Jump to content
Sports Interactive Community

Recommended Posts

Posted (edited)

I think in a season where you're favourites for the title, and breaking a defensive record in that season but not actually winning the title should tell you that there's a bit of a worry when going forward. But from the face value it's not like i'm dreadful at scoring goals. But i'm just really good at scoring in one or two parts of the game but awful in the rest. This season 10 matches in i'm actually the top of the league in scoring (I've played 3 of them while experimenting another tactic, scoring 7 goals within those games), however I've scored over a third of them from corners. Actually, in the last 35 domestic  games (so matches where I'm the favourite 90% of the time), I've only scored 38 non-corner goals a game, which is just over a goal a game, which i think is pretty worrying for a team that should is as good as mine. And of those 38 goals, 17 are from crosses. Maybe i'm overreacting but i have a feeling that I really can only rely on two ways to get a goal

When you aren't scoring goals, you have to analyse how you're doing going forward (i'll use last season as example since I played all 38 games with the tactic i'm going to ask to be reviewed later), so the first question is if you're actually creating chances, which is yes, top of the league in chances created and most games i have around 20 shots. Next, is if you're getting shots on target, the answer being yes, top in the league in both the amount of shots on target (the amount i can't recall sadly as i'm now in the next season) and shots on target % which was just over 50%. Finally, it's if you're converting these shots on target, which is no, being second to last in the league in conversion rate with approximately 7%. Next we're going to analyse these shots, for this i'll use a run of 8 games, where I've won 2, drawn 6, and only scored in 3 with only 4 goals scored (one an own goal, one a cross, one an open goal rebound and one a cutback pass to a player just inside the box). This is the streak that caused me to drop the lead in the title race and it's due to the lack of goals. I'll now post pictures of how we shot in those games:

3DF07781651159A7A10F869AE94D5A1FC78A66FA (1920×1080)

6524093E631E9B47967D115213A4423E45BE5BE1 (1920×1080)

B6776A7C54154FE31B66B2D137CB27720EF7C4D4 (1920×1080)

1663BC8AC70A3B5D5381C4CD15F1A7A8D93D28EF (1920×1080)

F25436B0518C070F7F0AA5012C0197D7CDEBBC70 (1920×1080)

5E16E6CA8CC512A552B00F3984E651A2A9323495 (1920×1080)

B716C346D2D0F1A74AF2BE9940CEDE9A46244DB5 (1920×1080)

F57802EC68C41E97E43BA27BEFA1353A37C254D5 (1920×1080)

From these matches, most of these shots are in easier areas to score from. So it's not the case as if we're over shooting from outside the box. Though this is without context as in whether it's from a set piece or the shots are while the forward isn't under pressure.

Before we go into the tactics, we'll take a look through the players you'd expect to be scoring the most from open play, the first 4 will be my first choice players, who'd start most games. 

74B343F53857476D3B120BBF6C7DE24AA0A7A355 (1920×1080)

B22A784217FB05E3C6C03B0309F5630FDBA5E179 (1920×1080)

CF60B6D8B2891B71B87E5657555584F654CC3E2B (1920×1080)

5188C1099FCA3A2621F1F09ACB9F8654616DAE36 (1920×1080)

A6D01023A8C14DE641AFCF8208473CD83AA5144B (1920×1080)

C8D6F82B0F7D2AD9512018EBDCAC0E1509298423 (1920×1080)

3A5A14A01D62D7C3BFBDBB2B127C42CFCAD42DD1 (1920×1080)

FE6E995F085EA846CAFE975F40C34E52E28BF4FB (1920×1080)

7F051BD1C89D3E712FB61E562F48F066A859C282 (1920×1080)

Might not be amazing but I don't think they're bad players (if they actually are though, please let me know). Now here's the tactic:

D09F3C6484950873FF0E9A0DA4935905EC80D95E (1920×1080)

I've made some tweaks to it, originally this tactic had a positive mentality had a BBM instead of a CM(a) and instead of having prevent short GK distribution I didn't have that and instead done a split block with the 4 most attacking players. I also tried using the offside trap, standard passing with higher tempo or shorter passing with standard tempo, WBiB along with Be more expressive etc. but it yielded the same results. So i feel like this tactic needs some tweaking so i can improve in open play. Help would be appreciated.

Edited by Jaydenoren

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

The tactic itself does not look bad at all. But if you are a top team in your league - and Rangers are the best in Scotland along with Celtic - I fear this tactic is a bit too unambitious, especially if you are struggling to break down defensive opposition and score from open play (as opposed to set pieces). In other words, rather than changing too much, I assume a couple of tweaks should suffice.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
19 minutes ago, Experienced Defender said:

The tactic itself does not look bad at all. But if you are a top team in your league - and Rangers are the best in Scotland along with Celtic - I fear this tactic is a bit too unambitious, especially if you are struggling to break down defensive opposition and score from open play (as opposed to set pieces). In other words, rather than changing too much, I assume a couple of tweaks should suffice.

