Perb
-
Posts
20 -
Joined
-
Last visited
Content Type
Forums
Articles
FAQs
Online Manual
Support: Blocks
Support: Games
Bug Tracker
SIGames Manual (beta)
Profiles
Posts posted by Perb
-
-
12 hours ago, Experienced Defender said:
Without seeing your tactic (screenshot), it's virtually impossible for us to offer any advice/explanation. So please post the screenshot of the tactic.
Sure, though I don't know why the lineup is significant
This is the most recent example after a corner:
Ball is cleared out in the open pitch. My number 14 doesn't even move at all, and number 10 picks it up. Again the problem does not exist in the other end of the pitch so I don't know what command I need to give. This is example is based on standard defend settings in set pieces.
When I have a corner and the ball is cleared, and the opponents pick it up for a counter, I've tried to keep 3 players back at all times, and aditional 2 lurking out the fields, with the result they stand on eachother, again not chasing the ball.
0 -
Hi guys
I have a major problem I can't seem to fix. My players never chase the ball. Especially after a set piece, either corner or free kick. The ball is always cleared and handed over to opponent. I have players nearby or close but they never go for possesion.
Also my players never clear the ball to own teammates. Only to opponents. Same goes for my goalkeeper, when I let him kick he plays it wide where there is no teammate, only opponents.
It works perfectly for the opponent, so the ME seems to work, but for some reason not my team.
0 -
Hi guys
This might be a minor issue, since it only occurs in the start of the season, but it is a bit aggresive th "usual" start 11 requests a transfer due to not participating in the CL cup. There is no convincing them. All meetings end up me decline their wishes.
Even hardcore Milan players like Romagnoli and Donarumma are unhappy.
0 -
@Experienced Defender thank you for your input.
I tried adjusting my tactic according with your instructions and line-up. The remaining 15 matches of the season my team was limited to 3 losses and 4 draws. My victories was not impressive though. mainly won on set pieces, and every match opponent had 20+ shots at goal.
It improved how my attack was performed. So when the attack was successful it was epic. However it was rare and I didn't produce enough chances during a match. I was stil bombarded with 20+ shots by the opponents and concede just a matter of time.
Using your instructions most of the attacks was coming from my wingers. but the transition was often directly from defend to attack. My forward and midfield was often left out of the game to chase a ghost. AF/PF or any other role would make the forward constant off-side, so I tried F9 to support my wingers and exploide the open AMC area. This turned out to open up more attacks, atleast put him in the game and the occasional deep run.
To try get a different dynamic on the midfield I went all defensive oriented. Instead of AP I switched to a DLP paired with a BWM. it gave a different midfield dynamic that have now greatly decreased the opponent chances at goal - so far.
I wanted to use my attack minded midfielders, but it doesn't seem to work well. This configuration now closes down more succesful and they sit back on ball possesion trying to find the deep passes. I remain control this way instead of rush attacks.
On 28/02/2020 at 00:13, Experienced Defender said:But the problem with counter-attacking tactics is that you cannot use them all the time (i.e. against every opponent). What will you do when you are the favorite in a match?
Opponent often park the bus. So far I seem to have found a solution. I am not sure it works throughout the season. Based on how my midfield work to retain possesion, instruction "work the ball into the box" seems to have a patient impact on the style of play - less direct but still focused on the 3 attacking positions.
A new season has started and my pre-season seemed promising. I started the new league against a team who always play extremely aggresive. Sometimes only 2 players back to defend, and I still can't fight them off - I should be pounting them with counters. They are pushing so high up the pitch it is ridiculous. Take this situation for instance:
My first go to solution for this would be to instruct my keeper to play long instead of short. However that would just result in a direct pass to the opponent.
They often play 4-2-3-1 or 3-4-3, pressing very high up the pitch. I just don't know how to work them. Physically my players are superior so it is not in duels they win. Opponent retain ball so quick my players are quickly disorganised. WB playing CB, my midfield is curled up somewhere on the sideline.
Do you have any suggestions how to overcome these type of aggresive play-styles?
EDIT:
Just played against Rangers and they had a more conservative and defensive approach - the tactic completely overwhelmed them.
