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Football Manager 2020 Feedback Thread


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7 hours ago, stevemc said:

The manager haircuts need some work, tried every single combination and not one looks right, or looks realistic. Most look like they've been plonked on and don't look part of the figure. Most the options pre-date the 80's mullets. I mean, what on earth is this? Imagine you went the barbers and they sorted you out with one of these.

Spoiler

DOuI1jb.jpg

It's 2019, I've literally seen better models/graphics/textures 10-15 years ago.

Also, why can't I give myself a a long beard? Closest option is a bit of stubble.

It's not a game breaker, as I'll just upload a manager photo, but it's not great is it.

I made a bug report when the beta was released on the terrible hairstyles. So many of them clipped through the skin for some reason, or were seperated from the skin at the side of the head so you could see the background through the gap! The 3D Modelling for managers feels unbelievably rushed and unthorough. Aditionally, who made the decision to have only 4 or 5 skin tones for managers when players can have 20 or so? And the same can go for the lack of hair colours, you can't have a realistic blonde/light brown, or white hair.

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Played the demo and I am truly dreadful at it.  I'm Exeter and had a horrific start to the season, bumbling along about 5th bottom, I kept getting the message to say that this could be my last game and the club were looking at my position, but I had a bit of a rally and was unbeaten in 6 games including a victory in the 2nd round of the FA cup which pleased the board - I lost the next game a bit unluckily and was sacked after a board meeting!  There aren't many (lower-level) clubs who would sack their manager after 1 defeat in 7 games surely?

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Really funny SI, going in as Barca manager with a 10 m budget and a club thing of signing high profile player.

 

And the Board is upset I failed it... I'm not sure how I'm supposed to get a Barca level high profile signing for 10 million. Would it really have cost you that much time to bother to let the board recognize they didn't give me the money to complete it?

 

I have one high profile signing for the start of next season after I got the next season transfer window budget, but that doesn't count until he arrives at the start of the new season.

 

No one wanted my players or bid on them in the January window and the Barca squad is dangerously thin, so it wasn't like I could sell 2-3 surplus players to create enough of a budget to get a high profile signing in, so without a good bid on a single player, I was kinda stuck with the 10 million, well I would have, but I think my backroom staff used up the money on contract renewals.

 

Even better, I check the overview screen and see this in red text:

Noticeable criticism:

Pleased that the team managed to win the La Liga.

 

So I'm going to get sacked for winning La Liga??

Edited by Miravlix
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I had no problems during the beta, game goes live, a couple hot fixes come through and now...I have no in-game visuals, even with the default skins. Yes, my drivers are up to date. Kinda hard to manage a game from a dark broom closet under the stadium. 

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10 часов назад, Thengil сказал:

This has never happened to be before in a CM/FM game, in all my years of playing. Thought I'd share it. The goalscorer is a DC in a 4-4-2. Awesome.

 

 

Company's goal for Leicester in prev season :) What a team in this navy shirt?

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45 minutes ago, jc1 said:

Strikers even AI ones cannot score 1v1.

Can we please just stop this myth once and for all. The issues are About certain types of one on ones, in particular from tight angles, as the wide guys are too easily through in particular. It's bout About the defending and decision making, the runs made when approaching the Goal, and probably also their conversion. That's what Needs to be watched. Saying one on ones are never scored is not only wildly inaccurate. It also distracts from what Needs to be watched and adressed specifically.
 


Not every one on one is, and should be, equal opportunity. At all.
Unlike from the penalty spot, the range is hugely wide, as the distance to the Goal differs, the angle of the Approach, whether the Forward is put under pressure by defenders Closing him down, the angle to the Goal, how much smaller the keeper has already made the Goal by coming off his line, etc. etc. That's the reason why in real Football they rank between 1 in 5 (20%) and 1 in 2 (50%) chances, for an average of 1 in 3 (33%). With the 1 in 5 type, streaks of misses of even 8 , 9, 10 should be reasonably common place. HOwever spread out over many weeks, rather than a single / couple Matches.

