Reversing Bad Form

So one of the things I'm finding with FM11 is that, form and 'confidence' are more important to your team then ever. I don't quite know what it is, but whereas it felt in previous FM's that your team would perform / get results based on the teams quality / tactics, this one is heavily waited towards your teams 'form'. For instance, every season my side will rotate between going on 8 game winning streaks, then losing one game and following that up with 8 games without a win.

I'm in my 8th season now and it always feels like there's a certain inevitability about it. After about 4 wins in a row every game I'll expect a loss - and it'll normally always come in the same circumstances of us missing 3-4 Clear Cut Chances by half time, then the opposition coming out in the second half inspired and dominating possession to get a 1-0 win. After that loss, the team will utterly collapse for a month or so.

So yeah, I need help preventing this happening, or if it's just part of the game. This level of form was never in previous games but it just seems to be part of this one on an exhaggerated scale. I know football teams have form in real life but never on a win 8 - lose 8 type theme.

As for what i've tried to counter it, so far I've mixed up my press conferences, changed team talks, rotated the team and changed playing style. So far nothing helps, it's just a matter of grinding it out until we come into a side who also has bad form and winning - to which we'll then normally win our next 3 or so 0_o.

My team have just gone from 7 wins in 9 (with the other 2 draws) to no wins in 11.... Really need some help with this!!!!

It makes absolutely no sense..

What team? What league? Reputation? Prediction? Expectation (what did you tell the board you would achieve)? Any injuries/suspensions? Have you bought/sold any players? Changed tactics, personnel, staff, etc? What were the match-odds? What did you say in press conferences? What did you say in manager/player interaction? What did you say in team-talks? etc...

In short... not enough information to be able to offer any help at all...

What team? What league? Reputation? Prediction? Expectation (what did you tell the board you would achieve)? Any injuries/suspensions? Have you bought/sold any players? Changed tactics, personnel, staff, etc? What were the match-odds? What did you say in press conferences? What did you say in manager/player interaction? What did you say in team-talks? etc...

In short... not enough information to be able to offer any help at all...

Okay... my team are Newport County. I've managed them from BSP to Championship now, but through the 9 years I've been doing this in game the theme has always been the same, we'll go on crazy winning streaks to then go long periods without gathering a point. Whether it be a relegation threatened season (Where we recovered from 9 losses in a row with 5 wins in a row) or a promtion chasing season (Where our 8 wins in 9 become 7 without a win) it seems every year, without fail, everything will go based on the last result.

So it's throughout multiple leagues, with different expectations, never seemingly making a difference. We're never 'favourites' for the league but it happens whether we have a team i see as either relegation candidates or promotion chasers... it doesn't matter this crazy form swap will happen. The match odds never matter, typically we'll be favourites before we go on the losing streak and not once we're out of form. Injuries are there but minimal - they dont make a difference when we're 'on form' so to speak.

As for what I've said in press conferences... typically try to play us down as favourites and say we'll play defensive. Have tried the opposite in home games but never results in a turn around of form. For manager interaction I'll go for a 'do it for the fans' when we're losing... maybe some personal interactions with saying i have faith . expect a performance, and say pressures off when odds are against...

Okay... my team are Newport County. I've managed them from BSP to Championship now, but through the 9 years I've been doing this in game the theme has always been the same, we'll go on crazy winning streaks to then go long periods without gathering a point. Whether it be a relegation threatened season (Where we recovered from 9 losses in a row with 5 wins in a row) or a promtion chasing season (Where our 8 wins in 9 become 7 without a win) it seems every year, without fail, everything will go based on the last result.

So it's throughout multiple leagues, with different expectations, never seemingly making a difference. We're never 'favourites' for the league but it happens whether we have a team i see as either relegation candidates or promotion chasers... it doesn't matter this crazy form swap will happen. The match odds never matter, typically we'll be favourites before we go on the losing streak and not once we're out of form. Injuries are there but minimal - they dont make a difference when we're 'on form' so to speak.

As for what I've said in press conferences... typically try to play us down as favourites and say we'll play defensive. Have tried the opposite in home games but never results in a turn around of form. For manager interaction I'll go for a 'do it for the fans' when we're losing... maybe some personal interactions with saying i have faith . expect a performance, and say pressures off when odds are against...

I think you missed the point, sorry...

basically what I was trying to say is there are too many variables for us to know what exactly is going wrong... it could literally be any number or combination of things.

