[4-3-2-1 DM - In search of tactical identity at FC Metz]

Am 31.3.2023 um 02:47 schrieb Cloud9:

I'd consider:

• Swapping the AM for an AP who could offer a different range of passing from the DLP/WP (and changing the WP to a WM). AP can look to make some cute passes to unlock defenses from the final third compared to a DLP recycling possession (and the long passes it sounds like you're asking of him). 
• Changing the AF for a PF(s) considering your setup, and to link up with the SS. AF/SS are trying to do similar things in the formation. Other supporting forward roles could work too but looks like you're doing your defending from the front. Having a strong/tall striker to do some holdup play could be nice too.
• Maybe the WM right to a W(s)? not sure if that would leave you too exposed. 
• Left WB(s) could become a WB(a) with the FB(s) on the opposite side. With your high lines I'd try out an IWB(s) or even an IWB(a), would move nicely into that midfield space and underlap into attacks.

Only concern I'd have w the current setup is you might find it hard to transition the ball outside of crosses and long range passes (esp w/ the AF and SS rushing forward, there's a bit of a gap, asking a lot of the roaming AMC).

Just some suggestions  

Thank you very much for your input.

First of all, I see exactly the passes/actions from the WPs that I expected, even against PSG. Also, I've never had a tactic that created so much xG.

What surprises me is how high up the pitch the AMs positions. Significantly higher than the SSa, for example. Additionally, I like the production of the WM. Initially, however, I had defensive problems here. Then I changed the FBs to an IWBd. Fits the player better and gives me more stability.

I will certainly develop variations of tactics in which your ideas will find influence. Anyway, the formation seems very powerful.

Against Paris, unfortunately, my DLPd was unavailable due to injruy. Otherwise, a win would have been possible.

The numerous goals conceded in the pre-season usually been late in the games, after I have subbed in the youth players.

Am 31.3.2023 um 08:04 schrieb lied90:

Seems like a good formation to use a IWB. Since you want to use the WP role, maybe make the opposite wide player into a defensive winger with a IWB behind him. This could also allow you to have both AMs on attack duty.  Just from personal testing I find AM (A) with move into channels to be more effective than the SS role.

100% agreement regarding the IWB. I have tested this in phases. Especially when leading the DW could be an important element to keep the lead.

Will give an update after the season, how it has developed and what changes I have made.

 

 

[4-3-2-1 DM - In search of tactical identity at FC Metz]

Hello guys,

after 1 1/2 years off I got back into it after the winter patch and had skipped FM22.

Recently I have started a career with FC Metz and now preparing for the 2026/27 season.

Review: In the first season, it was all about getting promoted, virtually no matter how. I managed to do that with relative ease. There I had a 4-1-3-2 wide. In Ligue 2, that worked well, but once I got to Ligue 1, it wasn't quite as functional.

Here began my odyssey on the "search" for my tactics. In FM21 I have quite successfully played a 4-2-1-3 with two DMs at ADO Den Haag. That was therefore a first starting point for me. Numerous other attempts at tactics followed. However, I was often without a chance or I had high xG and still often lost 0-1. Basically, it seems very difficult to me to find the right balance. Because in some systems you are completely open defensively and in others you hardly get any chances.

Here I am now looking for the balance at the beginning of the 2026/27 season.

This time I have thought about something "different". A system that I have never played in the FM. Basically, the first tests in the preparation are very promising, but that was in the previous season sometimes the case.
Now I want to play a 4-3-2-1 in the following configuration:

Spoiler

Inspired by @Rashidi, the idea is to install a right-footed wide playmaker on the left who can win the ball with good tackling and then feed the SS or AF. The AM should support him in this. Also, the DLP can feed the offensive forces with lethal passes.

So the DLP and the WP are my main creators. This has been shown in the tests and the SS also shows creative elements in the offensive phase looking for the AM/AF. Another option is the WBs who overlapping and at the far post lurks the SS as well as the WMs who "arrives late in opposition area".

Depending on the opponent, I will adjust the mentality. Initially, Balanced should be a good starting point, since it is a top heavy system. Against the top opponents I will probably go for a midblock.

DLPd has "Close Down Less" as PI because he needs to hold his position. My two DLPd are among the best DMs in the league if you exclude PSG.

