[[FM23/24] - Trying to build a tactic and picking appropriate roles (4-2-3-1)]

Strong start to my next season, winning the first 4 games with an aggregate of 11-1. Then a bit derailed by a 3-4 loss to Everton (Away). I rotated and tinkered a bit and although we pulled it back from 3-1 to 3-3, they scored late.

5th place last season ended up qualifying for the UCL so I'm about to start my first foray in that competition. I couldn't find a striker I felt suitable to come in that would be an upgrade on Joao Pedro. He looks pretty strong all round. Maybe not the best in the air but at 6'0" and with 12 for both heading and jumping, he should surely be more than serviceable?

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Therefore, I've decided to just focus on creating better service to him. 

Here's what I'm currently running (ignore the Gegenpress title):

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CAM seems more involved now on support. Still getting to grips with what the DM roles should be, and not sure yet if CF(a) is the right ST role or not. Endrick and Wahi, may struggle with this role as their passing/heading isn't as good.

 

[[FM23/24] - Trying to build a tactic and picking appropriate roles (4-2-3-1)]

The season is over now and I just fell short of top 4. Wahi (my top scorer) got injured a few weeks before the end of the season.

Our last 5 games:
Win 3-1 vs Norwich (Home)
Drew 0-0 vs Southampton (Away)
Lost 0-1 vs West Ham (Home)
Drew 1-1 vs Wolves (Away)
Won 5-0 vs Nottm Forest (Home)

I finished 5th on 71 points, 6 points off top 4 and 7 points off 1st (top 3 all finished on 78 points).

Here's the final stats for each player.

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Quite disappointed with Pedro, Schjelderup, and Endrick's outputs. Roony came in to the CAM role towards the end of the season and got 7 goals in his last 8 games. Wahi was our top scorer with 11. 

Aim for next season is to bring in a new striker who can give us a bit more presence up front. Any other recommendations of areas to improve?

I have this regen (Franco Vignali) who's been playing this season. Natural MC/AMC but possibly could do a job upfront?

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Traits:
Comes Deep to Get Ball
Knocks Ball Past Opponents

 

[[FM23/24] - Trying to build a tactic and picking appropriate roles (4-2-3-1)]

6 hours ago, Hoof-it said:

You're striker will suffer because you squeeze the pitch. He will score goals however because I imagine your camped outside the box a lot. The space won't be there for him to make his runs in behind. Look at haaland this season. Obviously he is a freak but he's playing the other way more because lack of space. Also you am is doing the same thing. Pushing right across the front line. Which makes it more work for your two dms. Don't trust ratings either. If your players are doing what you want them to do then you shouldn't worry about. 

Yeah, I figured this was the case. Just not sure how to fix it, especially as everyone else is playing well...

What metrics do you think I should be looking at? 

6 hours ago, Hoof-it said:

Also I will add youve gone for geggenpress tactic but then put ti on as if you want to play possession football. That preset is more about winning the ball high and going full throttle forward. Positive mentality makes you play at a higher tempo to then up the tempo more and shorter passing and work ball into the box is then asking them to be so technically good. Could result in more turnovers from trying to do everything so quick

Yeah, I certainly see that at times. I do turn the tempo down and sometimes even remove counter if I think we're trying to force it too much. I think I just used the gegenpress preset, but then changed everything so its more a custom tactic than a gegenpress preset despite what the tactical style suggests. High pressing, dominant possession football is what I said I wanted, with an eye of playing quick with purpose. Just need to then need to find a way to strike the balance of then creating space for the two star players who are playing ST and AM.

[[FM23/24] - Trying to build a tactic and picking appropriate roles (4-2-3-1)]

Hi all,

Firstly, apologies for the frustration in my previous two posts. It was quite annoying going in cycles of making changes and getting no impact, then not knowing what to do about it.

I made some slight changes to the tactic and it has now created some consistent performances with some great results. I'm starting to see some great team goals without much impact to the defensive strength.

Since the last update I've gone 11 wins, 1 draw and 2 losses, propelling me back in to the Europa League race and into the FA Cup Quarters.

I still am not getting consistent output from the ST/AM partnership, but a lot of good stuff from my wide players and midfielders. Have been trying different ST roles in games, but may also need to start trying different AM roles instead.