0 -
3 hours ago, XuluBak said:
Hard to give specific advice without your actual tactics, but from what you've said...
It sounds like you want to play a direct counter attacking system, which was working well until about the midway point of the season (were you overachieving expectations???), then goals become harder to find. I think this is a fairly common occurrence. Early in the year, teams were opening up more, allowing for good chances on the counter. As the season progresses, and you're at or near the top of the table, more teams start playing conservatively against you. Your tactic that was so successful against teams opening up, is much less effective against teams parking the bus.
I'm not sure I was overachieving since I had the same problem with different level of clubs, even in the cup competition against lower league teams I would get pounded - I would still win because of individual strength but it was clear that something fundamental was wrong in the lineup. When 1 striker can force 4 defensive players and a goalkeeper to clear the ball for a throw-in, you know somethings off.
Correct that I couldn't cope with teams parking the bus. Just couldn't get through. On the other hand I had incredibly poor possesion when oppponents was pressing hard all the way up to my defensive line. Forced to clear the ball everytime. This might be a result of me not able to counter the opposition instructions. I just don't know how to counter tight compact defensive lines or use the incredible open spaces when opponents are pressing high.
1 hour ago, Experienced Defender said:If I understood correctly, you want to play a fast counter-attacking style primarily through the middle of the pitch, while in defense you want to prevent crosses from the opposition as much as possible. Basically, force them to play through the middle and then counter-attack them also through the middle.
Based on that assumption, here are some tips:
- do not use a
narrowformation (so that your fullbacks would not to have deal against opposition players on their own too much)- do not use a formation with an
AMC(so that your wide forwards would be encouraged - i.e. not discouraged - to go inside, rather than wide)- use wider defensive width (as you want to prevent the opposition from crossing as much as possible)
- do not use the
wingerrole on the flanks (because you want to avoid attacking crosses as well)- use either narrower attacking width or focus play through the middle TI (because both at the same time could prove an overkill and limit your options a bit too much)
So when it comes to the choice of formation, these are basically ones you should consider IMO: 4141dm wide (a.k.a. 4123 wide) or 4213dm wide or 541wb wide (a.k.a. 523 wide).
I hope this is enough to give you at least some initial ideas. If you want any further advice, please let me know
You've captured my style of play - Let me just add it doesn't have to be attacked from center, wingers are supposed to offer wide solutions to take advantage og the exposed open areas.
I have tried set up a formation based on how I interpretate your thoughts. I know the TM may not be the best solution, he was completely anonymous, however my first striker was overcoming a small injury - usually I would play him as DLP-A or AF. the IWB has also been used as a FB-su.
One game I just played, i Won 1-0 but it wasn't pretty. The goal was a corner. As you can see I didn't really produce any attacking play. However I quite effective on the tackling part. I play comprehensive highlights, the few attacks I saw my forwards was tightly marked by on of their CB og backs. Everytime they would compense an attack they were tackled straight on - lost the ball. I am still defending alot against crosses. My backs seem to withdraw to a tight formation when the opponents wingers/backs are near the box. The opponent had a very aggresive type of play, they were pushing high - forward/winger was stopped at the center line quite often. Ball distribution was set to short (since my keeper would otherwise play for the opposite team - Handover balls), and they pushed high up the pitch. The ball was often cleared for throw-ins.
I did see alot of clear balls from the defends however I really fail to collect them. The opponents instead keep the pressure. This is just one classic example how elegant the opponent does. This is after a throw-in for me. For reference im playing white/Blue and opponent is white.
The ball is headed out in the open, and their player runs towards it, first-time the ball further wide to a Trequartista collecting the ball attacking. Where I usually find my forward player quite stationary - regardless of him playing TM, AF or DLF. They got a pretty decent chance out of it. Just a classic example on how they efficiently collect 2. balls and retain possesion - which is probably the main reason for their massive lead in shots. However they only had 1 CCC and 3 half chances. collecting balls in open play is a problem both defensive and offensive.
Another example where my formation is not working how I want it to. I am playing with a wide defensive line to counter the attacking flanks. As you can see on the far right there is a classic example of how the play usually ends. Ball is passed wide, back retracts to a tight formation line leaving space and time to cross.
