Will anyone be buying FM21?

[JordanMilly]

 

[Deisler26]

 

7 minutes ago, JordanMillward_1 said:

 

Should make it a slogan

"Football Manager 2021: Give Tom Cleverley a hug!"

Absolutely nothing in that video that I'm interested in. Let's hope for more coming.

[ChelseaSince86]

Actually liked the video but I hope to christ the "you opened your arms widely and improved body language" bit is not something we have to choose, before then having to choose conversation responses.

Choose how to welcome the player etc.  Not keen on that, at all

 

Will buy it ahead of release no doubt, as I do every year.  

Edited October 12, 2020 by ChelseaSince86

[HUNT3R]

I enjoyed that. It's an obvious teaser, so I wasn't expecting a full feature reveal. It's great to see some news about the next FM. Any news and any info is great. Looks like it's starting now, so will be keeping my eyes open on the social media channels from now on.  

[Nonlondoner]

I'll be getting it. 

Year on year its improved the experience for me. It's one of the best value, if not the best value simulation game on the market.  Every year I worry about the game dumbing-down or looking tacky and SI have yet to let me down. 

Maybe it's more for the geek-end of the football sim market.  The ME is fine with me, go back a few versions and you'll see how much better it is now. 

It looks like the conversations are becoming more realistic this year, I've struggled to imagine a 17 year old London kid saying "I am pleased with my performances of late". More "Cheers boss, s'been well hench innit?"

 

 

[Tony Wright 747]

45 minutes ago, Nonlondoner said:

I'll be getting it. 

Year on year its improved the experience for me. It's one of the best value, if not the best value simulation game on the market.  Every year I worry about the game dumbing-down or looking tacky and SI have yet to let me down. 

Maybe it's more for the geek-end of the football sim market.  The ME is fine with me, go back a few versions and you'll see how much better it is now. 

It looks like the conversations are becoming more realistic this year, I've struggled to imagine a 17 year old London kid saying "I am pleased with my performances of late". More "Cheers boss, s'been well hench innit?"

 

 

The ME, If you go back a few versions to FM17 you'll see how much better it is than now

[Lempicka]

Looks like we're stuck with the same stadiums for another year

 

[zakbrown96]

On 11/10/2020 at 15:07, Tony Wright 747 said:

In Manchester the average is £10

 

On 11/10/2020 at 13:32, dREIS said:

Slough average "large" Pizza is £17, if you're lucky it will be around £15. 

 

On 11/10/2020 at 14:11, BuryBlade said:

The government may have abandoned us in the North, but at least our pizzas aren’t extortionately priced! My local charges around £7 for a large pizza. 
 

On topic, I remember them saying early October for feature announcements. It’s the 11th now and still nothing.

Never thought I’d be reading about Pizza prices on here 😂😂

[zakbrown96]

On 11/10/2020 at 16:17, PoeticOtter said:

I've purchased every game since I first saw a box with a football on it on the shelves of Game way back in 2000 having no idea what it was. 

But unfortunately I won't be buying this year's breaking a 19 year streak. For me, the game has stagnated year after year with the quality of release dropping with it. I'm not really interested in redesigned panels, new obscure staff roles that don't really impact anything or a new tactic style isn't represented in the match engine. 

What I would like to see is are tactical instructions actually going follow through to the match engine as in FM20, I felt a huge disconnect between what I implemented to what actually took place on the pitch. I'd like the see media interaction binned or completely revamped as it's been tedious for years and doesn't have as much impact as media interaction does in real life. Player interactions have been an issue for years. They often seem engineered to create drama which you're then unable to resolve or follow up with the player in the days afterwards.

My save with Bilbao was ruined as I was unable to sign any reserve/youth coaches due to a bug which was never fixed. It's daft bugs like this and the terrible match engine which will keep my money in my pocket. 

I'll still keep an eye on the forums and announcements to see what FM21 has in-store but I have no excitement or anticipation for the new release for the first time ever. It's sad to say. 