The main change I've made is that the RB has returned to WB(S). What ends up happening is the full backs push up and hold width deep, ready to drive into the wide space late on. The DM sits in the middle in front of the CBs to either cut out counters or be an outlet to recycle play. The SV pushes up to join the front 4 which make a flat 5 across the defence. This tends to lead to an overload on the right hand side so the RW either has a chance on goal or the RB can get a cross in. The IF on the left will either create chances or go for goal himself. I toggle on/off the WBiB and change the tempo depending on how the game is going.

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[[FM23/24] - Trying to build a tactic and picking appropriate roles (4-2-3-1)]

The poor form continued into the next two games, with a 3-0 loss away to rivals Wolves in the Cup (turns out they're doing quite well this season), followed by a 3-2 away loss to Liverpool.

After this my form picked up.

Drew 1-1 vs Fulham (A)
Won 3-0 vs Crystal Palace (H)
Won 1-0 vs Norwich (A)
Won 2-1 vs Southampton (H)
Drew 1-1 vs West Ham (A) 

This summary from my analysts kind of sums it all up haha.

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And here are our Team Attacking statistics:

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When I watch us play, I see a lot of dribbling in to the sidelines and players being doubled up on (especially my wingers). We struggle to maintain possession as we get closed down quickly through the middle. If we do make a good chance, we tend to miss the goal or shoot straight at the keeper. If I make the ST an AF he has no involvement in the game, the AMC on S is the same. If I change their roles, they get more involved but there's still not much penetration and I don't think I really have the type of ST to play much other than an AF unless I'm using Pedro.

I've tried various combinations of ST role, LW role, AMC A or S, RW either W or IW. Doesn't seem to be able to generate consistent performances. I've tried watching the games and make tweaks but I think a lot of it is just guessing, try a few things and see what happens. The following game the same things have no impact so back to guessing.

Am I just overestimating how capable my squad is? Media prediction has us at 9th, so maybe losing and drawing all these games is expected?

[[FM23/24] - Trying to build a tactic and picking appropriate roles (4-2-3-1)]

Unfortunately, my form continues to tumble. It's now 5 league games in a row without a goal, with a 0-0 draw vs Leicester, 2-0 loss to Tottenham and a 3-0 drubbing by Man Utd.

I think it's safe to say this experiment has been a failure and an overhaul is required.

[[FM23/24] - Trying to build a tactic and picking appropriate roles (4-2-3-1)]

Okay I'm a few more games in to the season now, think I'm getting some results more by lucky than judgement...

Defensively we have certainly massively improved.

Win 2-0 vs Brentford (A)
Win 5-2 vs Doncaster (H) (Cup)
Lost 0-3 vs Arsenal (A)
Won 4-0 vs Man City (H) 
Drew 0-0 vs Everton (A)
Won 2-1 vs Bradford (H) (Cup)
Drew 0-0 vs Chelsea (H)

Still haven't solved the performance issue with my ST and AM. Both generally average <7.0 ratings. Any metrics I should be looking at specifically to see why they are struggling? I know it was mentioned that STs will get marked down if they're losing headers... Also getting really poor performances from the RW as well. 

I'm currently 9th and Arsenal, City, Everton, Chelsea and my next opponents Leicester, are all above me so I've had a tough start so maybe I shouldn't be too worried.

When we line up in attack, I do tend to see us in either a 4-1-4-1 shape or 3-2-4-1 so the formation is changing nicely. Just not getting quite the right output from my front four.

[[FM23/24] - Trying to build a tactic and picking appropriate roles (4-2-3-1)]

Okay, so I'm three games into the season. I have drawn 1-1 with Newcastle away (they scored with a header in the first minute), 2-2 at home vs Burnley (I dominated the game), and won 2-0 away vs Brentford. 

I've been watching the games and making tweaks and adapted my tactics to what I've seen. We have so far been dominating the games quite well.

My DLP has changed to a DM(S) with Hold Position as I found his pass % was bit good enough so wanted to take him off being a playmaker. 
My LB is now a WB(S). While he was creating havoc on (A), I felt him and LW were getting in each others way and the crossing from the by-line was slowing things down. 
The RW is getting a bit too isolated out wide so looking to get them more involved.
I think the biggest issue I can see in the post-match analysis is that while our passing maps are pretty good, in all three games there's been barely any passes to the AF. Should I try to change which role the ST is set too? I'm swapping the IF out for an IW(A) and will see if that helps.

