Football Manager 2020 Feedback Thread

[KUBI]

vor 14 Minuten schrieb prot651:

60 posts on Public Beta Forum ? More people seem  to be posting here

The public beta forum is for bug reports.

[randibw]

I had 12 penalties in a season that's just finished. Missed them all! (Taker Penalty score of 17). Maddening!

[Kingstontom88]

I can see an improvement to the match engine, but I am still seeing so many goals from shocking initial clearances. Soft, aimless headers and kicks away straight back to the attacker. I've scored and conceded a lot of goals like this. 

[Sharkn20]

Definitely out of the box shots goals are really OP'ed u don't need a high level Long Shot attribute to score terrific goals... Which is quite unrealistic...

The ME is better thougj, lots work to do still.

[fm2020.smith]

a major bug affecting every game. if you remove under 23s players to play in your first team they still play for the under 23s. you cant promote them all to your first team and remove them every week thats tedious! 

[Tiger666]

On 18/01/2020 at 15:14, themadsheep2001 said:

If you're seeing anything you're unhappy with on the public beta, threads and PKMs would be magic, there's really not that many threads in there at all compared to those of you posting in here: 

https://community.sigames.com/forum/670-public-beta-forum/

A lot of the issues being raised in here have already been raised and have threads in the standard bugs forum. Are we supposed to make new threads about issues that have already been raised?

[dannyfc]

6 hours ago, rp1966 said:

In your scenario with a packed area and a defender trying to get the ball out of the danger zone , they'd be looking to find any gap, however narrow, to get the ball into some space that poses as little danger as possible, If the 'hitbox'  (for want of a better phrase) around a player is too big those gaps are proportionately smaller and the ME will calculate that the ball has been cleared to the opponent and the visualisation will make it look as if defenders always kick it to the opposition.

In the reverse scenario, attacks that require precision passes or the typical wide player's make a yard of space and fire the cross in, get stifled as the ME thinks the space isn't there.  So you get the cross that should be fired round the defender going straight into them and bouncing away for a throw-in or corner, and you get creative passes in the area being ignored for a safe pass out wide, because although visually space is there, in the ME's calculation it isn't.

Obviously only the ME team could say if that is the really cause, but it fits the symptoms.

I'm 100% with you on this, this is the main issue I have with the ME. Just a overriding reluctance to iniate any move that doesn't utilise acres of space. A phobia of contact, or like you said too wide a 'hitbox'. Would be interested to know the developers thoughts as it's all speculation on the coding until then. 

For me there's a fundamental problem with how the ME interprets and deals with tight spaces. In older games it wasn't interpreted at all, so you had the problem of strikers constantly 'ghosting' through defenders. 

Since 2013 this has been addressed, but too far the other way where players are too adverse at interacting with opposition players.

The thing that stands out to me compared to real football is lack of physicality, or a reluctance to play through the opposition. This is why central players lack involvement, as there's always a defender close by deemed as a 'threat' meaning an out ball to the wings is always the preferred option. 

You very rarely see tight interplay or jostling between teams. One of the core aspects of a targetman is being able to play the ball into him with his back to goal, for him to then lay off to deep runners. Or even just basic 1-2s into the box.

These movements should be high risk / high reward, so more often than that not you see a player dispossessed around the box. But they need to be attempted much more regularly, as it's these moments that allow those really technically gifted players to stand out. Or alternatively those with high physical attributes able to bully their way through to goal. 

[Guest]

dugout

not a clue if I'm in the right place but anyway is there any chance the dugout could be updated as its like looking at a bus stop shelter why don't you have proper chairs in like in real life

[JordanMilly]

It is nice to see players making sensible choices between passing the ball and shooting themselves - just had this lovely counter-attack, and Firmino did exactly the right thing in passing to Salah who was clear on goal, rather than going for a shot or being tackled himself.

 

 

[Federico]

Yeah very nice. At this point of the legacy of FM, I'd like that to be the normality in most of cases, rather than something to highlight.

[FrazT]

1 hour ago, Jeff44 said:

dugout

not a clue if I'm in the right place but anyway is there any chance the dugout could be updated as its like looking at a bus stop shelter why don't you have proper chairs in like in real life

Raise a thread in the Features Requests forum

[Tiger666]

This beta match engine is capable of producing some beatiful goals.

 

Edited January 19, 2020 by Tiger666

[ajw10]

I'm not sure the Beta has made this game any better, just different. I'm finding that strikers are back to being useless, and wingers are the main source of goals. One on ones are still being missed at the same rate. 