Think you might prefer FM touch you know, no media to worry about 

[zyfon5]

3 hours ago, Tony Wright 747 said:

The ME, If you go back a few versions to FM17 you'll see how much better it is than now

Lol how is FM17 any good? The first FM game that I play was FM17 and I just basically set up a crossing tactic to lacazette and won the premier league with arsenal predicted to finish 4th. Easiest FM game I ever played if you ask me. If you want no challenge at all, then FM17 is better.

[Trainspotting90]

Yes, but probably the Touch versione, my pc is very good but from the FM12 edition, the game has been too... heavy.

[Tony Wright 747]

1 hour ago, zyfon5 said:

Lol how is FM17 any good? The first FM game that I play was FM17 and I just basically set up a crossing tactic to lacazette and won the premier league with arsenal predicted to finish 4th. Easiest FM game I ever played if you ask me. If you want no challenge at all, then FM17 is better.

In most polls run in the last four years on the best ME FM17 has come out on top

[themadsheep2001]

3 minutes ago, Tony Wright 747 said:

In most polls run in the last four years on the best ME FM17 has come out on top

This isn't true? In each of the last 4 years its been the latest ME

[FairyTailed]

I would like to drop in my 2 cents on the Korean 'Match Engine'. @Neil Brock

As curious as I am, I have done some testing of my own. Without knowing what exact non-realism negatives this physical acceleration change has in march, I have to say the most noticable two negatives are the following:

1. Tackles tend to sometimes miss the target visually, while still connecting according to the engine;

2. Tempo as a Team Instruction is significantly less impactful due to the overall increase in smoothness. With the increase in physicial acceleration, the differences in tempo are a lot less pronounced. The players seem to go about their bussiness only slightly less in the lowest tempo compared to the highest tempo.

These are currently the only two downsides I've managed to spot and they came at a huge relieve of stress of not being tortured with the most annoying parts of FM's Match Engine. We all know the scenarios where a Wing Back marauds the field and then completely stutters at the byline for a few seconds, only to have the defending full back track back and ultimately cross against his leg. We all know the scenarios where a cross goes outward and a player chases the ball, only to stutter in place and then either get it stolen or kicks it outside himself. All of these issues are... Gone. Due to the physical acceleration, the players go quicker about their business and these scenarios just do not occur at all. For me personally this is a huge change as biggest parts of frustration of the Match Engine have just dropped. Furthermore this comes with an overall increase in smoothness and opportunities inside the game.

I don't want to disbelieve that you found fundamental Match Engine problems with this change to the .json file, but as we all know no Match Engine has ever been perfect. Yet this seems to clear the most fundamental frustrating problems for the trade off described above. For perhaps a trade off in realism as you seem to have found yourself. If this is the trade off I have to take to have a Match Engine that's slightly less realistic, I will gladly take it any day of the year. And so will the others who wrote about it above. The increase in fun is immense. Surely, partially due to the drop of frustration (here within the placebo effect we see written). But - and I keep repeating myself - the most frustrating parts of the Match Engine are gone.

While I'm perplexed that such an easy change was always within handreach, I do not doubt the quality of the developers. However, I'd like to hear from you why you deem that type of change to be bad for the Match Engine and why you have decided against changing the values of this .json file and feature. What are the exact reasons that you did not feel like exploring it further?

If next year's Match Engine continues to have the same problems, I'd like to ask wholeheartedly to leave the .json file for physical acceleration editable for everyone. So even if you decide it's not the way to get the most realistic engine out there, I have the option myself to alter it and make that change to have fun at the game if the Match Engine starts to frustrate me again. In fact, if the file is not there and the issues are also not fixed, I will lose complete trust in the company because it will seem like you do not care about making it less frustrating and more fun for all of us.

 

That said, we're not yet at that point and for now I keep full faith. I also do not condone any of the hatred and misdemeanor spread in this thread against the SI Team and I look forward to FM21. The game has been pre-ordered.

Edited October 12, 2020 by FairyTailed
Missing word in a sentence.

[FrazT]

@FairyTailed

Quote from the SI staff in another thread:

Quote

Hey all,

As has been stated previously, this patch was only able to edit the game's physical constraints which is based on real life data and controls how quickly/slowly players can accelerate and decelerate. There's no AI changes at all in there, I've checked myself!