In terms of squad, I've been unable to sell Aarons, but have bought replacement defenders to play the IFB role. I also sold Alvarez because I got crazy money for him and Endrick had progressed more than I thought.

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[[FM23/24] - Trying to build a tactic and picking appropriate roles (4-2-3-1)]

Sounds great. Thanks for the advice. I'll make those adaptions and then monitor the highlights to see what we're getting.

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PIs:

RW: Stay wider
AM: Roam from position, take more risks, dribble more
LB: Stay wider

I'm excited to see what we can get out of Schjelderup. He's the main one I'm itching to get success with.

[[FM23/24] - Trying to build a tactic and picking appropriate roles (4-2-3-1)]

1 hour ago, Overmars said:

Nice post. I agree with the choice of 4-2-3-1 because of how flexible it is. There seem to be endless combinations of player roles that can work in this formation.

My comments on your team and choices:

1. Your fullbacks are short. You will be killed by far post crosses in this match engine. I don't think Aarons is good enough. You need height for all defenders in FM24. Maybe you could make an exception for truly amazing attacking fullbacks, but you don't have those. Also, it's nice to have at least three giants for defending set pieces.
2. I like your idea of having one fullback attacking and one more conservative. An IFB(d) role on one side and WB(a) on the other would do that. The IFB(d) also allows you to be a little more bold with the DM on the same side, potentially freeing him up to be a SV.
3. Your attackers are short, and this will be tricky in terms of earning good match ratings. They will get crushed by missed headers, even with "low crosses" chosen.
4. The AF(a) is probably the right role for your striker, given how you want to use at least 1-2 of your other attacking players in purely support roles.
5. For your AMR, I would pick an IW on the right side rather than a winger. The IW role is more flexible, you can customize it with player instructions exactly how you want depending on the game, and your players trained to be IW will always be familiar with the role.
6. For your AML, I would pick an IF(a). I would want a second player seeking to get on the end of attacking moves. Alternatively, if you wanted to change your AMC to a more attacking role (as detailed below), You could pick a support duty AML who focuses on feeding the other three attackers.
7. For your AMC, I find the AM(a) is a great role in FM24. Support duties in this spot can work too, but I find it much harder to get them contributing this way. One of the best patterns of play in FM24 is when the AMC runs into the box and finishes a quick low cross from a wide player. This happens so frequently that I would want to encourage it by using an AM(a). I have seasons where my AMC outscores my ST all because of this move.
8. I love high tempo in FM24. I think it produces far more scoring chances. Lower tempo is fine if you have a game under control, but as soon as you need to score, I would raise the tempo much higher.

Thanks Overmars. This is really good contextual advice.

1) I've had a scan through and can see: Mitchell (5'9"), Udogie (6'2"), Mukiele (6'2") and Aarons (5'7"). I'll have a scout around to see if I can find a replacement for Aarons who's taller, but think 6'2" should be fine right? I assume we want to be getting over 6'? 

2) I did think about the IFB(d) role, and it would suit Mukiele. I was thinking about the current popular 3-2-5 attack formation but think Aarons wouldn't suit that. Will see if I can find a suitable replacement, Aarons is in demand so can generate some cash too. Looks like Gomes could play SV, would I need to adapt Danilo's role? 

3) I was concerned about the height of my forward line. Guess there's not much way around that, other than to buy a taller striker?

4) Yeah, I think Alvarez and Pedro could play other roles but given we don't have much attacking impetus elsewhere at the moment I think we stick with AF(a).

5) If I have an IW and an IFB on that side, would I not lose the width on the right hand side? Even if I put Stay Wide on them, I can't imagine they'd be playing that wide still? Also, if we have an IFB and we updated to a SV, would we not benefit from the RW staying right out wide to create space for the SV?

6) Yeah, I like the idea of the IF(a). How would that gel with the WB(a) on the same side? Would it matter if they're both attacking or should I tone down the WB? 

7) It sounds like I might have to decide between this or the IF(a). I don't think having both and the AF(a) will be a good idea. Schjelderup looks like he's got the skills for this, and notice that Bardghji could be effective here too. Might be that we could do IW(s) and AM(a) or IF(a) and AM(s). One to play with I think to find out with option works best. 

8) Good to know, thanks. Ideally, I'd love to play lots of high tempo football. That's exciting, but think we stay a bit controlled and then play with the tempo as and when we need like you say.