But ok, let's have a go... the bolded bit interests me most, mainly because of curiosity I admit, but also because this could be where you're going wrong.

the way I approach a game is entirely dependant on the match-odds. I don't know why, but for some reason if you're playing the bottom team at their spot and you're unbeaten in umpteen the game often makes THEM the favourites (there are other anomalies too) and the players BELIEVE it! So if you go into the press conference "oh yeah, we'll tan these guys, they're rubbish, blah blah" even though they are, because the match-odds don't reflect that, your players will play badly...

UNLESS

you then give your players a team-talk that does reflect the odds... (e.g. "no pressure"). It's stupid I know, but the match-odds seems to be the key to understanding the game, match your interactions to the match-odds and the chances are you'll win comfortably or perform admirably against superior opposition.

The team-talks are all linked to what you say or do in the days leading up to the match, whether in press, manager or player interaction, and what you say or do in the days leading up to the match should be reflective of the match-odds (see the link?).

E.G. If my team were heavy underdogs then my manager interaction would be how good their team is, and how talented their squad, how good the manager, etc etc... in the press conference it would be "we're likely to get stuffed" and then my team-talk... most times it will be "pressure is off" or similar but occasionally I may just throw a spanner in there and "expect a win!" ("What?!?!?" I hear you cry.... honestly, sometimes after making the players think that a defeat is acceptable I demand the opposite... and most times I get it! )

If we're heavy favourites then the opposite applies...

As for the individual team-talks, what are your reasons for using them? Here's a few common reasons for using them myself (there are others). As you can see they're all fairly logical as to why...

Expect a performance! - why do you?? is it his 100th game for you? has he been singled out in the press conference as being one of your form players? Or playing at his former club? Bollocked them for a poor game? Another reason? - basically, if there's a reason to expect a performance, you'll probably get one...

Pick up where you left off! - only available when players have played well in their previous game (obv) but some players seem to handle it better than others... I'm actually still experimenting with this team-talk because it's so hit and miss. I think the pressure attribute matters here, not sure, also whether you're at home or away, have you said anything in player interaction since the last match, opposition, match-odds (maybe?) etc??? lot's of variables it seems...

You can make the difference! - can he? Why can he? What's he doing wrong that if he gets right will make that difference? (e.g. too much weight on the through balls? Winger beating his man all the time but not delivering a cross? etc). If you're watching the match then you can see where you're getting in good positions and wasting them, and why you are... and hopefully you will know, cos you should, what will fix it (and how to...)

Why use any of the other individual team-talks?

You have faith, No Pressure - is your star striker suffering from a lack of confidence and on a drought? Is your centre-back getting booed every time he touches the ball cos he injured the opposition's star striker? Is it your new signing's first home game? A debut? etc

Angry, Disappointing - why are you? What have they done wrong? Don't forget that a bad rating doesn't mean that they're playing badly...

Like I said, they're all fairly logical. I'm sure that with further experimentation with player interaction vs individual team-talk I'll find even more ways to use them than I have already.

Another thing to consider is the pressure on the players, especially approaching the end of the season or in big games against promotion/relegation rivals. The game, believe it or not, does actually reflect "squeaky-bum time" (q. why is my team losing all the time, we were top with 5 games to play, blah blah - a. squeaky-bum time ) and the pressure cooker games. Your job is to take the pressure off the players if they need it... (some like pressure *shrugs*).

See what I mean about "too many variables"? However, I hope that at least some of what I've posted will help.

It's a decent reply and I'll try bare in mind some of it, but i first have to ask do you ever suffer from crazy, eccentric, unpredictable form spikes? Most of what you said I already apply in my logic... I perhaps don't weight match odds as much as you suggest. I don't see why I should though, as they're so illogical as it is - but the game can't not have flaws i guess. but still, it doesn't really line up with whats happening to me as theres no real trend with odds as far as i can tell.

I don't know... what happens to me doesn't feel like a natural loss of form, it feels like an unprecedented U-turn out of nowhere. There's a certain inevitability that no matter what I do, after I lose one game after a run of wins, the next will be a loss and so on, and after I recover from a losing streak with my first win, the next few will also be wins. The matches go in that way too with possession, chances, everything. It doesn't feel like I have an influence over it, which is why I'm so confused :S.

What Lazaru5 is pointing out is only a fraction of things that may have to be considered when approaching a match, as he said himself.

First of all is your players: Do you have a determined team? Are there many players who enjoys big matches? Do you have a professional, ambitious squad? How are they handling pressure? Are there many good intra-squad relations? Are you thought of as a God (I suppose so since you brought Newport to the Championship)? Are there any new signings or other players that hasn't settled yet?