Even once patched. 
 

 

Edited by Svenc
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1 hour ago, Svenc said:

Can we please just stop this myth once and for all.
 

 

It's probably a case of the visual respresentation not being accurate. I see clear 1 on 1's (clean through, nobody near) missed regularly by stellar forwards from both teams. End of the third season my winger Pepe was the PL top scorer with 20 (7 pens), next was Martinez with 16 and third was Nketiah with 14. This isn't just missed 1-on1's, it's the fact that wingers and full backs have 'selfishness' 20 or 'brains' 1 depending on your viewpoint, since they rarely pass or cross to the striker standing all alone in the box (a known issue I know). I've played every version of this game ever made, and I definitely notice it. Saying that, I had an enjoyable run with Arsenal, winning the league and CL once each by the end of the 3rd, but I have to say I'm a bit bored of wathcing the highlights now due to the reasons outlined.

Edited by hazzabish
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41 minutes ago, hazzabish said:

It's probably a case of the visual respresentation not being accurate. I see clear 1 on 1's (clean through, nobody near) missed regularly by stellar forwards from both teams. End of the third season my winger Pepe was the PL top scorer with 20 (7 pens), next was Martinez with 16 and third was Nketiah with 14. This isn't just missed 1-on1's, it's the fact that wingers and full backs have 'selfishness' 20 or 'brains' 1 depending on your viewpoint, since they rarely pass or cross to the striker standing all alone in the box (a known issue I know). I've played every version of this game ever made, and I definitely notice it. Saying that, I had an enjoyable run with Arsenal, winning the league and CL once each by the end of the 3rd, but I have to say I'm a bit bored of wathcing the highlights now due to the reasons outlined.

I agree with the bolded part. Let's ignore the tight angle chances and focus on when a player is clean through, in a central position between the width of the 6 yard box, free of any defender who could exert pressure.

(these are my personal criteria to define a true 1v1) 

In such scenarios, players in reality tend to attempt one of the following:

  • Pick their spot and attempt a side foot finish into a corner
  • Wait for keeper to dive at their feet and lift it over them
  • Put it through the goalkeeper's legs
  • Wait for the keeper to commit and dribble it around them

Such variety in-game is either completely missing or very poorly represented. What we tend to see is that 1v1 attempts are just blasted straight at the keeper's face with no apparent forethought or intelligence. It's particularly jarring to see elite AI players do this as well as your own. It's reached the point where if the AI is clean through on goal due to my irresponsibly high line, I just sit back and relax in my chair. I just don't fear these situations like I should.

Edited by rdbayly
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1 hour ago, hazzabish said:

It's probably a case of the visual respresentation not being accurate.

Not what I'm seeing. The majority of one on ones complained About come from the "Bugg"y defending, the widish Players then being through too regularly, and also due to their movement approaching the Goals from difficult angles, all the while they're being chased by a pack of defenders. Naturally they shouldn't Always shoot from such angles too, but square it when it's on (the decision making in the final third is selfish in General...). But finishing in itself from such positions is not that easy. Plus the Forward even in more central ones is typically still under pressure from a Defender.

To repeat, in the Analysis, the red dots here are the one on ones (blue ones headers from the set piece, etc. but besides this Point). Compare this to most of the one on ones in my above vid.
2HCSDGR.png

There are evidently either way one on ones on this that are converted at 50/50 rates, if not (slightly) higher. Else the Matches I created wouldn't end in 30-0ish scorelines. They see the Forward approaching in space, and at better angles.  NOt this type though, and even if patched, shouldn't.