I also gave the AMs Dribble More and Roam From Position. Still have to see if that proves itself. I do like the adaptability of the role though. Against weaker teams would certainly be the option to go AMa or even make it a second SS.

For the moment it makes a balanced impression for me. How do you guys see it? Any objections/experiences/help?

 

Kind Regards,

Edu

 

[[FM 21] ADO Den Haag 4-3-3 sudden crisis]

vor 4 Stunden schrieb Rashidi:

On the face of it there doesn’t seem to be too much wrong with this system. However lets consider first the combinations to see how they can impact play.

- In defence it has a wingback driven defence that aims to play out from defence. When this happens most attacks will work their way from defence through midfield and finally into attack.

The combinations in defence are a bit unbalanced. On the left flank we have an inside forward surging into attack, behind him he has two roles that will only support these transitions. With the lower tempo, the ability to hold up the ball and transition through the phases will depend on the quality of the squad.

Down the left flank we won’t see much happening because all they will do is bring the ball and then run out of options. There may be an attacking playmaker in the centre, but the only option he has is the IF attacking space and the DLF(A) will play some part in building attacks by running wide occasionally and holding up the ball. Once the attacks have established themselves he may get on the end of goal scoring action.

The use of the AP(A) will see some adventurous runs and passes in that tier but he will need to do a lot on his own, since he doesn’t have any other options. The winger will only support him as a passing option, and behind them the wingback will only join in attacks once the team has established control in the final third.

If this were a world class team it might still struggle, with the fairly narrow width, the tactic will see a lot of wall passes so sideways pass numbers might be high, but it will struggle in terms of penetration.

The CM(S) role is a generic role and how it performs depends on the player in question. The system looks solid defensively, but will struggle to create goals because the combinations don’t lead to any exploitation of space.

A more solid option would have been to turn the AP to a CM(A) to reduce the chance that he becomes the single point in failure. Change the role of the WB(D) to a FB(A) so you can get some attacking options down the right flank. Changing the W to a IW(A) would have given us another option to unlock overloads on the right flank. Down the left flank, playing a WB(S) is fine as it still goes down the flank. And against weaker defences the option to change his duty to attack should be considered.

A simple change in roles gives the formation a bit more creativity down the right and gives us the chance to work overloads naturally. The use of low tempo is fine if the team is very good, otherwise just match the tempo to the team mentality and drop it once you have scored a goal.

The use of play out of defence can be situational. A team will still play the ball out from the back through its defenders with the use of goalkeeper distribution instructions such as roll it out to central defenders. If you don’t use the play out of defence in such a setting, the transitions can be a bit faster. That is something to note against less ambitious sides that may want to settle into a defensive state quickly.

This second tactic is interesting, but it suffers from some overworked combinations to create overloads.  An AP/MEZ combination in attack isn’t bad if its the ONLY creative combination in the park, it needs to be set up right

1. It makes it easier to find players
2. It makes it easier for you to spot points of failure in your tactic

The moment a DLP is added to the mix you have an issue.  The DLP may change the focus of your attacks, but how many options does he have? He can play the ball out to the winger to stretch teams, but that can be done by any other role without risking losing the ball or needing a player with good ability.

Again the DLP here suffers from a unique issue, how many options does he have? He has another AP on the left and a wingback that will only become an option if you camp. Otherwise he goes long. A better option here would be a box to box midfielder.

The very fact that you have anchored your defence with an anchorman provides a big security blanket for your two defenders. Having a FB(S) doesn’t do much, changing the role to a FB(A) or a Wingback gives the attack better options to stretch defences when you are camping with the natural overlaps of the fullback.

This tactic seeks to hit teams on the counter, so the use of multiple playmakers becomes an issue. To make multiple playmakers like that work you need to give the DLP player instructions that tell him  to get rid of the ball quickly so that your counter attacks don’t fizzle out. 

On  the left flank you have an interesting combination that not a lot of people like to play, so much so that some even say is a bad combination. In reality it isn’t, it just needs specific ways to exploit.

The AP/MEZ combination is good because it has the ability to unlock defences, but to play it well you need several things to work well together. You need a mezzala who is a good dribbler with great off the ball and you need an AP who can either drop deep and play diagonal passes or switch play to the other side if needed. Failing which, I almost always pick underlap.

