Football Manager 2020 January & February Transfer Updates Feedback Thread

[Domoboy23]

Could someone explain this to me? I understand that a lot of B teams can't qualify to go up, but I'm seeing a lot of teams with 9 games remaining that can still get a playoff place?

[KlaaZ]

7 minutes ago, Domoboy23 said:

Could someone explain this to me? I understand that a lot of B teams can't qualify to go up, but I'm seeing a lot of teams with 9 games remaining that can still get a playoff place?

What do you want explained? The league is divided in four periods, so you may want to check the fourth period table instead of the overall one.

[jc1]

15 hours ago, rinso said:

FM never is, or has been, about the graphics.. you want graphics, go play Fifa..   FM is the stats and the reaism and immersing you into the game, otherwise why would 2d exist in the first place ?   

The game has evolved to the stage where the graphics is also a main part of the game, yes we manage the team, tactics etc but the 3D graphics has to come up to modern day standards to keep the players happy. Are we really still happy seeing little coloured dots moving around a flat pitch, jeez c'mon it's 2020 .

[hh123]

1 hour ago, jc1 said:

The game has evolved to the stage where the graphics is also a main part of the game, yes we manage the team, tactics etc but the 3D graphics has to come up to modern day standards to keep the players happy. Are we really still happy seeing little coloured dots moving around a flat pitch, jeez c'mon it's 2020 .

Id prefer to go back to the dots in exchange for a working ME! I like the look of the new graphics but with the 1 v 1 problems to name a few this version id much rather have dots and not have thee issues  

[Tiger666]

1 hour ago, jc1 said:

The game has evolved to the stage where the graphics is also a main part of the game, yes we manage the team, tactics etc but the 3D graphics has to come up to modern day standards to keep the players happy. Are we really still happy seeing little coloured dots moving around a flat pitch, jeez c'mon it's 2020 .

The day 2D is removed is the day I stop playing FM.

[Guest]

FM is already CPU & RAM hungry. I don't want to be and GPU hungry.

Of course I would like to see graphics like ANNO 1800, but are you ready to be pay for i9, 32GB RAM and Nvidia Titan?

Me not.

[Tony Wright 747]

4 hours ago, Cadoni said:

FM is already CPU & RAM hungry. I don't want to be and GPU hungry.

Of course I would like to see graphics like ANNO 1800, but are you ready to be pay for i9, 32GB RAM and Nvidia Titan?

Me not.

Absolutely

[Etebaer]

vor 5 Stunden schrieb Tiger666:

The day 2D is removed is the day I stop playing FM.

Afaik 2D is already removed and the current 2D mode is 3D but displayed with 2D Dot Graphics to make it look so.

 

I remember the days when the letter "X" was moving from left to right on a Bar made of ASCII symbols in ancient FM games...that had some tension but i ever avoided DOT Manager and prefer Text over Dots but 3D over both - even a game as old as Dino Dinis Football Manager in Iso-3D is perfecly good to me for watching a Football Manager game.

 

I noticed many players in videostreams play on accelerated time and that gives a different Impression of the 3D match imho compared to normal time matchspeed Display which may alter the perception of the game as well.

 

Everyone Player has a different pleasure…

 

 

[Tiger666]

36 minutes ago, Etebaer said:

Afaik 2D is already removed and the current 2D mode is 3D but displayed with 2D Dot Graphics to make it look so.

Yes true, but it's the view I want. I find it tactically superior to 3D.

Edited April 16, 2020 by Tiger666

[rinso]

59 minutes ago, Tiger666 said:

Yes true, but it's the view I want. I find it tactically superior to 3D.

tactically superior? 

[Tiger666]

8 minutes ago, rinso said:

tactically superior? 

Yes, as in I can see my whole team, where everyone is, their shape etc in a nice flat static view that isn't distorted by perspective.

Edited April 16, 2020 by Tiger666

[CityAndColour]

11 hours ago, Nathozz said:

His average rating was 6.82. There was only a couple of games throughout the season in which he got more than a 7.0 rating and also I guess so. It's just annoying because he's not getting the credit he deserves. He's the only keeper in my squad. 