4SqjWJs.png

The reason why top Scorers oft score  fewer Goals in-game is that they don't get the amount of attempts they have in real Football to begin with. You rarely see AI central Forwards averaging like 4 shots per match (Kane IRL at his best 5, Messi 5, CR7 7, Lewandowski 5, in the CL over 6). How should they consistently score, given that even the best chances should be realistically 50/50 Affairs most of the time, except for tap-ins, extremely close range stuff and penalties? Part of that is striker movement related, part of it is wingers not squaring it (after the patch they likely won't be through this easily to begin with, so can't be a fix), part of this AI tactical. I agree with @rdbayly though that the finishing skills are lacking. I basically force sides to have a one on one every other Minute in a match, however there were perhaps a select few instances that could be classed as the Forward trying to go round the keeper.

Edited by Svenc
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OK, I've played the same game with 2 different tactics to see what happens.

1st tactic is 4-1-4-1 wingbacks(A) on attack, winger(S) and an IF(A), attacker as AF(A) Mentality attack, high press, short pass, high tempo, width wide, there are no added personal instructions. Results was wingbacks and wingers shooting from daft angles, strikers being ignored and midfield shooting all the time with little through passes, and a few missed 1v1's, with ratings except scorers and assists being fairly low for a team winning 5-0.

 

2nd tactic with a 4-2-3-1 tactic winbacks (S), winger/IF/striker all as above, AM(S). Mentality Positive, high press, high tempo, short pass, attacking width fairly narrow, play through the middle work ball into the box. Personal instructions are wingbacks to shoot less and stay wider, winger to stay wider and IF to stay narrower. This resulted in wingbacks crossing properly and cutting the ball back when going into the box, IF and wingers both playing as they should and due to this my foward gets more passes inside the box and higher ratings in general throughout the team, winning 6-0.

 

Now I don't know exactly what this proves, the wingbacks and wingers shooting into the side netting has been flagged as a bug, ratings also is seen as a bug and 1v1's also. I've managed to eliminate some of this by changing certain team and personal instructions, general game play and goals looked better, these wee things may be bugs but should we have to do all this just to get round some ME bugs?

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1 hour ago, jc1 said:

OK, I've played the same game with 2 different tactics to see what happens.

1st tactic is 4-1-4-1 wingbacks(A) on attack, winger(S) and an IF(A), attacker as AF(A) Mentality attack, high press, short pass, high tempo, width wide, there are no added personal instructions. Results was wingbacks and wingers shooting from daft angles, strikers being ignored and midfield shooting all the time with little through passes, and a few missed 1v1's, with ratings except scorers and assists being fairly low for a team winning 5-0.

 

2nd tactic with a 4-2-3-1 tactic winbacks (S), winger/IF/striker all as above, AM(S). Mentality Positive, high press, high tempo, short pass, attacking width fairly narrow, play through the middle work ball into the box. Personal instructions are wingbacks to shoot less and stay wider, winger to stay wider and IF to stay narrower. This resulted in wingbacks crossing properly and cutting the ball back when going into the box, IF and wingers both playing as they should and due to this my foward gets more passes inside the box and higher ratings in general throughout the team, winning 6-0.

 

Now I don't know exactly what this proves, the wingbacks and wingers shooting into the side netting has been flagged as a bug, ratings also is seen as a bug and 1v1's also. I've managed to eliminate some of this by changing certain team and personal instructions, general game play and goals looked better, these wee things may be bugs but should we have to do all this just to get round some ME bugs?

It's almost like a tactic with an attacking mentality will lead attacking players and wing backs on attacking roles to make even more attacking decisions, such as shooting instead of looking for a pass. 

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20 minutes ago, rockpie said:

It's almost like a tactic with an attacking mentality will lead attacking players and wing backs on attacking roles to make even more attacking decisions, such as shooting instead of looking for a pass. 

Exactly, an attacking tactic seems to over emphasise attacking nature which leads to players wanting to shoot at every opportunity and not pass to team mates.

