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Football Manager 2020 January & February Transfer Updates Feedback Thread

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21 hours ago, zyfon5 said:

some things that have helped me to understand tactics more including watching some tactical analysis videos and reading some books about football in general. other than that watch some football matches and try to analyze how they play urself using the tactical knowledge u have. it will gradually come with experience.

Unfortunately I don't have much tactical knowledge, despite watching football all my life. Mostly just watched it from an entertainment perspective, never really focused on the tactics. 

16 hours ago, Zemahh said:

If you don't mind playing through seasons at slower pace, my first advice would be to watch more of the highlights. You can set highlights to Full for first 15 minutes of the match, which should help you spot any glaring issues, and then switch to Comprehensive. Watch them at slow speed and rewind problematic things you notice, but aren't exactly sure why they happened.

For example, let's say you notice your Full-Back passing the ball straight to the opposition. Rewind the action (upper right corner) and try to find out why his pass got intercepted. Did he have enough passing options in close range, or is the winger in front of him bombing forward too quickly, meaning he has no short passing options? Did he take too many touches before getting closed down, which could mean your tempo is too low vs. the opposition' closing down urgency? Is he instructed to attempt risky passes? Or is it his attributes and he's just bad at passing or assessing his options? Then write these things down, look at your tactic and see how you could improve them. Make sure you're only fixing things that are actually problematic though (repeating pattern during 2-3 matches), you don't want to constantly make changes to your tactic, which could make players struggle to find their rhythm and create a problem in itself. Sometimes things just come down to your opposition having better players or system that is a natural counter to yours.

You obviously learn the most by watching matches and seeing how changes affect things on the go, but if you prefer to play at faster pace, I suggest briefly checking the Analysis screen after every game. Firstly the Summary section, which should point out any glaring issues, such as your GK making a mistake leading to goal, winger not connecting a single cross or your striker fluffing all of his chances, and then the Team/Player section, where you can filter down for all kinds of things. Some of the more common ones:

  • Passes/Key Passes/Crosses Completed: from which areas did the opposition threaten you the most?
  • Passes Intercepted: who lost possession the most?
  • Pass Received/Touches: is there a player that isn't getting as much of the ball as you imagined?
  • Heat Maps: are you enjoying possession close to your opposition's goal, or is it mostly non-threatening, in your own half?
  • Shots: are you shooting from dangerous areas (centrally, inside the 6-yard box) often enough? If you're Rashidi's Patreon, you probably already watched it, but he made a video specifically for this topic.
  • Fouls Made: is a certain player having issues controlling his area that could use more support defensively?

Also worth mentioning are the Analysis -> Goals -> Assist Locations/Goal Types and league's Team Detailed screens, which can help you spot issues such as constantly conceding assists from one area, or just not scoring enough goals for your media prediction/board expectation. That then gets you started on which areas of your tactic are problematic.

Great post mate, I'll bookmark this.

12 hours ago, Kingstontom88 said:

For new players or those who aren't great at tactics, obviously the presets make sense. But if the game takes a turn as soon as you deviate from them, what is the point for experienced players? It essentially becomes plug and play, which is dull in my view.

I have not, in any previous edition, encountered the mind-numbing frustrations as I have in FM20 from an ME perspective. I see all these advisory tips on here and those saying 'what issues?' - well done to all of them, but I have been through the mill and out the other side and nothing changes. Not only that, I watch highlights of other games regularly and the goals are repetitive, defensive behaviours are woeful.etc

I think it's in poor shape, and I will wait for feedback on next year's BETA before I even consider buying.

Yeah mate you are entitled to your opinion. If you feel that way then as you say, maybe wait and see how FM 21 is shaping up before buying. 

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On 04/05/2020 at 06:42, zyfon5 said:

With so many free kicks and fouls commited, I'm not surprised that u actually created so many shots. Was there actual real football being played? And from the sheer amount of headers and low number of passes by the more dominant side I'm pretty sure both sides are just trying to hoof the ball to each other. Is this by any chance a plug and play tactic?