I played a few games and I face similar challenges in all of them:
Offensive:
- IW seems quite anonymous together with DLF rarely around the box to finish
- IF-A is a part of most offensive highlights - he is behind most of my chances at goal
- Stationary forward /winger when ball is cleared to the open field
- Generally lack ability to pick up return or cleared balls - short and long play.
- No particular attacking movement when I have ball possesion.
- Half time analysis is often bad possesion in the opponents halfDefensive:
- Players easily panick when under high pressure, either clears the ball or gets tackled. Lack ability to play out of trouble.
- Defence is getting pounded with crosses deep and byline, opponents usually have 20+ chances in a match
- Midfield are providing a solid defensive wall but have no participation on closing down. Opponents have alot of time to pass wide to their flanks overlapping. As a result transition of the play is usually from defend to forward/winger and either lost or interceptet ball1 -
I have tried to find a stable tactic that I could use as a base throughout my season with minor changes depending on the opponent. So far I have mainly been working with a 4-2-3-1, 4-1-2-3, 4-4-2 and 5-3-2 WB. I just haven't succeded. (This is not a thread to adjust my previous tactics)
With 4-2-3-1, 4-1-2-3 I have made the best results. For the first 6 months it provided stable and successful results. For a few matches up until the transfer window/ winter break, I see a sudden change in the outcome of the matches. My offensive players, attack and wingers are all of a sudden completely taken out of the game. I may win with a single goal from my defenders or midfielders. After winter break my tactic is completely torn apart. 5-10 consecutive losses and constant load of bad decisions on the pitch. I don't know where it's coming from but it seems the AI have adjusted to my tactics and I just have no way out of it.
So the reason for this thread is to try a new build up for a specific philosophy based on any constructive suggestions you may have. I may have used the above formations wrong, I don't know - I think it's difficult to comprehend the consequence of any adjustment/role change. Logical changes may not be logical afterall. So ideas for any formation, instructions roles, anything based on what I am trying to build. Note: I don't have players available who can play for any major club teams. Therefore I am curious if someone have had success building a tactic outside the major leagues.I will try to explain my philosophy, please let me know if any additional information is required.
I don't mind not having the ball all the time but I imagine 40-45% is a stable level for game influence.Attacking philosophy:
Conquer the ball on own half, not from my own penalty area but more from a DM positon/line. Then use direct through balls to the forward player, or play wide for rushing wingers. Forward and winger positions is where I would like most of my goals to come from. If counter attack was unsuccesful and possesion is still kept, I would like ball-moving-players (midfield supported by back or CB) to player further back on the pitch drawing in opponents to provide options for wingers and forward(s) to move around finding space to receive and continue to attack. I want to completely avoid cross and headers as much as possible since they always end for goal kicks or blocked to corners. (Fun fact: the most dangerous situation for me is when I have the corner).
So goals will rarely come from backs or central midfielders and mainly distributed through forward and winger positions (based on the formations I have previously used).Defending Philosophy:
To avoid alot of crossed balls I would like to intercept the ball from the DM lines position as previously mentioned. I don't want to engage high up the pitch and keep spacefor my attacking players - classic counter play, but not completely backed up on the byline getting pounded. When possesion is lost I want to completely close down the flanks to prevent any attack coming through, force opponent to play center and snap the ball.I have a print of the type of players I have available:
I know it doesn't give you any idea of their stats and ability but I don't think it's too relevant, since I have been crushed against teams with players one to one I am far superior - so It can be done.
What do you reckon?0 -
I have now played almost half a season with this line up. The first 2 months went very well, then litterly from one game to the next the tactic completely crashed.
I have played games in the Champions league but I am not comparing these matches since those teams are way superior to me. I am experiencing defensive issues and no success with attacking build up.I still have around 60% ball possesion throughout the match but do not manage to create any significant chances and my opponent usually have 15 attempts through out the game with me conceding anywhere between 2-4 goals each game.
I know my players are more then capable and I analyse matches where every of my players are superior to the oppponents.This is my current line up after countless adjustments:
About 70% of the goals I concede is interceptions on opponents own half. There seems to be no pressure from my players and gives the opponents ridicolous amount of time on the ball. Plays over my defenders and 100% of the time they have a player who receives. Fortunately they don't score every time. On this particular match I also noticed the opponent plays very offensive. Usually only have 2 players back to defend. Which to me should open up for alot of counter plays. Yet there is no success when I try a more defensive luring approach.