If this is going to be the next update then I'm going to be hugely disappointed.

[_PeteG_]

For me, the public beta is an improvement. I've told my players to play short passing game and that is what they tend to do. I'm seeing more variety of play, nice passing moves around and in the area, occasional well placed through balls that look great to me. All in all, very happy with this version.

I'm playing in VNS fwiw. 

[Federico]

1 ora fa, Tiger666 ha scritto:

This beta match engine is capable of producing some beatiful goals.

 

Yeah but looking at how defenders move out of any logic just before your player is about to cross the ball in the box, it looks more cheap than beautiful.

[ajt]

Way less 1on1s (and ccc's in general) due to the long ball issue being fixed, but my striker actually scores some of his normal chances inside the box now.

Changing the passing seems to actually have an influence now which is nice.

Have resorted to using iwb due to the crosses mostly just hitting the opposition.

Quite a few goals seem to come from set pieces.

I see people talking about longshots but I'm not seeing that many go in. Could be that my players aren't very good at them though.

The offside throw in (passing back to taker) and players running past the ball when trying to keep it on the pitch are a bit annoying.

Overall goals in my league this season decreased compared to the one before ME update but could just be an anomaly.

Love my save anyway and it does seem to be on the right track.

My main complaint would be lack of play through the middle and amc position not seeming to do a lot.

Have only played 60 games though so ymmv.

Edited January 20, 2020 by ajt

[alian62]

12 hours ago, KUBI said:

The public beta forum is for bug reports.

Yes but im noticing people posting bugs in here . Just hope they are posting them in the Public forum too

[alian62]

15 hours ago, tajj7 said:

Beta ME is not much better IMO.

The long ball thing is way better.

But it's like watching FIFA still, with someone kid playing on easy mode.  Players with good dribbling are just stupid, they just go through players, they pick up the ball and go 50-60 yards and beat men far too easily.

If defenders make a tackle, then it goes nowhere, it seems to bounce straight back to the attacker again, I;ve conceded goals where my defence has tackled the ball 3/4 times and every time the attacker just has the ball back right at their feet and continues on normally.

Just had Kovavecic pick up the ball in his own half and just run at my defender and no one goes near him, they let him just run straight through and score. Both centre-backs are marking no one, yet they just stand and let him run through.  It's like their are Messis every game pulling of these long mazy dribbles against multiple opponents. 

I also have a penalty taker who is basically perfect at penalties (created him to see how it it was working) and he has missed 3 out of 4, this has been common in FM generally, even if a player has great penalty stats, he misses loads. Some players barely ever miss penalties, the best ones should be scoring 95% plus.

Seems 1 step forward and 2 back for me.

There are some nice aspects and nice play, but overall its just as bad. 

So Long ball is much better but the ME is no better ?

[maestro31]

Tested the new ME and I hate to say it but I prefer the ME on the actual game as I've seen some stupid goals conceded and ridiculous defending and 1v1 conversion rate is still poor. The one thing I did like about the new ME was the fact that players square the ball instead of trying to have a shot at goal. SI have really failed to appease their customers and quite frankly I don't think I'll be buying another fm after this one due to the regression of the match engine.

[Mr U Rosler]

Feedback on Beta version of the Match Engine.

(not helpful to have feedback on 2 match engines in the same thread by the way, better to have a separate thread like last year).

Its night and day to my eyes, the Beta is FAR better actually resembling football rather than the end to end Basketball of ME 20.2.

Its no longer a succession of one on one's which are largely missed, wide play is rewarded whilst i'm still seeing some nice play in central areas.

 

• A few spectacular long shots, not too many in my opinion, but I always enjoy these.
• Increased injury rate, whilst it makes life a bit harder its more realistic.
• 'Get stuck in' is borderline now, with more cards given out. Fair enough, don't think this instruction was intended for use for a full 90 minutes, every game.
• Previously it was harder to beat bottom of the league team than top of the league team, this is no longer the case thank god.
• Very few pin point long balls from Centre Backs, actual build up play now.
• Far fewer one on one's, more nuanced finishes from Striker.
• Far greater variety in general play, its interesting to watch games.

 

The game is actually logical and enjoyable to play.

A far, far better experience and a massive step in the right direction IMO 

 

     

 

Edited January 20, 2020 by Mr U Rosler

[saihtam]

9 hours ago, Federico said:

Yeah but looking at how defenders move out of any logic just before your player is about to cross the ball in the box, it looks more cheap than beautiful.