Bear in mind, using this 'mod' will cause divergences, which means if you try to play with friends in a network game or report a bug the match won't replay back in the same way. There's also no guarantees for sanity or stability, since some of the physical constraints were changed quite drastically to unrealistic levels. So personally I wouldn't recommend using it, but it's up to you.

Thanks,

Jack

 

[santy001]

@FairyTailed I will reiterate a point that I mentioned before. If it was really so great, SI would've just released it. It'd have taken a tiny amount of time to prepare a patch for it some time in the last 5-6 months in which they've been aware of it.

SI could just release it, and they don't need to credit anyone in any way because it's their game. If anything, given the way in which its described and talked about you'd have to imagine that different game developers may well have considered legal action. 

- - -

If you like it, have fun with it. No one particularly minds, cares or is upset/bothered by it.

[upthetoon]

12 hours ago, JordanMillward_1 said:

 

Not bothered about the cosmetics. Seems like it's the same ME. Will try the demo if the ME has improved before deciding to buy. 

[saihtam]

7 hours ago, FairyTailed said:

I would like to drop in my 2 cents on the Korean 'Match Engine'. @Neil Brock

Are the forum post deleted on this subject, because i could not find any. And Google directed here it was with errors.

Have been away for a long from FM, so very curious about it.

[Marko1989]

11 hours ago, Lempicka said:

Looks like we're stuck with the same stadiums for another year

 

I am glad I saw this screenshot. Judging only by awfull looking grass without any texture it seems they didn't do anything to make this game look like it is from this millennium. 

Edited October 13, 2020 by Marko1989

[herne79]

27 minutes ago, saihtam said:

Are the forum post deleted on this subject, because i could not find any. And Google directed here it was with errors.

Have been away for a long from FM, so very curious about it.

There's a highlighted quote from SI about it 3 posts above yours.

[talhak]

1 hour ago, Marko1989 said:

I am glad I saw this screenshot. Judging only by awfull looking grass without any texture it seems they didn't do anything to make this game look like it is from this millennium. 

This one looks like captured from a lower video quality. Actually, the grass does have texture as you can see the HQ version of a capture from the Feature Reveals video below. Also, we have no information regarding the graphics detail level of the capture of 3D match view available in the Feature Reveals video.

 

[FairyTailed]

9 hours ago, santy001 said:

@FairyTailed I will reiterate a point that I mentioned before. If it was really so great, SI would've just released it. It'd have taken a tiny amount of time to prepare a patch for it some time in the last 5-6 months in which they've been aware of it.

 

I'm not intending in having a long discussion as I was merely dropping my thoughts. However, I'll reiterate my point.

The mod drops all of the frustrating parts of the Match Engine that makes it unplayable and annoying for the majority of complaining people.

All the people who have talked about trying the mod here have been positive about it.

This means at least two things:

1. This is the direction they want the Match Engine to go as they prefer smoothness and less frustration over physical realism. The game being playable and fun is clearly seen as more important than so called physicial, but buggy, realism;

2. If the bugs are not fixed (regardless of them wanting to or they being seemingly impossible to fix) AND the file is no longer editable in FM21, I will lose trust and will no longer buy future FM's. FM is a game that is made fun by mods, all of the downloadable faces, real team logos and kits, and yes even the Match Engine mod. 

[It should also be perfectly fine to discuss the effects physical acceleration has on the game without referencing to the mod - but it seems they prefer censoring...]

Edited October 13, 2020 by FairyTailed

[Neil Brock]

5 minutes ago, FairyTailed said:

I'm not intending in having a long discussion as I was merely dropping my thoughts. However, I'll reiterate my point.

The mod drops all of the frustrating parts of the Match Engine that makes it unplayable and annoying for the majority of complaining people.

All the people who have talked about trying the mod here have been positive about it.

This means at least two things:

1. This is the direction they want the Match Engine to go as they prefer smoothness and less frustration over physical realism. The game being playable and fun is clearly seen as more important than so called physicial, but buggy, realism;

2. If the bugs are not fixed (regardless of them wanting to or they being seemingly impossible to fix) AND the file is no longer editable in FM21, I will lose trust and will no longer buy future FM's. FM is a game that is made fun by mods, all of the downloadable faces, real team logos and kits, and yes even the Match Engine mod. 