I'm fairly sure coaches only provide their reports and advice based on reputation and hidden CA/PA, not actual performance. If he is performing for you that's all that matters. In the same way that it is fairly easy to retain a high performing player with low CA/PA as AI teams simply won't be interested in him.

I play exclusively lower leagues and have countless examples of players that play well beyond their star ratings.

[Boroboss]

On 15/04/2020 at 22:45, rinso said:

it's highly unusual for me, usually the goals are well spread around, but this save, and these 2 strikes have been brilliant, McKenzie in particular.. i wish stats showed all games rather than just league games.. 

It does bring me back to something though.. you said it isn't fun? what would make it fun ?  What would make you enjoy it more?    Throwing players n stats n saves at ya aint gonna answer that

I finally sorted my team out, now seeing excellent buildup play and a few games where I’ve scored 5 goals including my last one where my lone striker got 4!!

i had to load up FM19 to check my tactics and realised I’d got tempo and passing directness the wrong way round, the change is immense! It never helped that any assistant always try’s to get me to pass short but I find passing direct but slowing the tempo right down results in short passing play anyway but always forwards and to a man in space. 
 

genuinely can’t believe I did 5 frustrating seasons on awful build up play but still managed to win the lot, now back to total domination!!!

[Travis Bickle]

2 Games in a row, guess the results? 

Never change. 

[rp1966]

On 16/04/2020 at 15:58, hh123 said:

Id prefer to go back to the dots in exchange for a working ME! I like the look of the new graphics but with the 1 v 1 problems to name a few this version id much rather have dots and not have thee issues  

As has been pointed out loads of times before - that is not a relevant supposed trade-off.

The ME is independent of the match visualisation.  Whether the visualisation is dots on a green background or full FIFA style 3d graphics, or even just a text description, has no bearing whatsoever on the gameplay generated by the ME. ME problems are ME problems only.

ME determines what happens on the pitch, the visualisation code just shows us what happened. 2D (or top-down 3D camera) is great for showing positions across the whole pitch and analysing the positional play of your team, but the 3D needs to look as good as it possibly can - even if all you want to look at is the goal highlights. Personally, once my tactics are sorted, I want games to look as close to TV presentation as possible in line with current PC technology - I'm going to be spending a lot time looking at those graphics.

 

Edited April 18, 2020 by rp1966

[Marko1989]

6 hours ago, Travis Bickle said:

2 Games in a row, guess the results? 

Never change. 

What about clear cut chances? You should include screenshot with that stat. Number of shots only does not tell everything.

[andu1]

6 hours ago, Travis Bickle said:

2 Games in a row, guess the results? 

Never change. 

Both 1-0 to the home team

[CityAndColour]

58 minutes ago, Marko1989 said:

What about clear cut chances? You should include screenshot with that stat. Number of shots only does not tell everything.

Clear cut chances haven't been recorded properly for years - they tell you almost nothing.

[haffaz77]

https://i.gyazo.com/acf70a3d86e27abb79b5929b14cd9cc7.mp4

 

This is so funny ... well ... actually it isnt lol  . ME is full of brainless players 

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Marko1989 said:

What about clear cut chances? You should include screenshot with that stat. Number of shots only does not tell everything.

I have seen AI vs AI having 5 CCC - 0 Goal (Home Team). The other team (Away Team) has been scored from SP. Well...

CCC doesn't tell me something for me.

Shots on Target - Goals - Points makes more sense.

[Old Joe Clarke]

On 16/04/2020 at 22:16, Etebaer said:

Text over Dots but 3D over both - even a game as old as Dino Dinis Football Manager in Iso-3D is perfecly good to me for watching a Football Manager game.

 

I

 

Dino Dinis Football manager and Kick off, such great times, mate, you just made my day, thank you.

[Mcfc1894]

Does anyone else notice Home teams are too overpowered for some reason Especially if it's similar ability 

[Travis Bickle]

All English CL and EL final again. 

You guys realise you have non-English players right? 

 

[Viking]

So, I started up a new save despite swearing to myself I would'nt touch FM20 again. I saw this youtuber take a mediocre Norwich side to Europa leauge football seemingly without any problems, so I though maybe the game got a bit easier after the latest updates. Turns out I can't even win with Wolves in the Championship with a PL-class squad. Well, I won the first five games, then I suddenly started to lose home agains teams like Millwall, ending their losing streak. Then the players lose trust in me and wants to discuss my manager skills, and the board wants to discuss my future, and I want to smash my computer into small pieces and cut out my eyes.

