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[FM20] FIFA World Leagues - A new take on the super league idea.

sporadicsmiles
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Dai35

Dai35

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Hi,

This looks like an amazing idea, i have a few ideas and some questions.

Under 18 and 23 cups is something i think would be good to give the youth teams something else to compete for besides the league titles.

Adding US and Canadian teams would be great (maybe this could be done by adding North and Central America/Canada leagues as every other continent is represented but that 1. The cup competitions would need reworking as a result though.

Is the Premier and First division league cup competition 1 cup or 2, if it is 1 maybe a pre season competition between the 4 league cup winners from the previous season to start the season off kind of like a curtain raiser (like most countries matches between their top league winners and main domestic cup winners)? if not could a random team from a division be picked every season to make up the numbers?

How come the top 2 divisions are 24 teams but every other division is only 16 teams?

is the fact that it is only 5 divisions down to the small number of teams in top leagues on some continents?

Is an identical thing possible for lower division sides (countries respective 2nd divisions and below) with the sides picked and sorted in order of reputation maybe? it would be interesting to see how competitve different countries lower leagues were. i am not asking for this to be done at all, i'm just curious to know if it was possible or would the number of teams in the deafult database from certain continents prevent it.

Many Thanks

Dai

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sporadicsmiles

sporadicsmiles

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2 hours ago, Dai35 said:

Under 18 and 23 cups is something i think would be good to give the youth teams something else to compete for besides the league titles.

This is definitely on my to do list. It is very easy to implement since I can copy existing competition structures and change a few things. I'd like to find a way to implement relegation from D4 in the U23 and U18 leagues, but it will require me to go through every D5 teams and manually add U23 and U18 teams. And this is very dull and long, so I need to be motivated. 

2 hours ago, Dai35 said:

Adding US and Canadian teams would be great (maybe this could be done by adding North and Central America/Canada leagues as every other continent is represented but that 1. The cup competitions would need reworking as a result though.

The Americas are lumped together because it makes things easier if there are four subdivisions to everything. Obviously you could work around it, but it would mean more games in each division, more complicated paths to the playoffs. Which is why I made that choice. I ranked the teams using some rankings for clubs based on performance. I do not know how it works really, but that is why there were no American teams in the pyramid. I have at the moment added NYRB and LA Galaxy into tier 4. Next time I run a test I am also going to try to weed out teams that underperform and try to balance the pyramid based on team strength. So I will also try to balance which countries participate. 

2 hours ago, Dai35 said:

Is the Premier and First division league cup competition 1 cup or 2

I have 2 different cups for each competition. There is a straight knockout cup for all teams in the playable division, and then there is a cup competition for each division. Kinda just fleshes it out and makes up for the lack of continental competitions. 

2 hours ago, Dai35 said:

if it is 1 maybe a pre season competition between the 4 league cup winners from the previous season to start the season off kind of like a curtain raiser (like most countries matches between their top league winners and main domestic cup winners)? if not could a random team from a division be picked every season to make up the numbers?

That could be a nice idea actually. I quite like that. I had ideas of something similar where I grab the winner of each continent's league in each division and have mini continental competitions somewhere. This idea also works, as it gives some prize for winning the league cups. This is something I will play around with for sure to find a good way to do it. 

2 hours ago, Dai35 said:

How come the top 2 divisions are 24 teams but every other division is only 16 teams?

Just to balance the number of games. Each continent has 6 teams in the top two divisions, and you play everyone from your continent twice, and everyone else once. So it becomes a real world league here, playing everyone. 

I made the decision to regionalise more from D2 onwards mostly so that I could get more reams from each continent into the game. So the chances are you can find whatever team you want to play active in the pyramid somewhere. It also makes it pretty challenging to bring a team from bottom to top, and gives a more rounded experience. 16 is then a good number of teams to get a good number of games, plus the cup competitions, without overloading the schedule. 

2 hours ago, Dai35 said:

is the fact that it is only 5 divisions down to the small number of teams in top leagues on some continents?

Actually at the moment it is purely because the number of teams active above D5 perfectly fit into a knockout tournament where each round adds a new set of teams. Adding more leagues makes a more complicated cup, and I just have not wanted to spend time finding a nice format for that. If someone wants to post a good format for the cup with an extra playable (or two playable) divisions, go for it. I also figured that at some point I would be adding extra leagues for the sake of it, rather than to enhance game play. 

2 hours ago, Dai35 said:

Is an identical thing possible for lower division sides (countries respective 2nd divisions and below) with the sides picked and sorted in order of reputation maybe? it would be interesting to see how competitve different countries lower leagues were. i am not asking for this to be done at all, i'm just curious to know if it was possible or would the number of teams in the deafult database from certain continents prevent it.

