Football Manager 2021 - New Headline Features

[grade]

4 hours ago, themadsheep2001 said:

Their goal, as in ultimate aim. Not that it does it yet, and literally no one has ever claimed it does. They've been quite open that its an approximation. It's a goal, not a promise, it might not be attainable, but it's something to aim at

Oh, okay then... my mistake... sigh!!!!!

 

[TokyoWanderer]

hace 55 minutos, mightypvfc dijo:

Well, when you're releasing a game every 12 months you need big headline features to keep the user base happy. It's all well and good to implement "under the hood" features as long as you're not planning on pocketing £40 for the game. I'd imagine this game will be marketed for at least £40 on Steam and even more on the Next Gen systems. My question is do you believe this iteration of the game has enough "headline features" to justify the very expensive price tag? 

The price tag is not very expensive and I have already preordered, so yes to your question. The developers try to make incremental improvements every year and it has been that way forever. Feel free to skip a few editions if you want, but I want my new FM every year and have no problem paying the current price.

[gunner86]

2 hours ago, mightypvfc said:

Well, when you're releasing a game every 12 months you need big headline features to keep the user base happy. It's all well and good to implement "under the hood" features as long as you're not planning on pocketing £40 for the game. I'd imagine this game will be marketed for at least £40 on Steam and even more on the Next Gen systems. My question is do you believe this iteration of the game has enough "headline features" to justify the very expensive price tag? 

First off, very expensive is subjective, it’s £45 on steam, but currently has 10% off so it’s £40.50. But there are places that do it cheaper too. There are games out there which cost a lot more every year and have a lot less new features (see: FIFA).

Secondly, there’s already a fair proportion of the community that already find a lot of the games features as unnecessary bloat.

Personally, yes, it is worth the price they charge, because I know I’ll get play time out of it, and some of the little QoL stuff they’ve added is really good.

Which brings me back to my original question. What groundbreaking new feature are you expecting?

[KloppRodgersHodgson]

On 21/10/2020 at 15:38, HUNT3R said:

Faces looking good, though some eyes still look a little spooky.

It still bugs me that managers don't wear a belt. 

Agreed. And the coat looks like something only Kasabian could get away with wearing.

[-Jef-]

[destmez]

51 minutes ago, rosque said:

Let's Go 🔥🔥🔥🔥🔥 

[destmez]

1 hour ago, gunner86 said:

First off, very expensive is subjective, it’s £45 on steam, but currently has 10% off so it’s £40.50. But there are places that do it cheaper too. There are games out there which cost a lot more every year and have a lot less new features (see: FIFA).

Secondly, there’s already a fair proportion of the community that already find a lot of the games features as unnecessary bloat.

Personally, yes, it is worth the price they charge, because I know I’ll get play time out of it, and some of the little QoL stuff they’ve added is really good.

Which brings me back to my original question. What groundbreaking new feature are you expecting?

30€ in instant gaming

[-Jef-]

23 minutes ago, destmez said:

30€ in instant gaming

30 euros / 26 pounds on shopto.  Do not use shady websites pls

[destmez]

1 hour ago, rosque said:

30 euros / 26 livres sur shopto. N'utilisez pas de sites Web louches pls

  " httpS " 

stop lying do your own research please   😡😡

I bought the "17" and the "19" on this site

https://gyazo.com/f579aeff6fede977d963abeeb1331062

Edited October 23, 2020 by destmez

[Double0Seven]

1 hour ago, destmez said:

  " httpS " 

stop lying do your own research please   😡😡

I bought the "17" and the "19" on this site

https://gyazo.com/f579aeff6fede977d963abeeb1331062

No one's lying, that's a keyshop. They sell keys that aren't directly bought from the publisher. It's illegal. Think for a moment why it's so cheap compared to official sellers. SI aren't doing special favours for random keyshops. 

[Cal585]

15 hours ago, themadsheep2001 said:

You can make some pretty good approximations of various styles tbh. 

I've seen people make some really good replication tactics. The day that the AI managers in FM can produce a good approximation of their own tactics is the day that the game reaches another level for me. But I'm not expecting that soon.