Unplayable.

[Svenc]

On 12/04/2020 at 14:30, Cadoni said:

Does SI has it's own internal tests for tactics?

Ranking 1-20 like FM Base?

 

AI vs AI "tactics" obviously, though AI doesn't deal in "tacticz" as such. They manage Matches dynamically and apply changes. Plus whatever their testers throw at the game.

Maybe they should though. A good portion of those FMBase tactics are abominations that a) shouldn't work and/or b) should lead to much more frustration than it typically does. The reason the aforementioned AI for instance can at all "frustrate" anyone vs. the human players can't is that the AI on occasion fields players actually focused on defending, for a start. Rather than having no defenders at all to begin with outside a pair of centre backs as the only guys sticking behind the ball. The human Player never even tries, certainly not at FMBase et all.

[Federico]

16 ore fa, Old Joe Clarke ha scritto:

Dino Dinis Football manager

Once and for all, It's Player Manager!!!!

Dino forever

[Old Joe Clarke]

8 minutes ago, Federico said:

Once and for all, It's Player Manager!!!!

Dino forever

Your are right, Player Manager. Dare I mention the ref called "Screech"...

[Federico]

4 minuti fa, Old Joe Clarke ha scritto:

Your are right, Player Manager. Dare I mention the ref called "Screech"...

Yeah Screech and Zappa were both quite "strict"... Steve Screech was actually the game designer

[Old Joe Clarke]

Strict, you are being very polite...

[Federico]

If you're still playing it, or wish to, there's a KO2 online version (KOOL) which is reguarly played by some nice (few) players. Of course an old Joystick is strictly required.

Sorry for the off-topic, I'll stop here.

[Old Joe Clarke]

Cheers fella, will have a look. Yeah we did get a bit off topic. Take care.

[Guest]

1 hour ago, Svenc said:

AI vs AI "tactics" obviously, though AI doesn't deal in "tacticz" as such. They manage Matches dynamically and apply changes. Plus whatever their testers throw at the game.

Maybe they should though. A good portion of those FMBase tactics are abominations that a) shouldn't work and/or b) should lead to much more frustration than it typically does. The reason the aforementioned AI for instance can at all "frustrate" anyone vs. the human players can't is that the AI on occasion fields players actually focused on defending, for a start. Rather than having no defenders at all to begin with outside a pair of centre backs as the only guys sticking behind the ball. The human Player never even tries, certainly not at FMBase et all.

This is another story. 

Do you know if SI has it's own testing tactics system? 

[Travis Bickle]

Do SI realise how frustrating it is when you take a small time club to the CL, play amazingly but lose 3 consecutive group games from ENTIRELY set-piece goals?

 

[craigcwwe]

On 14/04/2020 at 08:34, Tiger666 said:

Nobody should ever pre-order a game, ever. Wait until it's out, you've read a lot of opinion, THEN make the decision whether to give developers your hard earned money. Make them earn it, don't give in to pre-order discounts, it's a cancer.

I disagree with the idea that you should never pre-order something. That's silly. 

Why not pre order a game and try it for yourself instead of relying solely on some random person opinion to base your purchase decision off? 

However, I won't be pre-ordering FM21 simply based off my experience from the ME in the last two games but that is based on 19>20 and the lack of progress in the attacking third. 

On 15/04/2020 at 23:05, Marko1989 said:

Yes, I can. But I can't stand those ugly graphics and animations in 3D.

One of the things I wish the most for the FM2021, alongside with fixed ME, is 2D match engine looks from 2017 and earlier. Bright colors, nice to watch. Even if FM 2021 turns out to be the best FM ever, and they don't change the looks of 2D ME, there is no way I will buy it. That you would be just pure laziness. Just slapping some gray thing around the pitch and that is all

 

Yeah the 2D view in FM20 is really poor in comparison to say, FM17 as you show there. Why has this area in the game clearly gone backwards?!