No it's not a plug and play tactic, it's one I created myself based on Hassenhutl's 4-2-2-2 system.  The lack of passes is a ME engine problem, not a tactic problem. 

There is no hoofball in my system and no hoofball is played, the overall instructions are shorter passing.  The fouls and the lack of passing for Spurs is because of the intense press, it's actually an example of it working for once, probably because Spurs didn't have a defensive mentality in that game as they are similar reputation.

Often poor teams will have loads of possession and passes, despite being under constant pressure because they play 4-5-1 or 5-4-1 very defensive systems and stupidly manage to pass it around at the back under constant press but don't actually go anywhere, again because of the flaws of how the ME engine works. 

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45 minutes ago, tajj7 said:

No it's not a plug and play tactic, it's one I created myself based on Hassenhutl's 4-2-2-2 system.  The lack of passes is a ME engine problem, not a tactic problem. 

There is no hoofball in my system and no hoofball is played, the overall instructions are shorter passing.  The fouls and the lack of passing for Spurs is because of the intense press, it's actually an example of it working for once, probably because Spurs didn't have a defensive mentality in that game as they are similar reputation.

Often poor teams will have loads of possession and passes, despite being under constant pressure because they play 4-5-1 or 5-4-1 very defensive systems and stupidly manage to pass it around at the back under constant press but don't actually go anywhere, again because of the flaws of how the ME engine works. 

Hi both teams have low number of passes but the more dominant side has less than 10 passes per shot is it really a ME problem? The AI can play whatever they like to get a result but the team that is very likely controlled by a human player choose to play a tactic that can generate one shot with less than 10 passes and proceed to complain that it is a problem of the ME. Please explain to me the logic behind it.

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52 minutes ago, tajj7 said:

No it's not a plug and play tactic, it's one I created myself based on Hassenhutl's 4-2-2-2 system.  The lack of passes is a ME engine problem, not a tactic problem. 

There is no hoofball in my system and no hoofball is played, the overall instructions are shorter passing.  The fouls and the lack of passing for Spurs is because of the intense press, it's actually an example of it working for once, probably because Spurs didn't have a defensive mentality in that game as they are similar reputation.

Often poor teams will have loads of possession and passes, despite being under constant pressure because they play 4-5-1 or 5-4-1 very defensive systems and stupidly manage to pass it around at the back under constant press but don't actually go anywhere, again because of the flaws of how the ME engine works. 

If the AI feels that u are giving pressure to them of course they will try to keep the ball in possession. Why? U want the AI to give the ball to u so that u can score against them? Or u want the AI to be able to easily counter attack with one ball over the top? Wait a second. Is it what ppl complained about initial release of the game?

So tell me if u are so smart what should the AI do when they face high pressing? 

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Posted (edited)
52 minutes ago, zyfon5 said:

If the AI feels that u are giving pressure to them of course they will try to keep the ball in possession. Why? U want the AI to give the ball to u so that u can score against them? Or u want the AI to be able to easily counter attack with one ball over the top? Wait a second. Is it what ppl complained about initial release of the game?

So tell me if u are so smart what should the AI do when they face high pressing? 

Play smart short/medium passes into space to start proper counter runs. Problem is attacking teams can hold ball too well in attack and defending team can hold ball too well under pressure. First touches maybe over tuned, passes are too precise. Physical aspect is lacking and players usage of speed when pressing is poor.

Edited by Pasonen

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1 minute ago, Pasonen said:

Play smart short/medium passes into space to start proper counter runs. Problem is attacking teams can hold pressure too well and defending team can hold ball too well under pressure. First touches maybe over tuned, passes are too precise. Physical aspect is lacking and players usage of speed when pressing is poor.