[KloppRodgersHodgson]

15 hours ago, WelshMourinho said:

Extremely hopeful the next headline feature will be titled 'The death of gegenpressing.' 

Absolutely cannot be arsed for another FM where players with 12 workrate run around like they're Arturo Vidal and the ball is an alcoholic beverage.

Elaborating on this, I don’t really feel like the actual stats themselves matter much in the game:

 - Players with low finishing are just as likely to score a chance with their weaker foot as a world-class finisher on their stronger foot

 - Whenever I concede a long shot, I always check the stats and more often than not, they have a low long shot rating

 - Players with low stamina will run all day

 - As others have mentioned, Messi is no better at dribbling, or passing, or finishing, as a League Two player

 - Man City are just as likely to score headed goals as Sheffield Utd

If it came out that the result was just a case of adding up all the stats from one team, add up all the other team, throw in a bit of random factor and multiply it all by morale, it wouldn’t surprise me.

I tend to just buy players with the most CA stars, keep them rotated so they’re fit, keep them happy by talking nice to them, and win everything.

[yolixeya]

1 hour ago, KloppRodgersHodgson said:

I tend to just buy players with the most CA stars, keep them rotated so they’re fit, keep them happy by talking nice to them, and win everything.

I agree. Players with most CA will likely have the best attributes. Yes, the player can have lower CA but good attrubute spread but for the most part better the CA,  you will have the better player potentially able to perform at multiple roles in the team.

1 hour ago, KloppRodgersHodgson said:

Elaborating on this, I don’t really feel like the actual stats themselves matter much in the game:

 - Players with low finishing are just as likely to score a chance with their weaker foot as a world-class finisher on their stronger foot

 - Whenever I concede a long shot, I always check the stats and more often than not, they have a low long shot rating

 - Players with low stamina will run all day

 - As others have mentioned, Messi is no better at dribbling, or passing, or finishing, as a League Two player

 - Man City are just as likely to score headed goals as Sheffield Utd

If it came out that the result was just a case of adding up all the stats from one team, add up all the other team, throw in a bit of random factor and multiply it all by morale, it wouldn’t surprise me.

However I don't agree with the rest of this post. It is oversimplification that isn't useful in any way. Player that has a long shot of 1 can still score a long range goal especially if other things are in his favour (his other attributes like composure, decisions, attributes of opposing defenders and GK, morale, weather conditions, if he is playing in a dominant team, etc). That doesn't mean that someone who is equally good player but has a better long shots wouldn't do better in his role if your tactical setup requires him to take long shots often.

So it makes sense to pay attention to their attributes. You can getaway without it if you have really strong team but you really miss out on the gems with lower CA but the right attribute spread and potentially lower wage demands who still perform on a world class level. Like if your anchorman has all the right attribues for that role but is average or below average in anything else does it really matter. I really don't think that the game just adds up attributes of one team and attributes of other team with some random factor and morale as you put it. Player roles and key and preferred attributes would be useless in that case. You could have just one rating for every player then.

[KiLLu12258]

i mean everyone saw that something is really wrong witht he last ME's, when even messi doesnt score above 20 goals at most saves.

such things are just frustration as you see that is something so strangely wrong. 

Edited October 24, 2020 by KiLLu12258

[autohoratio]

 

[grade]

36 minutes ago, autohoratio said:

 

I hope that Training ratings is in FMT. It will be nice to choose your team on performance in training.

I'm a choosing my 11 players and stick with it, kind of guy.

Edited October 24, 2020 by grade

[Guest]

Just hope you can skip the VAR animations and any other nonsense (sorry, realism) that is added this time round.

Bad enough watching this in real games, without _having_ to suffer through it in a game.

[Nick_CB]

1 hora atrás, autohoratio disse:

 

Wow, incredible. 😒

[mightypvfc]

19 hours ago, gunner86 said:

First off, very expensive is subjective, it’s £45 on steam, but currently has 10% off so it’s £40.50. But there are places that do it cheaper too. There are games out there which cost a lot more every year and have a lot less new features (see: FIFA).

Secondly, there’s already a fair proportion of the community that already find a lot of the games features as unnecessary bloat.

Personally, yes, it is worth the price they charge, because I know I’ll get play time out of it, and some of the little QoL stuff they’ve added is really good.

