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How to Create Complex Attacking Patterns to Break Down Defensive Teams

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Posted (edited)

Much needed. Great post. These variation of overlaps and movement patterns are all I ever think about when making a tactic. You need to create at LEAST 2 routes to goal. I've found one overarching style often doesn't stay successful for long (all short passes or all crossing).

One thing I will add is that when creating a tactic is best not to look for or rely on 1v1s. Instead you should look to unlock/release that player into a 1v0 (or 1v1 with the keeper). I also personally find it very frustrating relying on a players dribbling skill to create chances. Unlike most guides out there I NEVER put a good dribbler in a dribbling role. I've found this just makes them hog the ball too much and run into defenders again and again. Usually if a player has sufficient dribbling to pass a player they will have a few PPMs that reinforce this, combine that with a different role such as WP or Trq and you have a much more versatile, interesting and unpredictable player. Not relying on dribbling players also helps you refine your tactic building skills. I strive to create tactics that don't require/rely on outstanding individual traits, if you can do that then you should have a bulletproof tactic has movement all over the pitch and multiple ways of scoring.

Edited by scwiffy

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Very good post @Jack722

When creating a tactic, I usually start fromt the question: how do I want my team to score goals? Most of the time, I end up with something around my wingbacks crossing because I am a wingback IRL and I love running forward to make a good cross. Depending on my best fullback, I try to implement it on one side and bring something else on the other side. This season, in 3.Liga, I am really struggling to have diversified type of goals because my team is clearly lacking of quality. What I mean is that my team is relatively balanced, but I have no key players. I have a good combination of a CM with a AP, and I am currently trying to figure out how to use them the most in my comp. Ideally, the easiest one to implement would be to have a very good MR, who can play 1v1 easily on his side, as I am using my left fullback to bring overload and good crosses from the left. 
Reading your post, it reinforces the idea of switching side, however if I use the shorter passing play does it still work to have one of my midfielders to switch the play?

Lots of ideas, I struggle to make myself clear. Anyway, these are questions I ask to myself while building my team. I have not figured out yet a pattern I want to implement on the long-term in my club except the fact I want to play offensive football. But thank you for sharing this post!

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26 minutes ago, KrKAlex said:

Very good post @Jack722

When creating a tactic, I usually start fromt the question: how do I want my team to score goals? Most of the time, I end up with something around my wingbacks crossing because I am a wingback IRL and I love running forward to make a good cross. Depending on my best fullback, I try to implement it on one side and bring something else on the other side. This season, in 3.Liga, I am really struggling to have diversified type of goals because my team is clearly lacking of quality. What I mean is that my team is relatively balanced, but I have no key players. I have a good combination of a CM with a AP, and I am currently trying to figure out how to use them the most in my comp. Ideally, the easiest one to implement would be to have a very good MR, who can play 1v1 easily on his side, as I am using my left fullback to bring overload and good crosses from the left. 
Reading your post, it reinforces the idea of switching side, however if I use the shorter passing play does it still work to have one of my midfielders to switch the play?

Lots of ideas, I struggle to make myself clear. Anyway, these are questions I ask to myself while building my team. I have not figured out yet a pattern I want to implement on the long-term in my club except the fact I want to play offensive football. But thank you for sharing this post!

Hi KrKAlex, I've noticed that PPMs always override the role the player is playing and the Team instructions you are using. So, as long as you have one player that has Switches ball to other flank, then he will always look to try this move, regardless of how short you want your team to play passes

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I wanted to expand on my example out Zaha and Crystal Palace. Unfortunately, I don't know Palace's squad very well, but let's just imagine we have the correct players with the correct traits.

Let's start by using the example that I used for the 1v1s, with Zaha as the winger. The most obvious formation we'll use for this would be the 442.  Another way to create chances that compliments a tricky winger would be to try and get chances on the Break. This means that I would want my 2 CMs to be good at defending and 2 CBs who are good in the air, as we're going to be under lots of pressure. Let's also now add the TI's:

  • Pass into space
  • Lower line of engagement 
  • Counter
  • Regroup
  • GK distribute to flanks

Now, how shall we set up the other side? The clearest method for me would be to try and create overloads. This does 2 things:

  • Allows us to create chances on the right flank due to a potential extra man
  • If they try to react to the overload by bringing more players over, they would leave the opposite flank open
    • This can be punished with a quick switch of play to Zaha, either giving him enough space to shoot, or beat a man using a 1v1

Finally, it makes sense to have a destroyer - type defenisve midifielder on Zaha's side, to cover for him and help soak pressure. Then we can have a slightly more technical midfielder on the right to help control the ball in the overloaded side, who also Likes to switch the ball. Now, we are able to use this ideas to create a tactic that uses 4 complex attacking patterns, that all compliment each other, and the team.

image.thumb.png.7c47b0e5105c2ba781e26ddcb7b83e19.png

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@Jack722 Really good and v helpful. Any more insight on combinations? An example shape, instructions, roles? Something I am interested in but always struggled. Thanks

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This is a really interesting read :thup:

For me, this is what the game is all about; looking to create intricate structures so as to manipulate the opposition and score all types of different goals.
Who are you playing as out of interest? Also, are you finding these sorts of attacking patterns as easy to implement in a top side as a smaller side? (re difference in quality of opposition vs quality of your own players etc) 

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, Sport Lacost said:

This is a really interesting read :thup:

For me, this is what the game is all about; looking to create intricate structures so as to manipulate the opposition and score all types of different goals.
Who are you playing as out of interest? Also, are you finding these sorts of attacking patterns as easy to implement in a top side as a smaller side? (re difference in quality of opposition vs quality of your own players etc) 

Thanks

I'm not actuall playing FM at the moment. The reason I made this was because, whenever I manage a team, I tend to initially overachieve, as i like to make my teams defensively solid and sign pacey forwards for counterattacks. But whenever I try to make the jump to solidify my self as a top side that dominates the ball and presses high, my career implodes and I start reguarly losing 1-0 or drawing 1-1 against bottom half sides :lol:

So to answer your question, I haven't really been able to implement these as a top side, but I haven't had another go since reading that section of lines and diamonds.

Once I have a better understanding, I'm going to start a long term save with a lower league team and try and build the club from the bottom up, trying to base every signing and tactical decision on these principles, so I can dominate the ball while not letting the attack go stale.

I also want to avoid having to lower my pressing to 'draw the other team out more'. I've seen other people say that it works for them, but I haven't really had any success doing that. Something about it just doesn't sit right with me. If a team is set on parking the bus and don't want to come out, you can't force them. And if it was that easy, then why is relentless pressing so popular in FM and for top clubs in real life?

I'm hoping other people will use this thread to talk about how they have been breaking down smaller sides so that I can better understand how to myself before jumping in again.