Noticing this more and more.
Like the changes in ME and the flow, but dont get what is going on with defenders. Too often they are brain dead, break the line for no reason or close down 1 guy together leaving huge caps (this double team happens too often in midfield also)

[Koffing]

Public beta seems like a trick  to stall players in order to gain more time for fixing ME. The CCCs are reduced so low that the ME relies on goals from longshot and chaotic ways.I had a game resutled 6-3 and the CCCs are 2 to 1. The defenders zombies all the time, does nothing after clearence from defending a set piece while opposite cuts the ball back and scores. Penalties are still a joke, as my main penalty kicker scored only 1 in 4 with a penalty taking 15. Guys with dribbling 9 can run past all the field and make an assist while my defenders zombies,long shot 6 players make screamers while finishing 15 players stuck in 1on1s. I think SI should publish a FM2020 remastered version next year as the current match engine does whatever he likes.

[wiseowl]

Quick question guys when will the retail version be updated to the beta with the fixes to the ME.

[Drebin893]

3 minutes ago, Koffing said:

Public beta seems like a trick  to stall players in order to gain more time for fixing ME. The CCCs are reduced so low that the ME relies on goals from longshot and chaotic ways.I had a game resutled 6-3 and the CCCs are 2 to 1. The defenders zombies all the time, does nothing after clearence from defending a set piece while opposite cuts the ball back and scores. Penalties are still a joke, as my main penalty kicker scored only 1 in 4 with a penalty taking 15. Guys with dribbling 9 can run past all the field and make an assist while my defenders zombies,long shot 6 players make screamers while finishing 15 players stuck in 1on1s. I think SI should publish a FM2020 remastered version next year as the current match engine does whatever he likes.

It's a football management simulation, not a card game like Pokemon or Topps Trumps. The ME takes more than single attributes into account.

[FrazT]

15 minutes ago, wiseowl said:

Quick question guys when will the retail version be updated to the beta with the fixes to the ME.

Unfortunately nobody can give you any concrete info on the timings of this as it will depend on the feedback to this beta and whether there are any further beta updates to test.

[He can't believe he's missed it]

11 minutes ago, Drebin893 said:

It's a football management simulation, not a card game like Pokemon or Topps Trumps. The ME takes more than single attributes into account.

I get the point you're making, but Football Manager top trumps with various wonderkids and favourites from the ages should absolutely be a thing

[wiseowl]

2 minutes ago, FrazT said:

Unfortunately nobody can give you any concrete info on the timings of this as it will depend on the feedback to this beta and whether there are any further beta updates to test.

Ok thank you for the reply. 

[Martini1991]

I'm enjoying the beta match engine a lot more than I was previously.

I've got the team playing the way I want to, which is far and away the biggest improvement.

 

But conversion rate still seems pretty poor.

Any time I manage to get a one on one situation where my striker is in on goal, I know they're going to fail to score. But how would PKM's help that? They aren't going to score every time, so I can't give a PKM of every opportunity surely?

 

And then there's golden opportunities that the keepers are able to consistently save.

 

I've ended up basically playing a mini game with myself keeping Middlesbrough in the championship and making profit. I've got 240M in the bank. Although that's probably going to increase as I've got a keeper to sell for 15M.

 

I've got strikers that would walk in the a lot of teams in the PL that can't score goals etc lol.

 

[WelshMourinho]

I think I'm definitely going to have to give the public beta a go, because what we've currently got is beyond frustrating to watch.

The build up in every highlight just feels like you're waiting for whichever player decides to hoof the ball for an actual chance to be created. You can feel it coming too, A few passes will be played before one of the players in the backline turns into prime Xabi Alonso and launches a pinpoint 60 yard pass to put someone through. It doesn't seem to matter if your defenders have good composure, they're still smashing the thing long even if your instructions suggest to do otherwise. 

Good chances don't really feel like good chances. I don't react when my striker goes through 1 on 1 anymore, because he's most likely smashing it straight at the keeper. You're more likely to score from your players being crowded out than you are from going through clean through. This one feels like a problem FM has had for a while, with what feels like too many good chances resulting in an unrealistic amount being saved. 

This one could be confirmation bias, but the sheer amount of highlights that seem to start from throw-ins close to the byline, or set pieces in general perfectly sums up the games current state imo: no creativity whatsoever. One highlight will show your most creative midfielder outright refusing to play any sort of clever through ball, and then the next your CB will have the vision and technical ability of Messi to play a ludicrous over the top through ball. 