Yeah it would be the ideal solution but balancing it will be very tough. If u allow teams to play around the press too easily, then u essentially nerfed high pressing which I don't think will be a good representation of current football. There is a reason why gegenpress become sort of an OP tactic after fm19. I still rmb from when I played fm18 it is very difficult to implement a high pressing system bcz the AI can very easily do what u have suggested above. Can u elaborate on what do u mean first touch are a bit overtuned? Other things I might not agree with u but everyone has their own different views on these perception things so I will not argue on that one

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2 minutes ago, zyfon5 said:

Yeah it would be the ideal solution but balancing it will be very tough. If u allow teams to play around the press too easily, then u essentially nerfed high pressing which I don't think will be a good representation of current football. There is a reason why gegenpress become sort of an OP tactic after fm19. I still rmb from when I played fm18 it is very difficult to implement a high pressing system bcz the AI can very easily do what u have suggested above. Can u elaborate on what do u mean first touch are a bit overtuned? Other things I might not agree with u but everyone has their own different views on these perception things so I will not argue on that one

After thinking it more problem is  accuracy of passes under pressure and because passes are too perfect they are too easy control. Even under no pressure made passes are not nearly allways perfect in real life. How many times you see ball bouncing before player takes it in control in fm? Not so many? Not ever? 

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Posted (edited)

I know ball movement can be also animation thing and players losing ball should show poor pass animation or poor first touch animation before that happens. But it cant be just that.

Now I stop. Its feedback post ;)

Edited by Pasonen

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Posted (edited)

it was a woodwork record before, for now its record of clear chances. I dont remember so many missed chances in official games ever (I mean a number which FM identificate as 'clear chance' because some chances are ignored). And this is euro cup vs team where are players cost for 15 mln euro for a second

Poor defence vs poor finishing - not a cocktail which really want to drink :) 

Спойлер

557159552_Image1.thumb.png.fcfe94b78679767ee522534ff49c7dfc.png

 

Edited by Novem9

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Posted (edited)
8 minutes ago, Novem9 said:

it was a woodwork record before, for now its record of clear chances. I dont remember so many missed chances in official games ever (I mean a number which FM identificate as 'clear chance' because some chances are ignored). And this is euro cup vs team where are players cost for 15 mln euro for a second

Poor defence vs poor finishing - not a cocktail which really want to drink :) 

  Reveal hidden contents

557159552_Image1.thumb.png.fcfe94b78679767ee522534ff49c7dfc.png

 

Haha. Damn.. you got fm'd :/. Send me .pkm I would like to see it.  If its ok.

Edited by Pasonen

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I think the preset tactics are a good addition to the game. It helps tactically challenged players (myself included) who don't have the time/desire to analyse every game played so as to get a successful passing game going. I'm sure it's pretty useful to newcomers by providing a framework of what instructions complement each other, which ones don't etc.

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3 минуты назад, Pasonen сказал:

Haha. Damn.. you got fm'd :/. Send me .pkm I would like to see it.  If its ok.

Dynamo Kyiv - Feyenoord.pkm

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5 minuti fa, Pasonen ha scritto:

Haha. Damn.. you got fm'd :/

Technically he wasn't. He still managed to win the game :lol:

Or was he Dynamo? :(

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1 минуту назад, Federico сказал:

Technically he wasn't. He still managed to win the game :lol:

its true :p but feeling almost the same :D 

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9 minutes ago, Federico said:

Technically he wasn't. He still managed to win the game :lol:

Or was he Dynamo? :(

Oops. :D

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On 10/05/2020 at 12:27, zyfon5 said:

of course the ME is not perfect and has bugs. i also encountered them. but when u have ppl claiming something like AI strikers are performing like normal and their strikers are nerfed without any evidence, are u not frustrated? 

I dont know what kind of evidence you want, People have been putting up stuff in Bugs forum, where conversion rate for human is lower than AI. Bugs forum is full of people putting up screenshot of players awful finishing. I had a discussion with you and you couldnt answer that "When 1vs1 , Should the tactic really matter?" 

I can see that you want to defend the game at any cost but they should also let you know that reporting BUGS WONT HELP because they wont release an update. You should also let other people discuss without jumping in with your "Fault with your tactic" "Fault with your setup"

248042798_Skrmbild(1318).thumb.png.050a8cf1291a693a1d60b9717a48371c.png1827967326_Skrmbild(1319).thumb.png.0efaf98436e0d15b09968263d8ad9cdc.png824318080_Skrmbild(1321).thumb.png.d9b3597cd691a8320cabc6c176110722.png962224263_Skrmbild(1320).thumb.png.590ed7436bb99ad89fa1214d8994bead.png1878738615_Skrmbild(1282).thumb.png.78a1d6e287bb44cce83ee0f83a02bd30.png1312210653_Skrmbild(1317).thumb.png.615e0b2bf24c2afa134d3c49f56ebd74.png

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Posted (edited)

Just because a team had a lot of shots to show on some spreadsheet come the final whistle it needn't be "FM'd".