Always had problems in this game being over-ambitious but this is a first. Thanks for the reply, may i ask what tweaks you'd suggest?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

My suggestion is that you have to go get the ball. This match engine does seem to favour aggression and urgency, but even ignoring the match engine, a superior team should be doing all they can to go get the ball from their opponents. If you don't, then they'll waste time and limit your opportunities to score. Higher mentality, more attack duties, more urgent pressing, countering, and even getting stuck in should help you force the play a bit more.

I would also switch FB(a) to WB(a) and seek to switch that DLP to a more exciting RPM or AP role.

Edited by Overmars

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 hours ago, Jaydenoren said:

may i ask what tweaks you'd suggest?

Without sufficient knowledge about your players, any potential suggestion could be misleading, especially when it comes to roles and duties. For example, I don't know if your RB is good enough to play as an IWB on support duty, which can be a very useful role behind a winger and attacking CM. Or do you have a midfielder who is good enough to play as a mezzala on attack duty? When I say "good enough", I am referring to player attributes, not the role suitability circle.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

I am a bit confused as to why Sleight that 19 year old striker is not starting for you? For me he looks clearly better than the other striker posted.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, Experienced Defender said:

Without sufficient knowledge about your players, any potential suggestion could be misleading, especially when it comes to roles and duties. For example, I don't know if your RB is good enough to play as an IWB on support duty, which can be a very useful role behind a winger and attacking CM. Or do you have a midfielder who is good enough to play as a mezzala on attack duty? When I say "good enough", I am referring to player attributes, not the role suitability circle.

IWB has always seemed great for my tactic but I've been to scared to use as the reasons you've mentioned. Here are my RBs.

89F57AE8FB69B14346559AB4B5D6B83D3FEF5248 (1920×1080)

C8F16C58F64E168B0A2F26F3F16A40BC5257BC3F (1920×1080)

 As for the question if the players are good enough for the Mezzala role. Here's the rest of my midfielders (as 2 has already been showed in the original post)

C6515B02AE78F197F7494E21FC294AA2C26C54B7 (1920×1080)

F87F12EABCD9E267901C23E5793A95DB0739380B (1920×1080)

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
3 minutes ago, Zendahl said:

I am a bit confused as to why Sleight that 19 year old striker is not starting for you? For me he looks clearly better than the other striker posted.

Hes great and has been playing well. It's just my bias towards players grown through the academy (which Kelly is). Sleight joined just this season. Both have been good, i'd even say that they're options 1a and 1b rather than 1 and 2.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
31 minutes ago, Overmars said:

My suggestion is that you have to go get the ball. This match engine does seem to favour aggression and urgency, but even ignoring the match engine, a superior team should be doing all they can to go get the ball from their opponents. If you don't, then they'll waste time and limit your opportunities to score. Higher mentality, more attack duties, more urgent pressing, countering, and even getting stuck in should help you force the play a bit more.

I would also switch FB(a) to WB(a) and seek to switch that DLP to a more exciting RPM or AP role.

I've always thought wing backs on attack would be risky unless you're using truly world class players. would it be too aggresive?

I'm happy with the DLP (9 out of 10 times they're the best performers for me) but the more attacking playmakers is definitely something to think about.

Edited by Jaydenoren

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)
3 minutes ago, Jaydenoren said:

Hes great and has been playing well. It's just my bias towards players grown through the academy (which Kelly is). Sleight joined just this season. Both have been good, i'd even say that they're options 1a and 1b rather than 1 and 2.

well, as your problem is that you can't, just taking a look at the attributes of the two players it would appear Sleight is significantly better and that shows on his goalscoring record, 6 in 10 starts i think it was compared to Kelly's 5 in 16.. to me there is a clear option 1 and option 2, i would keep ahold of Kelly as a backup but nothing more

Edited by Zendahl

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
9 minutes ago, Zendahl said:

well, as your problem is that you can't, just taking a look at the attributes of the two players it would appear Sleight is significantly better and that shows on his goalscoring record, 6 in 10 starts i think it was compared to Kelly's 5 in 16.. to me there is a clear option 1 and option 2, i would keep ahold of Kelly as a backup but nothing more

i guess you're right, just hope both can develop. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Maybe you could try Baynes as IWB on support. He is not perfect, but might do the job. 

Maguire should work nicely as a mezzala on attack  (instead of the CM on attack). Mwanza looks okay, but not as suitable as Maguire. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Take all of the following with a pinch of salt as I am in no way a tactical genius, and I play an entirely different tactical system to yours.

Firstly for a strong team in any league a positive / balanced mentality isn't conducive to scoring lots of goals. My default mentality is Very Attacking but I play with 5 at the back and defend very narrow to try remain defensively solid. 

