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Football Manager 2020 Feedback Thread


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13 minutes ago, StevehFC said:

Just finished my first season and in most leagues in my save. Most strikers have barely scored 15 or more.

Unless you've put the leagues in full detail, it's not a great comparison. Your own will be. It's partially also how AI managers set up. I've seen a Bournemouth striker get 27 in a season, but in a 442, so it shows that AI line striker formations could maybe do better.

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1 minute ago, HUNT3R said:

It's not. Factually, that's not close to correct.

Have to agree here,  witnessed no problems with it on previous ME. There weren't too many and I've seen them scored regulary for me and AI. 

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8 minuti fa, HUNT3R ha scritto:

Unless you've put the leagues in full detail, it's not a great comparison. Your own will be. It's partially also how AI managers set up. I've seen a Bournemouth striker get 27 in a season, but in a 442, so it shows that AI line striker formations could maybe do better.

I played 6 years in my save. 

In Hungary top division the year where top goalscorers score most Is one of the worst in 50 years. The worst year Is the worst in 100 years.

Look for top nation, in 6 years nobody score more than the worst record in european Golden shoes.

In 6y In english premier League the the biggest record Is 23 (that take It single, it's ok, the last y irl were 22, but as the best in 6y Is bad)

 

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I have a suggestion for the devs. Why not make the latest ME you develop inhouse available for people inside the beta program in steam.

Or perhaps I´m stupid here and if the game has been fully released the beta program is no longer a possibility?

 

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1 hour ago, akkm said:

his point was valid to raise in the context of the issue about lack of creativity in the engine. 

I never said his point wasn't valid, it was the circumstances in which he chose to bring this up that I found strange. It was one of these three scenarios.

1. He's noticed this pro-actively, and has raised a bug report on it 

2. He's noticed it, and decided to share it on the feedback forum as a standalone post

3. He's replied to a post showing the match engine looking fantastic to moan and pick holes in it. 

Guess which one? I've made it easy for you. 

Let's leave it at that, this is supposed to be for feedback, not me constantly having to explain points that are being spectacularly missed. 

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27 minutes ago, FlorianAlbert9 said:

I played 6 years in my save. 

In Hungary top division the year where top goalscorers score most Is one of the worst in 50 years. The worst year Is the worst in 100 years.

Look for top nation, in 6 years nobody score more than the worst record in european Golden shoes.

In 6y In english premier League the the biggest record Is 23 (that take It single, it's ok, the last y irl were 22, but as the best in 6y Is bad)

 

Again, there's a big difference between a league which has matches simulated in full detail and those which aren't. You haven't mentioned this even though you quoted my post saying that it's an important point. I've listed that AI lone strikers struggle. I've listed that AI 2 striker formations  seem to be better.

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6 minuti fa, HUNT3R ha scritto:

Again, there's a big difference between a league which has matches simulated in full detail and those which aren't. You haven't mentioned this even though you quoted my post saying that it's an important point. I've listed that AI lone strikers struggle. I've listed that AI 2 striker formations  seem to be better.

In Full Detail i had often the worst cases, but chancing make very little difference.

The fact that the AI 2 striker formation seems better is also a ME issue. 

The AI struggles to score is very common in every FM (in 10 years SI didn't succeeded to replicate Messi, CR7 or even Lewa or Suarez), but in this edition it Is at his worst. 

(A part that i like the ME and find It maybe the best)

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Again all, keep the thread on topic and, really, enough with the sniping at each other. There's people sitting on posting restrictions as it is, and if some others aren't getting they'll be joining them. God knows we've asked people to show basic decency and maturity enough times now. 

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12 hours ago, DP said:

I just want to see goals that look like those scored in real life. If you watch real life matches the types of goals that are scored are almost impossible to replicate in the ME and those we see in the game are generally all similar. The variety just isn’t there at all. 
 

Hard thing to get right and probably needs a completely new engine but it’s way off at the moment in terms of variety. 

Just watching the Liverpool game. 
 

Both those goals just scored are completely impossible to replicate in the engine. 
 

Until it’s able to simulate more goals from real life it will be seriously lacking, unfortunately. 

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8 minutes ago, steviemay17 said:

anyone else having issues with matches being crazy slow and laggy after that minor update? I'd finally managed to get it running smoothly and it's got ever worse

Shouldn't be the case, afaik there were no updates to cause that... You on a laptop? updated graphics drivers? if it's a laptop are you plugged in?