Mind you, Just an ado, I hate that term. May not be the case here, but 9/10 it's used in the completely wrong way, in particular as there are so many AI approaches that aren't fussed about winning the shot on a spreadsheet battle an inch. That the human Player doesn't take them in that misguided belief that Football was a sports of who had more shots on a spreadsheet come the final whistle blown doesn't make it better.

 

 

Edited by Svenc

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28 минут назад, Pasonen сказал:

Oops. :D

fm'd! :D

185527475_Image3.thumb.png.f9608962f49c4185cc3702c048439f0a.png

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4 minutes ago, Svenc said:

Just because a team had a lot of shots to show on some spreadsheet come the final whistle it needn't be "FM'd".

Mind you, Just an ado, I hate that term. May not be the case here, but 9/10 it's used in the completely wrong way, in particular as there are so many AI approaches that aren't fussed about winning the shot on a spreadsheet battle an inch. That the human Player doesn't take them in that misguided belief that Football was a sports of who had more shots on a spreadsheet come the final whistle blown doesn't make it better.

 

 

This is not really about amount of shots that determinate if you should lose or win. IT IS ABOUT THE CHANCES that you see in match engine, chance your players miss and opposition players take. I have only control over tactic to get the player 1v1 vs Goalkeeper then i dont have any control.  or you want to say that ME doesnt represent the actual situatoin of the match. I am assuming that my team is better my watch what ME is showing me.

the twitter thread, those things happens 2-3 times a season, not 2-3 per month

If this happened against me , i would never complain that i lost. 

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Posted (edited)
19 минут назад, sverige91 сказал:

I dont know what kind of evidence you want, People have been putting up stuff in Bugs forum, where conversion rate for human is lower than AI. Bugs forum is full of people putting up screenshot of players awful finishing. I had a discussion with you and you couldnt answer that "When 1vs1 , Should the tactic really matter?" 

I can see that you want to defend the game at any cost but they should also let you know that reporting BUGS WONT HELP because they wont release an update. You should also let other people discuss without jumping in with your "Fault with your tactic" "Fault with your setup"

248042798_Skrmbild(1318).thumb.png.050a8cf1291a693a1d60b9717a48371c.png1827967326_Skrmbild(1319).thumb.png.0efaf98436e0d15b09968263d8ad9cdc.png824318080_Skrmbild(1321).thumb.png.d9b3597cd691a8320cabc6c176110722.png962224263_Skrmbild(1320).thumb.png.590ed7436bb99ad89fa1214d8994bead.png1878738615_Skrmbild(1282).thumb.png.78a1d6e287bb44cce83ee0f83a02bd30.png1312210653_Skrmbild(1317).thumb.png.615e0b2bf24c2afa134d3c49f56ebd74.png

Well you use plug-n-play tactic right? This is not the same imo. Usually they use extra pressure and extra high lines, unbalanced roles/duties etc. So its difficult to criticize ME in this way
I use my own tactic and try to play realistic + change it for own players.

Wnen you use own tactic game looks more realistic and beauty :kriss:

Edited by Novem9

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Just now, Novem9 said:

Well you use plug-n-play tactic right? This is not the same imo. Usually they use extra pressure and extra high lines, unbalanced roles/duties etc.
I use my own tactic and try to play realistic + change it for own players.

Wnen you use own tactic game looks more realistic and beauty :kriss:

I am not really talking about losing here and i am talking about taking chances, when the player is 1vs1 , Tactic doesnt matter. Do we specify how a striker should finish? We can only buy striker with good finishing and hope for the best. About those chances are converted by AI with lesser good players

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19 minutes ago, Novem9 said:

fm'd! :D

185527475_Image3.thumb.png.f9608962f49c4185cc3702c048439f0a.png

I jinxed it. ^_^

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14 minutes ago, Novem9 said:

Well you use plug-n-play tactic right? This is not the same imo. Usually they use extra pressure and extra high lines, unbalanced roles/duties etc. So its difficult to criticize ME in this way
I use my own tactic and try to play realistic + change it for own players.

