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Hi everyone I have to say this fm 20 is one of the hardest I’ve played and I’ve played all the way back to champ manager days

Now I’m no expert but got a good track record of getting teams promoted but this version I’m struggling 

sorry I can’t post a screenshot of my tactics as I’m away from the laptop 

At the moment it’s 2021 and I’ve taken over at Newcastle who have recently been relegated to the championship and I’ve overhauled the squad and brought in 6 players and the team is ranked the best in every stat and statistic and promotion should be a formality but I’m struggling so much and I have no idea why as this squad is the best in the league 

We have proven premiership players but can’t get a tactic to gel 

After blowing Derby away first game of the season we have lost our next 4 and seriously need help

My formation and tactics are a basic 4-1-4-1

sw support 

Fb attack

Cd-defend

Cd-defend

lwb-defend

Dm-defend

lw support 

Rcm-dlp support 

lcm-cm defend

Rm-Inverted winger attack

pf support 

not many team instruction apart from high d line and high engament

 

 

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Just to add there’s not many ti

standard passing,standard sometimes quick tempo

high d-line high engagement 

standard width and that’s it

any advice would be great 

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I think the cm's have to static roles for the formation you use, right now all 3 midfielders will sit back, hold shape and shield the defence, when the main point of using a dmc  in this formation is that it will free up the cm's to be more involved in attack play

 

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Sorry meant to say that my lcm is either a mezzala or cm attack 

still really struggling and I haven’t got a clue why as I think my roles and duties are well Balanced any advice would be gladly received 

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Sorry mentality is positive now I’m not sure playing this attacking is the problem as I guess it makes the passing and tempo a lot quicker as I read that the more attacking the mentality the more direct the team becomes?

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On 22/12/2019 at 16:00, Ciderarmy said:

My formation and tactics are a basic 4-1-4-1

 

On 22/12/2019 at 16:00, Ciderarmy said:

I’ve taken over at Newcastle who have recently been relegated to the championship and I’ve overhauled the squad and brought in 6 players and the team is ranked the best in every stat and statistic and promotion should be a formality

If your team is the strongest in the league, why then have you opted for such a defensive formation as the flat 4141?

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I was originally playing a 4-3-3 with a dm but I keep getting hit over the top even though d line was standard probably due to my Xbox sakho not having great pace

So I tried to be more compact to be honest it’s working defensively but scoring is now a major headache as I’ve drawn my last 4 

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I have found that high lines and anything above a balanced mentality are very hard to implement this year. As soon as I changed my 4141 tactic to a standard defensive line on balanced mentality with short passing everything clicked into place, playing very similar to you, OP.

That’s not to say it’ll work for you and your current squad, but for me, having more of the ball, with less chances being created against me from through balls, has made a huge difference. 
 

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18 hours ago, sidslayer said:

I have found that high lines and anything above a balanced mentality are very hard to implement this year. As soon as I changed my 4141 tactic to a standard defensive line on balanced mentality with short passing everything clicked into place, playing very similar to you, OP.

That’s not to say it’ll work for you and your current squad, but for me, having more of the ball, with less chances being created against me from through balls, has made a huge difference. 
 

I keep a standard def line with an attacking mentality.  What I do switch is my line of engagement.  If I want to go defensive, I compress my midfield by dropping the line of engagement from standard.  I'm playing Newcastle with a 541, btw.  With previous versions I used to set up an attacking, balanced and defensive tactic and choose which one to play to start the match.  Now I just have my base tactic and work off of that to start the game.  I don't make in game adjustments based on how the opponent is playing but I do make adjustments based on how I want to play my opponent largely dependent on if I'm superior, equal or inferior.  

 

 

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On 22/12/2019 at 16:00, Ciderarmy said:

My formation and tactics are a basic 4-1-4-1

sw support 

Fb attack

Cd-defend

Cd-defend

lwb-defend

Dm-defend

lw support 

Rcm-dlp support 

lcm-cm defend

Rm-Inverted winger attack

pf support

 

On 23/12/2019 at 17:27, Ciderarmy said:

my lcm is either a mezzala or cm attack 

 

On 22/12/2019 at 16:25, Ciderarmy said:

standard passing,standard sometimes quick tempo

high d-line high engagement 

standard width and that’s it

 

23 hours ago, Ciderarmy said:

mentality is positive

Okay, so this is your setup:

PFsu

Wsu    CM/MEZat   DLPsu  IWat

DMde

IWBde    CDde    CDde     FBat

SKsu

Right?

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2 hours ago, Ciderarmy said:

Hi yes that’s my set up is there anything wrong that I’ve missed 

Nothing particularly wrong in the setup itself (perhaps a couple of tweaks to make it a bit more balanced). But the problem is that it's unclear what style of play you are looking to implement (and why you want that particular style, and not some other). Plus, I don't know your players, so it's difficult to offer a more precise piece of advice on what you could or should change.

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Personally, I'd drop the line of engagement to lower to compact the play and give your players more room to counter attack into.  Supplement this with 'gets stuck in' and 'more urgent or extremely urgent'.

Perhaps consider putting your striker onto an attack duty, and pushing your two wide midfielders into more advanced positions.                                                                                                                                         

Also, I'd have both full backs on support or attack duties as you have two 'sitters' in the midfield. You could control matches with 'shorter passing', 'play out of defence' and 'work ball into box'. 

Edited by silentwars

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Having IWB-De, DM-De and DLP-Su looks a bit static/deep for me in central areas.  PF-Su isn't really a creative role either so I think you might be relying on the dribbling of your wingers and crosses from winger and FB.

