Turkish League player contracts way off from the officially announced contracts, also whats with the winning prize money? Some wonderkids (kinda for Turkish league) are definetely missing. Staff wages...

Also i would like to ask if there is any dynamic winning prize money system? Lets dream one of the Turkish teams won the Champions League, is there any chance Turkish Super League prize moneys go up?

For answering prize money. It's very realistic. Turkey champ earns just 33.4M lira. Every wins means 2.3M lira. And also every teams get 33M as joining money. So in max possibility champ get 10-11M euros total.

Well, thats the end of the league then. Hope somebody answer about other issues.

1. Regarding Icardi's wages I had answered this in another thread. 

2. Unfortunately the new TV deal in Turkish football is indeed that low.

3. Most scouts and non-players in Turkey earn a very low wage.  Unfortunately our clubs prefer to work with agents rather than scouts.  Some first team managers have their own scouts that they pay out of their own pocket/earnings and are only loosely tied to the club.  We'll be looking to see how this can get reflected in the game in the future.

4. Regarding U19 teams please refer to the message below.

 

Your answer for the 1st is really troubling. I have no idea how you guys are handling this tax issues while teams in Turkey are trying their best to not get fined by FPP. Im pretty certain GS is not paying PSG taxing part of Icardi, that just doesnt add up. This is not something these managements are taking lightly considering their perilous finances. Im not sure if you understood what they wrote on that thread or mine, but the first season of Turkey is unbeareble if you arent cheating. The finance situation is so bad you cant even sign anybody from bossman rule.

 

Im sad for the second issue. And about third, i feel any stature of a team like GS, FB or BJK will be able to pay whatever they want to pay a scout if they want to. I am saying this because im pretty sure what they are paying paying agents are way over 20k salary for a scout. But i understand your reasoning. 

 

4th issue looks like something you are gonna resolve soon, i hope. Even putting 2-3 more players on amateur contracts to youth teams (which i dont understand why you avoid), would make the game so much more enjoyable i guess.

 

Your first issue answer here is troubling. I've seen a lot of threads about the fanaticism of team researchers of Turkey. Especially in Fenerbahçe. I know its cliche coming from me as a GS fan but what the hell is up with Fenerbahçe? Not even one title in 8 years and those are their players? Really? This is a troubling issue here that needs some tweaks. Will there be any fix for this? Like those guys mentioning these on your reply threads, they are way, WAY, WAAAAYYYYYY up for the real life Fenerbahçe. I like how balanced GS is after last season, not understanding the wage calculations but still. Besiktaş and Trabzonspor also looks nice. But Fenerbahçe? I cant help but wondering about your researchers accuracy. I dont care how long that have worked for you, that doesnt mean they are good at it, the database in Turkey isnt at its best for a very long time and im pretty sure you are aware of it.

 

I played this game for a very long time, and im very sad to see at least 40 youth player for Man City while 2 for GS. It just hurts my feelings. I really dont think my money is worth for the game now if i cant enjoy playing the game with my favourite club anymore. Turkish League needs a serious database balancing update in my opinion. 

10 hours ago, perpetua said:

1. Regarding Icardi's wages I had answered this in another thread. 

 

 

A couple questions here please:

1) How is the tax calculated? If Icardi is earning €750K net, then if we compare that with Mertens' post tax situation (attached) Galatasaray shouldn't be paying nearly as much as that. Is Galatasaray paying the tax with the French rate instead? If so, what is your source?

2) 

Here you mention that we should take notice that all numbers mentioned on the KAP announcement are net earnings of the player, not the gross paid by the club. By that logic, PSG should be paying €6M of his net earnings, as that is the number mentioned on the announcement. Which means, PSG should be paying almost €10M gross. But in the game, PSG is paying around €6M gross. Are you saying that in the KAP announcement, within the same sentence, PSG's amount is shown as gross and Galatasaray's amount is shown as net? If yes, what is the source on that discrepancy?

I trust the work you guys do, but such discrepancies seem weird and I would love to learn more about it if I am mistaken and there are sources confirming the high amount paid by Galatasaray in the  game, really.

Thanks a lot!