 

[[FM23/24] - Trying to build a tactic and picking appropriate roles (4-2-3-1)]

Hi fmjeros, thanks for the recommendation.

Could you please provide the link to the article you read? It would be interesting to see the thought process behind the setup. I'm looking to learn and understand tactic development, so for now I'll stick with trying to build my own thing but can certainly take pointers from what Cleon was doing here.

I appreciate that my post was quite long so probably why there's been few responses. By going through this process, it has helped me to think more about what's going on in my team. 

I'm still debating on the LW role. It has occurred to me that in the current set up I only have one person trying to score goals (the AF) as the winger, wing back, AM and IW are all more creative options. Therefore, I'm thinking that the LW (Joao Pedro currently) should may be an IF. I've seen people put things like Roam from position on the AM to try and create a bit more space as well. 

I also saw another thread that if you have two solid DMs then you can put both FBs to Wing Back to add more ball carriers, so might try that (but maybe might need to upgrade on Mukiele in that case).

[[FM23/24] - Trying to build a tactic and picking appropriate roles (4-2-3-1)]

Hi all, I've been playing this save on and off for a while now, and imported it in to FM24 from 23 to continue it going. I started out as Aston Villa as I liked the look of their base squad (FM23 original DB), but 4 seasons in, I've completely replaced it with my own team (I guess in true FM style...? ).

I'm not the best at creating tactics or understanding players capabilities so I thought I'd talk this one through with you all to see if I'm doing things right. I try to take a lot of advice from the various 4-2-3-1 threads that get posted, but seem to end up getting muddled and constantly changing things to no end. I hope through this process, I can gain some confidence in understanding how to set up my team and to get it to play how I want.

This team feels like it has a lot of potential but when I play, it is very inconsistent and just finished 10th in the league. I want to see if I can build a system that will start to make the most out of this team and push on to secure regular European football or higher. 

The Formation

I'm a fan of the 4-2-3-1 formation, so it works in my favour seeing lots of comments about it being the "meta". Hopefully I can use that to my advantage. In terms of how I like to play, I like to have an Out-and-out number 9, a number 10 who both scores and assists, a wide player who will keep the width and the other wide player tucking in to combine with the AM and ST. I like to have at least one full back bombing on and overlapping, holding the width on the opposite side to the "winger". The two DMs then should be a ball-winner/holder (traditional 6) and someone who controls the play from deep.

I want my team to control possession, but doesn't have to be Pep-like numbers, and ideally able to counter with speed when the opportunity arises. We should be looking to stretch the opposition to create chances (I think the two width holders should help with this).

The Squad

The squad has evolved considerably over time. Five of the young players I bought in during my first season are now key members of the squad, six more squad members came in season two and then seven came in season three. Season four was then a year of buying some "wonderkids" as I felt the squad was in a good place. Now for this season I'm moving on a few players who didn't make it, and needing to fill a few holes in the squad. The left wing position has been especially tricky to fill. 

Goalkeeper

In goal we have three keepers: Dennis Seimen, Niklas Hedl, and Emiliano Martinez (one of the few OGs left standing).

Seimen

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Hedl

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Martinez

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Seimen is my first choice here and seems to fit the sweeper keeper role nicely, with only his acceleration being a slight concern. Hedl's vision and anticipation could be an issue, while Martinez lacks acceleration and vision. I think they can both come in and do an effective job if they need to cover.

Role: Sweeper Keeper (Su)

Left Back

My two left backs are Tyrick Mitchell and Destiny Udogie. I don't think either are top tier but both look (to me) to be solid options. Udogie maybe lacks the mental stats but has great physicals, while Mitchell seems more rounded.

Mitchell

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Traits:

Run with ball down left
Gets forward whenever possible 
Knocks ball past opponent
Hugs line

Udogie

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Traits:

Runs with ball down left
Gets forward whenever possible
Dives into tackles

Think the option here is Mitchell due to the more well rounded stats. I'm torn between Wing-Back (Su) or (At). I really want the left back to get up there and create that width, which I think would be (At) but as both have gets forward whenever possible, we might get the same result from (Su) but with a bit more defensive control.

Center Backs

This area is lacking a bit of depth at the moment but I have two solid options to build around: Antonio Silva and Benoit Badiashile. 