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4 hours ago, Svenc said:

Not what I'm seeing. The majority of one on ones complained About come from the "Bugg"y defending, the widish Players then being through too regularly, and also due to their movement approaching the Goals from difficult angles, all the while they're being chased by a pack of defenders. Naturally they shouldn't Always shoot from such angles too, but square it when it's on (the decision making in the final third is selfish in General...). But finishing in itself from such positions is not that easy. Plus the Forward even in more central ones is typically still under pressure from a Defender.

To repeat, in the Analysis, the red dots here are the one on ones (blue ones headers from the set piece, etc. but besides this Point). Compare this to most of the one on ones in my above vid.
2HCSDGR.png

There are evidently either way one on ones on this that are converted at 50/50 rates, if not (slightly) higher. Else the Matches I created wouldn't end in 30-0ish scorelines. They see the Forward approaching in space, and at better angles.  NOt this type though, and even if patched, shouldn't.

4SqjWJs.png

The reason why top Scorers oft score  fewer Goals in-game is that they don't get the amount of attempts they have in real Football to begin with. You rarely see AI central Forwards averaging like 4 shots per match (Kane IRL at his best 5, Messi 5, CR7 7, Lewandowski 5, in the CL over 6). How should they consistently score, given that even the best chances should be realistically 50/50 Affairs most of the time, except for tap-ins, extremely close range stuff and penalties? Part of that is striker movement related, part of it is wingers not squaring it (after the patch they likely won't be through this easily to begin with, so can't be a fix), part of this AI tactical. I agree with @rdbayly though that the finishing skills are lacking. I basically force sides to have a one on one every other Minute in a match, however there were perhaps a select few instances that could be classed as the Forward trying to go round the keeper.

did you edit the AI team to get 87 shots?? is this fm20?

 

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9 minutes ago, penza said:

is there a way for your assistant to tell you which tactic to use on fm touch which suits your squad the best?

Best to ask in the FMT section.

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1 hour ago, Harrymcintyre said:

I just seen my Norwich player through one on one and he didn’t score against arsenal. This must be a bug ;)

not even remotely close to what happens in game yet you trying to defend the ME by this example

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I'm sorry but I am genuinely done with this game until the one on ones get fixed. I have just had a game in my Shrewsbury save where my striker has missed 7 one on ones, SEVEN.

It's happening every game where at least 2-3 one on ones get missed, I can't remember the last time I scored one, seriously. It's sucking all the fun out of it for me.

 

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4 minutes ago, BeadyRoller said:

I'm sorry but I am genuinely done with this game until the one on ones get fixed. I have just had a game in my Shrewsbury save where my striker has missed 7 one on ones, SEVEN.

It's happening every game where at least 2-3 one on ones get missed, I can't remember the last time I scored one, seriously. It's sucking all the fun out of it for me.

 

Imo the players dont palace their shots when they really have the time to setup the finish. A perfect example is cantwells finish today against Arsenal. You dont see goals like that in the current ME. 

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18 minutes ago, BeadyRoller said:

I'm sorry but I am genuinely done with this game until the one on ones get fixed. I have just had a game in my Shrewsbury save where my striker has missed 7 one on ones, SEVEN.

It's happening every game where at least 2-3 one on ones get missed, I can't remember the last time I scored one, seriously. It's sucking all the fun out of it for me.

I think the bigger issue here is that one player had  "7 one on ones"

Quote

 

 

Edited by Os
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19 minutes ago, MBarbaric said:

how on earth are these 1on1's?

Both seem pretty clear through on goal to me...

even if you don’t agree the positions of all the players in both scenerio is so on the money. The ME is indeed very well done this year. 

EA195737-0C82-4453-A031-F5AB0A811FAB.jpeg

F4A4892D-0003-4844-B3A1-3D3730235AE3.png

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2 hours ago, bleventozturk said:

 All these lead to way too many chances in the ME to begin with. 