Which brings me back to my original question. What groundbreaking new feature are you expecting?

I'm not looking for a "groundbreaking" new feature as you put it, I'm simply looking for features to get excited about. You've seen the new screens. Are you genuinely excited about FM21? 

I'm not sure what I've seen so far is worth £45. Gestures have replaced tones and press conferences have been tweaked a bit. Oh, and a new staff role. That isn't really dunking my biscuit. 

It's been mentioned a few times in this thread but I'm a firm believer that a lack of competition is hindering the pace of development. SI are in the comfortable position of rocking out features when they feel like it due to the monopoly the hold in the football management market. They're comfortable in the knowledge that people will buy the game no matter what. Look at the match engine shots from 2011 compared to 2021. It actually looks like it's not progressing at all.

[Manjusaka]

The headline features are... disappointing. Clearly there is a large gap between SI and a large portion of fans in what features are desirable. Players play the game for the on-the-pitch tactics and squad building. You can easily see that in the forums. Players like to discuss how to emulate a tactical style and which players are cheap-to-buy wonderkids. I bet this is the core of the game to most of the players, but these are also areas in which FM has been stagnating.

In terms of tactics, we all know the match engine is just an approximation and we should not expect too high. But it is just...stagnating too much, sometimes dissatisfactory. SI gave us tactical templates, but they don't look like that particular tactical style at all even you played the style in a team that should be ideal enough. Playing vertical tiki-taka still funnels the ball to the flank resulting in blocked crosses? I am fed up with that. And every year there must be some positions or roles which are dysfunctional. One year it may be the half-back, one year it may be the raumdeuter, one year it may be the false nine. And sometimes you are unlucky enough to have the whole striker position lacking movement or the whole AMC not working. And all these positions and roles and duties are not even new. (IMO the roles and duties have been expanding too much without a clear defining characteristic for each role. And funny enough a single player can only be tactically fluid with a single role/duty even though the roles look so similar!) Counterpress looking like 2-3 players chasing a single ball from the same direction, Messi consistently having headed attempts in the box, non-existent low crosses...I am not even talking about the inability of the game to emulate some real-life play-style: the Luke Shaw or Azpilicueta type side-center-back, Fellaini acting as a target man in the MC/AMC strata, and also the overlapping center-back - I just saw today how Aaron Cresswell as a side-center-back overlapped the LWB Masuaku to deliver a cross.

In terms of macro-management, the financial side of the game has been way too shallow. I know it may not be the manager's job to run the financial side of the club, but the financial side definitely should have more impact. Dynamic competition prize money, economic downturn, owner decreasing investment due to his own financial hardship, Serie A flourishes again and draws a big chunk of sponsorship and investment...etc. And I am not even talking about the often criticized transfer AI - too many new signings get no appearances and get dumped next season, clubs signing players just for the sake of signing players...etc. Club vision? Good as a whole, but a vision of "spending as much budget as possible"? You must be kidding. Addition of new staff roles? I still remember I delegated the staff contract handling to the technical director just to find out that he only knew how to renew contracts without any intention to replace subpar staff members.

And now SI is boasting about the overhaul of press conferences? A side dish only which some of the players don't even want to bother with it. I don't think anyone is playing FM for the simulation of answering questions from press. I believe no one will be talking about this unless it goes as broken as the ever-overwhelming match shout. A nice end-of-season summary? Is UI improvement worth that spotlight?

 

[Viking]

In the "Sports Interactive and the Impact of Covid-19" Mr. Brock wrote:

Quote

We’ve been very quiet about future plans throughout this period, but then I never like us to talk about our plans until everything is definitively settled. I know that frustrates some of our fans, but it’s a policy that’s worked well for us in the 25+ years we’ve been making games. What I can confirm today is that, despite all the problems going on in the world, there will be new Football Manager games released later this year. They will be delivered a little later than we’d originally planned, but they’ll have exceptionally strong feature sets… albeit different to those we thought we’d settled on back in January when I completed my ‘dream feature set.

Is that reffering to the features already confirmed, something coming, or does it mean something completley different? English is'nt my first language.

Edited October 24, 2020 by Viking
I learned english from watching Monty Python.