Silva

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Traits:

Stops play
Stays back at all times
Tries long range passes
Refrains from taking long shots

Badiashile

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Both look like decent ball playing defenders, though should I be concerned that they both lack aggression? Depending on how the team shakes out, one or both could be set to simple central defenders. Silva looks like he would still try to play as a BPD because of his traits. I'm thinking Silva as BPD (De) and Badiashile as CD (De).

Two who can stand in are Ezri Konsa (another survivor) and Nordi Mukiele.

Konsa

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Mukiele

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Konsa tends to be the backup RCB while Mukiele plays more at RB. Konsa should be able to fill in as the BPD (De) for rotation. I'm looking for a second LCB to rotate with Badiashile.

Right Back

As well Mukiele above, at right back I also have Max Aarons.

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Traits:

Gets forward whenever possible
Plays short simple passes
Tries to play way out of trouble
Does not dive into tackles

Max is certainly more of a wing back than Mukiele. I'm certainly torn here whether to go for a more solid Full-Back (Su) behind what will likely be a winger, or allow Aarons more freedom as a Wing-Back (Su). I'm leaning to FB (Su) as his crossing isn't great, and he plays short simple passes anyway. The gets forward trait should still make him move up the pitch so will need to consider that for the DMs to cover. FB will also make it easier for Mukiele to rotate in.

Back Five

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Hopefully this five will give us a great base to build on. In terms of PIs, I may consider asking Badishile to defend wider and Aarons narrower to create a 3atb if Mitchell is bombing forward, though Aarons may run up as well so not sure this will be effective.

The number 6

Now I think I have two good options for this role; Joao Gomes and Manuel Ugarte. Both are very capable of playing either as a BWM or a regular DM.

Gomes

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Ugarte

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Traits:

Marks opponents tightly
Dictates tempo
Looks for pass rather than attempting to score

As they both have good passing stats, I think I'll start with them as Defensive Midfielder (Su). This way they can still be involved in the build up and pass the ball forward.

The deep creator

With this role, I'm not necessarily looking for someone who can generate a ton of assists. I see this role more as the one who keeps the play ticking and controls the tempo. At the moment I have two players in this position; Danilo and Kiernan Dewsbury-Hall.

Danilo

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Traits:

Dictates tempo
Tries long range passes
Likes to switch ball to wide areas

Dewsbury-Hall

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I'm going to start with Danilo as a DLP (Su) on the left.

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Danilo and Gomes will be my starting pair. Ugarte can come in for Gomes, Kiernan for Danilo. While this provides a solid base, I do wonder if: a) should one be more defensive, and/or b) should one be looking to break forward more? I think we've got a good balance at the moment and with the LB bombing on, and possibly the RB, we don't want to over commit.

Right Wing

My two options on the right are Michael Olise and Roony Bardghji. These two players, while fitting the concept of right sided forward who cuts in on to their left foot, are actually different profiles. Olise is more classic winger with pace and crossing, while Bardghji is a bit more modern inside forward looking to score.

Olise

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Traits:

Curls ball
Looks for pass rather than attempting to score
Tries tricks
Cuts inside from both wings

Bardghji

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Traits:

Shoots from distance
Plays one-twos
Runs with ball often
Cuts inside from right wing

Thinking back to my original plan, I wanted the RW to hold the width so Olise probably fits that bill better. Bardghji provides a good option though if I need to change things up. I'll go for Winger (Su) for now.

Attacking Midfield

This is the player I want to nit our attack together. I have two players I think can play this role; Andreas Schjelderup and Jacob Ramsey (still in for Home-grown reasons). 

Schjelderup

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Ramsey

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Schjelderup is my starter. He's labelled as a winger cutting in from the left, but he looks to be an effective Attacking mid. Ramsey isn't as strong but can be brought in for rotation. I may look for an upgrade.

Striker

Upfront I have three options; Joao Pedro, Julian Alvarez and Elye Wahi.

Pedro

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Traits:

Plays one-twos
Tries to play way out of trouble
Tries tricks
Does not dive into tackles
Runs with ball often

Alvarez

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Wahi

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Traits:

Runs with ball down right
Likes to try to beat offside trap
Knocks ball past opponent
Cuts inside from left wing

Alvarez and Pedro are a bit more well-rounded, while Wahi looks to be purely a striker. This gives me some options and all three look to be suited to Advanced Forward (At), which suits my want for an out and out number 9. It looks like I could use any of these three upfront, and probably Alvarez and Pedro could play left wing, which I'm missing at the moment.