As the "best" team in the league I'd look at giving your main creator (DLP?) more options.  This could be by freeing the LB a bit (support duty) and/or playing the DLP in DM then the MCR is a role that doesn't Hold Position and isn't a playmaker so can play closer to the ST.

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On 25/12/2019 at 00:15, melogroovy said:

I keep a standard def line with an attacking mentality.  What I do switch is my line of engagement.  If I want to go defensive, I compress my midfield by dropping the line of engagement from standard.  I'm playing Newcastle with a 541, btw.  With previous versions I used to set up an attacking, balanced and defensive tactic and choose which one to play to start the match.  Now I just have my base tactic and work off of that to start the game.  I don't make in game adjustments based on how the opponent is playing but I do make adjustments based on how I want to play my opponent largely dependent on if I'm superior, equal or inferior.  

 

 

I really love this

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4 hours ago, Rashidi said:

I really love this

Wouldn't he be better playing a high line and trying to dominate possession, as he has the strongest team in the league

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Hi thanks for all the replies so after tinkering I think I have cracked it

I starting playing a high line to try and pin the opposition back but after so many draws and nearly getting the sack I notice that teams were basically sitting deep and being so defensive all most every formation I came up against was a 4-5-1 or a 5-4-1 as we are the best team in the league 

So after playing around with the tactic I now play standard defensive line with lower line of engagement with less urgent pressing and my back 4 on less pressing and front 4 on urgent pressing 

Ive never played this way before but now unbeaten in 16Still not 100 percent happy with the tactics and no idea if this will work in the premiership but I think I will avoid the sack now so thanks everyone for there advice 

By the way what do people do with tactics and transfers when you get promoted as I’ve got a good track record of getting to the. English premiership but once there I really struggle and always jump ship after 2 seasons and never really get the chance to build a project 

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Your patient approach will see you perform a lot more effectively.  The low LOE allows teams to come out and your standard defensive line doesnt' over commit. If you need to switch it up you can I'd probably push the LOE up first.

Once you get promoted, the challenge is actually staying up, that requires a thorough analysis of your squad. In most cases the players you are using won't be good enough to keep you up. They may win a few games, but without strengthening the core of your team you will struggle. IMHO the only way to stay up and do well is to make sure that your players are good enough to achieve those goals. 

I am now in L2 with Kingstonian and after getting promoted I had to get an entirely new backline sans my left back who is only there for speed. My project can really only take off once i establish a presence in a league for at least 2 seasons.

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11 minutes ago, domperignon said:

The game is simply broken and can't be played following real life logics. It's not a better simulation than SWOS. 

It's not difficult, it's simply there is something inherently wrong in the game, how it is modeled, it's basis. I always find myself trying to play against it. If I follow game logics I don't find it enjoyable because it's not playing football or anything similar.

Follow the simple rules of the game and you'll win.

Totally irrelevant to any constructive discussion in this part of the forum. Just because you can't manage by drawing teams out or patiently breaking down defences or taking advantage of spaces created by attacking systems doesn't mean the game is broken, it just means you aren't as good as you think you are.

The game has some issues but its far from broken, any further posts like that which are not constructive will see you issued with a warning. In these sub forums, we have plenty of players who know what they are doing. And if you opt to debate this further you will also receive a warning.

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5 hours ago, Rashidi said:

Totally irrelevant to any constructive discussion in this part of the forum. Just because you can't manage by drawing teams out or patiently breaking down defences or taking advantage of spaces created by attacking systems doesn't mean the game is broken, it just means you aren't as good as you think you are.

The game has some issues but its far from broken, any further posts like that which are not constructive will see you issued with a warning. In these sub forums, we have plenty of players who know what they are doing. And if you opt to debate this further you will also receive a warning.

Blimey, it’s not that bad is it!? Just activate the obligatory ‘ignore’ filter ... :)

Back on topic ... I’m loving the ME at the moment. Last few years ‘Attacking’ has been so dominant as the go to tactic. Not for me so far this year. I haven’t played as a big club yet (doing a journeyman save) and every time I try out an attacking tactic I get punished. I like it. It makes sense that I should lose 4-0 away to Liverpool if I play with an attacking mentality with Villa. What I’ve picked up so far this year is that variation of roles in the tactic and the right lines of engagement and mentality, for the players you have, is very important. Gone are the days of a plug and play tactic that works with any team in any situation. It’s fantastic. 

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17 hours ago, sidslayer said:

Blimey, it’s not that bad is it!? Just activate the obligatory ‘ignore’ filter ... :)

Back on topic ... I’m loving the ME at the moment. Last few years ‘Attacking’ has been so dominant as the go to tactic. Not for me so far this year. I haven’t played as a big club yet (doing a journeyman save) and every time I try out an attacking tactic I get punished. I like it. It makes sense that I should lose 4-0 away to Liverpool if I play with an attacking mentality with Villa. What I’ve picked up so far this year is that variation of roles in the tactic and the right lines of engagement and mentality, for the players you have, is very important. Gone are the days of a plug and play tactic that works with any team in any situation. It’s fantastic. 

Dunno about that. I was struggling like this guy, tried a few downloads to see what they are doing to use as a base for mine, and there are definitely a few plug-and-play tactics that pretty much instantly worked. I think FM will always struggle to eradicate p&p tactics. At the moment, a bit like last year's incarnation, I'm struggling to find a balanced formation. What I mean by that is not one that gets humped every week (obviously), but not one that instantly produces 20+ shots every game. I really tried for a long time to find that in FM19, and never really did. Hope I can this year.

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