[Football Manager 2020 Feedback Thread]

9 minutes ago, themadsheep2001 said:

This, and it's tiresome people deliberately misrepresenting stuff. It needs to stop or action will be taken as described 

My responses are not really directed at you.

I know you are only doing this out of passion for the game, and you are doing the best you can in the situation that is presented to you! Thanks for taking up that role!

My responses are aimed at the people in charge in the company. They have put you in this position, which is causing frustrations at your end, as well as at the end of the customer. It would be great if you could make them aware of this.

[Football Manager 2020 Feedback Thread]

26 minutes ago, themadsheep2001 said:

No, toxic is exactly what it is. And we're not am awkward position. The fact that you think we need to worry about who to speak for is exactly the problem. This isn't a play ground, there aren't sides. And the sooner everyone realises this the better. 

Yes and I am trying to tell you that you see it as toxic because of the way the company deals with the feedback, in other words; it has evolved into toxic because of the inability of the moderation team to appropriately deal with this feedback. Now I am not saying that this is the fault of the moderators themselves, the problem lies in the position of the moderator in the company. The problem is that a moderator can't speak for the company, and this shows how much SI values the community. People see this, and get frustrated....

There is the side of the customer, and there is the side of the seller; the company. If a moderator doesn't see this, then I don't really see a point in writing further (please don't take this personally).

Besides this, the frustration a lot of people have, might come from the inability of the company to deal with the main issues raised over multiple years. Now, it could be that the company does not really pick up on these issues and set their own course, and just use the moderator team to 'hold the forum in line', so to speak. This doesn't serve the community. It could also be that the company is not able to fix these issues, in which case they should communicate this to the community. This way, the community might develop an understanding.

I should ask money for this type of consulting, my degree wasn't free.

29 minutes ago, HUNT3R said:

Might help to read this  :  

 

Thanks, that is where I have read it.

[Football Manager 2020 Feedback Thread]

2 hours ago, themadsheep2001 said:

Just to clarify, there's a post at the top of this thread dealing with both communication and feedback. Would appreciate if people read that before posting if possible. 

If people want to talk about openness and transparency then this forum needs to be accepting of what's being said by the moderating team and the developers when they make posts It cuts both ways and this forum, while important and a great source, is only small percentage of the overall player base. 

You talk about working with the community, but it's difficult for the developers if rather than engaging in constructive communication, there are insults and falsehoods being stated in threads like these. And sadly that's no exaggeration. 

The thing is, you seeing it as toxic is the wrong way to look at it. It could very well be that the majority of the people on this forum are 14-18 year old youngsters, who are just venting their frustrations in an emotional immature way, however, they do take the time and energy to do this (this shows that they are committed).

The points they raise are still valid, besides from how, and how often, they bring it. It is upon the company and its people, including the moderators, on how they deal with this. 

And saying that openness and transparancy should be dependent upon the maturity of its community, to me, this seems to be the worst way to deal with it. Okay this is going to take up more time than I intended, but here we go;

I read somewhere that the moderators are volunteers, is that right? If this is the case, this is the first problem, as you as a moderator are not really part of the organisation, but have to deal first handedly with the community. So you have to feel responsible for something which you are not really part of. This puts you as a moderator in an akward position, as you are not really sure who you should speak for. 

This also shows that SI does not take the community that seriously, as they are not willing to pay for moderators who can speak for the company with the community.

[Football Manager 2020 Feedback Thread]

Hi,

I opened an account here some time ago, because I was doubting wether to buy this new version or not, and I wanted to raise the issues I have with the series. First of, I must say that in general you guys have put a wonderful game together, looking back where the game started. The series has really developed over these 25+ years! However, since the last 4 or 5 versions, I see some stabilization and reoccurance of issues, which have become annoying enough for me to raise them.