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1 minute ago, Welshace said:

Shouldn't be the case, afaik there were no updates to cause that... You on a laptop? updated graphics drivers? if it's a laptop are you plugged in?

It's only since that miniature one came out, laptop all plugged in and the same save that ran smoothly a couple of days ago

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1 minute ago, steviemay17 said:

It's only since that miniature one came out, laptop all plugged in and the same save that ran smoothly a couple of days ago

Double check your preferences and do the usual cache resets etc, just in case the update reverted your settings or something.

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15 hours ago, Mitja said:

Definetely good reason for keeping fouls, crosses and corners on realistic levels. 

Definitely. THen again that could only happen if the tactical combinations would be all realistic. There are too many that make it incredibly easy for a packed defense to foul, deflect and clear……. :D

 

Btw, somebody had uploaded a great pkm in the bug sections showing a bit of both. It was a "tons of SOT target match with Little Goals", naturally.

- Frustration from the 1vs 1 (lots of them, and oft poorly defended Long balls)

- Frustration from the set piece.

The shot map in parts Looks almost like a Mirror Image of similar Matches pre-patch. 

- Not all, but quite a number of one on ones finished from either tight angles or Yards out (unlike most of These)
- Almost all of the SOT from actually premium zones centrally in front of the box being the perennial pressured Header from the freekick, Corner, throw-in (blue dots). This also hurts shot on target conversion, Always has.

zebw5OZ.png


This BOTH Needs watching, though the set piece is the longer term stuff and was going on way before FM20. 

 

Edited by Svenc
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My two cents in the topic. 

Ive been playing FM series for over 20 years now and I can only tell that every ME shenanigans, that we've been through over the years, are the result of nonexistent defensive play. Im certan that SI can program accurate, inteligent offensive movement. that looks like real football and produces similar statistical outcomes(as we all have seen it here and there), but they are just simply unable to replicate defensive phase of the game to counter that offense, so if they left it in FM, we would see almost handball-like results. 

Unfortunately, the problem is even deeper, cuz the whole ME core is lopsided this way. If you want to play "proper" defense, you have to put all your midfield in DM strata and all your strikers in CM strata. Otherwise, the gaps between formations are unrealistic. Also team movement as a defensive block is just horrendous. No teamwork whatsoever. No movement whatsoever. Real players are constantly "in check", looking for opposition runs, ball, teammates etc. In Fm, though, players are completely unaware of anything. Strikers can easily run in-between defenders and unless they get the ball, defenders dont give a crap about them. This stuff has been present in every FM since 2d introduction and Im afraid its never gonna be fixed.

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13 minutes ago, tts0 said:

My two cents in the topic. 

Ive been playing FM series for over 20 years now and I can only tell that every ME shenanigans, that we've been through over the years, are the result of nonexistent defensive play. Im certan that SI can program accurate, inteligent offensive movement. that looks like real football and produces similar statistical outcomes(as we all have seen it here and there), but they are just simply unable to replicate defensive phase of the game to counter that offense, so if they left it in FM, we would see almost handball-like results. 

I think the balance between defense and offense is an interesting Topic. However, if the defense was that (horrendous) underpowered in comparison, there wouldn't be that many set pieces to begin with. Every set piece is, to simplify, the result of a side still getting a foot into a move somehow. I've never ever seen an attacking side on FM having like almost 100% of its shots (or the majority) off 20-30 being from open play. Yet that is quite regularly happening in Football. On FM that wouldn't even happen with good tactics that are apt at actually stretching packed defenses.

Naturally, you could Interpret this the other way. Precisely because the attackers had this much space, the defense would rely on tackles and fouls too oftenly… which is where at least some added set pieces would be coming from.
 

Edited by Svenc
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Hi, 

 

Long time football manager player and fan, however the latest patch leaves much to be desired, although the fix claims 1 v 1s are better and less shooting from the byline, the fact that this is still a constant is ridiculous, strikers miss 90% of their 1 v 1s and full backs and wingers cross the ball only 10%  of the time.  I don't think I have seen a first time cross since I have started playing, finally the centre backs are awful.