 

Edited by Jack722

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This thread appeared in the right moment for me.

I'm going to start the second season at Sevilla and I had a lot, but a lot, difficulties in scoring goals. My forwards had poor numbers.

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Posted (edited)

Let's have a go

I haven't actually played a save since starting this thread, so now it's time to see if what I researched has actually improved my game at all, or if it was just a waste of time :lol:

I already mentioned that I always seem to have a hard time as a team that dominates the ball, so I'm going to pick a team that is one of the better sides in the division, but I don't want to play as the best as I don't want to rely too much on purely indiviudal brilliance to skew the results. The team I'm going to go with, because of this, is Chelsea. Chelsea also have the beneift of being a big premier league team, so most of you should already be a little familiar with the squad meaning I don't have to introduce all the players.

I've holidayed up to a point where I can have a solid few games in a row against inferior opposition, so that I can test my tactics against likely low blocks.

image.thumb.png.d19daf8c217a00c5164dd6382e8a2071.png

I've also saved a backup, so I can revisit this point if I fail, or come up with other ideas.

The Key Players

  • Hazard
    • Key PPMs: Likes to switch ball to other flank, Runs with ball often, Plays one twos
    • Key attributes: Flair, Dribbling, Agility
    • Hazard is definately a player I need to get the best out of to get the best out of the team.
    • With his PPMs and attributes, I can already see him being able to produce 3 complex patterns
      • 1v1s - I definately want to use a formation that gives him a fair amount of space so he can isolate himself with a fullback
      • Switch of play - I can see him looking to switch the ball after cutting insde after realising that the takeon isn't on, to get the most out of this, I want someone on the opposite flank who is always looking to hold width
      • Combination - With his PPM of 'plays one twos' and his agility, even though we want to leave him space for 1v1s, it would be a good idea to maybe have a DLF or an AM near him so that he can combine.
  • Higuain
    • Key PPMs: Moves into channels, Looks to beat offside trap
    • Key attributes: Teamwork,  Strength
    • I was glad to see that Higuain has 17 teamwork, i defantely feel that he would be the perfect partner for Hazard to combine with, he can be the guy to occupy defenders and play the return ball into Hazard during a one two.
    • Because of this, I'm liking the idea of having a left sided IFs and a DLFs/a in the middle. If i have Higuain dropping a bit deeper, I woudn't want to have an AMC, as this would put 2 other players in the postion that Hazard is going to be looking to move into.
    • Higuain is also going to be looking to break the offside trap, so we should see some nice variations between Higauin dropping deep and offering a combination play, and Higuain playing on the shoulder of the CB, waiting for him to cover for a Fullback that Hazard has just beaten.
  • Pedro
    • On the right wing, I had a choice between Pedro and Willian. The reason I'm going to use Pedro, is because he's much more direct and has good off the ball to get into the box and take shots. Willian is more of a creator. I didn't think I needed another creator as both Higuain and Hazard prefer to be supporting players who play others in.
    • Pedro's good movement also gives me a chance to utilize through balls. Ideally, through Hazard's dribbles, players from the right side of the pitch should be dragged over to the left to cover for anyone that Hazard has dribbled past, this should leave space for Pedro to exploit.
      • After either a combination, or 1v1 from Hazard, Pedro should be fast to get into the box for a potential cutback, along with Higuain.

image.png.5ea708822dd03100fbac12b00463773e.png

After deciding on my front 3, the ideas for the rest of the tactic came fairly easily and were pretty self explanatory

  • With a front 3, I had 2 obvious choices for a formation. 433, or 343. I went with a 433 purely because it can accomodate Jorginho as a DLP. With his excellent passing, he can allow us to play out the back fairly easily, which is important if we want to dominate the ball
  • My 2 highest ability players for the central midfield duo were Kante and Kovacic. Kante being more of the workhorse and Kovacic being more technical.
  • I opted to play Kovacic on the right of the pairing for 2 reasons. 
    • He has 17 for passing and likes to run with the ball often. Because of this, I would like him to be near Pedro. This gives us a nice Creator-scorer combo for through balls on the right side. I can see him running with the ball and drawing a marker, which leaves space that Pedro could exploit.
    • I wanted to give Hazard as much space as possible on the left side, because of this, it didn't make sense to put another player whos looking to get on the ball and make things happen. It made more sense to put a player on the left side of midifeld who's looking to do the 'dirty work' and not get too involved in the attack.
    • Role ideas could be BBM --- MEZs

I didn't put so much effort into thinking about the back four. Although one thing I though that was important for the tactic would be to have an attacking right back who stays wide. This is to recieve the switches of play from Hazard on the left. The wide full back would also hopefully pull out the opposition's full back, leaving a channel for Pedro to exploit and recieve through balls in. Because of this, I won't play Azpilacueta, as Zappacosta is more attacking - even if he might not be as good overall. I will also ask him in the PIs to stay wide so that the switch of play can be as effective as possible.. My left back should be more conseravite, as I don't want him to bring opposition markers into Hazard's space. I also want him to cover for Hazard.

image.thumb.png.3182af51ddc5a08f19d829da7d98df3e.png

 

Here are the roles I've selected for the first XI. I've noticed that we only have 1 attack duty. This is something I'm going to look out for if we're lacking penetration. If we're lookng blunt in the first game, I will change one of or both of Zappacosta and Higuain to attack duties. Zappacosta on attack would also give us more oppertunities to overlap. The reason I've started him on support, however, is because I'm worried that on attack, he would be too far forward to be found by Hazard's switch of play. I also need to look out for a potential lack of width on the left side. I have two options to combat this if I think it's becoming a problem, either increasing our team width or by asking Emerson to be a higher mentailty role such as FBa or WBs, although this may make Hazard's space a little cramped.

*Note that Higuain likes to beat the offside trap. This means that it is likely that for periods of the game, we will push up against the opposition's defensive line and act like an attack duty player anyway.

 

In terms of instructions, I can't think of any in particular that that would help us. I'm happy enough with the roles and the quality of the players to 'let them do there own thing' for the most part. The only instructions I'd use are those that would help us keep possession and be on the front foot

  • Play out of defence
  • Higher line of engagement + DLine
  • More intense pressing
  • Work ball into box
    • This is because we don't have many players who are good at shooting from distance, we also don't want to cross the ball so much
  • Counter press
  • GK distribution to CBs
  • Potentially hold shape when in transition, however we definiately won't use Counter, as the majority of our attacking players aren't very fast

With this set up, we have tried to utilize 4 different attacking patterns, hopefully this means that we won't be 1 dimensional and can still create lots of chances, even when the other team gives us no space,

I'll try to analyse some games in the next post. Fingers crossed we'll see some of the patterns I set out to achieve and won't be stuck with my ususal 0-0's when I'm a bigger side :lol:

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by Jack722

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On 24/04/2020 at 15:26, Jack722 said:

Hi KrKAlex, I've noticed that PPMs always override the role the player is playing and the Team instructions you are using. So, as long as you have one player that has Switches ball to other flank, then he will always look to try this move, regardless of how short you want your team to play passes

Ok, thank you for your answer. I am going to try to implement it. However, with my poor staff in 3rd division, teaching a PPM can take some time!