Another classic scenario for me is when my players fail to keep the pressure on the opponent. When opponents intecept the ball they clear it up the field and always has a player in that area without being pressed by my midfielder/defender or tries to recover in a duel and maintain pressure. Instead they just back down. My CBs are strong on crossing and win alot of there duels, however there is no other players to pick up the ball so the opponents keep the pressure. The goals I concede from crossing is only through the wide areas of the pitch, for example winger crossing to winger where usually you would find a FB position ( The FB is in position but just not marking the player).
The only reason I have 60% ball possesion is because the opponents time to recover the ball, play up the field and finish is rapidly fast. When my Goalkeeper distributes to a defender (allways CB even though instructed to FB area). They seem to play the ball around 2-3 players and when pressed by opponent they clear to ball or try a long pass attempt.
I am stuck at one particular match with an opponent I know I should be able to overcome on every aspect of the game, but yet I still experience all the playing issues.
This is their line-up
My thoughts on this:
Given my defenders are overrun on every attack I figured the high DL was too much. They aren't the fastest. (neither are the opponents defenders vs. my striker pace/acceleration but they don't seem to have a problem...)
I tried to adjust the DL the first standard, with no change of game experience then adjusted to "lower" still same game result.
I figured my offensive line and CM-D was not pushing opponents on the ball and instructed them to press more and still keep the urgency to standard for the team instructions. No change in gameplay. Also adjusting the LOE to higher but no change it gameplay.
I tried a whole new tactic 4-1-4-1
It changed my offensive play where I managed to score a few goals (maybe 4 goals through 10 matches) Didn't really do any justice since the same defensive issues still occured.
No matter my tactic layout I still have the same issues. My opponent is attacking the same approach every time.
Buttom line: I would like to play how my opponent plays me.
I even desperately tried to copy their line-up - didn't work....Any thoughts on how to overcome these same time of attacking plays from opponents?
Thanks0 -
Sorry to capture this thread, but hopefully I'm not the only one wondering.
42 minutes ago, Experienced Defender said:Player instructions - split block with 4 or 5 players
Can you elaborate on split block.
I'm not sure how it works and how you instruct players.
What is the dynamic behind it - How does it influence the players?0 -
20 hours ago, Experienced Defender said:
The setup of roles and duties looks decent. I don't know your players, so it's hard to tell you what exact tweaks you could try to improve it further. One role you should reconsider is the CF. The role itself is great, but can struggle in a top-heavy system due to the lack of space and requires a really good all-round player. DLF on attack would be a better choice in this particular setup IMHO. It's also the creator type of role, but is more simple than CF.
A very important thing when it comes specifically to top-heavy systems without a DM (such as 4231 or 424) is that you need to make sure both your CMs are defensively reliable players. If not, then better avoid the 4231.
Besides the higher DL, you also use more urgent pressing and overlaps on both flanks. So even if you drop the DL, these other 2 instructions can also contribute a lot to your defensive issues (along with the counter-press, which is always a risky instruction if your players are not good enough to execute it properly).
The fact that you tend to lose possession in the opposition half probably means that you should remove the
Work ball into box, again due to the lack of quality on the part of your players - they are probably not good enough to execute such an instruction.In a 4231, you should not use any
attackduties at all in CM positions.Btw, what are OMV and OMH ???
This could well be caused by your use of the overlaps. Your fullbacks are probably not able (i.e. good enough) to perform their defensive duties when they need to get back quickly into their defensive positions in the defensive transition phase.
Overall, I fear that your tactic might be a bit too ambitious for the quality of your players. Maybe a more balanced formation (like 4141dm wide) would help for starters.
Thank you very much for your input. I used your advice in regards to reconsider the CF role.
After I sold my first striker my reserve was about to come in handy. He was easily adapted to a false nine or DLP role. MY reserve striker was not working in my old system before - either as Poacher, CF or AF. Now as a False Nine: 5 matches, 6 goals, 1 assist. What you can't see in the line-up is he is only a young striker developing.