[Dagenham_Dave]

27 minutes ago, craigcwwe said:

 

Yeah the 2D view in FM20 is really poor in comparison to say, FM17 as you show there. Why has this area in the game clearly gone backwards?!

Whilst it looks nice, it's not really practical. I'd imagine the vast majority of 2d players will use the space around the pitch for all the stats tabs. I daresay that's why SI removed this. 

[kuraeero]

16 minutes ago, Dagenham_Dave said:

Whilst it looks nice, it's not really practical. I'd imagine the vast majority of 2d players will use the space around the pitch for all the stats tabs. I daresay that's why SI removed this. 

If I recall correctly, I think SI stated at some point that the old 2d view was removed because of the new 3d modeling and that data analyst camera angle was its replacement.

[Overmars]

The match engine features too much GK-CD passing. I couldn't figure out how I had dominated the first half of a match, producing chances, crosses, shots, and a goal, while my opponents (Leicester) held a huge possession advantage and had nothing to show for it. Then I looked at the full highlights and saw the problem.

Their stats In the first 45 minutes:

• GK had 51 passes
• One CD had 71 passes
• One forward had 3 passes
• 61% possession
• 3 shots
• 0 chances
• 6 cross attempts
• 86% pass completion (296 of 343)

For real life context, Van Dijk leads the EPL with 85 passes per game, and that is already an outlier consider how historically superior Liverpool has been. Soyuncu logging 71 passes in one half is just silly...though not as silly as Schmeichel attempting 51 passes, all while my team is "urgently pressing."

[Bigpole]

I think I've put enough effort to play the game and give my feedback so here it is. I warn you, it will be long. 

And because it's based on playing in lower tier of football (3/4 tier in Spain and 4/5/6 tier in Poland) so my feelings may be different to those who play in more professional leagues.

I'll try to rate all these main aspects of the game starting with headline features

Club Vision - It's a great addition to the game, sometimes it could be more strict and not throw random visions every new season like make most of set-pieces. Board sometimes gives a weird grades because of finances of someone's transfer or something like that. But overall I like it and it's a plus.

Development Centre - Apart from more clicking than before to get into u23/u19 - it's a cool option but I don't think many people are using it (only youth candidates tab and u21/u19). And maybe I'm stupid or don't know it but why can't I speak with club manager I've loaned my player into? I don't want to wait a month for loan report and do it then - if I see that this club had 6-7 matches in this month, I want to talk with other manager right now why my player is not playing. It's inconvenient.

Backroom staff changes - As many of us here, I don't personally listen to them because they can sometimes completely change your starting eleven from last match only due to 'player is good in that role' (just because he has a little bit brighter green circle than other player). And I'm always told to swap my CD's (even if they have the same pref foot). So don't care.

Playing Time Pathway - Absolutely not existent in my saves and in other people careers. I mean, it's okay to have it but no one use it, you can negotiate with players without even propose them different squad roles so no need of using this really.

Graphic Improvements - Haven't really noticed them, apart from newgen faces which are unfortunately still ugly. 

 

Okay let's get straight to the game. 

Match Engine is weird because always I feel like it's ignoring my tactics and player attributes. In my opinion wingplay is the only way to go. I tend to stick with narrow wingerless tactics (sometimes I have wingbacks to give more width in central play). There's no quick direct passing in the middle and final third, I've noticed too many hoofballs from back line which are right to the feet. One on ones are annoying because there is too much 1vs1 and the accuracy is random. You just can't rely on your strikers, even if they have good attributes. Gegenpressing is too powerful and what's worse - why gegenpressing works in 4/5th division? You can't gegenpress successfully with players with workrate and stamina around or below 10. People are just given up on creating tactics because either you'll be frustrated that your tinkered tactic doesn't work or join the evil and download some overpower tactic. Player decisions (in defence especially) are just not natural. Stupid fouls, Stupid giving the ball away in easy positions, stupid unnecessary passing near the box. And the distance between players is sometimes too big, despite setting narrow play and playing on small pitch.

The Morale factor is make it or break it this year. If you have good morale - you're just destroying everyone. If you have bad morale - you just can't do anything, despite having good professional and determined personalities in the squad, team talks means nothing and are really hard to 'do it right'. You have to be unambitious if you are overachieving and can't be 'realistic' - or you can, but you'll have red or orange morale everywhere. 