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I was thinking about how to apply this yesterday for my Liverpool save on FM19.  I came up with a lot of similarities to yours @Jack722 but I notice some big differences (mostly in midfield).  I am using the same formation (4-3-3).

 

Up top, I am obviously trying to use Firmino (CF), Mane (LW) and Salah (RW).  I have the same roles for CF and LW (DLFs and Ifs) but I am considering whether to put RW on IFa or Raumdeuter.  I will experiment with this and see what happens.  Now I think about it, I wonder what would happen if I play Salah as another forward, such as an AF or a poacher and leave the RW empty.  Might that allow for more penetration and give more space for the RCM and RFB?

 

In midfield, I wondered whether to have an AP on the left side of CM.  This would allow an overload on the left and give a chance for a through ball to Salah.  I have no idea whether to make this an APa or Aps but again I can experiment.  I guess another option is to have a non-playmaker role here with changes to their PPMs to encourage the through ball, but as you state have a playmaker here would encourage the ball to this side (a ball magnet).  I guess I want to avoid the ‘exploit the left flank’ at the moment to allow for versatility.  Lallana might be the best option here.

 

On the right side of CM, I am a little torn here.  My thoughts are either go with a BBM to try and have an overloading run, or keep things much simpler and have something like a CMs as a second out ball and for extra protection.  Both Keita and Wijnaldum would be suitable for this (actually Henderson too). I have kept your idea of a DLPd, but I might experiment with a DLPs just to see what it offers here.  This would be Henderson's position.  I wonder if the DLP could be moved from DM to CM, again it will be worth experimenting with.

 

In CD I have the same as you, but I am also thinking about the FB position.  Liverpool’s FB have ‘get further forward’ so I think maybe just have WBs here.  I am less worried about crowding the LW so this can add to the overload on the left (and possibly to a cutback from Robinson to Salah) and Alexander-Arnold can be the width on the right (but I can’t remember if he has the 'cuts inside' ppm).

 

My thinking is then I would have:

Overload

Through ball

Switch of play

Third man combination

Possibly an overloading run

 

I am not sure if I am attempting too much here, but I am quite excited about the role of Firmino here, basically where he goes can run what the team does.  If he goes to the left side, then the team can look for an overload, through ball or switch of play (the slow approach).  If Firmino goes right then the team can look for a combination play and release Salah quickly (the fast approach).  If Firmino stays central then either it can start an overloading run (if I decide to use that) or the team can use Firmino’s intelligence and he can choose to either slow down the play and go left or play the ball back deep, or go fast and release Salah or keep going himself.

 

I am still working on team instructions! 😉

 

For your team Jack, do you think that having Hazard on a playmaker role might be beneficial as it will get him the ball more?  Also, how would you change things if certain people are not available?  I mean if Pedro is out, then Willian may not be able to do the same thing (He might be ok for a Hazard replacement).  Would you look to another player and just keep things as they are?  For Liverpool, if Firmino is out, then I have to think a bit.  I am not sure Origi can play that role, so either I have to consider other players (Lallana or Shaqiri maybe) or look to change the role.

 

Like you said, this does allow for more interesting player development, it gives a clear identity to what I want people to do.  It does give me a quandary though when I can see a person fulfilling multiple roles, I guess I need to lay off the PPMs for them!

 

Also, does anybody have ideas for other 'attacking patterns' we could consider?

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Posted (edited)

Well, I had a go yesterday, and it was pretty much a disaster.

Ill start with the positives

  • We didn't concede any goals and hardly any chances
  • We won every game

However, I wasn't looking for good defensive performances, this thread was about breaking teams down. 

The problem is, I didn't see any patterns that I was hoping to see. Every goal was either a penalty or a long shot. If I had good longshot takers and I set my team out to create space for longshots, I wouldn't mind, but our goals came from Emerson, Kante and Hazard. None of them have a longshot attribute of above 12. This isn't sustainable. At some point today or tomorrow, I'm going to reload the save and have another try with a few changes, I will also try and post some screenshots of the issues.

Here is what I noticed.

  • The ball didn't get to Hazard nearly enough
    • This is an issue because most of the attacks that I wanted to use involved Hazard
    • I have 2 options to combat this, the first is to give Hazard a playmaking role, the reason I won't do this is because I know that playmakers will gravitate towards the ball a lot, often coming very centrally. This means he wil drift into more restricted space. Instead I will ask my team to exploit the left flank 
  • Higuain dropped way too deep for my liking
    • He often dropped into central midfield to find the ball. This shouldn't be needed, as our midfield three should be more than enough to win the possession battle against low blocks
    • This also meant that Hazard never really had anyone to play combinations with
    • To combat this, I will set Higauin's role to DLFa. And if that still drops too deep, I will experiment with a TM role. I'm reluctant to use a complete forward role, as they roam too much, or an AF, as they won't look to hold up the ball.
  • Not always dominating the ball
    • In a couple of the games, we struggled for even 50% possession
    • This means that we have less time to produce our patterns
    • Sometimes possession can be seen as a negative, but as we don't have the pace to play on the counter and run in behind, I want as much of the ball as possible
    • To address this, I will bump up all my pressing instructions: Intensity, LOE, and DLine
  • My right wingback wasn't in a position for the switch of play most of the time, he was far too deep
    • As support duty wingbacks only push up high when it's safe and necessary to do so, Zappacosta was often quite low on the field when the ball was on the opposite flank, as his side of the field wasn't making the attack
    • I want to make sure he is a bit further up, either by changing him to a WBa or FBa or CWB
  • Hazard not attempting any 1v1s
    • I wonder if this is a problem with the ME, because when I think about it, I rarely see attacking players taking on there full back, or maybe I just struggle to see it as I watch in 2d and to me it might look like the fullback only being beaten for pace.
    • I don't really know how to improve this one, maybe I'll experiment making the left sided full back a more attacking player, this may force the opposition fullback further outisde, creating more space, as long as the other team's winger doesn't track back
    • I could also ask Hazard to stay wider, and try and drag the fullback out that way.

If anyone has any ideas then let me know, as I am struggling at the moment.

Edited by Jack722

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@Andros

I talked about maybe making Hazard a playmaker in my previous post. I think I'll give it a go if exploiting the left flank still doesn't give him the ball enough.