Wnen you use own tactic game looks more realistic and beauty :kriss:

I use my own tactic and the game looks terrible. My 1st season in The Prem with Weymouth and some of the defending I've seen is ridiculous. Mistake after mistake after mistake. Easily preventable mistakes too. In 12 games I've conceded 7 penalties. 7!!!! I've conceded 4 goals from corners where a player has 'missed' a header. It's getting boring now. Add on to that that my striker hasn't scored yet. 

Vukan Tintor_ Attributes.png

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20 minutes ago, sverige91 said:

This is not really about amount of shots that determinate if you should lose or win. IT IS ABOUT THE CHANCES that you see in match engine, chance your players miss and opposition players take. I have only control over tactic to get the player 1v1 vs Goalkeeper then i dont have any control.  or you want to say that ME doesnt represent the actual situatoin of the match. I am assuming that my team is better my watch what ME is showing me.

the twitter thread, those things happens 2-3 times a season, not 2-3 per month

If this happened against me , i would never complain that i lost. 

Mind giving me ur pkm? Many people claimed they got a lot of 1 on 1 chances which in reality and close inspection is a low percentage chance. I try to have a look at the shots u are getting.

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19 minutes ago, sverige91 said:

I am not really talking about losing here and i am talking about taking chances, when the player is 1vs1 , Tactic doesnt matter. Do we specify how a striker should finish? We can only buy striker with good finishing and hope for the best. About those chances are converted by AI with lesser good players

A 1 on 1 doesn't mean a high percentage chance. Check back my previous comments. If u have doubts about ur strikers finishing, can u show me ur striker personal stats?

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2 minutes ago, zyfon5 said:

Mind giving me ur pkm? Many people claimed they got a lot of 1 on 1 chances which in reality and close inspection is a low percentage chance. I try to have a look at the shots u are getting.

I have already uninstalled the game just here to see if SI can say by themselves to stop reporting bugs because they wont get fixed. 

You can see PKM is these thread and some of them are even ignored by SI:
 

https://community.sigames.com/topic/516855-1v1-is-it-broken/

https://community.sigames.com/topic/520159-hitting-woodwork-too-many-times/

https://community.sigames.com/topic/518867-i-need-to-have-23-more-shots-score-as-much-as-the-ai-despite-being-the-better-team/   (Someone even a table to show that)

https://community.sigames.com/topic/518923-my-issues-with-the-me/

https://community.sigames.com/topic/519120-me2040-too-good-game-from-gk/

https://community.sigames.com/topic/518135-fm-20-me-strikes-again-what-a-shock/

You can find much more

 

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2 часа назад, Pasonen сказал:

I jinxed it. ^_^

Feyeenord board want to see you mate ^^

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FM20 is the best FM for my journeyman saves anw :thup: some issues for sure but it much better in compare of any past edition

And I enjoy to watch how my newgens are grow up and improve themself

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4 hours ago, rafaelbenitez said:

I think the preset tactics are a good addition to the game. It helps tactically challenged players (myself included) who don't have the time/desire to analyse every game played so as to get a successful passing game going. I'm sure it's pretty useful to newcomers by providing a framework of what instructions complement each other, which ones don't etc.

Spot on.

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4 ore fa, Novem9 ha scritto:

fm'd! :D

185527475_Image3.thumb.png.f9608962f49c4185cc3702c048439f0a.png

 

3 ore fa, Pasonen ha scritto:

I jinxed it. ^_^

Nooo no and no guys!

This is being FM'd!!:

Cattura1.JPG.13b55a75324ed6effe9e35440fcd869f.thumb.JPG.04adf3331649fe1741636a9ba2677285.JPG

To be honest Wolfsburg did enough to deserve a good result... just an unfair game.