[IrrelevantLion]

Can't wait for xG 

[Buffalo12]

Question: Is this the SI forums or the " I hate FM but spend my time complaining about it instead of simply not buying it and moving on with my life" forums?

[destmez]

8 hours ago, Buffalo12 said:

Question: Is this the SI forums or the " I hate FM but spend my time complaining about it instead of simply not buying it and moving on with my life" forums?

there is " Football Manager Feature Requests " but there are very few people, here we can discuss a lot more, watch for proof we have discussed during 24 pages 

you are very lucky if you past the page 1 in the feature forum

this is the " try to make fm better forum " 

Edited October 24, 2020 by destmez

[grasu]

4 hours ago, yolixeya said:

I agree. Players with most CA will likely have the best attributes. Yes, the player can have lower CA but good attrubute spread but for the most part better the CA,  you will have the better player potentially able to perform at multiple roles in the team.

However I don't agree with the rest of this post. It is oversimplification that isn't useful in any way. Player that has a long shot of 1 can still score a long range goal especially if other things are in his favour (his other attributes like composure, decisions, attributes of opposing defenders and GK, morale, weather conditions, if he is playing in a dominant team, etc). That doesn't mean that someone who is equally good player but has a better long shots wouldn't do better in his role if your tactical setup requires him to take long shots often.

So it makes sense to pay attention to their attributes. You can getaway without it if you have really strong team but you really miss out on the gems with lower CA but the right attribute spread and potentially lower wage demands who still perform on a world class level. Like if your anchorman has all the right attribues for that role but is average or below average in anything else does it really matter. I really don't think that the game just adds up attributes of one team and attributes of other team with some random factor and morale as you put it. Player roles and key and preferred attributes would be useless in that case. You could have just one rating for every player then.

That's the result of years of players never being consistent. All players feel the same, there's nothing truly distinctive about them. I remember, back in FM2007, I used to sign Freddy Guarin. He had 20 long shots, but was otherwise more or less useless. HOWEVER, when I slid the long shots slider all the way up the guy would CONSISTENTLY score 10-15 longs shots per season. Was that one dimensional? Sure, but it made players good at certain things, according to their stats. And it made playing against the AI more interesting because their star players preformed just like they should. That hasn't happened in FM in the last 10 years!

[Lexis]

I m still looking at the first page and there s a very big amount of people who are in agreement that this year s feature sets are extremely weak. Before the features were released, SI even went to priming us for big features by mentioning they ll have an exceptionally strong feature set.

Yet no comments from SI

I feel this is a huge slap in the face to us. The features currently announced can t be considered an "exceptionally strong" feature set by any possible bar. I would not even call them decent.

Edited October 24, 2020 by Lexis

[DMaster2]

1 ora fa, Viking ha scritto:

In the "Sports Interactive and the Impact of Covid-19" Mr. Brock wrote:

Is that reffering to the features already confirmed, something coming, or does it mean something completley different? English is'nt my first language.

I'm afraid he seriously thought that the media revamp and confettis are the "strong features"... Of course i hope they left something big for later, but honestly who can believe this.

[Lexis]

It would be tragic if they haven t fixed stamina, workrate and gegenpressing, something the community is barking at them for at least 2 seasons and they seem to be ignoring / missing it, despite it being obvious to any beta tester

[themadsheep2001]

1 minute ago, Lexis said:

It would be tragic if they haven t fixed stamina, workrate and gegenpressing, something the community is barking at them for at least 2 seasons and they seem to be ignoring / missing it, despite it being obvious to any beta tester

Beta testers don't fix things. They break things, test things and flag it

[Lexis]

Just now, themadsheep2001 said:

Beta testers don't fix things. They break things, test things and flag it

My point exactly. These are things that should be flagged and fixed. How are they still present after 2-3 years, hard to think, given how hard they influence the game

[themadsheep2001]

1 minute ago, Lexis said:

My point exactly. These are things that should be flagged and fixed. How are they still present after 2-3 years, hard to think, given how hard they influence the game

Everything goes into a list, and gets given a level of priority, along with how easy/hard it is to fix and the impact/balance it has elsewhere. And they work to that, and they will be best placed to know where to start

[FedAt]

23 hours ago, forameuss said:

Oh well, if they just have to "handle it" then I guess that just means it must be easy then. Brilliant.