I linked to the post where I raised the main issues I have with the series as of late. Now FM19 was an enjoyable game, despite the issues that I've mentioned. I however didn't buy the new version up until now, because of these issues, and the previous versions were quite buggy upon release. With buggy I mainly mean; a poor ME. Now I can imagine that some of these issues, and the ME, are not easy to fix as everything in the game is interdependent, I get that. But if you don't have the people to get them fixed properly, the issue seems to be deeper imbedded in the organisation. The thing is, that people, me including, are not willing to pay 50 euros every year for a product which is not finished. People put a lot of time and energy into playing this game, which is, when the game is good, quite rewarding, however, when the game is not good, this becomes quite annoying, especially when this happens multiple years in a row. Now I don't know how the financials are at your company, but you must understand that your salaries and your profit are paid by us. This game has a committed community, and a lot of players buy this game every year, or every two or three years. If the company keeps putting out a product which is not finished, or do not listen enough to the feedback given by the community, or do not communicate in a transparent way, this company digs its own grave. The time where customers are silent buyers , and a company can do whatever it wants without being transparent about it, lie behind us (luckily).  Either you realize this and work with the community to make this product great again, or the community falls apart and this product dies.  Looking through this topic, I will wait to buy this game, and if I do, I am definitely not spending 50 euros, not because I don't think the game is not worth it, it would just set a wrong incentive.

There is a difference between money grabbing every year before the holidays, or putting in all the effort to make a great game. If the company chooses the first, and deliver an unfinished product, this will only go well a few years. I hope the management at your company isn't that short-sighted, however from my experience in the business world, this is more common than uncommon.

[Football Manager 2020 - Out 19th November 2019]

Hi,

I just opened an account here to let you know my concerns about the fm series. Long time fan here playing since 97/98.

First of, although I know you are running a business, which runs on money, but giving long time players only a 10% discount on the new version is just not cutting it. There are just not enough improvements each year to merit a 40+ euro investment. Even from a business perspective you could do better. Let me explain; now I just skip 1 or even 2 versions because it is not cheap and the improvements don't justify the investment. So now, in 5 years you make 120 euro max of me. If I get 30 or 40 percent off, I would buy it every year and you will make the same or more money, and have a more satisfied customer. I have a Master Degree in Business Administration, please contact me if you are interested in hiring me.

Now about the lack of improvements, the thing which bothers me the most in the series in the last couple of years, as it makes the game too easy and unrealistic in the long haul, is the AI for squad building. The opposition is often not able to buy and build a decent squad, too many strikers.... no right backs... and sofort. This makes the game just too easy and unrealistic (except from high expectations from the board).

Also, the transfer market is still under par (although improved a bit). You are still able to buy top players for cheap (which are not unhappy or have short contracts). This also adds to the game being too easy and unrealistic. I hope you are able to improve this, as I am losing my interest in the game because of this. I already saw in the videos on youtube on FM20 that this is also the case in this version, so I dont think I am going to buy it again this year.

The problems above I see as major, and I guess that a lot of people are annoyed by it. So instead of putting the money and attention to creating new shiny 'features' to help and sell the game, this is just short-sighted and almost an insult, as I guess that most of us are not dumb.

Luckily you were able to improve the match engine in the patches in FM19, but I also see some work to be done here, to make the game more realistic and improve the joy in the game. I still see sliding goalkeepers and wingers just walking past a back without an action. Its 2019 now! Some attention could also be turned on the graphics of the stadium and how it is presented in matches. But these are second to the first problems I mentioned.

The club vision system looks like a nice new feature for long-term games, if it works out well.

Thank you.

(edit) I want to add that the 4-1-2-2-1 (or 4-3-3 with the point towards the back, or how you want to call it) system, which a lot of AI managers in the game use, works just too defensive in the game. Strong clubs who play this system are greatly underperforming because of this. This mainly comes from the MC's not playing high enough on the pitch in an Advanced Playmaker role. There is no way in this role to get them to go further forward. Also a major problem for the game being too easy. Besides this, I find the tactical system still a bit rigid with the roles and their limitations. If I am manager at a Club, I decide how the youngsters are going to play. But I can imagine that this is not easy to improve.