I also have a young Endrick and Vitor Roque coming through but they're not ready to take over for these guys yet.

Left Wing

Currently this is a hole in my squad as I don't have a dedicated player for this position. However, considering my depth at ST, I think Joao Pedro can fill in here. I'm a bit torn on what role this should be. He's good enough that he could be a goal threat as an Inverted Winger (At), but that might be too attacking with the WB (At). Inside Forward could be an option, but might remove him from any build up and I worry if he'd clash with the AF and AM. I think we'll go IW (Su) for now.

Full Team:

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Team Instructions

As I want to on the front foot, I think we need to be on Positive. In possession Seimen, Silva and Badiashile are all capable to Play out of defence. To control possession we will pass shorter, but I'll keep width and tempo default for now. None of my strikers are especially tall so I think we need to aim to put in low crosses. 

In transition, I think I'll just mark counter and distribute quickly. I want to break fast in transition, though this might ruin our ability to control the game if we're rushing to turn the opposition over. I don't think we are fully capable to counter press. I'll leave distribution type and area/player blank so Seimen can make the decision on who to pass to.

Out of possession we'll have a higher defensive line as our centre backs are quick enough. I also think we can press high as we have a top heavy formation, we can use our forwards to defend high. I'm going to start with trigger press More often. 

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Conclusion

Thank you for taking the time to read through all this. I hope that what I've tried to create makes sense and sounds like a viable system, with suitable players. Please do let me know if you have any observations or recommendations.

I'm just starting the summer transfer window now so plenty of time to get a few players in, bed in the tactics (or tweak them if needed). I'd love to get this team up competing in the Europa League spots, maybe with a sniff of top 4.

[The FM 2023 and 2024 .. I guess.. 4-2-3-1 DM Thread]

How do you guys adapt to the opposition adapting to you? My team crumbled in our last 10 games as the opposition were all playing 4-3-3 with IFB/IWBs to suffocate the middle, and sitting deep to prevent my AF having space.

I've been playing as a team who were touted for mid-table/top half but we were in with a chance of Europa League/maybe 4th, but fell apart and finished 10th. I was moving between balanced and positive depending on who we were playing, but seemed to always start terribly when on positive. 

 

[The FM 2023 and 2024 .. I guess.. 4-2-3-1 DM Thread]

Love this, the tactic posted in the first post matches what I like from a tactic. High pressing 4231 with a complete forward, a double pivot and an attacking wing back, but I've gone with two IWs due to personnel.. I'm creating a high xG each game but struggling for any consistency in front of goal. My forwards are just not being clinical, hitting the post, smashing the ball over the bar from the penalty spot when clean through, all the usual stuff... Can't see any reason for it from their stats, and the chances we're creating seem to be good opportunities.

Forwards: Julian Alvarez, Elye Wahi, Matias Arezo

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Wingers/CAM: Joao Pedro, Andreas Schjelderup, Michael Olise, Roony Bardghji

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Lower tempo doesn't seem to help. Do I need some PIs or traits added? Or do I just need to adjust the tactic to suit my players a bit more? Maybe I'm just completely over-rating my players .

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Other question, would there be much change if the DM(s) was a BWM(s)? Joao Gomes and Manuel Ugarte are supposedly better suited as BWM(s). I do want to upgrade my DLP but don't have the rep currently to get the next level of player.

[Combining My Favorite Two Tactical/Team Building Threads of FM22 Into a Moneyball Everton Career]

Thank you for the sheet and the detailed explanation.

Good to see you're getting a tune out of Richarlison. I've used him in a couple of different saves and he just never seems to perform.

[Combining My Favorite Two Tactical/Team Building Threads of FM22 Into a Moneyball Everton Career]

This looks really interesting and great to see your analysis of the Everton squad as I recently started a save with them too.

The spreadsheet looks great. Is it something you'd be able to share? I tried to follow what you'd done to create it, sounds like you've put a lot of work in to it. I love graphical tools like this that make it clear to see what role to use people in, I can't easily tell from just viewing the player stats like some people can.