As I posted previously, it's not something we're supporting or recommending people use, as stated by Jack's quoted post above. People are entitled to play the game however they want, but as with other unofficial tools or hacks it's not something we feel is appropriate to be discussed on these forums.

Thanks. 

[Tony Wright 747]

44 minutes ago, talhak said:

This one looks like captured from a lower video quality. Actually, the grass does have texture as you can see the HQ version of a capture from the Feature Reveals video below. Also, we have no information regarding the graphics detail level of the capture of 3D match view available in the Feature Reveals video.

 

It would appear that there is some texture, but have you ever seen real grass this colour

[themadsheep2001]

@FairyTailed @forameuss I've removed posts after Neil's reply because as @Johnny Ace points out it's not really anything to do with this thread, the questions have been raised, discussion had and answers given. 

[Sharkn20]

I am waiting for the full list of improvements, but seems that I won't be buying FM21 based in what I saw in the new features video, nothing game changing that will make it different from FM20.

[allezdae]

On 07/10/2020 at 20:41, davehanson said:

Keep in mind that you don't get early Beta with cdkeys though

Is this not right then?

[PoeticOtter]

13 hours ago, zakbrown96 said:

Think you might prefer FM touch you know, no media to worry about 

I did have a good save going in FM Touch 18 I think it was and it's a nice alternative for some people. But I don't see why after purchasing a £30 game I should play with the trimmed down freebie version because parts of the main game are so poor. I'd like to worry about the media. I'd like to think my answers to questions would have an effect on the world I'm in or I could develop a personality but let's be honest, it's case of clicking on the same answers for the same questions every week as it stands. 

[themadsheep2001]

3 minutes ago, allezdae said:

Is this not right then?

This is the official list: 

https://www.sega.com/sega-approved-partner-list

So I would perhaps be wary of sites that aren't listed

[pizzachips]

100% buying- every year I plunge hundreds of hrs into each save - always value for money & looking fwd to a bit of escapism in November!

 

[davehanson]

40 minutes ago, allezdae said:

Is this not right then?

They are not on the official list. They advertised it as this last year but people who ordered through them didnt get the Beta.

I order a lot theough CD keys but wont order FM, when I do pre-order, as you dont usually get the beta.

[zyfon5]

12 hours ago, Tony Wright 747 said:

In most polls run in the last four years on the best ME FM17 has come out on top

Refer to posts below if you prefer fun over realism then it's no doubt the better engine. Spamming crosses to lacazette to score more than 40 goals a season is not realistic even though it's fun as hell for sure.

[lex311085]

not until the match engine is sorted out. Any goal you score and any goal against you is a cross or set piece then header. Rinse repeat. Surely the dullest match engine so far

[hungmn]

Paid for it already. I need a cure for my Man United disappointment in real life at the moment

[Artin]

at the moment no.

cyberpunk 2077 is coming out a week before FM21 so i'll be playing that. then i'll play it again so i'm thinking two playthroughs will be done around jan or feb 2021.

then if there are more PS5 stocks next year then i'll probably be playing new PS5 games as well.

that's my plan for the rest of the year and early next year.

only way i'll buy FM21 is if they show something really, really good. something that really adds something to the game (like when they added the new presets to the tactical creator) and not just UI recoloring or rearranging of old panels. i doubt it though going by SI's history so it looks like summer sale of 2021 is when i'll pick up the new FM.

[kevhamster]

I've pre-ordered via shopto.  Not sure how they're selling it so much cheaper than the other stores, but they're listed as an official channel by Sega, so all good.

[Gee_Simpson]

1 hour ago, kevhamster said:

I've pre-ordered via shopto.  Not sure how they're selling it so much cheaper than the other stores, but they're listed as an official channel by Sega, so all good.

They're brilliant. I order everything from them when it comes to gaming (mostly PlayStation). I ordered FM from them for the first time last year because it was so cheap! Very good price imo.