Players dropping in determination even when you carefully select your team, youngsters and new transfers, I don't know why it's still a thing. If you have a black sheep or party boy in squad - sure why not. And in this situation I'd understand that there's a chance of this happening. 

Cheap loans are fixed for this edition which is good, which is not good is why you can still loan/transfer a massive amount of players and your board is like - fine, no problem. I mean, you can loan some hot prospects from chelsea, city, liverpool, fill your squad with them and just destroy everyone. The board is first to block your transfers when the big finances are involved but when it comes to quantity - yeah keep signing them mate, no worries. You can't have more than 30 trialists but you can have 60 players contracted to your first squad and nothing happens. And why can't I select teams in division/nation/world menu and team report them in one click? And what about this stupid limit of 50 scouted players and 500 players added to shortlist maximum at once?

Scouting alone is okay I'd say but scout recommendations are really weird sometimes, you get 95-100 rated player reports which are anywhere near your crap club level JUST BECAUSE you have a big transfer/wage budget and his massive wages/transfer fee has orange colour (whis is still over your transfer/wage budget). Some user in other thread found that the scout reports are neglecting good but aggressive players giving them lower report rating.

Interactions with fans should be improved as well, but this was greatly explained in THIS and THIS feature requests.

And the last thing for now - lower league management is far too easy, you can exploit loan market still to some degree, really good players with continental reputation can join you without problems (even if they have no connection with your country). 

 

Overall I think that FM20 is a good game, but not enjoyable in long term. I spent over 100 hours on my update for this year but I can't even enjoy it because it's dull after few years. 

[jc1]

Getting fed up having to verify the integrity of the files on Steam every 2-3 day, never used to have to do this so often.

[Marko1989]

3 hours ago, Dagenham_Dave said:

Whilst it looks nice, it's not really practical. I'd imagine the vast majority of 2d players will use the space around the pitch for all the stats tabs. I daresay that's why SI removed this. 

There is no way that is the reason. They most probably had some performance issues and they have just removed it and replaced it with the laziest gray pattern in history. ( also grass is 200X worse looking) 

They should just make an option to enable or disable that. I understand that Fm is not all about graphics, but if we currently have 3D engine from '90s in FM, we should at least  have decent looking 2D engine as it was in previous versions. 

Edited April 19, 2020 by Marko1989

[Travis Bickle]

5 hours ago, Travis Bickle said:

Do SI realise how frustrating it is when you take a small time club to the CL, play amazingly but lose 3 consecutive group games from ENTIRELY set-piece goals?

 

4/5 of my group games lost to setpiece goals. 

SI, anyone? Are you reading this even?

[MINTED BLOB]

I don't know if any of you guys have had this but I just don't enjoy this game at the moment. 

I've played so many matches on my save this season whereby I've absolutely ran the riot act on a team but failed to win because of some finishing that quite frankly would embarrass Danny Welbeck. I just have a feeling of hopelessness now, because it's not even like there's a clear issue of failing to create chances which I know I can do something about with tactical improvements. My players just aren't sticking the ball in the net. 

I feel far less aggrieved over matches where I get battered and deservedly lose, because then there's clear lessons to be learned. When I create five great chances and fail to score any of them, however, I don't know what I'm supposed to have done differently. Create six? Seven? 

I'm aware people are probably sick of seeing this whiny ass complaint but at the same time I figured this thread is the best place for it. Again, wondering if anyone else has had this with Football Manager? 

 

[CityAndColour]

17 minutes ago, MINTED BLOB said:

I don't know if any of you guys have had this but I just don't enjoy this game at the moment. 

I've played so many matches on my save this season whereby I've absolutely ran the riot act on a team but failed to win because of some finishing that quite frankly would embarrass Danny Welbeck. I just have a feeling of hopelessness now, because it's not even like there's a clear issue of failing to create chances which I know I can do something about with tactical improvements. My players just aren't sticking the ball in the net. 

I feel far less aggrieved over matches where I get battered and deservedly lose, because then there's clear lessons to be learned. When I create five great chances and fail to score any of them, however, I don't know what I'm supposed to have done differently. Create six? Seven? 