Yeah that would be possible, there is more than enough teams in the database. I mean the difficult thing I had to work out was getting the teams sorting into the right leagues. Now I know how to do that you can make this work for any format. For example it would be easy to make an NFL clone with this setup. 

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Dai35

Dai35

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1 hour ago, sporadicsmiles said:

This is definitely on my to do list. It is very easy to implement since I can copy existing competition structures and change a few things. I'd like to find a way to implement relegation from D4 in the U23 and U18 leagues, but it will require me to go through every D5 teams and manually add U23 and U18 teams. And this is very dull and long, so I need to be motivated. 

The Americas are lumped together because it makes things easier if there are four subdivisions to everything. Obviously you could work around it, but it would mean more games in each division, more complicated paths to the playoffs. Which is why I made that choice. I ranked the teams using some rankings for clubs based on performance. I do not know how it works really, but that is why there were no American teams in the pyramid. I have at the moment added NYRB and LA Galaxy into tier 4. Next time I run a test I am also going to try to weed out teams that underperform and try to balance the pyramid based on team strength. So I will also try to balance which countries participate. 

Actually at the moment it is purely because the number of teams active above D5 perfectly fit into a knockout tournament where each round adds a new set of teams. Adding more leagues makes a more complicated cup, and I just have not wanted to spend time finding a nice format for that. If someone wants to post a good format for the cup with an extra playable (or two playable) divisions, go for it. I also figured that at some point I would be adding extra leagues for the sake of it, rather than to enhance game play.

That would be good.

i noticed from the screenshots you have shared that there seems to be a slight imbalance with regards to divisions having larger than average numbers of teams from specific countries in them, i noticed it particularly with german teams in divsion 4 (4 compared to 1 from every other country) and the same appears to have happened in division 2 with the english sides (5 compared to the others having 1 or 2 representatives) i didn't check any of the other continents to see if the same was replicated in them. i don't know how you could fix this or whether the issue is the same on other continents also i don't know if/when more divisions were added how this would change but maybe move a few of the teams around and change a few of the lower rep teams where countries have lots of representatives to a similar reputation team from a nation that has few or no representation (e.g. scandinavian teams maybe where the european leagues are concerned to give a wider continental spread) plus it would stop the top divisions containing teams from only a few of the bigger more financially wealthy countries (England, Germany Spain and France) unless you have evened that side out somehow.

The america's league systems seem to all be slightly different in some way with some having it split into 2 sections and others not and some having a few very big teams and the rest made up by smaller teams that struggle a lot due to lack of finances.

just a thought on the cup issue if more divisions were added but could you not maybe add a group stage at the start to cut down some teams, do qualifying rounds similar to what is done in the european continental competitions as well as some countries domestic cups (Champions league and french coupe de ligue spring to mind) to cut down the number of teams, exclude teams below certain divisions from the main cup or split the knockout cup into 2 separate 1's for say division 1-5 and division 6-10 for example?

Many thanks

Dai

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sporadicsmiles

sporadicsmiles

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Quick update on what I have done this weekend.

- Added a cup competition for the U23 and U18. Just a main cup, not one for each league. I feel like that might be overkill.

- Finally fixed the finances. I went through everything and deleted extra payments for U23 and U18 leagues. That should solve this permanently.

- Added NYRB and LA Galaxy to level 4 so we have some US teams.

- Started to think about how to get league winners for all leagues. At the moment I have just ranked teams by the points in the league, but probably I will want to eventually make some extra stage. The issue here is that I have to deal with promotion as well, and the game promotes first and sets teams into the next stage second. So I will try to work on it. At least we have a champion now. 

- Checked compatibility with files for Africa and Japan players. Both work, I will link to them when I update. 

It takes a long time to actually test this database since a season takes a fair bit of time to finish (many games). So it is slow going. Using the test competitions in the editor speeds this up, but I really need to do both. I will keep working on this. Still to do.

- Work out some nice pre season competitions as curtain openers. 

- Decide if I will have championship stages for all tournaments. 

- Try to balance the teams and get rid of anyone who always does crap (I am looking at you Levadia). 

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28618677

28618677

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11 hours ago, sporadicsmiles said:

 

 

 

- Finally fixed the finances. I went through everything and deleted extra payments for U23 and U18 leagues. That should solve this permanently.

 

I play with FC Bayern and have 3 billion for transfer the second season. This situation will not happen with this fix, am I right?