You couldve just stopped at "i don't understand" really.

Well, they sell a product, for money, so yeah, different issues during development is their problems, and they have to handle it, whether it's easy or not.
And you don’t have to be rude, no one offended you, just because you don’t agree with other opinion doesn’t mean you have to be rude, so clearly you have to work on yourself)

[FedAt]

@Manjusaka what's your opinion on set pieces and training systems, do you satisfied with it? Do you use set pieces editor? and in general i'm wonder how many people use set pieces editor and are pleased with it

[Lexis]

38 minutes ago, themadsheep2001 said:

Everything goes into a list, and gets given a level of priority, along with how easy/hard it is to fix and the impact/balance it has elsewhere. And they work to that, and they will be best placed to know where to start

Yes sir, I am quite familiar with the process. Personal opinion, but I would be very disappointed if reskinning press conferences was prioritized above fixing such a critical ME issue. Does look like I m not the only one thinking that

[themadsheep2001]

16 minutes ago, Lexis said:

Yes sir, I am quite familiar with the process. Personal opinion, but I would be very disappointed if reskinning press conferences was prioritized above fixing such a critical ME issue. Does look like I m not the only one thinking that

If you're familiar with the process then you'll know the ME has it's own dedicated team, and doesn't compete for priority against non ME items

[Lexis]

4 minutes ago, themadsheep2001 said:

If you're familiar with the process then you'll know the ME has it's own dedicated team, and doesn't compete for priority against non ME items

It depends. There might be interplay with how the attribute system works. Don t think we know the whole aspect.

[themadsheep2001]

4 minutes ago, Lexis said:

It depends. There might be interplay with how the attribute system works. Don t think we know the whole aspect.

To be clear, press conferences will have nothing to do with, nor conflict with, the priority of an ME item. So people don't need to worry about that

[Lexis]

Just now, themadsheep2001 said:

To be clear, press conferences will have nothing to do with, nor conflict with, the priority of an ME item. 

I understand. But if the ME item interplays with systems outside of ME, I imagine at that point the other team is needed as well.

[Manjusaka]

9 分钟前, FedAt说:

@Manjusaka what's your opinion on set pieces and training systems, do you satisfied with it? Do you use set pieces editor? and in general i'm wonder how many people use set pieces editor and are pleased with it

In this regard I agree with SI that set-pieces should not be the prime focus at the moment but my reason is that the open play has so many things that need to be fixed first. I am satisfied with it as long as players follow the set-piece instructions and set-piece goals remain at a realistic ratio. Of course I will be happier if multiple set-ups can be implemented simultaneously, and if set-piece duties can be automatically assigned according to attributes so that you don't need to worry about messing up the set-piece set-up by replacing a tall player with a short one on the formation board. I believe there is a need for a better set piece editor in the long run though as in real life there are teams which really drill on it a lot.

The training system in the current state is at least quite aesthetically pleasing. I don't expect the training system to have a substantial effect on player development so I cannot say I am not satisfied. In terms of player development I am more concerned about the mechanics of new position development, lack of character of youth academy and the player trait system.

[Rashidi]

29 minutes ago, Lexis said:

Yes sir, I am quite familiar with the process. Personal opinion, but I would be very disappointed if reskinning press conferences was prioritized above fixing such a critical ME issue. Does look like I m not the only one thinking that

The match engine has its own dedicated team, each module in the game has its own dedicated team. Focusing on the press conference does not reduce the priority of other aspects of development. I could ask the project lead to come in and here and his answer will also be the same. I don't think its a good time for me to go ask them too, because they are after all prioritising development work at the moment. 

[Lexis]

1 minute ago, Rashidi said:

The match engine has its own dedicated team, each module in the game has its own dedicated team. Focusing on the press conference does not reduce the priority of other aspects of development. I could ask the project lead to come in and here and his answer will also be the same. I don't think its a good time for me to go ask them too, because they are after all prioritising development work at the moment. 