:(

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Spain B teams, the menu about having Senior players play on the team is broken, it contain the senior team in the make available. If you then click the players name and select them for B team, it DOESN'T work either. You have to go to the inbox Available players for B team message and go to the blue box that is supposed to indicate that the player is selected and set all to be available and then they get into the squad.

 

And you can add screen flow is broken too. It stops working after the season ends it was added in.

 

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I seem to have fixed the ongoing issue with lag in the 3D engine. I put Steam on offline mode, and suddenly it's super smooth. 

The reason I discovered this was I was looking back at some older saves from previous games, and I loaded uo FM19 and was amazed at how smooth it was given I had constant issues with it at the time. This may have nothing to do with it, but I wondered if it was now so smooth because there's hardly anyone still playing it compared to the current one. 

So, I went to offline mode on Steam, loaded up FM20, and I've never seen it so smooth. Coincidence? Maybe, but if you're having issues with this, try it and see how you get on. You can always pop back into online mode when updates are announced, etc. 

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21 hours ago, pats said:

After playing 15-20 more matches, I also feel that the long passes are a bit too accurate and the defence reaction time to these long balls also looks a bit low. Only slight tweak is required in both these areas imo. Nothing too drastic.

 

Yeah, there's also just IMO, and it is probably down to my setup, too many hollywood passes at the expense of the simple pass. Defenders in particular are bad offenders for this, but I loathe to put 'play out of defence' because one or three of these passes get through and create chances. Has been this way for a while with me though, not exclusive to FM20.

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I have not seen the weird obsession of hitting the side net of the Goal excessively though i dont play with wingers as i only use 2 Striker Formations that are supported by central midfield Players.

Even my Wing backs rarely hit the side net - i see a ton of very bad shots that miss wide and far and in any hilarious way or be blocked and Neuerlike GK wordclass saves amass.

Edited by Etebaer
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24 minutes ago, Etebaer said:

I have not seen the weird obsession of hitting the side net of the Goal excessively though i dont play with wingers as i only use 2 Striker Formations that are supported by central midfield Players.

Even my Wing backs rarely hit the side net - i see a ton of very bad shots that miss wide and far and in any hilarious way or be blocked and Neuerlike GK wordclass saves amass.

I use wingers with a lone striker, the emphasis in my tactic is on wing play, and I still don't see any shots from wingers hitting the side net. I also don't have any problem with wingers refusing to cross, their first choice always seems to be crossing.

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10 hours ago, DP said:

Just watching the Liverpool game. 
 

Both those goals just scored are completely impossible to replicate in the engine.

If you're really talking about Salzburg vs Liverpool game, then you are wrong. The first goal I've seen in FM19, or at least a goal very closely like that. The second goal I've seen on FM20, although the goalie was a bit more passive there.

Edited by Mikke
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vor 26 Minuten schrieb Mikke:

I use wingers with a lone striker, the emphasis in my tactic is on wing play, and I still don't see any shots from wingers hitting the side net. I also don't have any problem with wingers refusing to cross, their first choice always seems to be crossing.

I am on my third CaC Career since the patch bcs reasons (the frist was learning the patch, the second was really good but it allways applied the wrong Keeper Kit, so number 3 now).

In my first CaC i had arund 70% of my Goals coming from the infamous long over the top through balls.

In my second CaC i suddenly had 60% of my Goals coming from crosses….long over the top through balls were still a problem but had low scoring chances this time somehow.

The third is about to start and i am curious how it will work out - at least it apllies my Keeper Kit almost the way it is intended (yeah that matters to me bcs i intend to do a really long lasting Career and such details anger me until they kill the motivation).

 

I even bought the ingame Editor and allowed its use so i can change the Trikot Kits ingame to see if that helps but i have not found how to edit them yet - where can you edit ingame Trikot Kits with the ingame Editor?

Edited by Etebaer
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Ok i found it, the Editor menu changes in context to the page you are on...but the Kits are saved as they be intended to look so i guess it will not help me.

At least i can change the Stadium Name when i get a new one in a far far future...^^

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Has anyone else had a bad experience with board takeovers coming at very bad times and taking ages?

I've had two board takeovers in 6 months now, and both have come just befor transfer windows. With the first one I was lucky it ended about a week in to the transfer window. With the current second takeover it is late June and I am wanting to build a squad for my first foray in to Europe. I'm in the first qualifying round so I need to get players in fast, but can't with a takeover going on.