I'm aware people are probably sick of seeing this whiny ass complaint but at the same time I figured this thread is the best place for it. Again, wondering if anyone else has had this with Football Manager? 

 

If you are wanting a game where the team creating the better chances is rewarded, particularly from open play, then FM20 is probably not for you. 

[MINTED BLOB]

2 minutes ago, CityAndColour said:

If you are wanting a game where the team creating the better chances is rewarded, particularly from open play, then FM20 is probably not for you. 

I've learned that the hard way. 

I feel like Sisyphus every time I start up a new save at the moment. 

[Overmars]

2 hours ago, MINTED BLOB said:

I've played so many matches on my save this season whereby I've absolutely ran the riot act on a team but failed to win because of some finishing that quite frankly would embarrass Danny Welbeck. I just have a feeling of hopelessness now, because it's not even like there's a clear issue of failing to create chances which I know I can do something about with tactical improvements. My players just aren't sticking the ball in the net.

Speaking of hopeless, one of my forwards is at 16 hours of competitive football without scoring. He has "superb" morale, but I can't play him because he'll hit every post and the game will taunt me with another drought statistic.

If SI makes one change for FM21, I hope it's a reduction of the importance of player and team form.

[CityAndColour]

27 minutes ago, Overmars said:

Speaking of hopeless, one of my forwards is at 16 hours of competitive football without scoring. He has "superb" morale, but I can't play him because he'll hit every post and the game will taunt me with another drought statistic.

If SI makes one change for FM21, I hope it's a reduction of the importance of player and team form.

Just stick him on the far post for corners and free kicks?

[Etebaer]

vor 11 Stunden schrieb Bigpole:

 Gegenpressing is too powerful and what's worse - why gegenpressing works in 4/5th division? You can't gegenpress successfully with players with workrate and stamina around or below 10.

The Morale factor is make it or break it this year. If you have good morale - you're just destroying everyone. If you have bad morale - you just can't do anything, despite having good professional and determined personalities in the squad, team talks means nothing and are really hard to 'do it right'. You have to be unambitious if you are overachieving and can't be 'realistic' - or you can, but you'll have red or orange morale everywhere. 

Nice write up with many good Points like the Morale thing albeit i tend to differ at Gegenpress.

On the morale factor i completely agree that it has a HUGE influence and it is very debatable if it goes over the top.

Gegenpress (and mostly anything in Football) is not depending on absolute values but on the relative value comparison thus Gegenpress is totally a valid tactic in any Tier of Football bcs you meet opponents who also have much weaker Physics and are unable to exploit your own Workrate and Stamina weakness therefore and as they are technically worse it is probably even better to Gegenpress in lower leagues as they are less able to avoid it - on top of that are physical Attributes the easiest to improve by Training or Transfer.

 

D = Delta = Decisive

 

PS: Delta - not only the forked mouth of a river but also a technical term for the difference between certain values.

 

 

Edited April 20, 2020 by Etebaer

[rafaelbenitez]

I think B, C & u19 staff roles are completely broken in Spain.

As Sociedad, there are absolutely no respondents to my u19 staff adverts. All B Team and C Team staff (even those with key attributes less than 5!) are asking for well above the wage I can offer. If I leave a technical director in charge, he hasn't filled any of the open roles presumably because he can't get anyone to agree to a contract.

This is very disappointing as I can't hire any new staff and my existing ones are going to leave as I can't meet their contract demands. Can't think of a workaround and pretty much kills any chance of a long term save in Spain.

[baris28]

I've to tell again wide free kicks(IDFK in game) are very common type of assists I've experienced in the league I've experienced. All other good in game as far as what AI could manage. But  how goals scored at least in FM'18 standard for a future simulation would be progressive, it is either wide freekick to far post assist or long shots currently.

Edited April 20, 2020 by baris28

[Travis Bickle]

New save, first season, All English CL & EL Final

Second season, 3/4 teams in the CL SF are English, Liverpool beat Real Madrid 5-0 and Manchester City beat Juventus 4-0 to get there.

Do you guys not realise how insanely anglocentric this game is? 

Edited April 21, 2020 by Travis Bickle