It's a frustrating experience because it seems quite a lot of us have been waiting for a ME that allows for a bit more build up play, and for central players to really shine, but the evidence suggests that might be impossible to achieve, but at least previous FMs found a way around it that wasn't just putting a bit of Jerome Boateng in every defender in the game lmao. 

Oh well, we wait for another update. For now I'm going to give the public beta a chance to see what I think of that.

[Koffing]

1 hour ago, He can't believe he's missed it said:

I get the point you're making, but Football Manager top trumps with various wonderkids and favourites from the ages should absolutely be a thing

No , he is right the ME is perfectly balanced  and takes into more than single attribute into account. There were posts about penalty taking is related with players weight/height ratio  in steam forums.

[He can't believe he's missed it]

Just now, Koffing said:

No , he is right the ME is perfectly balanced  and takes into more than single attribute into account. There were posts about penalty taking is related with players weight/height ratio  in steam forums.

err i was talking about the card game?

[Tangerine_Army]

I must be playing a different game than most of you on this beta as the only thing that has changed is less clear cut chances 

other than that its the same with goalkeepers being worse

[Major Raver]

Its dumming down of the attackers in the game that is a problem.  In my game this is what I currently see against what is real life.  This is the same across every league, and im using the 20.4 engine.

 

Prem League

Game: 31matches top scorer Mane 12 goals

Real Life 23matches, top scorer Vardy 17 goals

 

Championship

Game 38matches top scorer Pereira 10 goals

Real Life: 28matches Watkins / Mitrovic 18 goals

 

League 1

Game 39matches top scorer Marquis (plays for me) 12 goals

Real Life 26 matches, Toney 15 goals

 

League 2

Game 40 matches Nicky Maynard 13 goals

Real Life 28 games, Doyle 23 goals

[craigcwwe]

13 hours ago, ajw10 said:

I'm not sure the Beta has made this game any better, just different. I'm finding that strikers are back to being useless, and wingers are the main source of goals. One on ones are still being missed at the same rate. 

If this is going to be the next update then I'm going to be hugely disappointed.

I think the next full update to the game, probably in March will build upon this public beta build. 

Still an alarming lack of central play on the newer ME I've found after playing through a full season. Too few goals from both players and teams overall when compared to the previous season on the older ME build. 

Toning down the pinpoint 60 yard balls from CB to CF was nice to see however. 

Still can't beat FM17/18 ME for me and that's the most important part of the game imo. 

[Lexis]

1 minute ago, craigcwwe said:

I think the next full update to the game, probably in March will build upon this public beta build. 

Still an alarming lack of central play on the newer ME I've found after playing through a full season. Too few goals from both players and teams overall when compared to the previous season on the older ME build. 

Toning down the pinpoint 60 yard balls from CB to CF was nice to see however. 

Still can't beat FM17/18 ME for me and that's the most important part of the game imo. 

FM 19 was marked by overly defensive opponents.

FM18 was marked by execrable and outrageously bad long shots and shots from inside forward position.

[witchplease]

Conversion rate is frustrating af. Atleast in last patch there were tons of chances so that was helping, now there are few key chances (as it should be) but both my 160 CA strikers would rather hit the post or keeper than back of the net. One of them is still somehow scraping a goal every other game because of set pieces or penalties but the other striker is basically a passenger in this patch. Even more frustrating watching him hit post every other game when he hasn't scored a goal in 6-7 games.

[Johnny Ace]

23 minutes ago, Major Raver said:

Its dumming down of the attackers in the game that is a problem.  In my game this is what I currently see against what is real life.  This is the same across every league, and im using the 20.4 engine.

 

Prem League

Game: 31matches top scorer Mane 12 goals

Real Life 23matches, top scorer Vardy 17 goals

 

Championship

Game 38matches top scorer Pereira 10 goals

Real Life: 28matches Watkins / Mitrovic 18 goals

 

League 1

Game 39matches top scorer Marquis (plays for me) 12 goals

Real Life 26 matches, Toney 15 goals

 

League 2

Game 40 matches Nicky Maynard 13 goals

Real Life 28 games, Doyle 23 goals

Similar experience, I like to run a holiday save just too see how things are going & watch out AI games, I ran the first 10 games of the season & Mane was top-scorer with 7 in 10, top striker was Deeney with 5 in 10

I need to restart it as that was the start of the 20/21 season, when I get my mojo back I'll put in some reports on it (did it last year & already done one for this year) 

[Kirariuk]

Sorry but we should use this public beta of me until March ??? Or can we expect another update first?

