dafuge Posted September 26, 2009 Share Posted September 26, 2009 What a crazy month for Damien Miles! Two consecutive own goals then a brace at the right end. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oxslow Posted September 26, 2009 Share Posted September 26, 2009 Southern Softies - 2035/36 - Febuary Dorchester v Mangotsfield(FA Trophy 3rd Rnd) A great game. Free flowing football and lots of goals. Mangotsfield v Dorchester(FA Trophy 3rd Rnd Rep) I told the plays what I thought of there perfomance at half time and this was the result. Dag & Red v Mangosfield 2 poor teams turned up to play an awful game of football and we were the worst. Torquay v Mangotsfield I hope the wheels are not starting to come off after the last 2 games. Mangotsfield v Preston My fears were unfounded after a good bounce back after the last 2 games. The whole team turned up an played well in this 1. Bury v Mangotsfield(FA Trophy 4th Rnd) We might have been a little lucky to force the replay but there was not much in it. Mangotsfield v Bury(FA Trophy 4th Rnd Rep) A game I though we had done enough to win in normal time was heading towards penalties before Jamie Neal poped up and put us through. I think I should win this competition now there is 2 teams below the BSN/BSS and 1 team at the bottom of the BSP. Squad We were hit hard in the middle of the month with injuries and suspensions, but there was nothing that was long term. League Table I now think that getting 100 points in a season is within my sights. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oxslow Posted September 26, 2009 Share Posted September 26, 2009 Southern Softies - 2035/36 - March Stevenage v Mangotsfield We were taken apart from start to finish. Mangotsfield v Thurrock After being so bad in the last game the team turned it around for a convincing win. Mangotsfield v Rochdale For the second game in a row we won by 3 goals. Gateshead v Mangotsfield A game where a draw would have been fair but both team should have scored. Mangotsfield v Fisher(FA Trophy Semi Final Leg 1) I was very disapointed with the team 0 - 0 against a team lower than the BSS/BSN and they played part of the match with 10 men. Mangotsfield v Burton I hope the fans do not get fed up of not seeing any goals. Fisher v Mangotsfield(FA Trophy Semi Final Leg 2) The keepers had a poor game. Between the 2 sides there was 7 shots on target and 7 goals were scored. Mangotsfield v Cheltenham Our form has hit a bit of a blip with 1 win in the last 5 games. Newport v Mangotsfield A even game that could of gone to either side. Squad The squad has done very well this year so far with injuries and it continued with every injury I picked up only being a short 1. League Table My lead has been cut but I should still have the title in the bag and I am in the playoffs no matter what. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dafuge Posted September 26, 2009 Share Posted September 26, 2009 0-0, 0-0, 0-0, 2-5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oxslow Posted September 26, 2009 Share Posted September 26, 2009 Southern Softies - 2035/36 - April/May Rugby v Mangotsfield The team was awful we are luck we did not lose by more. Mangotsfield v Rushden A draw would have been a fair result but it did not go that way. Mangotsfield v Woking A comfortable victory for the team with a couple of goals disallowed. Ossett Town v Mangotsfield This was an unlucky result for the team I thought we had done enough to get the points. Mangotsfield v Grimsby A deserved win by the team but there was not that many highlights in the game. Bury v Mangotsfield I hate it hate it hate it when we give away goals away this late on in the game. Bishop's Stortford v Mangotsfield I had high hopes for a big win before the FA Thropy Final because Bishop's Stortford was already relegated. Mangotsfield v Barrow(FA Trophy Final) This game was over by half time and nothhing of any real note happened in the second half. Squad I think the squad will have to be made bigger next year. I got lucky this year with the longest injury being 4 weeks I think. League Table My hopes of getting a 100 failed in the end. But if you offered me that many points at the begining of the season I would have bitten your hand off. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dafuge Posted September 26, 2009 Share Posted September 26, 2009 Great stuff, another convincing league win for us softies and another trophy which was a bonus Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oxslow Posted September 26, 2009 Share Posted September 26, 2009 I have made a bit of a blunder I offered a new contract to Colin Whitney so he will be on £1600 next year. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dafuge Posted September 26, 2009 Share Posted September 26, 2009 I have made a bit of a blunder I offered a new contract to Colin Whitney so he will be on £1600 next year. Is it worth transfer listing him now and trying to force him out of the club? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oxslow Posted September 26, 2009 Share Posted September 26, 2009 I will leave that for the next person to decide. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dafuge Posted September 26, 2009 Share Posted September 26, 2009 Who is up next anyway? Do we have anyone waiting? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oxslow Posted September 26, 2009 Share Posted September 26, 2009 Southern Softies - 2034/35 - Season Summary Past Positions As you can see we dominated the league from start to finish. Finances We made a lot more money than I though we would this year. If I knew we were going to make so much money I would have not got rid of so many players. We got £425k from a bank loan and £460k from the FA Cup tie against Braintree. ***Players Reviews to be added tomorrow (going out in a tonight.)*** Save Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oxslow Posted September 26, 2009 Share Posted September 26, 2009 Who is up next anyway? Do we have anyone waiting? I dont think there is anybody waiting. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dava Posted September 26, 2009 Share Posted September 26, 2009 Well done on the league, looked a stroll in the park! Any monkey news? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
conners Posted September 26, 2009 Share Posted September 26, 2009 I'm afraid i'm gonna have to retire from this thread guys. We're 2 seasons behind and i can't see where i'm gonna have the time to finish. Sorry Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bermybhoy Posted September 26, 2009 Author Share Posted September 26, 2009 That's a pity conners, but no worries. Unless anyone else is particularly desperate to have a go and rattle through the season quickly, I could jump in and play it? Downloading now, might be able to have a poke about for a little while tonight but probably can't make a proper start til some time tomorrow. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hamilton162 Posted September 27, 2009 Share Posted September 27, 2009 A fantastic season there Oxslow I don't think anyone is lined up to go next yet. Unfortunately i won't be able to do another season before FM10 comes out Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bermybhoy Posted September 27, 2009 Author Share Posted September 27, 2009 Well since no-one else seems to want to go, I've made a start. Have reached the season click over point, and hoping that we'll become more attractive to some higher quality players. Have already had a fair clear out, as the squad was too big, and as I continually say, at this level it should not be hard to replace players with similar quality. The 'core' first XI though, does look very strong and indeed the minimum expectation the board was willing to offer for budget-setting purposes was 'mid-table' - instead I told them to expect promotion... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bermybhoy Posted September 29, 2009 Author Share Posted September 29, 2009 Sorry for the lack of updates. I have actually made a start and played through a few months, will update as soon as possible. Does anyone want to go for the Softies? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
berty1978 Posted September 29, 2009 Share Posted September 29, 2009 Hmm, like I said before I'd like another go on this but I think there has only been 5 seasons since my last go, but if there really is nobody else.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hamilton162 Posted September 29, 2009 Share Posted September 29, 2009 go ahead berty No-one else seems to want to go atm Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulHartman71 Posted September 29, 2009 Share Posted September 29, 2009 Hello. As you all know or hopefully know, I am running the CSE Ultimate League. This league features some of CSE's greatest sides, 4 of these have come from this sign up. Basically, when I eventually get round to sorting summaries of the team's I need some help. I am able to do the FM08 Monkey's squad anaylsis since I was in charge of their last season, however I need help with the FM08 Softies, FM09 Softies and FM09 Monkeys. The FM08 Softies and Monkeys both came from the final season for both teams, I'm not sure on the exact date. Whilst the two FM09 sides come from the final season for both teams of this year, 2031-32. I believe dafuge was the last in charge of the FM08 Softies. This year dava was in charge of the Monkeys, whilst Cardiovascular was in charge of the Softies. They are not required to do the summaries however, if someone else is interested in doing them than that is fine, as long as someone does them. I will disclose a link to the post in the other thread describing what I am hoping/looking for in the summaries. link Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hamilton162 Posted September 29, 2009 Share Posted September 29, 2009 I'd happily do the FM09 Softies PaulHartman71 That's providing my internet is fast enough to download the file :o Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulHartman71 Posted September 29, 2009 Share Posted September 29, 2009 I'd happily do the FM09 Softies PaulHartman71 That's providing my internet is fast enough to download the file :o you wouldn't necessarily need to download the file, if you have enough knowledge of the side then surely a screenshot of the players in the squad, or at least the final season summary would be enough? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hamilton162 Posted September 29, 2009 Share Posted September 29, 2009 Trouble is i was on holiday when the review was posted etc. and i can barely remember the squad :o And now the file won't download Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dafuge Posted September 29, 2009 Share Posted September 29, 2009 I believe dafuge was the last in charge of the FM08 Softies. This year dava was in charge of the Monkeys, whilst Cardiovascular was in charge of the Softies. They are not required to do the summaries however, if someone else is interested in doing them than that is fine, as long as someone does them. I will disclose a link to the post in the other thread describing what I am hoping/looking for in the summaries.link I don't mind doing the FM08 softies, but I've already got my Dartford team in there, so would anyone else here like to do them? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
berty1978 Posted September 29, 2009 Share Posted September 29, 2009 Ok, I've downoaded the save, I'll do a player summary as soon as I can. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hamilton162 Posted September 29, 2009 Share Posted September 29, 2009 Good Luck berty Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
berty1978 Posted September 29, 2009 Share Posted September 29, 2009 Thanks hamilton, to follow on from two excellent seasons I feel there is a bit of pressure there. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hamilton162 Posted September 29, 2009 Share Posted September 29, 2009 If our squad is as good as dafuge says, none whatsoever berty If it isn't as good, then there's really no pressure Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulHartman71 Posted September 29, 2009 Share Posted September 29, 2009 oh, I presumed he was doing the summary for the FM08 or FM09 Softies. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bermybhoy Posted September 29, 2009 Author Share Posted September 29, 2009 Northern Monkeys 2033/34 - first impressions My assessment of the squad is roughly in line with that posted by conners previously, with a few exceptions. While the core of the squad is very strong, I immediately chose to get rid of a lot of players, and for kick off, anyone who was coming out of contract was released or sold. I then went through and considered who failed to offer 'value for money'. Hence, if they were on more than around £300 a week, they were punted, unless I saw them as integral parts of the team. My philosophy is that unless a player is truly exceptional, there's no point tying up a limited budget on him when there's probably cheaper options out there. So after getting rid of that lot (25 in total, earning a healthy £120k in transfer fees) and bringing in a good number (27 at last count), I feel we have a strong squad with 2 or 3 players covering in all positions. For obvious reason I'm not inclined to post sreenshots of them all. I'll wait til later in the season, see who my favourites have become, and report on them. Quite simply, at this point I can't decide who's better than who in most positions and I might be surpised myself. The coach and assman ratings are useless, as they're so impressed that there's 7 stars all over the shop, so you can't differentiate between 'good' and 'very good'. Anyway, what I do feel is that we have depth - we shouldn't be seriously weakened by injuries, unless they pile up in one position. I hoped that by freeing up the budget, bringing in transfer fees (which were immediately applied against the wage budget - who wants to pay for players when you're down here and there's tons on frees?) and with the click over to becoming a BSP team, the board would seriously increase the upper limit on individual wages. Which they did - allowing up to about £875 p/w - unfortunately there was no way of getting close to it as players in that price range simply aren't interested. We have the cash, but lack the rep. Final league table - just to confirm promotion at a canter League player stats League team stats Season summary Last season's best XI An interesting message popped up when Bermuda dispensed with the managerial services of a familiar name...cracked me up, who did that? August coming up... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bermybhoy Posted September 29, 2009 Author Share Posted September 29, 2009 Northern Monkeys / Rugby - August 1 - Rugby v Bristol Rovers Our BSP campaign got off to a great start. Richard Fraser, a right winger picked up on a free after being released by Chelsea, opened the scoring early on, before supplying another new signing, forward Lee Taylor a cross to nod home a second and secure a straightforward win. 2 - Torquay v Rugby A poor game of few chances saw Torquay convert the only shot on target. No complaints, we need the squad to gel. 3 - Rugby v Kidderminster Not much to write home about here either, Lee Taylor again proving useful though, converting our one effort on target to seal a narrow win. 4 - Aldershot v Rugby The term 'smash and grab' doesn't quite do this justice. They pounded us throughout. Even having a central midfielder sent off midway through the 2nd half didn't turn the tide. Remarkably though, late on we won a corner, which new centre back Paul Moses - short but dominant in the air - got his head to, sealing an implausible win. 5 - Rugby v Hinckley Our main striker Milsom was yet to get off the mark this season. He started doing some catching up though, first bulleting home a header from a blasted cross from the wing, before netting from a corner, to seal the points before half time. You might notice the attendance shooting up already on the back of these results... All in all, a good start, blip against Torquay aside. We don't look convincing at this stage - 2 or 3 of those wins could as easily have been draws. We do seem to be solid at the back and have only lost one goal despite playing a very open style, but are lacking any serious qualiy up front... League table - early days but looking good Squad - assman ratings - he's impressed! Squad - contracts - to back up previous comments about getting the wages down, yet improving the quality Squad selection - some early signs of who could be key this season. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
berty1978 Posted September 30, 2009 Share Posted September 30, 2009 oh, I presumed he was doing the summary for the FM08 or FM09 Softies. Actually I have still got the save from the season before Cardiovascular so if he can't do it I may do if I get time between my current softies season. edit: that's the FM09 Softies of course. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
berty1978 Posted September 30, 2009 Share Posted September 30, 2009 It's just a fantastic squad I've inherited here, I'm hoping I don't let us down as I think the team is good enough to do well in League 2. Goalkeepers Stephen Hunter: Probably just about the better of the two keepers, and 8 U21 caps for Scotland still one for the future at 22 years old. Mike John: Also 22, and an U21 cap for Ireland, they were rotated last season and I may well do the same. Defenders Marko Knight: Probably the weakest of the three, with a comparatively low marking attribute. Damien Miles: I'd say the best defender we have, he did end up with the highest average rating of the three. James Webb: Again, excellent and with some high attributes including determination and concetration he shouldn't make many mistakes. Full Backs Lee O'Brien: Can play equally as good as a DL or ML which will come in very handy. Jamie Mackey: Excellent mental attributes but his technical ability lets him down a bit. Stewart Williamson: I don't play with Wing Backs so he'll probably be first choice right back, excellent physical attributes. Glenn Wright: Useful as he can also play right midfield, but probably backup in both positions. Midfielders Paul Westley: Actually looks better all round than Whitney with excellent physican attributes. Colin Whitney: As Westley is better anyway, I may follow on and transfer list him as his wage is a bit high even for League 2. Even then I can't see anyone wanting to take him off our hands. Chris Burrows: A versatile player who's only natural position is MC but as I do play with an MC he may get a good look in. Bryan Bryant: Can play in both MC and AMC positions and has amazing pace for this level expect him to tear opposing defences apart. Kevin Yates: Good all round player with very good mental attributes. Can only play as an AMC. Wingers Ian Morgan: A good creative winger who isn't the fastest player in the squad but high acceleration makes up for that. Simon Neil: Very good player as he can play left or right wing but being right footed I'd be inclined to keep him on the right. Strikers Jamie Powell: The only forward not to score more than 15 goals last season, his low pace may mean he'll struggle in higher leagues. Jamie Neal: Top scorer last season, good all round striker with plenty of pace for this level. Tom Cropper: Excellent physical attributes but slightly let down elsewhere. Dave Arnold: Again, good all round and probably the player of the season. Ass Man ratings before... ...and after reset date upgrade to training facilities Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cardiovascular Posted September 30, 2009 Share Posted September 30, 2009 Paul, what would you need for the summary? I could squeeze it in if I've got the time. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bermybhoy Posted September 30, 2009 Author Share Posted September 30, 2009 Northern Monkeys - September 6 - Newport v Rugby With Newport bottom, we were heavily tipped for this. Milsom again come up wth the goods, nodding home a corner before spinning his man and tucking home nicely from the edge of the box to give us a good second half lead. We then let Newport right back into it, first a fluke of a cross rocketed in, before static defending let their striker knock home a low cross late on. 2 points lost. 7 - Rugby v Maidenhead Heavy favourites again for this one, this time no slip ups. Moses headed home from a corner, before Milsom finished off some good wing play from Fraser to make it 2. 8 - Rugby v Team Bath Another game against frankly rotten opposition. You can only beat what's in front of you though and it was wrapped up in 12 minutes courtesy of a scorching free kick from midfielder Pritchard and another header from centre back Moses. The enigmatic Raw added gloss to the scoreline late on. Worryingly, Milsom picked up an injury. 9 - Crawley v Rugby An even match in which we took the lead through striker Curtis Williams, with his first Rugby goal. Crawley dominated after that though, and in the end a draw was a decent result, leaving us 3rd. 10 - North Ferriby v Rugby North WHO? Anyway, they are yet more relegation fodder who we were expected to beat easily. A rocket inside the box from versatile defender/def mid/att mid Lowe gave Rugby a deserved lead, but it wan't til very late on that Williams scored the second, despite NF playing much of the second half with ten men. This lack of goalscoring is going to come back and bite us. 11 - Rugby v Dorchester Before the game, Dorchester's defence looked weak and so it proved as we created numerous chances. The versatile Heath, playing central midfield, headed the opener before Lowe capitalised on shambolic defending to knock home on the goal line. We looked home and dry at half time, but a scorcher from distance just after the break made the scoreline closer than the performance warranted. The result edges us top for the first time, replacing Tamworth. We continue to miss Milsom, and should really be scoring more than we are at this stage. Squad selection League table Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oxslow Posted September 30, 2009 Share Posted September 30, 2009 Thank you you berty1978 for doing the player reviews. I have had some RL stuff that got in my way and leaving me with no time to do them. I was was going to do the reviews now but you have already done it for me Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
berty1978 Posted September 30, 2009 Share Posted September 30, 2009 That's quite alright oxslow. One of the first things I'm doing is hiring a lot more staff, we have one coach and we can have up to 9. Also a few more scouts. Are we allowed to get a parent club, I've asked and I've got the choice of Aston Villa or Bolton. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PaulHartman71 Posted September 30, 2009 Share Posted September 30, 2009 Paul, what would you need for the summary? I could squeeze it in if I've got the time. Originally Posted by PaulHartman71 I believe dafuge was the last in charge of the FM08 Softies. This year dava was in charge of the Monkeys, whilst Cardiovascular was in charge of the Softies. They are not required to do the summaries however, if someone else is interested in doing them than that is fine, as long as someone does them. I will disclose a link to the post in the other thread describing what I am hoping/looking for in the summaries. link Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cardiovascular Posted September 30, 2009 Share Posted September 30, 2009 Need to learn to read, would you like the summary in the league thread aye? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
berty1978 Posted September 30, 2009 Share Posted September 30, 2009 Pre-season Friendly results Frome Town 1-7 Mangotsfield Chippenham 0-3 Mangotsfield Shortwood 0-5 Mangotsfield Mangotsfield 1-0 Man Utd Reserves Mangotsfield 1-0 Aston Villa Mangotsfield 2-0 Peterborough Mangotsfield 2-0 Fulham Reserves And a few free signings found in the trial day, I wanted a couple more wide players and an MC: Jamie Brock Dave Hooper Paul Sheridan Sorry about the high wages, but any players worth signing wanted high wages. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
hamilton162 Posted September 30, 2009 Share Posted September 30, 2009 A good pre-season there berty What position do you reckon we are capable of? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