What if the majority of those ones aren't as good as the Posters think they were? I mean we're talking guys here who suspect the game would end in hockey scorelines consistently -- apparently these all must be 1 in 2 chances or easier. That's actually, if anything the Long-term issue from my end (not merely FM 20, mind). Unlike the ones I posted in my video above, quite a few of one on ones in-game are not that easy, so perfectly possible to miss 7 of the lesser ones (those shouldn't happen in a single match mind you). Add to that the shots on target purely form the set piece… headers under pressure will never have the same Chance as a tap-in, unless this was going to be FIfa. Given their average numbers in a match, defending actually can't be all that bad, which is crucial as to balancing this in the future. Every single set piece is the result of a defense getting a foot into a move somehow still, after all.

At FM we're still at the stage where Players see 30 shots on the spreadsheet an immediately assume there MUST be like at least 3 Goals in there. That's so not Football. Until SI communicate better what they Code / consider as better and worse chances, then this debate will continue forever, though. :DAnd yes, the defending leading to those one on ones Needs to be adressed, same as the selfish decision making in the final third, and possibly somewhat their conversion.

I'd really like to know what the "official" stance is on this. The frequency is likely acknowledged, the defending also. Plus how selfish guys are. What About the rest? Will it be worthwile at all to defend in the low block and frustrate the heck out of Opposition by forcing them to shots in limited space, or are SI going down the FIfa route of lots of neato goals. Will it be possible one day to replicate Burnley 2017, given the aim is Football sim proper?

 

@MBarbaric What is and isn't a one on one may actually be part of the issue. The Norwich against Arsenal one was adressed as such in numerous press today. As to Analytics, Norwich didn't have a single "big Chance". On FM this would have been a "CCC" likely for sure. However, that is not saying much, as that stat is a purely semantic one, and obviously disconnected from the actual Chance of scoring inside the ME.

Edited by Svenc
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@JPChenet Why do I find that hard to believe? Oh, that's right; you posted a thread saying you would never buy the game again after FM18.

Why, then, did you put yourself through the inevitable disappointment again? Why didn't you at least try the demo first before handing over your money?

Look... I can understand your frustration (FM20 hasn't impressed me that much, in honesty), but this feedback is probably of little help to SI at all. Saying that the game is "5 years behind" and needs a "30% improvement on everything" is just so vague.

What EXACTLY is it about FM20 that you're not happy with? What EXACTLY do you want SI to address in a future patch or in future titles?

Edited by CFuller
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I've got the match-lagging (low frame rate) issue but if I watch highlights of an AI vs AI game, it is super smooth. I've tried all the tricks by using another skin, the Nvidia setup preferences etc but not luck so far.

Edited by ViG1980
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10 minutes ago, ViG1980 said:

I've got the match-lagging (low frame rate) issue but if I watch highlights of an AI vs AI game, it is super smooth. I've tried all the tricks by using another skin, the Nvidia setup preferences etc but not luck so far.

Run OBS Studio in the background? I was given the link from SI to record the framerate issues but hilariously, anytime I load it up in the background it makes the game run at 60fps... Which means I can't record the evidence needed for the framerate drops, heh.

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A few more games with the less attacking mentality, and less shots from wingers and wingbacks. Ratings are still too low for certain players, win a friendly 5-0 against a smaller team and half the team struggle past 6.6. Still too many 1v1 getting missed, seems to be with balls over the top and the player running onto goal, never a deviation of movement, just a run straight at the keeper and a blast right into his body, AI teams are just as bad, all strikers are guff when in this position. Keepers can make 3-4 good saves a game and get 6.6 - 6.7?

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I'm finding boards on this version to be very weird.

I'm trying to sell a 32-year-old midfield who can't move anymore, and have bids of £1.8m accepted. A day later, I get a bunch messages saying the move has been blocked by the board because they think we can sell him for more. How much? For £2m. A measly extra £200k. And of course, this is a non-negotiable position. 

The oddest thing about it all is that I had just sold off a bunch of players for less than they value, and not once did the board intervene. 