3 ore fa, sverige91 ha scritto:

They wont get fixed for this year but I'll assure you they will be taken in consideration for the next edition. There's nothing they ignore, and if people are still willing to upload evidences of bugs or issues, they're all and always welcomed.

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Is the Club Vision target "Develop players using the club's youth system" bugged?

I had a reasonably long term save where I would average 3-4 home grown players in the match day squad every game, and only got that to "Satisfied" ("We are content with the opportunities handed to the younger generation but feel more could have been done on this front").

I then did another test save where I quite literally used only home grown players. Every player in the starting XI and every player on the bench, even the ones not on the bench - all home grown players. All bar one 20 or under (the oldest was 22).

I still only got "Satisfied" with the exact same write-up - "...feel more could have been done on this front." Not really sure how more could have been done when literally 100% of match day opportunities were given to young home grown players?

 

Anyone ever got that particular Club Vision goal to anything higher than "Satisfied"?

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3 minutes ago, clokey1988 said:

Is the Club Vision target "Develop players using the club's youth system" bugged?

I had a reasonably long term save where I would average 3-4 home grown players in the match day squad every game, and only got that to "Satisfied" ("We are content with the opportunities handed to the younger generation but feel more could have been done on this front").

I then did another test save where I quite literally used only home grown players. Every player in the starting XI and every player on the bench, even the ones not on the bench - all home grown players. All bar one 20 or under (the oldest was 22).

I still only got "Satisfied" with the exact same write-up - "...feel more could have been done on this front." Not really sure how more could have been done when literally 100% of match day opportunities were given to young home grown players?

 

Anyone ever got that particular Club Vision goal to anything higher than "Satisfied"?

I've got delighted in my first season. How many appearances are they making I did have that many (2-3 i think) but my main one Brandon Williams played like 35 games including a final

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5 minutes ago, themadsheep2001 said:

I've got delighted in my first season. How many appearances are they making I did have that many (2-3 i think) but my main one Brandon Williams played like 35 games including a final

 

Hmm, must just be a demanding board for me then!

In the second example I only have a squad of 20 (all HG) and the first choice players are starting pretty much every league game plus some cups... 

Even in the first example the HG players tended to be key players so would start 30+ league games.

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Just now, clokey1988 said:

 

Hmm, must just be a demanding board for me then!

In the second example I only have a squad of 20 (all HG) and the first choice players are starting pretty much every league game plus some cups... 

Even in the first example the HG players tended to be key players so would start 30+ league games.

Sounds particularly demanding @Seb Wassell would you be able to shed any light on this?

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1 hour ago, themadsheep2001 said:

Sounds particularly demanding @Seb Wassell would you be able to shed any light on this?

@clokey1988

They need to have been with the club since age 21 or younger and have played a large number of First Team matches by the age of 23.

If this criteria is being met, could you post here please - https://community.sigames.com/forum/726-football-manager-2020-bugs-forum/ 

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1 minute ago, Seb Wassell said:

They need to have been with the club since age 21 or younger and have played a large number of First Team matches by the age of 23.

If this criteria is being met, could you post here please - https://community.sigames.com/forum/726-football-manager-2020-bugs-forum/ 

Cheers Seb. @clokey1988 take a look at this and if you're doing this and still getting nothing create a thread. 

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24 minutes ago, Seb Wassell said:

@clokey1988

They need to have been with the club since age 21 or younger and have played a large number of First Team matches by the age of 23.

If this criteria is being met, could you post here please - https://community.sigames.com/forum/726-football-manager-2020-bugs-forum/ 

Okay thanks, maybe they are too young to trigger it yet? All meet the HG criteria (with the club for 3+ years between 15 and 21) but are for the most part still 20 or younger, so maybe if I give it another season or two and if there is still nothing I will post a proper bug report. Cheers.

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Do you guys usually change your tactics a lot each season or just few adjustments?

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9 hours ago, rafaelbenitez said:

I think the preset tactics are a good addition to the game. It helps tactically challenged players (myself included) who don't have the time/desire to analyse every game played so as to get a successful passing game going. I'm sure it's pretty useful to newcomers by providing a framework of what instructions complement each other, which ones don't etc.