berty1978 Posted September 30, 2009 Share Posted September 30, 2009 Definately capable of winning the division but whether we do or not remains to be seen. I have offered our best players in their last year of contracts new deals, they all want between £800 and £1100 pw. I have lowered the offers somewhat, most by a couple of hundred so that will ease the wages a bit if they accept. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Oxslow Posted September 30, 2009 Share Posted September 30, 2009 That's quite alright oxslow. One of the first things I'm doing is hiring a lot more staff, we have one coach and we can have up to 9. Also a few more scouts. Are we allowed to get a parent club, I've asked and I've got the choice of Aston Villa or Bolton. "Parent clubs: please do not use parent clubs. It’s been found they can provide some sides with a large advantage. You may have as many feeder clubs as you like." From the second post. I think I had the most amount of staff I could have when I looked. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bermybhoy Posted October 1, 2009 Author Share Posted October 1, 2009 Sorry for the slow progress, anyone's who's still following the Monkeys (anyone?). Had some internet problems, have progressed to end of November though. Will hopefully get it finished over the weekend, early next week at latest. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dafuge Posted October 1, 2009 Share Posted October 1, 2009 "Parent clubs: please do not use parent clubs. It’s been found they can provide some sides with a large advantage. You may have as many feeder clubs as you like." From the second post.I think I had the most amount of staff I could have when I looked. I don't really see a problem with having a parent club, as long as we don't loan players from them. The staffing limits have probably jumped up by us reaching the football league, it was one of each in my season. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
berty1978 Posted October 1, 2009 Share Posted October 1, 2009 Yeah, sorry guys I did accept Villa as a parent club, so 2 options now: 1. Start again 2. Carry on as I wasn't going to loan any players in and we probably made all of £30k from the fee and gate receipts from the friendly. The next person can cancel the link on 27th June next year. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
dafuge Posted October 1, 2009 Share Posted October 1, 2009 I'm pretty sure it is ok if we carry on, just as long as we don't loan any players from them. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
berty1978 Posted October 2, 2009 Share Posted October 2, 2009 Southern Softies - End of September update League 2 Mansfield - Mangotsfield A good solid start to the season as we created plenty of clear cut chances. League Cup 1st Round Charlton - Mangotsfield pfft, I could curse our luck that we were drawn away at a championship side but it was an awful performance in our first LC game with Mangotsfield. League 2 Mangotsfield - Hartlepool We were lucky to come away with a draw here as we were bad again. League 2 Wycombe - Mangotsfield Not much better as they had their man sent off too late to make a difference, League 2 Mangotsfield - Peterborough Much better performance as we improved our score over the friendly in pre season. Johnstone's Paint Trophy South 1st Round Mangotsfield - Exeter Probably the best performance so far and against League 1 opposition. League 2 Grays - Mangotsfield We created plenty of chances but none clear cut as they scored from theirs. League 2 Mangotsfield - Northampton A fantastic performance from Brian Bryant as he scored a lovely hat trick and we even missed a penalty. League 2 Brentford - Mangotsfield Another missed penalty and again didn't matter as we ran out comfortable winners including another from Bryant. League 2 Mangotsfield - Doncaster For the neutrals this must have been a fantastic game but for me I was banging my head against the wall. At 1-1 we missed a penalty for the third game running, and the sending off in the 83rd minute seemed to have an influence on the game as we conceded a last minute goal. League Table We now have fairly basic training facilities, and with plenty of coaches now all the training categories are at least 4 stars. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
berty1978 Posted October 2, 2009 Share Posted October 2, 2009 With £425k transfer budget I am keeping an eye on reports from the reserves and U18s. These two have just come up: Dave Beevers - Scout Report Jeff Jackson - Scout Report The scout reports shown are from the scout with 18 for judging potential. The problem with Beevers is that we have plenty of strikers already but I can't pass up on Jackson, can I? edit: I've bid for the players and they're both wanted by other clubs, so may not get them anyway. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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