This happened moments after my bid for Luca Pellegrini  was blocked because he wasn't Spanish, even though signing Spanish player is only "favoured" in the club vision and I had just signed a Turk and Brazilian. 

To say nothing of being given a low grade for league performance despite getting a club record number of wins and points. 

I love Club Vision as an idea but its implementation so far has been wacky. 

Edited by JEinchy
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1 hour ago, yonko said:

All the unnecessary extra stuff they keep adding every year doesn't really do anything for me. It's all about the ME, tactics and training. These 3 things have to be as realistic and enjoyable as possible. The rest don't matter much.

So I agree. They need to spend a whole year on just making the ME as good as possible and forget adding any extra features that don't mean much.

You can have an opinion that's fine. But in your scenario what do all the other non match engine staff do? Turn up and cheer them on for 8 hours or more a day for a year? 

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1 hour ago, santy001 said:

You can have an opinion that's fine. But in your scenario what do all the other non match engine staff do? Turn up and cheer them on for 8 hours or more a day for a year? 

There is a lot of people who have the same opinion. The ME is almost the same for a decade it's time for a change. The rest of the game with the new features and all it's amazing. What more do you want to add?

At the end of the day you want to have fun during matches. About the non match engine staff they are doing great what is the problem?¿  Just keep going and help the ME one.

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There is quite a lot I don't fully get in this version, most of which I've seen covered in here quite regularly, usually as the most up-rated comments in the thread.

One I've not seen so much, given that people are complaining a lot about keepers being amazing during 1 on 1 situations, is some of the absolutely mental mistakes I've seen made, too regularly.

Look I'm a Newcastle fan, I've seen some...unusual defending and goalkeeping in my time, but the few seasons in I am here have comfortably outstripped my real life experience of watching us.

Attached is a fairly mild (though my most recent) example. There is a point here, where the keeper is rushing out, gets to within what looks like a foot of the ball,  farcloser than the on rushing attacker, and rather than getting off his feet and clearing it out as you'd see most times this happened, or even just picking the ball up, he instead chooses to turn sideways, run away from the ball he was just sprinting at, and concede. This was not his only terrible, goal conceding mistake in this game (I got battered 3-0) yet he got a bang average 6.6 rating.

I don't understand, what are we meant to see? Is 'keeper ai wrong, are the match ratings wrong or can the visual representation of what is happening not actually show whats going on properly?

 

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1 hour ago, iamcontrol said:

I don't understand, what are we meant to see? Is 'keeper ai wrong, are the match ratings wrong or can the visual representation of what is happening not actually show whats going on properly?

 

<admiral ackbar>It's a trap BUG! :D </admiral ackbar>

This also btw. is not quite like the average one on one from my vids on this page. I'd personally expect it to be scored About 1 in 4ish (Bugs excluded) once all Patches up to realism. At best 1 in 3. Maybe me though. Seen better ones rated 1 in 4.

Edited by Svenc
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18 minutes ago, Svenc said:

<admiral ackbar>It's a trap BUG! :D </admiral ackbar>

This also btw. is not quite like the average one on one from my vids on this page. I'd personally expect it to be scored About 1 in 4ish (Bugs excluded) once all Patches up to realism. At best 1 in 3. Maybe me though. Seen better ones rated 1 in 4.

 

I...do not understand what point you are trying to make here.

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11 minutes ago, iamcontrol said:

 

I...do not understand what point you are trying to make here.

Mainly, that this is clearly a bug. The underlined part is a link which you can click showing Fifa game glitches. So, Bugs.

The second half was mainly About the one on one discussion in General. I had posted a Video above showing one on ones that in-game (I had counted over dozens of attempts) are converted roughly 50% of the time, Maybe slightly higher. In all of them the Forward is in less pressure than in this one. There is also a Defender Closing him down. Therefore, I would expect this type to be scored at significantly lesser rates. It's a 1 in 3 Chance at best.

 

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