Edited October 13, 2020 by Gee_Simpson

[Gee_Simpson]

12 hours ago, upthetoon said:

Not bothered about the cosmetics. Seems like it's the same ME. Will try the demo if the ME has improved before deciding to buy. 

How can you tell it's exactly the same ME based on like 5-10 seconds?

[Tony Wright 747]

18 hours ago, themadsheep2001 said:

This isn't true? In each of the last 4 years its been the latest ME

This isn't true.  In this years poll on these forums by Prot651, in the ME section 27.27% voted for FM17 and 19.01% voted for FM20.  What usually happens is that the latest version wins followed by FM17 and FM12, this didn't happen this year and the only section that FM20 came out on top was the graphics section

 

18 hours ago, themadsheep2001 said:

This isn't true? In each of the last 4 years its been the latest ME

 

[kevhamster]

3 minutes ago, Gee_Simpson said:

How can you tell it's exactly the same ME based on like 5-10 seconds?

It won't be. People assume the ME is the same because the graphics have basically not been changed. 

[pizzachips]

3 minutes ago, Tony Wright 747 said:

This isn't true.  In this years poll on these forums by Prot651, in the ME section 27.27% voted for FM17 and 19.01% voted for FM20.  What usually happens is that the latest version wins followed by FM17 and FM12, this didn't happen this year and the only section that FM20 came out on top was the graphics section

 

 

I dont know the Mad Sheeps source but you can hardly reach a true consensus of the entire FM populations view on favorite ME based on 1 poll on this forum

[themadsheep2001]

8 minutes ago, Tony Wright 747 said:

This isn't true.  In this years poll on these forums by Prot651, in the ME section 27.27% voted for FM17 and 19.01% voted for FM20.  What usually happens is that the latest version wins followed by FM17 and FM12, this didn't happen this year and the only section that FM20 came out on top was the graphics section

 

 

So not most polls then either

[themadsheep2001]

6 minutes ago, pizzachips said:

I dont know the Mad Sheeps source but you can hardly reach a true consensus of the entire FM populations view on favorite ME based on 1 poll on this forum

At the time of each of the last 4 polls I looked at, the latest one led each time. Granted the polls don't get locked so they could have well changed after. Though he's said most and pointed out one

[Tony Wright 747]

10 hours ago, themadsheep2001 said:

So not most polls then either

When polls have a separate section for the ME as opposed to the game overall yes, this would be a range of polls, not just on these forums but across other sites both closed and open

10 hours ago, pizzachips said:

I dont know the Mad Sheeps source but you can hardly reach a true consensus of the entire FM populations view on favorite ME based on 1 poll on this forum

See my reply below

10 hours ago, themadsheep2001 said:

At the time of each of the last 4 polls I looked at, the latest one led each time. Granted the polls don't get locked so they could have well changed after. Though he's said most and pointed out one

Prot651's poll is now locked the last vote cast was September 12th, so nothing changed after that.

[themadsheep2001]

Just now, Tony Wright 747 said:

Prot651's poll is now locked the last vote cast was September 12th, so nothing changed after that.

Which doesn't change my point as to when I looked it at last? 

[Tony Wright 747]

Just now, themadsheep2001 said:

Which doesn't change my point as to when I looked it at last? 

To my knowledge in the ME section there was no point in which FM20 was in the lead, if you can show me otherwise I will happily concede

[Harrison Bored]

Seems a bit of a pointless discussion to have. Whether people think the FM17 ME is better or not, SI aren't going to roll back to it, especially given the song and dance they've made about improvements every year since. 

Edited October 13, 2020 by Harrison Bored

[srvngrc]

I'm a big fan of FM and have been playing this game since 2005. It's a part of my life. For the first time I'll wait for the demo. The ME and AI in FM 20 is a disaster. SI didn't fix the problems. So why should I buy FM21? If the problems are solved then why SI didn't make an update for FM 20? If not there is no reason to buy new game. 

[enigmatic]

19 hours ago, srvngrc said:

 If the problems are solved then why SI didn't make an update for FM 20? . 

I mean, they did...

[srvngrc]

Duplicate.. Please delete. 

Edited October 14, 2020 by srvngrc