The principle I am basing my choice of team talks on (I have left Press Conferences to the Assistant), is that the bigger the disparage between your odds and their odds is, the more pressure is put on your team. It doesn't matter if that number is in your favour or disfavour.

So if the odds are fairly even, and you have Fans to which you can dedicate a victory, For the Fans works fine. The same with Expect a Victory - if your assistant tells you that one or more players believe they can only show up and win. If you don't have fans, You Can Win may work fine.

If the odds are very uneven, both being a big underdog and a big favourite may make your players nervous and you don't want that. This is why Expect a Victory may backfire unless you have a team of ambitious, determined model pros - if you are huge favourites at home. Wish Luck or For the Fans may work better in those cases. No Pressure is good when you are the underdog.

But there is a good reason I say "may" and "if" a lot there - especially in lower leagues where super-motivated players are scarce - as I said to begin with, it all depends on what kind of squad you have built. The assistant's team talk advice is good as long as overconfidence doesn't set in, and as long as the morale and form hasn't gone down the drain. The longer the winning streak, the worse the hangover. When those two things do happen, which they will eventually, you need to take a close look at your players' personalities and Determination.

There is a thread on here where someone analysed the possible personality descriptions and figured out the underlying hidden attributes. I suggest taking a look at that to find out more about your squad and what you should tell them when things go wrong.

I don't get the spikes no... Last season I went 6 without a win, a draw either end of four defeats, but for most of them I knew where I'd gone wrong (actually most defeats/draws I can usually attribute to something I did "wrong"). Squeaky-bum time gets me usually, and it can take me a while to realise why we're drawing games we should be winning comfortably (2 or 3 matches maybe) and I correct it then.

In 4 seasons I have lost 4, 5, 3, and 4 in a row according to the records (both 4's seasons = title/promotion winning seasons) and most games without winning were 4, 5, 4, and 6 respectively whilst won in a row were 12, 5, 4, and 8 and without losing 21, 9, 9, and 13. No major 'spikes' as such and screenies of fixtures can be posted if required.

match odds are the key (for me at least...)

Well I'll see if basing things around the odds helps... even though thats make absolutely no sense to me, but I guess thats just how it might have to be. Sadly i think i might be done with this game instead, I'm not sure... even after getting the promotions it just hasn't felt natural. It either requires some mad micro-management where you considered a plethora of variables to try and guess the right 'fixes' or my team just haven't got the right mental stats to go on a winning streak without then completely collapsing.

I'm tired and grumpy tonight so probably being overly negative but this FM just hasn't felt right since i started this file just cause of this form thing. It just surprises me that others haven't had similiar problems...

I'll see if there are any more replies tomorrow I guess. I'll read into the tactics and stuff a bit more and see if I can find another thread or anything similiar to mine... it just feels way too odd though. Maybe I'm just too used to the older CM / FM's where by having the better team you'd win most the time without needing to rely on form too much... like real football :/.

Well I'll see if basing things around the odds helps... even though thats make absolutely no sense to me, but I guess thats just how it might have to be. Sadly i think i might be done with this game instead, I'm not sure... even after getting the promotions it just hasn't felt natural. It either requires some mad micro-management where you considered a plethora of variables to try and guess the right 'fixes' or my team just haven't got the right mental stats to go on a winning streak without then completely collapsing.

I'm tired and grumpy tonight so probably being overly negative but this FM just hasn't felt right since i started this file just cause of this form thing. It just surprises me that others haven't had similiar problems...

I'll see if there are any more replies tomorrow I guess. I'll read into the tactics and stuff a bit more and see if I can find another thread or anything similiar to mine... it just feels way too odd though. Maybe I'm just too used to the older CM / FM's where by having the better team you'd win most the time without needing to rely on form too much... like real football :/.

Oh we're all experiencing this form streak/slump thing. Player morale is too volatile - that's all.

Oh we're all experiencing this form streak/slump thing. Player morale is too volatile - that's all.

Speak for yourself, I don't experience it... Here's my results for the last two seasons, as you can see there are no slumps as such (and where we've lost games in succession I usually knew why..)

Season 3

Season 4

I save the game after every 15 matches, watch the full 90 and micro-manage. I usually have the game permanently running but I haven't had a chance to play season 5 yet (last saved 1st August 2014) as my PC broke after the last save - I updated Windows and my AV, rebooted and the PC BSOD'd... took me 4 days to fix (and it's still not perfect). I've saved the game 20 times in the 149 days, 17 hours and 24 minutes that the game has been running (I haven't been playing all that time, lol!).

It's not the game that's at fault if you guys are experiencing these form spikes and slumps...