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Stokkmarka80

Stokkmarka80

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I've had a similar idea, allthough slightly different. My idea is to create a top level league with 4 sub-divisions (continental leagues), all of these leagues have 2 or 3 levels below them. The teams from the different continental groups play eachother in the cups, plus one champions cup with the 4 best teams from each continental group. This way you'll still get to use African, American, Asian and European teams and take on the best teams from other continents, even if it will only be in the cups. The best team from every continent will also win a title every year, which is cool. Should probably include a cup for every continent too. Really like your idea, I'll give it a go and test it!

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Shookis

Shookis

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Posted (edited)

@sporadicsmiles Just thinking, I really like the idea of 5 subs allowed that they have at the moment Germany. If I was to introduce this concept to the file would I have to do every league and cup individually? I guess this can be found in the league rules? 

 

oh and one other thing, Which african file did you test? Just want make sure I have the correct one. Thanks!

Edited by Shookis
another question
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Unknown Hacker

Unknown Hacker

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1 hour ago, Shookis said:

@sporadicsmiles Just thinking, I really like the idea of 5 subs allowed that they have at the moment Germany. If I was to introduce this concept to the file would I have to do every league and cup individually? I guess this can be found in the league rules? 

 

oh and one other thing, Which african file did you test? Just want make sure I have the correct one. Thanks!

Changing the subs for all the leagues isn't too time-consuming. You just need to check on each league page which ficture rules they use, and then go into the fixture rules section of the advanced rules panel and change the substitutions section for each set of rules you wish to edit. I'd say it would take about 10 mins.

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Shookis

Shookis

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57 minutes ago, Unknown Hacker said:

Changing the subs for all the leagues isn't too time-consuming. You just need to check on each league page which ficture rules they use, and then go into the fixture rules section of the advanced rules panel and change the substitutions section for each set of rules you wish to edit. I'd say it would take about 10 mins.

@Unknown Hacker nice one! I'll have a look at that. I love giving the youth a chance so five subs will mean I can chuck in a few kids for the last 20 minutes without worrying about being caught out if I get an injury. Cheers

 

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andydick

andydick

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Loving this and really appreciate all the time and effort gone into setting this up.

I've ran it for a few seasons and it's all very good indeed, but wanted to add more options re promotion/relegation whilst also increasing the number of games.  So the plan is to make the Premier and Division One 8 teams per group and expand Divisions Two to Four to 20 teams.  This would give every side a 38 base league game season.  Premier and Divison One would play 14 + 8 + 8 + 8 games (38) and Divisions Two to Four would play 19 x 2 (38).  It would also mean I could relegate 2 from the top 2 Divisions and make the promotion from Division Two to One less daunting - instead of just 1 promotion spot make it 2 - one automatic + 1 via a 2nd to 5th play-off.

I'd (naively) assumed that the configuration changes would be pretty straightforward - the only real effort being the movement of sides up the league ladders with each region moving from 6, 6, 16, 16, 16 to 8, 8, 20, 20, 20.  I moved the highest ranked sides up so the top 2 from Div One moved into the Prem.  The top 4 from Div Two moved into Div One.  Then the top 8, 12, and 16 etc.  Obviously a lot of the Division Five sides that have now moved into Division Four don't have U23 or U18 sides so these will need to be added when I expand the U23 and U18 sections.

I checked under Database | Competitions | FIFA World Premier League and under Teams | Teams and it had the correct number of teams in there (32).  The other divisions were correct too (Div One - 32; Div Two - 80 etc)

All well and good so far.

For the initial configuration changes (promotion and relegation will come later) I thought I'd only have to do this:
 - in the Advanced Rules section update the matrix under Gibraltar | Required Teams and set min teams and max teams to 32, 32, 80, 80, 80
 - in the Advanced Rules section update each high level league (e.g. FIFA World Premier League) under Stage 0 | General, to have the correct Number of Teams.  In this case 32.  Same for the other leagues but teams = 32, 80, 80, 80

image.thumb.png.75aefb8c2220ab282ad4095d99230a03.png  image.thumb.png.8aa4257e43f1855ae955840472227870.png

Now the problem.