Why do they take so long? Am I just unlucky?

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17 hours ago, Sophos said:

It's been a problem for multiple instalments and keeps getting worse.

Don't agree it's been in multiple issues; this one certainly - generating 1 on 1 situations I found quite difficult in previous editions. It's overpowered in 2020.

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22 hours ago, Welshace said:

Details? what was the bug? whats the point commenting at all without any detail?

the bug is saying I am fired for being over wage budget, I was not. The point was to express my /feedback/ on the game. I have all ready put in the bug report to the correct place. 

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Just now, Soverntear said:

the bug is saying I am fired for being over wage budget, I was not. The point was to express my /feedback/ on the game. I have all ready put in the bug report to the correct place. 

Sorry, i can see how my reply might have come across as petulent... I didn't mean it to be!   I just meant it would be handy to have a bit more detal on the issue is all, which you have now given

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11 hours ago, tts0 said:

My two cents in the topic. 

Ive been playing FM series for over 20 years now and I can only tell that every ME shenanigans, that we've been through over the years, are the result of nonexistent defensive play. Im certan that SI can program accurate, inteligent offensive movement. that looks like real football and produces similar statistical outcomes(as we all have seen it here and there), but they are just simply unable to replicate defensive phase of the game to counter that offense, so if they left it in FM, we would see almost handball-like results. 

Unfortunately, the problem is even deeper, cuz the whole ME core is lopsided this way. If you want to play "proper" defense, you have to put all your midfield in DM strata and all your strikers in CM strata. Otherwise, the gaps between formations are unrealistic. Also team movement as a defensive block is just horrendous. No teamwork whatsoever. No movement whatsoever. Real players are constantly "in check", looking for opposition runs, ball, teammates etc. In Fm, though, players are completely unaware of anything. Strikers can easily run in-between defenders and unless they get the ball, defenders dont give a crap about them. This stuff has been present in every FM since 2d introduction and Im afraid its never gonna be fixed.

But you could say the other way around too, if they made defense stronger attacking play would suffer. I think there are improvements made but have to agree that both vertical and horizontal compactness looks odd currently, often you see the difference in compactness of attacking vs defending team only when the ball is final third. It's interesting to note that wide forwards will position themselves wider in defense than attack (???), when the ball is further up the pitch, which enhances feeling of poor defending in organised and compact manner.  Also there's ongoing issue I reported last year of how wide area is defended, where fullbacks will rarely pick opposition wide players. They retreat too deep for absoultely no reason and won't close down those players. This creates space for wide playeres which they easily explore. This issue is in the game at least since fm17. 

Edited by Mitja
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Before anyone mis  interprets, this is not a thread to throw a banter against the game or the SI community. At the end of the day, the game doesn't have a human mind to be so realistic and accurate
That being said I believe we can put across some points that could be worked upon.

I've read many threads and discussions about these incidents..

Lemme start:

1v1s: While viewing the game, whenever players are on a 1v1 run, they NEVER score. Even the top most prolific finishers. These 1v1 animations often begin with a single player on a counter attack dribbling the 'ENTIRE LENGTH' of the pitch like superman (even slow paced players) and hittng the ball against the keeper. So it's become so obvious that during key or extended highlights, I can pre assume and be correct that it will be a miss if I  see a player starting on a run to dribble the entire field.

Transfers: are very unrealistic. Top players are herded in one single team often. For example Liverpool have got Milik and Kane in the same season, causing an overflow of forwards. Man City despite having a good midfield have got Dybala, Vidal, Pogba in one season. 

Liverpool being too strong? : I agree they are a great team on good form, but dropping just 16 points over 2 seasons overall? Scoring like 3-4 goals every game? Unrealistic.

Frequent Injuries: Players getting injured way more than previous FM editions. Even if I keep a light training schedule.

Players not passing into open  space: Like the first point, if a player is on a dream  run, and will even have 2-3 players open for a tap in, he wont pass.

There are so many more issues tbh.
I hop it gets resolved via patches

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4 minutes ago, ravalamol said:

1v1s: While viewing the game, whenever players are on a 1v1 run, they NEVER score. Even the top most prolific finishers. These 1v1 animations often begin with a single player on a counter attack dribbling the 'ENTIRE LENGTH' of the pitch like superman (even slow paced players) and hittng the ball against the keeper. So it's become so obvious that during key or extended highlights, I can pre assume and be correct that it will be a miss if I  see a player starting on a run to dribble the entire field.