This exactly. :thup:

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, LucasBR said:

Do you guys usually change your tactics a lot each season or just few adjustments?

If a tactic is working then I would say making small changes for each game based on the opposition and what you see happening during a game. 

Edited by Gee_Simpson

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1 hour ago, LucasBR said:

Do you guys usually change your tactics a lot each season or just few adjustments?

It depends. Currently playing LLM where players come and go all the time due to being on non-contract terms.
So have sometimes had to change tactics to suit the player changes.
I did stick with the same one (almost) all this season though.
But I'm generally a tinkerer, rarely go a full season with the same tactic tbh.

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nice to see how old players and some players from top leagues moves for clubs from lower leagues to play in ChL Group Stage :thup: I found some very interesting transfers after few seasons 

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11 hours ago, LucasBR said:

Do you guys usually change your tactics a lot each season or just few adjustments?

Maybe make a slight change once every few years. Always stick with the same tactic.

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On 10/05/2020 at 06:57, zyfon5 said:

@Novem9  @Pasonen

if u want to know what kind of shots will give u the best chances of scoring, check out this video

notice how little goals were from a floated cross let alone a first time shot from a cross. even an unmarked long shot directly facing the goal will give u a better chance of scoring than from a cross. and pay attention to how most of their 1 v 1's scored is from a cutback or from a well controlled ball not immediately pressured by a defender. what i feel SI should be doing though is increase the chances of getting a rebound from a cross or a shot currently it is too easy for the GK to held onto the ball or players to get a shot from a set piece directly.

The goals I see regularly from that clip is cut backs into the box from wide and shots from around 30 yds screaming into the top corner, what's missing from FM20 ME is the one on ones being scored like delicate chips over the keeper etc or someone following up after a keeper makes a save. 

I've seen  few cracking goals with through balls and sliding shots past the keeper but just not enough of them, I'd say 80% of the one on ones are hit straight at the keeper with 30% of goals coming from either corners or free kicks from out wide. Scoring and winning is not a problem with this ME, it's just so repetitively boring, not enough little gems like defence splitting passes, or little dink chips or goals.

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16 minutes ago, jc1 said:

I've seen  few cracking goals with through balls and sliding shots past the keeper but just not enough of them, I'd say 80% of the one on ones are hit straight at the keeper with 30% of goals coming from either corners or free kicks from out wide. Scoring and winning is not a problem with this ME, it's just so repetitively boring, not enough little gems like defence splitting passes, or little dink chips or goals.

how many goals from this clip are defence splitting passes or little dink chips again? truth is these goals are always very rare. most of the time the goals u will see IRL are a cutback, a rebound shot unmarked or a long shot that is uncontested directly facing the goal. the REAL PROBLEM in the ME is a lot of times the player will be more likely to shoot at goal from a counter attack instead of passing to another player that is in better position. also set pieces and crosses generate too many shots compared to real life. GK are also a little bit too good at holding on to a ball especially from close range shots compared to IRL these shots will get parried away. BTW the sole reason i posted this video is to counter other's claim that they can't score from 1 on 1 which when i further checked their PKM most of these shots are coming from a cross into a header or a 1 on 1 that is tightly contested from a tight angle which hopefully from this video u know are very low percentage chances.

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Teams that only play with just wing backs seem infinitely more dangerous down the flanks than teams that play with both wingers and full backs. I cannot work out how to get my players to tracks attacking runs from wing backs, they just bomb down the flanks completely unchecked.

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1 hour ago, CityAndColour said:

Teams that only play with just wing backs seem infinitely more dangerous down the flanks than teams that play with both wingers and full backs. I cannot work out how to get my players to tracks attacking runs from wing backs, they just bomb down the flanks completely unchecked.

At individual player instructions, u can set to mark individual positions or players. The mentality and instructions of ur players will also determine how often they will neglect their defensive duties over scoring opportunities. For example, an inside forward on attacking mentality will not track any attacking full back or wing back runs. Even if u put instructions for them to do so they will not be defending as well as a winger on lower mentality bcz their main aim is to score goals not to defend.

