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LCFCEaves31

Anyway of stopping AI counter?

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Another problem (one after another with this game...) Injury after injury... I currently have 7 first team players injured, it has been as high as 9... I never have my strongest team available to me. Other than rotation (which is what I do already) can you advise if anything else can be done?

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So, finished the season... finished 2nd. Not great as we were expected to win the league, but it is promotion back to the premier league all the same.

Below are some screenshots I felt were important to share

Tactic - this is what was used for the last 10 - 12 games of the season. Only thing you cannot see there is I have asked the front 3 to press more. Was unsure whether I maybe should ask the AP (a) to as well, never tried it in the end. Taking counter press off seems to have helped with conceding so many goals, except in the 4-4 game (below) against Millwall where we were 4-1 up... If any game can some up my experiences with the last few editions of FM, then it is that. Just when you feel like everything has clicked into place, you get kicked in the stomach.

As you can see from the Results screenshot, still very inconsistent. I have struggled in breaking teams down. It feels (as per my thread title) you have score from the counter attack majority of the time. Is that realistic in todays footballing world? Probably to be fair... And the other goal I see a lot is when I am taking a throw in... all of a sudden that frees up space in the middle of the park, edge of the opponents area, for one of my centre mids to get a shot on goal. Other than that, I really struggle creating clear cut chances (my definition of clear cut, not FM's). 

Any help or advice on this still welcome. If not, this is just me signing out and thanking people for their time in trying to help. I am going for a lie down...

 

Results.jpg

Millwall 4-4.jpg

League Table.jpg

Tactic.jpg

Edited by LCFCEaves31

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On 20/01/2020 at 21:36, LCFCEaves31 said:

Just loaded game up, this is what I've used last couple of games. I thought I had better post it, as I have tried a few different things over last couple of days, I think I had forgotten exactly what I was using! This sometimes changes in game, sometimes the wing backs are changed to WB (s) or (a) as apposed to IWB. And sometimes I play wider... I know things need to be amended slightly in games, depending on what you see or feel is needed, what I am really looking for is a solid foundation to start from (and in the long term, a better understanding of TI's and roles)

20200120203228_1.jpg

 

EDIT: I have just realised I didn't mention how I have changed from Attacking to Positive. I think Attacking was probably a bit of an overkill in terms of the risk we were taking and wasn't helping the issues I have been experiencing. Since then results and performances have improved, we do not look as open. Would still love to hear what you thougth if you have time to watch any of the games. 

The tactic looks alright. Just remove "more urgent" & set it to "default". Give the closing down to your ST, both wingers and both CM's. Leave the rest on default. Try it, for more consistency.

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23 hours ago, LCFCEaves31 said:

As you can see from the Results screenshot, still very inconsistent. I have struggled in breaking teams down. It feels (as per my thread title) you have score from the counter attack majority of the time. Is that realistic in todays footballing world? Probably to be fair... And the other goal I see a lot is when I am taking a throw in... all of a sudden that frees up space in the middle of the park, edge of the opponents area, for one of my centre mids to get a shot on goal. Other than that, I really struggle creating clear cut chances (my definition of clear cut, not FM's). 

I'd say your tactic isn't designed to "break teams down". If the transition into the final third isn't quick I'd expect it to struggle.

Two of your front three are attack duties which I read as wanting quick attacks into space.  Then two of your midfield three are playmakers with the other a BBM.  This will create a more structured approach with the midfield rarely making runs past forwards.

This I think make things a bit easier to defend once they have numbers back and organized.  There wont really be space behind for runs and passes into space.  Speaking of which, your DLF, IF, AP and I think the two IWBs, BPD and SK already try risky passes often, do you need to tell the others to try often as well?  Why have two playmakers wanting the ball to there feet when other players are wanting to play a through ball?  Why play to central defenders with a SK-Su?

Not saying it's bad, just that it's not setup to break down teams.  If want to maximize the setup I'd look to attack faster without shorter passing or work ball into box. Take take with the  all earlier whilst there is still space for your front 3. I'd also adjust the midfield so theres a player pushing higher earlier to support the front 3.  The AP-At does not do that, he will still typically come deep to collect or be behind the ball.  BBM is also more of a late arriver in the final third.

If you want a more pass and move fluid style I think you need to change a lot of roles and duties.

Edited by summatsupeer

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On 25/01/2020 at 10:43, summatsupeer said:

I'd say your tactic isn't designed to "break teams down". If the transition into the final third isn't quick I'd expect it to struggle.