Underlap is an instruction that tells the widest player to hold up the ball and pass it off to someone running inside and beyond him. That is what the Mezzala is doing. And remember the underlap will be perfect as it will encourage the AP(S) to drop just a bit deeper to play those kind of balls over.

Now a look at the defence.

Here again the use of play out of defence for a counter attacking system makes little sense. Instructions like standard passing, mixed width and normal to higher tempo would be preferable since the tactic already has distribute quickly.

There is one inherent issue against sides that press high. When you are using central defenders and an anchor man and you have told your keeper to distribute quickly to your wingbacks, there is always going to be the risk that they will be marked. So the keeper might go long.

Here I would consider several options:

• Use a ball playing defender if such a player is in the team.
• Ensure the Anchor man has comes deep to get the ball so I don’t need to use the option play out of defence.

In terms of strikers you could probably do well with a PF(A) or an AF as well.

Thanks @Rashidi and all the others, it helped me to develop my team tactically.

In the meantime, 1 1/2 to 2 seasons have passed and last season I was able to qualify for the Champions League for the first time, leaving both Feyenoord and PSV behind.

Spoiler

 

Financially, I'm also in a good position, which, since I play in Holland, is mainly due to good transfers. 

Spoiler

 

It's currently January 2026 and I'm top of the table and have survived a group of death in the Champions League. At the beginning of the season, I tried a lot of different tactics, but I stuck with the 4-2-1-3 because of the wins against Paris/Inter and because of the stability.

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The only problem with the 4-2-1-3 is that I don't have a role for Cohen...

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Kind Regards,

Edu :-) 

 

[[FM 21] ADO Den Haag 4-3-3 sudden crisis]

The new stadium was completed at the start of the 2024/25 season. I had no influence on the size of the pitch. Now the pitch is wide with a size of 105x85 metres. 

Can I use this for myself in any way? Does it follow that it makes sense to play more. Feels a bit like Camp Nou. 

At the moment I run a 4-3-3 and a 4-2-1-3.

[[FM 21] ADO Den Haag 4-3-3 sudden crisis]

Hi guys, it's me again.

After a third place finish in my first year, a fifth place finish in my second year and a seventh place finish in my third, I'm still searching for my footballing identity. Although I was able to win the cup last season, that however  had a lot to do with luck of the draw.

I actually thought I had developed as a Football Manager player - I only started with FM2017 - after winning the Champions League with Antwerp and back-to-back league titles with Nantes and Sampdoria. With Den Haag, however, I'm having a much harder time.

Now I had developed a new tactic, which is attached.

Spoiler

The red circles showing ways in which chances should be created. I thought APsu and MEZat would create chances or create space for DLPsu or the right wing. In the match it turned out that this doesn't work at all because AP/MEZ take the same space. I then tried different things, but it didn't get any better.

I had decided on the combination because I think I have interesting players for it with Essahel and Diomande. In the screenshot Essahel was still in the wrong position, but I had corrected this before the match started. (Screenshots attached)

 

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I had also decided to play narrowly, so that Wat would make runs into the box and become a wide striker, so to speak. In the course of the games, however, I switched to wide and IFat. But both options didn't have a nice movement / too little danger.

One problem that also runs through for me is inconsistent full-backs. Inconsistent in that they are very hesitant to cross. Very often they pull back and play "backwards" again. Does the PI "Cross more often" help here?

Thank you very much for your advice. Enclosed are my "key players".

 

 

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[[FM 21] ADO Den Haag 4-3-3 sudden crisis]

vor 19 Stunden schrieb 13th Man:

Totally up to you, but I’ve had some good success with combining a mez(a) on the winger side. Especially with an RPM moving into space, it can create a great overloads that are still supported, and can leave the backside open for switches too. I haven’t liked a mez of any kind with an IW (they too often occupy the same space) but with an IF it’s worked for me. 

Thank you for your advice, I will take that into account. 
 

For now, I switched to a 4-2-1-3, which gave me wins against Eindhoven and against Zwolle. Let's see how it does against the 4-4-2 with deep opponents.

I'm sure I'll add a classic 4-3-3 to it, if only because you can switch between the two systems fluidly.

 

 

Please feel free to comment, if you spot any major flaws.

Thank you. :-)

[[FM 21] ADO Den Haag 4-3-3 sudden crisis]

Already during the first 15 minutes of the game, I made changes. It actually looked pretty confident.