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Posted (edited)
3 hours ago, CityAndColour said:

Teams that only play with just wing backs seem infinitely more dangerous down the flanks than teams that play with both wingers and full backs. I cannot work out how to get my players to tracks attacking runs from wing backs, they just bomb down the flanks completely unchecked.

If you got enough men on amc department you can try man mark their playmaker. Sometimes I even use my support st to mark their lowest cm to mess game building and limit balls out wide and controlling.

But yes team defending logic and formation width dont keep eye on wingbacks well enough. In real life in defline fullback role is more mobile and they anticipate movement to flanks.

Positioning if lurking wba/fba free.

FM -> DL-DC-DC-DR (allways)

IRL -> DL--DC-DC--DR

Edited by Pasonen

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On 11/05/2020 at 10:20, zyfon5 said:

Hi both teams have low number of passes but the more dominant side has less than 10 passes per shot is it really a ME problem? The AI can play whatever they like to get a result but the team that is very likely controlled by a human player choose to play a tactic that can generate one shot with less than 10 passes and proceed to complain that it is a problem of the ME. Please explain to me the logic behind it.

You do get that it's a press tactic yes, so the idea is to turn possession over high up the pitch, therefore there won't be lots of passes before a chance because you are looking for quick turnovers. That is how it works IRL with high press systems, Hassenhutl even at times instructs his players to play the balls into the channels giving the opposition back possession near their box so that the team can then win it back high up the pitch rather than try to break the team down by playing through the lines deep from midfield. 

My comment on passes was not about this game, it was more general that BAD teams are able to keep possession better under pressure of a high press better than better teams, which I presume is a mentality thing and a ME engine problem.

In my example game Spurs, a high reputation, good team, were trying to attack, so therefore were trying to beat my press and generally were failing most of the time.

But lower reputation teams that set up in lower defensive blocks, from my experience, can complete a lot of passes and keep high possession by basically playing lots of short but sideways passes within their own third, which is unrealistic two fold, firstly no team even very good ones can not play constant keep ball in their own final third against a good press without making mistakes and losing the ball. But the AI does this quite well, far too well, with high possession and high completed passes but very little attacking threat or territory. 

That is not how real life teams that defend deep play, they play with narrow and deep defensive lines and look to counter attack, usually they will have very low possession and low completed passes, but not in game.

I posted an example of this on page 39 of the thread, Fulham playing a defensive 4-2-3-1 against me, with two DMs and a defensive mentality, with very average defenders, had 58% possession and completed 449 passes, despite carrying next to zero attacking threat and me battering them all game (6 clear cut chances and 4 half chances, 27 shots in total). 

A poor team like that, under pressure, playing a low block, should not be able to keep that possession, its totally absurd, but the AI can happily play the ball around at the back with average players against high quality opposition and against a top quality press. But as soon as they try to be more adventurous, like Spurs, they don't do very well. 

It's completely backwards, better teams that you press should be better at breaking out and should create more, but they don't, bad teams most of the time should crumble if they try to play it around at the back against such a press, but they don't, they play keep ball like they are a Pep team. 

 

 

On 11/05/2020 at 10:27, zyfon5 said:

If the AI feels that u are giving pressure to them of course they will try to keep the ball in possession. Why? U want the AI to give the ball to u so that u can score against them? Or u want the AI to be able to easily counter attack with one ball over the top? Wait a second. Is it what ppl complained about initial release of the game?

So tell me if u are so smart what should the AI do when they face high pressing? 

People weren't complaining about the frequency or the attempt of balls over the top, they were complaining that they were too successful and it was absurd as defenders with average passing at best could half volley, on their wrong foot, inch perfect 70 yard passes that Gerrard in his pomp couldn't pull off AND the fact that the defenders, supposedly marking the forward, when this ball was played and was in the air, continued moving forward reacting far later to this ball over the top as if they could only see 20 yards in front of them.

It is still what the AI should be doing against an attacking team doing a high press, look for quick passes forward on the counter attack and trying to break with numbers, not playing keep ball in their own box with absurd levels of success. 

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