[Bakiano]

My topscorer is my BBM with 15 goals in 33 games where all goals came from long range. He has long shot 13.

[Major Raver]

Another thing i've just noticed.  One of my players Curtis just take a shot from 30 yards and it went wide, and his match rating dropped from 6.8 to 6.1 straight away.  By half time it was 6.0.  Seems one error wrecks the player for the whole game.  This is happening a lot with forwards, miss a chance and their morale is shot for the rest of the game and the next few.

[Tiger666]

46 minutes ago, Major Raver said:

Its dumming down of the attackers in the game that is a problem.  In my game this is what I currently see against what is real life.  This is the same across every league, and im using the 20.4 engine.

 

Prem League

Game: 31matches top scorer Mane 12 goals

Real Life 23matches, top scorer Vardy 17 goals

 

Championship

Game 38matches top scorer Pereira 10 goals

Real Life: 28matches Watkins / Mitrovic 18 goals

 

League 1

Game 39matches top scorer Marquis (plays for me) 12 goals

Real Life 26 matches, Toney 15 goals

 

League 2

Game 40 matches Nicky Maynard 13 goals

Real Life 28 games, Doyle 23 goals

After one full season I have

Premier league: Martial 26 goals

Championship: Woodrow 21 goals

League 1: Ennis 18 goals

League 2: Miller 17 goals

 

So yes a bit low.

 

[Sharkn20]

3 hours ago, Drebin893 said:

It's a football management simulation, not a card game like Pokemon or Topps Trumps. The ME takes more than single attributes into account.

So u saying attributes don't matter?

[craigcwwe]

4 minutes ago, Major Raver said:

Another thing i've just noticed.  One of my players Curtis just take a shot from 30 yards and it went wide, and his match rating dropped from 6.8 to 6.1 straight away.  By half time it was 6.0.  Seems one error wrecks the player for the whole game.  This is happening a lot with forwards, miss a chance and their morale is shot for the rest of the game and the next few.

Morale plays a major factor in the game. 

 

[craigcwwe]

27 minutes ago, Bakiano said:

My topscorer is my BBM with 15 goals in 33 games where all goals came from long range. He has long shot 13.

Likewise had a top scorer on 11 goals from 30-ish games from CM, he was also good at long shots. 

Meanwhile my world class striker looks like a L2 player playing in a top European league. Sad. 

[Major Raver]

12 minutes ago, Tiger666 said:

After one full season I have

Premier league: Martial 26 goals

Championship: Woodrow 21 goals

League 1: Ennis 18 goals

League 2: Miller 17 goals

 

So yes a bit low.

 

On yours the EPL total is realistic, but the other leagues certainly aren't

[Neil Brock]

On 19/01/2020 at 09:18, autohoratio said:

@ChuskeThePrince means their financial balance, not their scouting/transfer budget. This is what it's set to in the database: 

This is a known issue we're investigating. Thanks. 

[andu1]

21 minutes ago, Tiger666 said:

After one full season I have

Premier league: Martial 26 goals

Championship: Woodrow 21 goals

League 1: Ennis 18 goals

League 2: Miller 17 goals

 

So yes a bit low.

 

Are you using full detail for those leagues? I always see these types of tests but nobody mentions if they use full detail or not in those leagues.

[Major Raver]

2 minutes ago, andu1 said:

Are you using full detail for those leagues? I always see these types of tests but nobody mentions if they use full detail or not in those leagues.

full detail on my results, good point.

[Toshef]

21 minutes ago, Tiger666 said:

After one full season I have

Premier league: Martial 26 goals

Championship: Woodrow 21 goals

League 1: Ennis 18 goals

League 2: Miller 17 goals

 

So yes a bit low.

 

Yep the same thing I am preaching

Strikers are even more useless then before.  20 games in the season there is no striker in the world with more then 10 goals in the league...

 

I am just trying to give it a go right now at half time i have 15 shots 1 on target.. I mean ... 

Most goals I concede are poor cleareances so usually ist scored from everybody. I mean my defenders keep clearing to opposition players or goals from IFK... Opposition striker almost never score so for me

My top scoresrs are MC and AMC with shoot more with long shots 10 both... 

 

Just finished the game i was it 25 shots 5 on target against 12 shots 4 on target 1:0 for me.. 60 % possesion

We finished with 3 CCS and 4 half chances for one rebound goal... 

[duesouth]

49 minutes ago, Kirariuk said:

Sorry but we should use this public beta of me until March ??? Or can we expect another update first?

We don't know at the moment - we'll just have to look out for news.