When I verify it I get an error and I get the same error when I run an individual Competition test for the "FIFA World Premier League".  Error: "xxxxxx have played more than the max number of games in stage 0 of World Premier League" (xxxxxx is one of the teams in the WPL - it varies).  Stage 0 has been set to 32 teams and the fixture generation process hasn't changed.

image.thumb.png.d59171516604bf0fa830ee0bddf9124e.png

When I look at the output from the Test, under "FIFA World Premier League" the 4 groups are fine (8 teams each) but each team has only played 27-29 games.  Within the Test, under the Rules section each group is stating "Number of Matches: 28 games" which explains why we get the error - as soon as a team goes to play its 29th game it fails.  28 games is significant as it's how many games would have been played when there were 4 groups of 6 (10 + 6 + 6 + 6).  So, there must be a setting still somewhere that is stating 24 teams or 6 groups of 4 etc.  But for the life of me I can't find it.

image.thumb.png.05a0237fe1ab67d83acaa7b667f2a448.png

 

One thing I did do was to revert back to the "Basic Rules" and this does state that the min/max teams in the WPL is 24.  But surely, the Advanced Rules which have been changed to 32 should supersede this.

As said, I'm assuming there's something I missed in the Advanced rules but haven't a clue what !

image.png

image.png

Edited by andydick
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Unknown Hacker

Unknown Hacker

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3 hours ago, andydick said:

Loving this and really appreciate all the time and effort gone into setting this up.

I've ran it for a few seasons and it's all very good indeed, but wanted to add more options re promotion/relegation whilst also increasing the number of games.  So the plan is to make the Premier and Division One 8 teams per group and expand Divisions Two to Four to 20 teams.  This would give every side a 38 base league game season.  Premier and Divison One would play 14 + 8 + 8 + 8 games (38) and Divisions Two to Four would play 19 x 2 (38).  It would also mean I could relegate 2 from the top 2 Divisions and make the promotion from Division Two to One less daunting - instead of just 1 promotion spot make it 2 - one automatic + 1 via a 2nd to 5th play-off.

I'd (naively) assumed that the configuration changes would be pretty straightforward - the only real effort being the movement of sides up the league ladders with each region moving from 6, 6, 16, 16, 16 to 8, 8, 20, 20, 20.  I moved the highest ranked sides up so the top 2 from Div One moved into the Prem.  The top 4 from Div Two moved into Div One.  Then the top 8, 12, and 16 etc.  Obviously a lot of the Division Five sides that have now moved into Division Four don't have U23 or U18 sides so these will need to be added when I expand the U23 and U18 sections.

I checked under Database | Competitions | FIFA World Premier League and under Teams | Teams and it had the correct number of teams in there (32).  The other divisions were correct too (Div One - 32; Div Two - 80 etc)

..........

The maximum games setting can be found at Stage 0 > League Settings (All Groups). There's also a League Schedule of only 28 games within the Stage 0 settings. If you haven't changed this then you're telling the teams to play 38 games (by adding teams to the league) but neither allowing them to play more than 28 games nor giving them a schedule with 38 game dates in it.

If you want to expand the league there's probably other stuff that you'll need to change, but that's what I can think of off the top of my head.

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andydick

andydick

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1 hour ago, Unknown Hacker said:

The maximum games setting can be found at Stage 0 > League Settings (All Groups). There's also a League Schedule of only 28 games within the Stage 0 settings. If you haven't changed this then you're telling the teams to play 38 games (by adding teams to the league) but neither allowing them to play more than 28 games nor giving them a schedule with 38 game dates in it.

If you want to expand the league there's probably other stuff that you'll need to change, but that's what I can think of off the top of my head.

Ahhh that's awesome - thanks.

Not really sure what the purpose of setting the min/max games to 28 (now 38) is so I've removed it to understand it better.  Running a test competition for the Premier league generates the expected 38 game season.  Full file verifies, loads up in FM20 and looks ok at the moment so holidaying to the end of season 1.

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Unknown Hacker

Unknown Hacker

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1 hour ago, andydick said:

Ahhh that's awesome - thanks.

Not really sure what the purpose of setting the min/max games to 28 (now 38) is so I've removed it to understand it better.  Running a test competition for the Premier league generates the expected 38 game season.  Full file verifies, loads up in FM20 and looks ok at the moment so holidaying to the end of season 1.

No worries. Hope it all works out.

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blimey

blimey

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Being enjoying this mod so far. Great work!

But I still see teams receiving bonus money three times at season's end. This practically made every club in the league system super rich after one season. I thought this bug has been fixed in the latest upload, hasn't it?

 

EDIT: It's the TV money you receive at the start of every season. My U23 and U18 teams are each getting 100M for me every year from TV broadcast rights...

Edited by blimey
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lukavski

lukavski

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On 13/11/2020 at 04:51, sporadicsmiles said:

This file kinda got a little orphaned by me this year, with some improvements to be made. I wonder how many would be interested in a reprisal of this file, and what features you would most like to see included?

Hi! I would love to play this custom SuperLeague this year! 
This is the best World League I have seen in all FMs.

Do you have an updated version for FM21?

Thanks a lot, sporadicsmiles

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