Edited October 24, 2022 by egesagin

@egesagin

- The tax rate in France is higher than in Turkey (45% vs. 40%)
- Icardi is earning his income in Turkey so he's obligated to pay taxes in Turkey.
- Icardi's contract is 6.75 million Euro and he expects to be paid that amount.
- If Icardi stayed in France, PSG would have had to pay 6.75 / (1 - %45) = 12.27 million Euro
- Since Icardi is playing in Turkey and earning 6.75 million Euro net, his cost in Turkey is 6.75 / (1 - %40) = 11.25 million Euro
- KAP announcement says how much the player will be paid and how that is split.
- So essentially PSG says to Galatasaray, I will send over 6 million Euro to you in order to help you pay the player.
- The rest is up to Galatasaray.
- With Icardi's cost being 11.25 million Euro for playing in Turkey, Galatasaray will need to pay the remaining amount (11.25 - 6)

If this was structured as Galatsaray pay loan fee of 750K to PSG and does not pay the player then we could have reflected that Galatasaray's obligation was only the 750K and PSG was responsible for the rest.  My reading of the KAP announcement is that PSG have capped their obligation with 6 million Euro and Galatasaray are responsible for the rest.

Regarding Mertens.  His contract is 2.9 million Euro + 1.1 million Euro.  Signing on fees also have tax obligations.  Typically the primary difference is in when the cashflow occurs.  Players in Turkey typically get paid over 10 months so Mertens is likely getting 1.1 upon signing, plus 290K Euro per month.  So in the game you see 4 million Euro + tax.

18 hours ago, Folligue said:

Your first issue answer here is troubling. I've seen a lot of threads about the fanaticism of team researchers of Turkey. Especially in Fenerbahçe. I know its cliche coming from me as a GS fan but what the hell is up with Fenerbahçe? Not even one title in 8 years and those are their players? Really? This is a troubling issue here that needs some tweaks. Will there be any fix for this? Like those guys mentioning these on your reply threads, they are way, WAY, WAAAAYYYYYY up for the real life Fenerbahçe. I like how balanced GS is after last season, not understanding the wage calculations but still. Besiktaş and Trabzonspor also looks nice. But Fenerbahçe? I cant help but wondering about your researchers accuracy. I dont care how long that have worked for you, that doesnt mean they are good at it, the database in Turkey isnt at its best for a very long time and im pretty sure you are aware of it.

 

I think I explained the rest of the stuff.

Regarding the quoted bit.
Overall ability wise (current ability), Fenerbahce is not overpowered at all.
The Fenerbahce researcher wanted to identify players' strengths and weaknesses which often means some attributes look high while others are low.
This isn't overrating but rather trying to better reflect players' strengths and weaknesses.
One or two attributes being high doesn't make a player better necessarily.
It simply means the player is quite skillful in those one or two areas.

So imagine this scenario.
You have a player who looks to have very good attributes.  He looks like he can do a great job.  But once you play him, you realize that he doesn't actually perform to those attributes.  He's inconsistent in his performances.  There are such players in the world.

When a researcher tries to rate a player in this fashion, he's immediately criticized very heavily for overrating by opposition team fans.

He has two choices, lower some of the attributes of the player and improve his consistency.  So this player becomes a less skillful player who is consistent rather than a skillful player who only shows that skill in a few matches.

Conversely, a player may not be very skillful but very extremely consistent in his performances.  The criticisms arrive that the player is underrated by fans of the player's club.  He did this and did that etc. etc.

If the researcher gives in to his, the player is improved in attributes (perhaps unfairly so) but is now a less consistent performer.

So first reactions to player attributes, in my opinion, are almost always overreactions.  Play the game, evaluate the performances, then tell us what you see.  That way we can make necessary adjustments.

When we follow these first reaction criticisms we just end up with a bunch of players who all resemble each other.  Full backs who are good enough to play as a winger even though they can't in reality or defensive midfielders who look like great central defenders even though they are not very good when playing that position.  This makes for poorer research and a poorer game enjoyment in my very honest opinion.

1 hour ago, perpetua said:

@egesagin

- The tax rate in France is higher than in Turkey (45% vs. 40%)
- Icardi is earning his income in Turkey so he's obligated to pay taxes in Turkey.
- Icardi's contract is 6.75 million Euro and he expects to be paid that amount.
- If Icardi stayed in France, PSG would have had to pay 6.75 / (1 - %45) = 12.27 million Euro
- Since Icardi is playing in Turkey and earning 6.75 million Euro net, his cost in Turkey is 6.75 / (1 - %40) = 11.25 million Euro
- KAP announcement says how much the player will be paid and how that is split.
- So essentially PSG says to Galatasaray, I will send over 6 million Euro to you in order to help you pay the player.
- The rest is up to Galatasaray.
- With Icardi's cost being 11.25 million Euro for playing in Turkey, Galatasaray will need to pay the remaining amount (11.25 - 6)

If this was structured as Galatsaray pay loan fee of 750K to PSG and does not pay the player then we could have reflected that Galatasaray's obligation was only the 750K and PSG was responsible for the rest.  My reading of the KAP announcement is that PSG have capped their obligation with 6 million Euro and Galatasaray are responsible for the rest.