 

 

[[FM 21] ADO Den Haag 4-3-3 sudden crisis]

Many thanks for the numerous comments and the help.

Basically, I overestimated my team a bit, at least that is my analysis.

That's why I decided to adjust my tactics. As it is a bit special in Holland with 4 excellent teams and a subsequent performance gap, I have designed two tactics. One tactic for counterattacking when I play against top teams and another tactic when I go into games where I claim to be the favourite. 

The counter-attack tactic aims to constrict spaces and, after winning the ball, to overload the right half-space with the Segundo Volante. This should create spaces for the IFat and the AFat. Alternatively, the APsu can drop deeper and pick up the ball to create chances. 

Spoiler

With the second tactic, I also try to overload the right half-space but try to play a wider game and thus create space for the Wat and the WBat. The tactic is more intended to break through deep defences.

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I hope you understand my approach and it makes sense. Let's see if it helps me against the 4-4-2. 

I would be happy if you help me again. I am very grateful for your advice. 

[[FM 21] ADO Den Haag 4-3-3 sudden crisis]

vor 11 Minuten schrieb zabyl:

Don't use counter-press if you are not sure. Your team can counter-press without it if they decide it is the correct option. That TI increases risks defensively. You can use none or you can use counter-press against weaker sides for an in-game strategy to see its impacts to your team.

How do I know? It probably depends on attributes like aggression, stamina, bravery, etc., doesn't it?

[[FM 21] ADO Den Haag 4-3-3 sudden crisis]

vor 2 Stunden schrieb zabyl:

This idea may create overloads on the left half of the pitch. After this dribbling from left footed APa, would you take into account filling that space he vacated with someone?

Thought about an IWB instead of an WB but wasn't sure about it. 

 

vor 2 Stunden schrieb zabyl:

Why do you use "throw it long"  with distribution to CB-FB? Is there any reason to use them together?

I usually try everything so that the goalkeeper doesn't knock the ball forward senselessly. That's the reason... not the best I know.

 

vor 2 Stunden schrieb zabyl:

Is counter-press TI suited to your team's strengths?

I am honestly not sure but I have had better results with Counter-Press.

Actually, I would rather play Regroup/Hold-Shape, but it has never worked.

vor 2 Stunden schrieb zabyl:

By the way; why do you use stay on feet? For decreasing risks or another reason?

A penalty against me every game.

 

vor 2 Stunden schrieb zabyl:

Take fewer risks can force players to do clearances when pressured.

I never thought of it that way. I will certainly change that.

 

Thank you!

[[FM 21] ADO Den Haag 4-3-3 sudden crisis]

Good morning everyone, 

late in FM 21 I started a new score with ADO Den Haag. After successful runs with Royal Antwerp and Nantes/Genoa I felt it was time for something new. I chose The Hague because I recently spent a summer holiday here and because I don't want to deal with registration rules again. Also, I thought it would be a cool challenge to break through the Rotterdam/Amsterdam/Eindhoven bar.

As always, I had problems finding the right tactics at the beginning. First I used the Sampdoria tactic, but I clearly didn't have the players for a DLP/RPM/AP midfield. Around the halfway mark of the season, I thought I now had a good framework. Mainly because of my three key players and the convincing wins. At one point I was even top of the table with a 6-point lead. Suddenly, the crisis started with 7 games without a win. I then made changes to the tactics and still finished third with 3 wins from the last 6 games. However, I want to improve for the new season and hope to find help here. 

Now to my tactics:

I use the SK on defend because I have had bad experiences with all other variants. I have also added "take fewer risks". 

Why do I use a wingback on defend? I thought it is a deeper option for the AP on attack, who can cross from deep, especially when looking for the IF on attack. In addition, I had opted for a left-footer on the half-right (AP), thinking that when he moves from the outside to the inside, it creates nice opportunities for lethal passes. It worked from time to time. Furthermore, I decided on a winger to give my team width. From a tactical point of view, I use a standard defensive line with a standard LOE, because I had the impression that a higher defensive line leaves too much space behind the back four.

I hope this is enough information for you to help me. If you are missing any information, feel free to ask. 

And be nice, it's my first post on the SI forums.

 

Kind Regards,

Edu