In terms of availability, that is a good question :lol:. Obviously, if I was doing a full season with Chelsea and Hazard got injured, my plans would go out the window. Chelsea luckily have quite a few like-for-like replacements on the bench who can do a similar job to the first teamers. For example, Giroud can play a similar hold up role to HIguain with his strength and teamwork. Kovacic could also be replaced by Barkley or RLC. If Jorginho got injured, I would problably keep everything the same but move to a 343 and ask Luiz to play as a Libero.

I think that if I was doing this long term, I'll just make sure that every key player has a like for like replacement on the bench. Either by bringing in an older player at the start of the season who doesn't mind sitting out for most of the year, or a youngster who his happy with games off the bench to develop. I guess with Chelsea, I could start training Hudson Odoi to play a similar role to Hazard and for him to learn similar PPMs.

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Posted (edited)

Have you tried bump up team mentality to attacking? Your midfield is quite conservative and you have only one player who attacks the space. You need players who can strach opponent and make space for Hazard. By looking at your setup, Pedro is the only one who is in position to score, everybody else are creators - more or less. By bumping up team mentality, the ball will reach Hazard much quicker, something that can solve your problem involving Hazard more in the game.  My experience after the last patch is that I have better results with higher mentality and higher tempo. It may have something to do with improved positioning for defenders and you need to move the ball quicker to be able to brake the down opponents defence. You will be able to keep the ball effectively with the good team as Chelsea, despite for attacking mentality. The majore change by bumping team mentality to attacking is that your fullbacks, and the two midfielders, will change their individuel mentality to positive, while Higuain change his individuel mentality to standard (if I remember corectly). Your tempo will be higher, your players more aggresive in pressing and passing more direct.

Edited by jascko

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17 minutes ago, jascko said:

Have you tried bump up team mentality to attacking? Your midfield is quite conservative and you have only one player who attacks the space. You need players who can strach opponent and make space for Hazard. By looking at your setup, Pedro is the only one who is in position to score, everybody else are creators - more or less. By bumping up team mentality, the ball will reach Hazard much quicker, something that can solve your problem involving Hazard more in the game.  My experience after the last patch is that I have better results with higher mentality and higher tempo. It may have something to do with improved positioning for defenders and you need to move the ball quicker to be able to brake the down opponents defence. You will be able to keep the ball effectively with the good team as Chelsea, despite for attacking mentality. The majore change by bumping team mentality to attacking is that your fullbacks, and the two midfielders, will change their individuel mentality to positive, while Higuain change his individuel mentality to standard (if I remember corectly). Your tempo will be higher, your players more aggresive in pressing and passing more direct.

Definately something I'm going to try. At the moment I am using positive, however I was already worried about lack of penetration, and was reluctant to change my roles due to my thinking behind them. Changing to attacking could easily give us the extra penetration without changing the idea of the tactic too much :thup:

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@Jack722 It seems you are doing well in terms of identifying problems (something I have struggled with!).   let's see how your changes go.

 

Would it be worth going through them one by one and trying to fix them rather than all at the same time?  I mean then you can see what affects your decisions make.  For example: you could focus on Hazard first (as he is the key player) and see if you can get him right and then move onto Higuain.  I think Cleon used to be big on making one change and seeing what happens (or Rashidi, sorry memory is a little fuzzy here).  I mean the aim of this save seems to be get the tactic right, then maybe you can start a real save using it later.

 

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1 minute ago, Andros said:

@Jack722 It seems you are doing well in terms of identifying problems (something I have struggled with!).   let's see how your changes go.

 

Would it be worth going through them one by one and trying to fix them rather than all at the same time?  I mean then you can see what affects your decisions make.  For example: you could focus on Hazard first (as he is the key player) and see if you can get him right and then move onto Higuain.  I think Cleon used to be big on making one change and seeing what happens (or Rashidi, sorry memory is a little fuzzy here).  I mean the aim of this save seems to be get the tactic right, then maybe you can start a real save using it later.

 

Yes good idea, infact I think the first change I'll make will just be to raise my mentaity to attacking, seeing as two of my problems stem from players not being high up enough. I also remember some people saying that if you use lots of support duties, then the average support duty will have there mentality raised a little, to composate for the lack of designated players being asked to be more attacking

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8 hours ago, Andros said:

Now I think about it, I wonder what would happen if I play Salah as another forward, such as an AF or a poacher and leave the RW empty.  Might that allow for more penetration and give more space for the RCM and RFB?

Rashidi did this in FM18 to great effect - Firmino as DLF (STC), Salah as AF (STCR), Mané as AP (AML). If you were to do this I’d advise mimicking him and having a conservative midfield role on the right of the 3 (he used DLP-Su next to a holding player I believe), which would then allow you to still play Alexander-Arnold quite aggressively to get width. 

You wouldn’t necessarily go for possession play here, more of an aggressive strategy like in real life. 

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In FM19, Hazard found his niche as an Advanced Playmaker (I played him on attack duty) played in the AML/AMR slot, he could perform equally well on either wing. In a 433, one method of making overloads (and thus freeing up space on the other half) is to pair him up with a Roaming Playmaker on his side of the midfield, thus enabling two of the patterns you outlined (overloads and switches of play). 

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This was a really well structured post, it's kinda like a lines and diamonds for attacking scenarios. I wish there was a post just like this for defensive scenarios as I find myself conceding all sorts of types of goals and not always knowing what team instructions or tactical setups would remedy these scenarios.

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Posted (edited)

If your playing a 433 I strongly recommend using Attacking mentality as it will push up your CMs more for that essential movement into the AM void. I often push this further by using very aggressive CM roles (CM-A or Mez). It also helps make your deeper forwards (F9/DLF etc) pose more threat. If your on FM19 I'd also recommend a Treq in one of the AM-R/L positions, this role worked wonders for me in every tactic I created in FM19, it doesn't posses the same all round qualities in FM20 for some reason (maybe since they introduced IW there).

 

Generally in this years game I'm struggling more than ever to make the roles do what I'm used to or even do what I want entirely. It's like I'm having to re-learn a lot of the roles again and how they perform on the pitch. This is annoying as its what made me good at the game, understanding what the roles do on the pitch IS the game in my eyes. I'm a little like you in that I'm still winning but Its frustrating not seeming what I intended or what I expect

Edited by scwiffy

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Posted (edited)
30 minutes ago, scwiffy said:

If your playing a 433 I strongly recommend using Attacking mentality as it will push up your CMs more for that essential movement into the AM void. I often push this further by using very aggressive CM roles (CM-A or Mez). It also helps make your deeper forwards (F9/DLF etc) pose more threat. If your on FM19 I'd also recommend a Treq in one of the AM-R/L positions, this role worked wonders for me in every tactic I created in FM19, it doesn't posses the same all round qualities in FM20 for some reason (maybe since they introduced IW there).