Regarding Mertens.  His contract is 2.9 million Euro + 1.1 million Euro.  Signing on fees also have tax obligations.  Typically the primary difference is in when the cashflow occurs.  Players in Turkey typically get paid over 10 months so Mertens is likely getting 1.1 upon signing, plus 290K Euro per month.  So in the game you see 4 million Euro + tax.

Thank you for the explanation, so the way I understand it is this:

- His annual salary is €6,75M net, and Galatasaray pays €750K net of that part. However, PSG only sends over €6M net. The rest of the gross is paid by Galatasaray.

However, I'm not really sure the KAP announcement can be interpreted that way. If only net amounts are (or can be) mentioned in the announcement, how do we know that PSG isn't sending over the gross amount but due to the way KAP announcements are structured, only the net part of that is mentioned?

I mean, if Galatasaray's contribution is shown as net but it gross in reality, logic dictates (at least in my opininon) that PSG's contribution should also be gross in reality. Nowhere in the announcement it is said that "PSG will send x amount to Galatasaray" it is stated that "PSG will pay €6M of this amount." That's why, it can easily be assumed that PSG is obliged to cover all costs for that net €6M part of the salary. Do you have any source on how the deal is structured apart from the KAP announcement? Because it definitely doesn't say that €6M will be sent over and the rest of the gross is to be paid by Galatasaray. It sounds more like an assumption, unless that is the way all loan deals are handled in Turkey. Which I guess should be somewhere in an official regulations document or something.

 

Btw, I have no issues with Mertens apart from signing on fees being part of the salary (should be part of the transfer budget imho) but that's SI's decision anyway so all good, that was just to show the tax rate as per my confusion about €750K for Icardi.  

Also, thanks for your patience! 

4 minutes ago, egesagin said:

Thank you for the explanation, so the way I understand it is this:

- His annual salary is €6,75M net, and Galatasaray pays €750K net of that part. However, PSG only sends over €6M net. The rest of the gross is paid by Galatasaray.

However, I'm not really sure the KAP announcement can be interpreted that way. If only net amounts are (or can be) mentioned in the announcement, how do we know that PSG isn't sending over the gross amount but due to the way KAP announcements are structured, only the net part of that is mentioned?

I mean, if Galatasaray's contribution is shown as net but it gross in reality, logic dictates (at least in my opininon) that PSG's contribution should also be gross in reality. Nowhere in the announcement it is said that "PSG will send x amount to Galatasaray" it is stated that "PSG will pay €6M of this amount." That's why, it can easily be assumed that PSG is obliged to cover all costs for that net €6M part of the salary. Do you have any source on how the deal is structured apart from the KAP announcement? Because it definitely doesn't say that €6M will be sent over and the rest of the gross is to be paid by Galatasaray. It sounds more like an assumption, unless that is the way all loan deals are handled in Turkey. Which I guess should be somewhere in an official regulations document or something.

 

Btw, I have no issues with Mertens apart from signing on fees being part of the salary (should be part of the transfer budget imho) but that's SI's decision anyway so all good, that was just to show the tax rate as per my confusion about €750K for Icardi.  

Also, thanks for your patience! 

I'll refer you to my second bullet in my answer above.
Icardi is earning his income in Turkey so he'll be obligated to pay taxes in Turkey.
PSG are not in a position to withhold taxes from Icardi on behalf of the Turkish government.
So this amount will have to be handled by Galatasaray.
If PSG was paying for that withholding tax as well, Galatasaray would have likely announced that the amount they were receiving was higher.
Or they simply would have announced that they will pay 750K Euro to the player net and not mention anything about the 6.75 million Euro salary and PSG covering 6 million of it.

In a sense, the extra information is the reason for the interpretation.

Also, after the transfer was completed the Galatasaray AR (Sinan Yilmaz) on his podcast with Erinc Bilican described the deal as such with some further information than what was publicly announced.

The only thing that I am unsure of is how to handle the 20% tax that players are obligated to pay with a filing on top of the withholding tax.  In 2021 (first year that players were obligated to file taxes) very few players actually filed their taxes or paid them.  By law they are obligated but almost all of the players are unaware of their need to file their earnings for taxes.  So we'll find out  what happened in 2022 and how this gets handled/amended in the future.  In law the tax is there but if in practice players aren't paying and the government isn't pushing for payment then we may need to rethink.

Thank you for the extra information @perpetuamuch appreciated, it's all clear now.  

Just for clarity, I didn't think PSG was witholding tax, I assumed that since all details on the KAP announcements are net earnings, PSG would be sending over the taxes as well as the net €6M for said player's earnings. Now it makes sense that the information is kind of extra for that reason, and a club source is great to set things strait. 

I wish you a nice day!