About the defensive issues began to make small changes just to see what gave the most impact. I started my removing "work into box" instructions and being less aggressive about the overlaping backs. Keeping the WB on a defensive duty makes together with the high defensive line, he is more considered in his approach up the field together with the support duty of the right IW works well together with the FB-AT.
I've had a quite impressive start to the season:
OMV and OMH is a brain-fart from my part. I unintensionally used my native contractions of the positions. It just means Offensive left winger and vice versa on the right.
1 -
Hi Guys
I know there is alot of threads out there, but everyone seems to have different problems with the gameplay/adjustments and none have been quite helpful for my case.
I have used an entire season to adjust my 4231 tactic for for stability, diverse goal scores and less predictability. I thought I was close and have seen some remarkable results (in very few matches). I have also restarted alot of matches to see how adjustments would change the outcome against the same team. If relevant I play in the Danish top league. My team is in the top half of the league so on paper it is one of the stronger teams.
This is my set tactic with most common used instructions. Of course I like when my attacker manages to score, but I would also like to see alot more contribution from my OMV, AMC and OMH.
So what is wrong now?
My Striker has been taken out of the game. He gets the open chances but fails and now my OMV, AMC and OMH plays anonymous.
When I look at the stats I have a fair amount og ball possesion throughout a game. Usually 55-65%. However I usually have 4-7 chances and opponents atleast 15 (I get the same result with high and low ranked teams)
I mainly lose possesion on the opppents half which results in a long pass to striker running deep. I have tried adjusting the defensive line back and forth but it doesn't changes the outcome. Conquering the ball --> Long Pass --> Deep run --> goal.
Also I concede alot from overlapping backs coming to cross (Which strangely is something I have never achieved - the assists mentioned above is from other gameplays, mainly set pieces).My central defenders mark poorly given the many deep runs, my backs push forward to stop the engaging attack but without support from midfield and wingers they are easily overlapped (I see this even when on a defensive role. Even worse when positioned as WB)
I also have the setting distribute to backs. But never happens. Ball is distributed to CD which holds the ball untill they are engaged by the opponent - completely unnecesary BTW.To help the attack play I also had the CM -AT it helped on the offensive play but left the defense even more vulnerable. Not a valid option.
Another thing I have noted which I imagine doesn't make the play easier. I usually have atleast 20 fouls each game. Mainly by my backs. I have tried to use less intensity in the team instructions, Stay on feet and defensive instructions, but still same outcome.
I have tried alot of different roles, bringing the OMH to Su, DLP-su, MC-D, AMC-AT nothing seems to change their participation in the game.
Striker I have tried different roles as AF, False nine. CF seems to bring him more into play and give him the chances.Any thoughts on how to improve the flow of the play?
0
How to instruct players to chase ball and clear towards own player?
in Tactics, Training & Strategies Discussion
Posted · Edited by Perb
Yes, by standard I mean default routine on the defensive corners.
Of course that makes sense the tactic will impact the moment game goes from set piece to open play. Though these are just danish players, they are still professionals. Some certain amount of football intelligence must be expected, and in these particular examples related to set pieces, If I have to control simple behaviour in players I might just play FIFA (That will never happen).
Yes I am. Like Sporadicsmiles says, I am not expecting to make aimed perfect cleareances. To my understanding they are and should be random like in real life. However I do not see that problem with my opponent. There are several times during a match where they manage to clear the ball and have a player ready to intercept. If this is caused due to unbalanced main tactic from my part I do not know, but there seems to be inconsistency in how plays are presented between my team and opponent.
I also experience opponent goalkeepers manage to volley long kicks up to their striker time and time again. Defenders do not press and let opponent continue his run.
I usually have a really good first half season, and after the winterbreak I have to change my tactics because the first one is just completely broken down.
I have tried simple roles keeping a plain CM defend and support, and tried other tactics aswell. No luck though. The mentioned line-up is the only way, so far, I have managed to create some movement and gain some hightlights during the match going through the last half of the season.
Originally I wanted to play a narrow 4-3-3 because I have some very capable strikers, worked the first half of the season. My midfield eventually broke down and was completely left out. And by left out I mean they had no influence in the match. Completely skinned. So I had to start over.