 

Generally in this years game I'm struggling more than ever to make the roles do what I'm used to or even do what I want entirely. It's like I'm having to re-learn a lot of the roles again and how they perform on the pitch. This is annoying as its what made me good at the game, understanding what the roles do on the pitch IS the game in my eyes. I'm a little like you in that I'm still winning but Its frustrating not seeming what I intended or what I expect

I haven't had another go yet, but I like your suggestions. I think that when we are camped in the opposition half, it's a bit redundant having a designated ball winner, especially in the more advanced part of your midfield three. I think in my next try, I will pair Kovacic with Loftus Cheek or Barkley insted of Kante, as I believe both provide more of a threat going forward that Kante does.

I also don't think my vision of Hazard taking on - and beating lots of defenders was quite accurate. So I think instead I will push up the left back further just to create an overlap, which can distract the defence away from Hazard a bit more so that he has more freedom to use his flair. I will also try him as a trequartista, as I didn't see him on the ball enough on the left, despite 'exploiting the left flank' so maybe it's a better idea to let him float around to find the ball himself, and let the left back provide width.

I also didn't realise quite how fast Hazard was, I don't watch Cheslea games, and always thought he was a Messi-like player. Very agile and good at dribbling, but not the fastest. So maybe I'll drop the LOE a little and increase our passing directness and tick counter, to make us a little more direct and use Hazard's pace on a counter attack.

Edited by Jack722

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4 hours ago, Jack722 said:

I haven't had another go yet, but I like your suggestions. I think that when we are camped in the opposition half, it's a bit redundant having a designated ball winner, especially in the more advanced part of your midfield three. I think in my next try, I will pair Kovacic with Loftus Cheek or Barkley insted of Kante, as I believe both provide more of a threat going forward that Kante does.

I also don't think my vision of Hazard taking on - and beating lots of defenders was quite accurate. So I think instead I will push up the left back further just to create an overlap, which can distract the defence away from Hazard a bit more so that he has more freedom to use his flair. I will also try him as a trequartista, as I didn't see him on the ball enough on the left, despite 'exploiting the left flank' so maybe it's a better idea to let him float around to find the ball himself, and let the left back provide width.

I also didn't realise quite how fast Hazard was, I don't watch Cheslea games, and always thought he was a Messi-like player. Very agile and good at dribbling, but not the fastest. So maybe I'll drop the LOE a little and increase our passing directness and tick counter, to make us a little more direct and use Hazard's pace on a counter attack.

Nice. Yeah I don't think dribbling in FM resembles real football enough, either that or it just mentally scars me each time a player runs into a defender for the 5th time in a row (although o be fair I think its slightly better in this years game). For me 1v1 or passing your man isn't a tactical option in FM but as I said earlier, but that forces you to be a better manager/tactic creator so :)

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Posted (edited)

Hey @Jack722, great post! I wasn't even aware of the Lines and Diamonds guide so thank you for bringing that to my attention. I'd like to contribute to this thread with a post of my own based on a few of the attacking patterns you've spoken about. What did you use to create the team sheet with the player roles and movements?

Edited by camoulton21

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32 minutes ago, camoulton21 said:

Hey @Jack722, great post! I wasn't even aware of the Lines and Diamonds guide so thank you for bringing that to my attention. I'd like to contribute to this thread with a post of my own based on a few of the attacking patterns you've spoken about. What did you use to create the team sheet with the player roles and movements?

Thanks,

The website is here

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Posted (edited)

Finally getting somewhere...

On my third try, I (finally) saw a performance that I was happy with, as we beat a very defensive Southampton 4-0, with some brilliant goals.

1354519977_Saintsformation.thumb.PNG.a416f42167123cb0b2ee348f0a4e6cef.PNG

898200683_Playerstats.thumb.PNG.e02edf1d428d87bb6942982bbbdb43b4.PNG

  • I clearly outlined Hazard to be the main component of our attack, and we got a man of the match performance from him
  • I was hoping that Pedro could be the main scorer of the side by using his excellent off the ball and he delivered with 2 goals. (Despite losing 16 minutes after me forgetting to start him :rolleyes:)
  • Higuain was meant to be the man to provide the link and support Hazard, and he made a key pass
  • Kovacic, the man to provide through balls, also provided a key pass and created a chance.

 

The changes

I decided to scrap the 433 and change the DLP (sorry Jorginho) into a third CB. There were a few logical reasons behind why I did this.

  • Chelsea are strongest attacking the wings. Both full backs have the trait gets forward whenever possible and Hazard only has 12 work rate, so he's not going to be at his best when tracking back. The central CB allows the outer CBs to spread further wider and cover the wing backs, allowing the wing backs to have a solid base to go forward. The DLPd covers the wingbacks to an extent, but he is there mostly to cover the middle, where we have Kante who can win the ball back easily with 20 tackling. Jorginho also isn't known for his defensive work.
  • 264785450_Exploittheflanks.thumb.PNG.84e7a64ab6ecace4b2ddf559530a014f.PNG
  • You can see how much, from the heat map, that we attacked down the flanks, especially the left side, with Hazard.
  • Playing with 3 centre backs allows Luiz to express himself more. Luiz has relatively poor concentration and Positioning for a title challenging defender. Giving him an extra CB to cover for him masks his inabilities a little.
  • Luiz also has the traits Tries long range passes and Gets further forward. The long passes are important because we can catch a defence off guard before they have settled, and by passing any kind of high or mid block. Higuain also has good enough Bravery, Balace, Strength and first touch to win and control these long passes. Using this, we can instantly get in between the lines of a teams defence in one pass. Higuain can then use his excellent teamwork to link up with Hazard. The extra centre back also allows Luiz to get further forward, without being a liability.

I also changed Higuain's and Alonso's roles to an attacking duty.

  • I mentioned why I wanted to do this in an earlier post, and the change worked, he was much more involved in the attacks as a DLFa and didn't get lost in midfield
  • Alonso also provided more support to Hazard, as Hazard wasn't attempting any 1v1's I thought we may aswell try and give him more support and potentially overloads/provide overalps on the left side. Notice Alonso also registered an assist. The 3 at the back change also gave more reason to push Alonso forward.

Change in instructions

  • increased the tempo as well as got rid of all the possession instructions apart from Play out of defence. I also added the Counter TI.
    • This was because, when we were looking to keep the ball, our attacks were far too stale. I believe, to effectivly use possession as an attacking rather than defensive strategy,  it is important to fill your squad with extremely technical players. We have a few more physical players in our XI, such as Kante, and Higuain.
    • The slightly more direct approach also allowed Luiz to use his long passes to a greater effect, and was able to give Hazard more space as we were able to get in behind the midfield line more often, despite southampton using a more defensive formation and a very defensive mentality.
    • I kept play out of defence to make sure that the GK was passing to Luiz, and to let Luiz decide what to do with the ball.