When it comes to the games and chances created that are not crosses, are they from bad angles / long distance and go wide? Or are they on target and get blocked by defenders. Also in most games are you in total control and just can't score? Or are the games close? Because if you are dominating, a defensive midfielder might be a wasted position in terms of production, even if he is getting a good rating (because he's playing David Batty passes 5 yards under no pressure). You can either throw a second striker in to give your players another target to aim for in the box with crosses, or put a central attacking midfielder in to give a run from deep / cut back option. It depends on the options and abilities of your players.

If you are good at crossing / corners, have you looked at long throw routines? As a way to capitalise at getting the ball into the box from another direction.

Instructions to play wider / look for overlaps / increased passing tempo, are all options that look to move the ball quickly, and try force the opposition to have to spread out more if they want to take the ball off you. 

Experiment (as you say you have been doing) its your tactic and your squad you have the most information available, watch the game (if you can) on extended highlights to see what your players are actually doing on the pitch compared to what you want them to do. Do you have players getting in each others way? Is there unexploited space on the pitch over and over again that you don't take advantage of because your instructions have the ball going elsewhere? Do your players have the physical / mental stats to either get up and down the pitch like you want them to, or find that key pass that is going unlock defences?

 

Using my tactic as an example, I had a vertical tiki-taka system with ultra high engagement and extreme pressing, my 1st season we got stuffed late on in most games because we didn't have the natural fitness / teamwork or workrate required to get around the pitch and put the fear into the other team. 

The aim of the tactic was to have as few passes per shot at goal as possible, and for that I felt I had to play more direct passing, to get the ball up the pitch faster, but I was just hoofing it long and losing out and turning over possession. I slowly brought the passing directness down and we now play on the lowest "shorter" passing. We still switch play, or my ball playing defenders play long looping through balls but it's a lot more controlled and conducive to being effective. I only learned these things by watching the match engine.

Hope this helps 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

A little improvement, but still inconsistent with the scoring

6E29A2409CD63E798BE30F147E007737407AC076 (1920×1080)

3D8F0F9ABAEC793BCA9836AF577C52E333E5959C (1920×1080)

C80EBC9A330ECA1295A02290B51B0D18360AA715 (1920×1080)

My new tactic: 

B3B4C3E603F65059E9FDE31A0CB15B74593AE60E (1920×1080)

Also tried using shorter passing without WBiB. 

 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
2 minutes ago, Jaydenoren said:

B3B4C3E603F65059E9FDE31A0CB15B74593AE60E (1920×1080)

Quick tips:

- remove the higher tempo

- remove the take short kicks (distribution) and add the Distribute to CBs and FBs instead

- remove both higher line of engagement and more urgent pressing and apply the split block (involving the striker, both wide forwards and mezzala) instead

- remove the Counter team instruction

- try PF on attack duty instead of the DLFat and IWsu instead of IFsu in AML

- experiment with the LB as WB on attack duty instead of FB on attack (but be careful)

Report back if you've noticed any improvement (or maybe deterioration).

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

Just looking at some of those player's attributes and I wouldn't say they have particularly good attributes in terms of finishing, long shots etc..

In the example of your CMA, Spencer Stainsby, he has 6 for finishing and 9 for long shots. When I first saw him I thought he was a defensive minded player but he's your CM getting into the box to try and score.

I'm looking at the Ross County game in particular where you won 1-0. You seem to have created plenty of chances but 11 were off target and 9 were saved. You sure it's a tactical problem and not a personnel problem?

Edited by TheGoodRebel

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Posted (edited)

From those players posted only the wonderkid seems likely to score on a consistent basis. It's fairly poor for a team like Rangers which is expected to dominate most games domestically.

I'd have the striker with high finishing play as close to goal as possible (with how much depending on his movement and pace) and have players providing him more quality chances. I would not use him in a creator/striker role such as a DLF but make him a focal point of attacks.

On a 442 he'd be an AF or a Poacher partned with a less offensive role and in a 433 I guess i'd try him as an AF or PF-A opening space for a IF or an IW cutting in and perhaps a winger on the other side. Overlaps would be very important in this setup so it's key to find the right tempo for the whole system to work.

Edited by afailed10

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 15/06/2020 at 21:59, TheGoodRebel said:

Just looking at some of those player's attributes and I wouldn't say they have particularly good attributes in terms of finishing, long shots etc..

In the example of your CMA, Spencer Stainsby, he has 6 for finishing and 9 for long shots. When I first saw him I thought he was a defensive minded player but he's your CM getting into the box to try and score.

I'm looking at the Ross County game in particular where you won 1-0. You seem to have created plenty of chances but 11 were off target and 9 were saved. You sure it's a tactical problem and not a personnel problem?

It might've possibly been, but then again finances weren't amazing so it was hard to improve the team (e.g Sleight took out nearly the whole budget). Since switching to the tactic ED given me however there's been an improvement and we've had a takeover since then. A little bit of problems here and there of course but we're on the right direction. 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...