It's interesting that so many players seem to have this issue, and then my players score 30% of 1v1 situations. Is this maybe something that weaker teams are actually better at?

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5 minutes ago, ravalamol said:

Before anyone mis  interprets, this is not a thread to throw a banter against the game or the SI community. At the end of the day, the game doesn't have a human mind to be so realistic and accurate
That being said I believe we can put across some points that could be worked upon.

I've read many threads and discussions about these incidents..

Lemme start:

1v1s: While viewing the game, whenever players are on a 1v1 run, they NEVER score. Even the top most prolific finishers. These 1v1 animations often begin with a single player on a counter attack dribbling the 'ENTIRE LENGTH' of the pitch like superman (even slow paced players) and hittng the ball against the keeper. So it's become so obvious that during key or extended highlights, I can pre assume and be correct that it will be a miss if I  see a player starting on a run to dribble the entire field.

Transfers: are very unrealistic. Top players are herded in one single team often. For example Liverpool have got Milik and Kane in the same season, causing an overflow of forwards. Man City despite having a good midfield have got Dybala, Vidal, Pogba in one season. 

Liverpool being too strong? : I agree they are a great team on good form, but dropping just 16 points over 2 seasons overall? Scoring like 3-4 goals every game? Unrealistic.

Frequent Injuries: Players getting injured way more than previous FM editions. Even if I keep a light training schedule.

Players not passing into open  space: Like the first point, if a player is on a dream  run, and will even have 2-3 players open for a tap in, he wont pass.

There are so many more issues tbh.
I hop it gets resolved via patches


It's not a 1v1 per se, But regarding the dribbling the entire length and NEVER score:
 


If i were to base the injuries in my save i could argue that they should adjust the injuries up, having more injuries. I hardly get injured players. But that is solely basing it on my game.

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2 minutes ago, roykela said:

Hmm. I'm 3 seasons done now and not a single 1v1 has worked tbh. Nor the dribbling entire length.


It's not a 1v1 per se, But regarding the dribbling the entire length and NEVER score:
 


If i were to base the injuries in my save i could argue that they should adjust the injuries up, having more injuries. I hardly get injured players. But that is solely basing it on my game.

 

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11 hours ago, tts0 said:

My two cents in the topic. 

Ive been playing FM series for over 20 years now and I can only tell that every ME shenanigans, that we've been through over the years, are the result of nonexistent defensive play. Im certan that SI can program accurate, inteligent offensive movement. that looks like real football and produces similar statistical outcomes(as we all have seen it here and there), but they are just simply unable to replicate defensive phase of the game to counter that offense, so if they left it in FM, we would see almost handball-like results. 

Unfortunately, the problem is even deeper, cuz the whole ME core is lopsided this way. If you want to play "proper" defense, you have to put all your midfield in DM strata and all your strikers in CM strata. Otherwise, the gaps between formations are unrealistic. Also team movement as a defensive block is just horrendous. No teamwork whatsoever. No movement whatsoever. Real players are constantly "in check", looking for opposition runs, ball, teammates etc. In Fm, though, players are completely unaware of anything. Strikers can easily run in-between defenders and unless they get the ball, defenders dont give a crap about them. This stuff has been present in every FM since 2d introduction and Im afraid its never gonna be fixed.

I'm not to sure, 19 was very useful for defensive gaming, 20 is okay from what i've gathered and some people have said in the sense of defending in air or ground. The problem lies when set peices or when a CB suddenly comes out of position and gets pulled away from defensive line so your other cb does and the ball goes in behind. Happened on a few occassions but the SI have acknowledged it, whether they fix it is another question. Countering is quite useful, a few streams using counter attacks with worse off teams has helped them gain their preffered status of mentality and the way they really want to play. Tackling/heading has been pretty good but the positioning and "Out of the blue" things are bad at times. I think if the SI sort the ball over the head the constant 1v1's will reduce and seem abit more realistic and happen less often but if it still persists they should tone it down as 1v1's are rareity on a game on game basis. That way defending looks decent and then the focus is on scoring from open play or direct play like it should be and not heavily one sided to direct. 

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