And that was it :thup:

Tactic.thumb.PNG.023dc200d4d3de983c2ca337575eac19.PNG

*Kovacic had the PIs: Take more risks, dribble more. This is because I want him to use his technical ability like a playmaker, but not demand the ball like a playmaker.

Also notice how many times we entered the final third  and how many touches we had in the opposition penalty area - no aimless passing the ball around the box.

Some of the patterns we should see:

  • Combination between Hazard and Higauin
  • Overlap between Hazard and Alonso
    • This leads to a third man combination between the three
  • Switch of play from Hazard to Zappacosta
  • Potential for a break with Luiz's long passes to Huguain
  • Through ball from Kovacic to Pedro, and Potentialy Hazard to either Pedro or Higauin after he cuts inside
    • I believe that width is important for through balls, as this stretches the defence and creates bigger channels for players to run between. We have very good width from our attacking wing backs
  • Pedro should be in a prime position to finish off lots of cut backs from either Hazard for Alonso

Some key goals

562447988_Switchofplay.thumb.PNG.719e3048295ff1cf9dbd33b77b12154e.PNG

Here we have a beautiful switch of play from Kovacic to Hazard. Look how much space Hazard is in when he recieves the ball, he can choose to take on his defender, or spot the overlapping run of Alonso, who has no marker - as the whole Southampton team was sucked in to the attack on the other side. (I had set the tactic up to look for switches of play to the other side, but this will do :lol:) Hazard actually picks out a run from Pedro into the box instead, but the ball was half cleared, and Hazard was able to finish the rebound from inside the box.

This next one was my favourite goal - exacly what I envisioned when I set about making this tactic.

It is a mix of a break, Combination play, and a cut back

1945338738_Goodgoalstart.thumb.PNG.8fa853e272c7e94dc5e0cd0fc884a0f9.PNG

Higuain recieves a long pass in between the opposition's midfield and defence. He then lays it off to Hazard to create a chance with acres of space.960388008_Goodgoalend.thumb.PNG.8d32c73bb07a5f10609977cdc482ac03.PNG

Hazard runs the rest of the pitch and plays a cut back to Pedro, who was making a gut busting run the whole time to make sure he gets into the box.

 

 

 

 

Edited by Jack722

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Posted (edited)

The final goal that I wanted to talk about also came from a switch of play (again from the wrong side :mad:) but this was in combination with an overlapping run as well. And again, Pedro was the one to finish it all off.

1726352686_Finalgoalstart.thumb.PNG.fe15b807d66bb906cb1474875e0cc428.PNG

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*EDIT I didn't realise before, but Kante also has the trait to switch ball to other flank, which is probably why it was happening more from the side that I wasn't expecting.

This was actually a very good exercise for me in breaking down defensive teams. I encourage anyone reading this to contribute to this thread with ideas and analysis, as I've always liked to read these sort of posts myself, and the act of writing about what I'm trying to do forces me to think more and put more effort into analysing what has gone wrong, rather than just getting frustrated and hitting continue :lol:.

 

Edited by Jack722

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@Jack722 great thread mate. Its interesting to see diffrent ways of attacking. Its just sometimes hard to implement such attacking patterns when you’re weaker side in the league. 

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After reading this thread some of the attacking patterns that @Jack722 outlined in his OP reminded me of an article I read awhile ago about Sarri's Napoli. It's no wonder that Napoli played a wonderful brand of football because they employed a wide variety of attacking patterns.

  1. Overloads in the left half-space - Insigne is given freedom to come inside and roam freely from his wing, Hamsik makes forward runs from his midfield position, Mertens can also operate in this area dropping from striker position
  2. Through Ball - Insigne comes inside and can play a lofted pass for Callejon to run on to. Insigne is well suited to making this kind of pass (Strong Playmaking Attributes) and Callejon is well suited to making this run (PPMs Likes to Beat Offside Trap, Moves Into Channels, Cuts Inside)
  3. Overloading Run - Mertens may not be a Target Man but is still comfortable holding the ball up, Hamsik and Alllan are both dynamic midfield players capable of getting forward to support
  4. Overlapping Run - Ghoulam overlaps Insigne as he comes inside
  5. Cutbacks - Overload in the left half-space allows Napoli to unleash Ghoulam down the wing on the overlap
  6. Switch Run - A switch run could be seen as a more adventurous version of a Overloading Run and Hamsik makes more aggressive forward runs than Allan. The movement of Mertens and Callejon could also be described as a switch run

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This thread is brilliant. Probably the best there's been this edition.

@Jack722 Feels like a fresh approach to posting the way in which you start from the base of considering the most common attacking patterns, rather than simply roles, mentality, TI's and the like. With this you show what I feel this forum has lost over the years - once you know how you want to play, the rest just falls into place.

Sure, it can be trial and error and take seasons until you get the right players if you're starting lower down, but in essence knowing what you want/expect to see makes changing stuff easier further down the line. Throwing out a combination of roles/TI's as an abstract helpful post is a bit too gamey for my liking. The OP shows here that football logic still applies very much when you want it to. :applause:

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23 hours ago, Andros said:

any updates @Jack722?

I've actually taken a bit of a break from FM recently, because I tend to go through phases of getting way to into a save sometimes and spend too much of my time here. But seeing as there's still a bit of interest on this post, I'm going to boot up FM touch now and write a follow up

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Posted (edited)

Round 2

After playing as a side with lots of top players with some excellent attributes and complimentary PPMs, I thought that it would be a good idea to play as a lower ability team that may still face low blocks.

The team? Southampton

Why?

  • A mid-table team in the premier league, so when we face other mid table sides at home, or relegation fighting teams, we will still need to rely on our patterns to break them down
  • A team that I have played with many times before, which saves me time identifying my players
  • A very average squad with no stand out players and very few high attributes as well as fewer PPMs to play with.