[[FM22] United 4-2-3-1 - conceding in the first half, struggling to break down the opposition]

On 06/04/2022 at 15:54, Johnny Ace said:

Funny you should mention that, @themadsheep2001had the exact same experience with Harry Maguire 

In a 4-2-3-1, if you want really aggressive fullbacks, your CMs need to be set accordingly, think of them as a base to allow your FBs (or in this case Wingbacks) forward. Straight away you have Shaw as a CWB, the most adventurous fullback role in the game. I really wouldn't trust Paul Pogba to anchor for a CWB to get forward at every chance. Ideally with a CWB, you want a DM in there to keep things secure 

 

Maguire has now been replaced in the starting line up.

I made a few tweaks as I went through the season, and settled on changing the BWMd to a CMd. The tweaks led to me going for a strong run from Dec to the end of the season and finishing a few points behind City and Liverpool. I've changed a lot of the team now with Pogba moving on, I didn't try to convince him to stay for the reasons you've stated above. I've gone for a more defensive focused pairing in the two, still with a bit of ability in Rice and Kessie. I think now I have a lot better squad, and not sure the system is getting the most out of the attack. Happy to try changing the CWB. Now all of my RBs are reasonable going forward, I'd like a more balanced style with the WBs providing width on both sides.

Squad is:

GK: Onana, De Gea, Henderson
RB: Dalot, Williams, Laird
CB: Varane, Bastoni, Milenkovic, Maguire

LB: Shaw, Telles

DLP: Rice, Garner
CMd: Kessie, Kamara, McTominay, Haidara*

RW: Sancho, Januzaj, Amad

CAM: Fernandes, van de Beek, Hannibal
LW: Rashford, Elanga

ST: Ronaldo, Martinez, Hzolek, Adeyemi

*not in UCL squad

Hzolek, Ronaldo and Adeyemi can also rotate in to the wide positions if needed.

Last season Ronaldo (26 in 30[3]), Elanga (16 in 20[25])** and Hzolek (13 in 16[7]) (from Jan only) were my top scorers, so it shows that in this system my striker scores goals. Would ideally like to bump the numbers up of the LW and CAM. Rashford only managed 11 and Bruno 9. Sancho got 5 goals and 11 assists.
** Played sometimes at LW and sometimes at ST.

Feel like I could control games better, still very lump it over the top and strong teams tend to dominate the match vs us.

[[FM22] United 4-2-3-1 - conceding in the first half, struggling to break down the opposition]

Hi,

Long time FM-er, only occasional tactics dabbler. Usually I'd use a P&P tactic, but this year I'm trying to experiment and make my own tactic. Safe to say, it's a work in progress. I've read a lot of the material that has been posted on here over the years, but am very bad at identifying how things apply to my system, or what I should be looking for to understand why issues are occurring.

I'm currently using Man Utd and want to play an attacking system that focuses on getting goals out of both Ronaldo and Bruno, with support from the likes of Rashford. I'm looking for assists to mainly come from Sancho, Shaw and Pogba. Unfortunately we're not blessed with midfielders and I haven't found it easy to fill those spots in the summer window so I do lack depth and solidity in that midfield two (I feel like Ole, having to rely on McFred haha). I'm doing okay against some teams, but struggling to beat the low block teams. Also early on in the season, I did find I was losing to the more mid-table teams. This was usually due to conceding first half goals.

So far I'm getting a good goal output from Ronaldo and assists from Sancho in the more open games, but no real contribution from Bruno at all. Rashford has been injured so hasn't played much yet. Shaw is really active and getting in to good spaces, just not really creating any clear cut chances.

One goal I'm seeing a lot, is a long ball down the middle, my LCB stepping up and missing the header and the striker running in behind them to score or either cut it back. Either that or my RCB stepping in to midfield to win a challenge and being done by a through ball round them. Also seen in the data hub that we're really struggling to make tackles:

I appreciate that Pogba isn't going to be the most useful in a midfield two but if I play Fred in there (as I've had to do a lot when Pogba covers in the positions further forward), I'm worried that he's not really suitable to be a deep-lying playmaker and if I change that role I'm not sure what I'd use instead. 

In terms of goals, I'm creating lots of low-quality chances, the box seems very clogged, we put headers over the bar or its straight at the goalie. 

To add to all this, because I don't really know what is and isn't working I do tend to tweak a lot in the hope something works, without ever really settling on a tactic and running with it. I have no confidence in what I have done is correct.

If you could kindly help me identify how to improve my system, I would really appreciate it. Thanks in advance.