativity, Flair, Technique, Passing, Decisions, Pitch Condition, Weather, Position of Opposition Players, Position of Teammates, Player Condition, Player Motivation, Player's Consistency stat etc. etc.)

In your specific case of Rooney's heading, it is simply one of those things. On his form and play over the last 6-7 years he has been utterly abysmal at heading the ball. Through spending a lot of his own free time during the summer working intensively he has clearly improved it to a new level.

However, if you understand the training system this is already possible to achieve in game.

If you have a young player, with a good professionalism score and a decent gap in CA/PA (lets say 150 CA, 180 PA), then you can simply raise his Ball Control training workload into intensive, along with raising his strength and aerobic training workloads, while decreasing the rest of his category workloads to a maintain level.

If you have an older player who has already reached their CA peak then you can redistribute their CA into the stats you want by lowering workloads under the maintain level. Say for example you wanted to increase a player's heading at the expense of his Defending ability. Then you just drop every category down to a maintain level, except for defending which you put down at the no training mark, and ball control which you put as high as you can. Now as the player trains, he is losing points in his defending attributes, but he is not losing any CA, so those CA points are redistributed into his ball control attributes.

[ac13]

What's even dafter is that your scout can go to some far off country and in a week or 2 tell you detailed info about 10 youngsters who he sees are good. If he's seen 10 good ones how many crap ones did he see... 100? And in 1/2 week. Now somehow he can give you exact details about how good he is at everything. How is this possible...did he watch home made videos his parents have made of the last 2-3 years of matches the child has played in. Remember that youth games are generally all on at the same time so he couldn't be going to watch many in a week.

[sperlz]

What's even dafter is that your scout can go to some far off country and in a week or 2 tell you detailed info about 10 youngsters who he sees are good. If he's seen 10 good ones how many crap ones did he see... 100? And in 1/2 week. Now somehow he can give you exact details about how good he is at everything. How is this possible...did he watch home made videos his parents have made of the last 2-3 years of matches the child has played in. Remember that youth games are generally all on at the same time so he couldn't be going to watch many in a week.

no need for a sarcastic reply. the point im trying to make is that the game would be better if you couldnt see all the attributes. Even it it just showed for example that a player like arteta was a quality passer and not a 16 rated passer. Or even if it was just simply harder to reveal a players attributes.