I've started the game later in the season, where the champions league games are beginning. And we're lucky to have a good string of games against teams (with maybe the exception of Wolves and Bournemouth) where we should be the favourites and can expect to face a more defensively minded team.

image.thumb.png.1daaaacc75a8b20b5e184ca8a03d3e68.png

Key players to build around

  • Nathan Redmond
    • Someone that offers us lots of pace and acceleration, but not much else
    • No massively useful PPms..
    • He offers us a brilliant weapon on the break, definetly a player who will thrive given direct passes and space to run into, but won't be very useful in a slow, possession based side.
  • James Ward Prowse
    • Looks like a typical mid table Deep lying playmaker, until you notice that he has 18 crossing! which is crazy for a mid table team
      • Theres a strong case to play him on the right wing as a wide midfielder in a kind of 'Beckham' sort of role, especially as we don't have a any great right wingers
    • To make the most of his crossing, it's important to make sure we can get numbers in the box. - already giving me ideas for roles and formation.
  • Stuart Armstrong
    • An attacking midfielder with 15 finishing
      • Looks like he could be a very strong goalscoring threat from deep, makes me consider trying to incorporate switch runs / overloading runs.
      • A late runner into the box could also be difficult to track as he may get on the end of a Ward prowse cross.
    • I've played as southampton before on FM19 and I'm sure that Armstrong normally has the trait 'gets into opposition area' but he doesn't in this save.. So it would be importatn to play him in an aggressive role such as a shadow striker  to make sure that he gets into the box
  • Pierre Hojbjerg
    • A deep lying playmaker who is very good on the ball, with good passing, vision and composure
    • with the PPMs tries killer balls, dictates tempo, likes to switch ball to other flank. 
      • He can help us achieve 2 patterns a long with Redmond:
        • Killer balls can help us achieve a break, especially with the pace of redmond running in behind
        • If we are camped around the opposition box, he can switch the play to Redmond to try and leave him with a 1v1 against the keeper or become isolated against his full back, which is where he will be at his best.
      • Because of the switch of play, I want Hojbjerg to play either play in the centre of midfield, or on the opposite side to Redmond.
    • His excellent technical ability is slightly offset by his low defensive attributes, which is why i think it's important to pair him with a more defensive minded midfielder, or play him in a midfield 3.

We have another excellent player in Danny Ings, who can score us goals - but he is very well rounded, so it makes more sense to play him in a role and position that compliments our more 1 dimensional players.

I didn't mention our defenders, but they are also fairly well rounded, so they can also be set to complment the rest of our players.

 

Potential formation and roles:

image.thumb.png.3b185f5909bbd8998f21e6d324624937.png

What does this give us?

  • World class crosses from Ward Prowse should be able to find at least 3 players in the box (Armstrong, Redmond, Ings)
    • An attacking full back behind him was chosen for 2 reasons:
      • JWP lacks the pace and trickery of a traditional winger, the pace of Valery should keep the right side less predictable
      • JWP has great workrate and is a support duty in the CM strata, meaning that he will certainly track back and reduce the chances of us getting caught on the break on the right side
  • An excellent technical playmaker in Hojbjerg who can dictate the play when we have the ball.
    • His attributes and PPMs also give us a few patterns:
      • Long passes, mostly to Redmond, to catch teams on the break ( this can also be seen as a Through ball depending on the situation)
        • These long passes could also find Ings, who as the bravery and strength to either win the pass or the second ball against an opposition CB, he can then hold the ball up for support from Armstrong and Redmond
      • Switch of play to the left flank, ideally to isolate Redmond against his full back, or Redmond has gone too far forward, Bertrand can be the reciever  and maybe Overlap and/or put in a cross
        • Redmond should also be able to perform a cutback into the box after recieving a switch of play. After Redmond's cutback, if Ings is free, he will finish, but if Ing's is being marked, there should be space for Armstrong to make a late run and arrive in the box unmarked.
  • Switch runs with Ings and Armstrong, this will hopefully confuse defenders and make there job more difficult
    • As Ing's role is fairly neutral, he may stay further up and we could see overloading runs instead.
  • Consistent overlaps on the right side
  • Defensive cover from Romeu, who is a natural DM, this cover is much more important for a lower ability team as the opposition is more likely to leave attacking players forward to try hit us on the break.
    • It also gives our midfield the brilliant combo of defensive and technical ability.

 

In terms of Team instructions - I'm not really sure yet, this team doesn't really lend itself to a particular style. The roles and PPMs also should be enough guidance for the players. The only TI I will start with will be Counter, To make sure our players are looking for the runs of Redmond when we win the ball. But other than this, I will set the mentality, Closing down and Passing instructions based on what I see in the first game. 

 

Edited by Jack722

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Posted (edited)
15 minutes ago, Jack722 said:

Round 2

Lots words.

That seems like a really strong setup with Southampton. Hopefully you will do well.

Do you rate the central defenders?

Edited by Djuicer

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2 minutes ago, Djuicer said:

That seems like a really strong setup with Southampton. Hopefully you will do well.

Do you rate the central defenders?

In real life, Stephens and Bednarek have been an excellent duo - Stephens is technical and composed on the ball whereas Bednarek is more of a natural centreback. I would say they -on this game- they are bang average for this level, which is partly why i thought it would be a good idea to have at least one full back on support and a centre mid who is willing to sit back.

They also have Vestegaard, who i will look to bring in if I decide that we should play a lower line, because he has poor quickness attributes, but has 19 jumping reach, so would be an excellent centreback for a team looking to flood the middle and invite crosses. However, he hasn't been very good in real life and I tend to overate both players who are in form in real life, as well as players developed in the academy, which is why Stephens gets the nod for me.

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22 minutes ago, Jack722 said:

In real life, Stephens and Bednarek have been an excellent duo - Stephens is technical and composed on the ball whereas Bednarek is more of a natural centreback. I would say they -on this game- they are bang average for this level, which is partly why i thought it would be a good idea to have at least one full back on support and a centre mid who is willing to sit back.

They also have Vestegaard, who i will look to bring in if I decide that we should play a lower line, because he has poor quickness attributes, but has 19 jumping reach, so would be an excellent centreback for a team looking to flood the middle and invite crosses. However, he hasn't been very good in real life and I tend to overate both players who are in form in real life, as well as players developed in the academy, which is why Stephens gets the nod for me.

I see, Bednarek have impressed me too this season. I find Stephens and him a bit underrated in the game tbh.

Vestegaard is so big. Reminds me in a lot of ways of a worse Mertesacker.  As you said he is competent defending deep or to play in a back three. A true specialist.

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We just played against West Ham at home, and although I saw some things that I liked, there's still a lot of imporvements to be made. At half time, we were a goal down and had no shots on target, but after some small changes, we really turned the game around and created 2 clear cut chances before scoring the equalizer. I'm planning on iterating this West Ham game a few times so that I can make the right changes.

What is fascinating is watching Ward Prowse play as a wide midfielder. It's a role that doesn't get used that much, and in the game I just played, despite being second best for the most part, it felt like we had a prime David Beckham in our team. The long passes and crosses were absolutely ridiculous, he also created by far the most amount of chances, as well as getting the assist.

image.thumb.png.35eef66da068c3c0a32750b11140cda5.png

 

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4 hours ago, Jack722 said:

 

 

Potential formation and roles:

image.thumb.png.3b185f5909bbd8998f21e6d324624937.png

 

 

Looks good. I tried a very similar formation on my Lyon save.