I m not sure how granular teams are we talking about. If there s a specific training module team, why are we sometimes seeing very few if any changes to the training system? I imagine there s some sort of segregation, but Im not sure if it s per module. Would be interesting for them to share this with us

[ParanoidBuddha]

I am happy that now we can throw the bottles on our players but......

Will serie A finally have the right taxation for staff and players wages? As a serie A fan I don't want to play another year with many inflated gross wages.

Edited October 24, 2020 by ParanoidBuddha

[isignedupfornorealreason]

20 hours ago, Double0Seven said:

It's illegal.

It's not.

I do think it is very important to stress that grey market and unofficial market suppliers are very much legal. If a store buys from German/East European (or wherever) keys and sells them elsewhere, that is perfectly legal.

People have conflated them with Key market resellers - the ones that use credit card frauds etc, places like G2A and Kinguin - you'll know who they are because you're buying from individuals not from an actual store.

Key shops are otherwise above board believe it or not.

[-Jef-]

29 minutes ago, isignedupfornorealreason said:

It's not.

I do think it is very important to stress that grey market and unofficial market suppliers are very much legal. If a store buys from German/East European (or wherever) keys and sells them elsewhere, that is perfectly legal.

People have conflated them with Key market resellers - the ones that use credit card frauds etc, places like G2A and Kinguin - you'll know who they are because you're buying from individuals not from an actual store.

Key shops are otherwise above board believe it or not.

And yet, we cannot guarantee that cdkeys, g2a, kinguin are not selling stolen keys or using CC fraud. While it's not illegal - it also may not be legal.

Edited October 24, 2020 by rosque

[destmez]

18 minutes ago, rosque said:

And yet, we cannot guarantee that cdkeys, g2a, kinguin are not selling stolen keys or using CC fraud. While it's not illegal - it also may not be legal.

ok ok ok its ok i didnt buy FM21 for now ,i will buy it later 😒😓

[forameuss]

4 hours ago, FedAt said:

Well, they sell a product, for money, so yeah, different issues during development is their problems, and they have to handle it, whether it's easy or not.
And you don’t have to be rude, no one offended you, just because you don’t agree with other opinion doesn’t mean you have to be rude, so clearly you have to work on yourself)

You're very welcome to have your own opinion, everyone is.  Just like everyone else is welcome to challenge you on it.  The right to express your opinion doesn't protect you from that.  If I said something demonstrably wrong, I'd expect to be picked up on it.

[Double0Seven]

3 hours ago, isignedupfornorealreason said:

It's not.

I do think it is very important to stress that grey market and unofficial market suppliers are very much legal. If a store buys from German/East European (or wherever) keys and sells them elsewhere, that is perfectly legal.

People have conflated them with Key market resellers - the ones that use credit card frauds etc, places like G2A and Kinguin - you'll know who they are because you're buying from individuals not from an actual store.

Key shops are otherwise above board believe it or not.

Ok but still doesn't seem like a normal to me. If they are legal, why not apply to become an official seller and be listed as one? 

I wouldn't buy there, but that's me. 

[Double0Seven]

https://www.reddit.com/r/footballmanagergames/comments/jh5dyh/phil_jones_paris_saintgermain

Heres another example of the ME needing fixing. Someone plays Phil Jones as striker and he's top scorer. While putting in the most minimal effort tactics wise. 

Even though it's a funny thing to do, the ME should punish this very hard. Phil Jones isn't a striker. Certainly not a top scoring one. 

I hope this isn't possible anymore in 2021.

 

 

[grade]

33 minutes ago, forameuss said:

You're very welcome to have your own opinion, everyone is.  Just like everyone else is welcome to challenge you on it.  The right to express your opinion doesn't protect you from that.  If I said something demonstrably wrong, I'd expect to be picked up on it.

Yeah I agree with that. Too bad sometimes most criticisms are brush to side... but Gods forbid the other way around happens... it is like the Sky is Falling.

 

[KloppRodgersHodgson]

15 hours ago, FedAt said:

@Manjusaka what's your opinion on set pieces and training systems, do you satisfied with it? Do you use set pieces editor? and in general i'm wonder how many people use set pieces editor and are pleased with it

I tend to not use set piece editor as it feels too easy to exploit, corners in particular.