Two of your front three are attack duties which I read as wanting quick attacks into space.  Then two of your midfield three are playmakers with the other a BBM.  This will create a more structured approach with the midfield rarely making runs past forwards.

This I think make things a bit easier to defend once they have numbers back and organized.  There wont really be space behind for runs and passes into space.  Speaking of which, your DLF, IF, AP and I think the two IWBs, BPD and SK already try risky passes often, do you need to tell the others to try often as well?  Why have two playmakers wanting the ball to there feet when other players are wanting to play a through ball?  Why play to central defenders with a SK-Su?

Not saying it's bad, just that it's not setup to break down teams.  If want to maximize the setup I'd look to attack faster without shorter passing or work ball into box. Take take with the  all earlier whilst there is still space for your front 3. I'd also adjust the midfield so theres a player pushing higher earlier to support the front 3.  The AP-At does not do that, he will still typically come deep to collect or be behind the ball.  BBM is also more of a late arriver in the final third.

If you want a more pass and move fluid style I think you need to change a lot of roles and duties.

I guess, because I am now the underdog every week, it would explain why all of a sudden we are scoring.. however we continue to concede bucket loads. We cannot defend corners, there is always someone unmarked. 

We also concede loads from crosses still, back post players unmarked is really bugging me now. 

I have made a similar tactic but try to be more defensive when playing top 6. We were 3-1 up against Chelsea, it seemed to be working perfectly (but as per concede from a corner), but we just buckle. They have better individuals, so it is no surprise, but we keep drawing from winning positions. See below said tactic...

20200126195002_1.jpg

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32 minutes ago, LCFCEaves31 said:

I guess, because I am now the underdog every week, it would explain why all of a sudden we are scoring.. however we continue to concede bucket loads. We cannot defend corners, there is always someone unmarked. 

We also concede loads from crosses still, back post players unmarked is really bugging me now. 

I have made a similar tactic but try to be more defensive when playing top 6. We were 3-1 up against Chelsea, it seemed to be working perfectly (but as per concede from a corner), but we just buckle. They have better individuals, so it is no surprise, but we keep drawing from winning positions. See below said tactic...

20200126195002_1.jpg

Well the 4141 DM Wide is weak on the flanks with the space between the wide forwards and fullbacks, especially the IF-At.  Then playing narrower defensively your kind of giving up crossing opportunities.  Why did you pick that formation rather than a flat 4141 if your trying to keep defensively tight against bigger clubs?

Corner wise I think depends on your teams height and defensive ability.  If your CBs are the only ones with height and jumping ability it can be hard to defend.  How have you set them up?  Maybe add a "Defensive Corner" prep if its hurting your results that much?

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On 26/01/2020 at 21:27, summatsupeer said:

Well the 4141 DM Wide is weak on the flanks with the space between the wide forwards and fullbacks, especially the IF-At.  Then playing narrower defensively your kind of giving up crossing opportunities.  Why did you pick that formation rather than a flat 4141 if your trying to keep defensively tight against bigger clubs?

Corner wise I think depends on your teams height and defensive ability.  If your CBs are the only ones with height and jumping ability it can be hard to defend.  How have you set them up?  Maybe add a "Defensive Corner" prep if its hurting your results that much?

I literally just copied what I had before which has brought some success and thought I would try and make it slightly more defensive. I will try a flat 4-1-4-1 as you have suggested. 

I was also defending Narrow before because too many goals were scored from opposition going through the middle or having all the time in the world to place a shot from edge of the area. Now I have gone narrow and goals are coming from wide... :seagull:

Anyway, will try the flat 4-1-4-1 as suggested, makes sense. 

My corner routine I changed to what Rashidi had mentioned/posted about. It seemed to help slightly, but I am thinking I have a small team. I will have to have a look on comparisons page. 

Edited by LCFCEaves31

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On 13/01/2020 at 21:21, LCFCEaves31 said:

In both FM19 and FM20, I can’t stop being countered? Either a quick ping to the wings or they just lob it in behind and hey presto... goal. I dominate the play, struggle to score and with one counter they do. 

 

On 20/01/2020 at 20:36, LCFCEaves31 said:

 

20200120203228_1.jpg

This is going to sound a bit obvious.  But the key might be as simple as not using a Positive or Attacking strategy. Using those mentalities, then setting your wide player duties to attack or support from the attacking midfield strata, may give those players individual mentalities which are too high for them to consistently track back and provide cover down the flanks. This makes it easier for the AI to  get 1v1s and counter.

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