I'll be interested to see how much success you get from your SS. Also you CM-D wont really go back how your arrow suggests, instead they will be pretty static, sounds boring but works really well in with only 2 in centre of midfield, allowing the other player to be a runner or playmaker, essentially working like a DM but in the CML/R position

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Posted (edited)

Preliminary analysis

After reloading the save a few times due to not being happy with how the tactic played, we had a good performance. I was originally hoping to dominate the game like we did when I was Chelsea, but i quickly realised that that was not realistic, as West Ham have an equal reputation to Southampton, so we can't expect them to sit back and force us to break them down, despite us being at home.

This time round, we had a poor first half again, but after changing the role of the striker, we were the much better team in the second half, winning 3-1. I also saw a lot of the patterns which I set out to achieve with the tactic, which is more important than the result. Hopefully, when we play against of the some lesser teams coming up, such as Swansea and Burnely, we can be the dominant team and use our patterns to greater effect.

image.thumb.png.6c362be2be819eacd0d150b44565d2d5.png

If you look at the player stats from the game. Apart from Hojbjerg, every attacking player that I outlined in the most recent post produced some sort of output. Goals from Armstrong and Redmond, both were players that I wanted to see be direct and get into the box, a goal and an assist from our supporting striker (Ings got injured late on, so Gallagher came on and played the same role). And another brilliant creative performance from Ward Prowse.

The changes

during the first game against West Ham, where we drew 1-1, I made a couple minor changes, and that was really all it took to dramatically turn out performances around. The roles stayed exactly the same, but all I did was change out mentaility and defensive instructions

  • I moved the mentailtiy from standard to control, just to encourage some more direct passes from Hojbjerg and Ward prowse, as well as ask our team to be more proactive, as I felt we were sitting back too much and inviting too much pressure
  • Added the TIs:
    • Get stuck in
      • Purely due to our player's collectively high bravery and aggression
    • Counterpress
      • Partly due to our striker, Ings, having 16 work rate and a high bravery and aggression, he is a good player to lead a press and try to win the ball back quick after losing it
      • I would probably remove this if we play against a stronger team, or a team that is very good at playing out the back.
    • More Intense pressing
      • There wasn't really much to this instruction, it was mostly due to our team having very low possession stats and being put under lots of pressure, I also didn't fancy reducing the passing length and tempo seeing as we had good long passers and the pace of Redmond.

image.thumb.png.2f5849d116564e1269722589aa3a10ae.png

*I don't normally set out making a tactic so that it will be balanced, but the balance normally comes anyway once I'm thinking about ways we can attack and how to avoid getting caught on the break. Notice a defensive minded midfielder covering for a slightly adventurous left flank of an attacking winger and a wingback, also notice the attacking full back on the same side as a relatvely conservative right flank of 2 lower metality support roles. We also have an attack duty, and therefore penetration on the left flank, right flank, and centre.

 

The goals

785642471_goal1edited.thumb.PNG.4febb08977fec565fa8dfe8651e29c00.PNG

Goal #1 was a brilliant through ball from Ward Prowse to Ings, Ward Prowse out wide not only gave him the oppertunity to use his crossing ability, but it also put him in an area that's less crowded, allowing him to use his excellent passing range to a greater extent, seeing as his is a natural deep lying playmaker. Notice our RIght back, Valery, making an overalapping run. If West Ham's left back closed down Ward Prowse, then it would leave Valery wide open for a pass on the overlap, where he would then be able to pull off a cutback.

35106065_goal2.thumb.PNG.0190d1689d81164aab4ee22011973d93.PNG

Our second goal was a through ball, to Redmond although not from who I was expecting. But it was still a product of our role setup. Having a pacey winger on attack duty means that he is reguarly looking to run in behind, also pushing Betrand to a wider postition as a wingback means that the opposition right back has to think about 2 players to cover.

743250534_goal3.thumb.PNG.298ff71b762f7cb16575c2ab6a03a585.PNG

This goal is a direct product of our switch runs between the shadow striker and the supporting striker. Gallagher (Ings's replacement) uses his strength to hold up the ball from the most attacking position, and waits for Armstrong to run past him. Once Armstrong has passed, Gallagher moves the ball forward.

 

It's fairly obvious from these screenshots that West Ham were playing a high line, so this match wasn't the best to analyse for this thread, because lots of our goals came from through balls behind the high line. We should see a greater variety of patterns if we play against a team looking to sit back a bit more.

 

 

 

 

 

Edited by Jack722

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On 24/04/2020 at 13:16, Jack722 said:

1 v 1s

  • This is a way to give your players the best oppertunity to beat there man by using dribbling or tricks.
  • Taking a defender out the game by dribbling past him can lead to a free shot on goal, or even overloads.
  • 1v1.thumb.PNG.69b4827ca05b687697ae0b5af8ce6e9b.PNG
  • Here we are trying to give our winger as much space as possible to isolate himself against an opposition full back.
  • The use of an AF on the left side will pin back the opposition CB and make them think twice about covering for there full back. 
  • The FBs stays out of the way of the winger and offers an outlet pass to recirculate possession if the dribble isn't on, he also offers cover so the winger as more freedom. Also, if your FB tries to overlap, not only will you lose an outlet pass, you will likely end up creating a 2v2, should the opposition winger track back, which is much harder to dribble through.
  • Useful PPMs and attributes
    • For the winger: Runs with ball often, Tries tricks, Hugs the touchline; Good Dribbling, Flair, Agility
    • For the AF: Moves into channels
  • Useful TIs
    • Play wider, Exploit the flanks

@Jack722

Can this attacking pattern be done effectively with a single striker? From the screenshot it looks a like a 2 striker formation.

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2 hours ago, maztheplaya said:

@Jack722

Can this attacking pattern be done effectively with a single striker? From the screenshot it looks a like a 2 striker formation.

Yes, pretty much any pattern can be recreated using any formation. For the 1v1s, the general idea is that you try to get your skillful winger isolated against his full back, kind of like the opposite of an overload. A one striker formation may even be more effective, as there the winger's flank will be even more vacated

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Great Post! Never Really given this much thought when putting a tactic together! @Zemahh thanks for linking me to this! 

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Great post!

A theory that isn't as importantly discussed is "space". Most people I've seen, often clog roles together in a bid to force "overloads". I say force because you can have players operating within a particular area of the pitch, but relatively "spaced" in other to operate efficiently.

This in mind, however way you play the game, is fine & good. It is in fact, a game. I'm just so obsessed with not seeing two players "on top" of each other than any of such scenarios, & i scrap my whole tactic.

Good example was the "Central midfielders" issue we used to have. My point is, learn what movement PI's & PPMs do. Allow players a lot if space for creative freedom. IF/IW roles have the "stay wider" options. If they start wider, will it be a surprise that they'll be in more 1 v 1 situation? No. F9 needs space in the middle, too.

Play the game & enjoy. But learn movements too. Great post, again!.

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