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Football Manager 2020 Feedback Thread


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I like the match engine too. I much prefer this version's central play compared to the FM19. I really struggled with AMCs and strikers last year and that killed my enjoyment a little. I think the ME is in a better place this year, just need to find the balance with the 1v1s but at least my playmakers are playing defense splitting through balls!

Edited by rafaelbenitez
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There's a whole host of issues with the ME which have caused me to stop playing. I would go back to FM19 but find it too hard to motivate myself to play a game I'd expected to replace. 

Most of my concerns have already been pointed out, but thought I'd list some of them anyway as this is a feedback thread:

One on ones/balls over the top - far too many one-on-ones which kills any enjoyment for me. Seems to be a combination of defensive lines being in ridiculous positions, and CB's failing to react in any way which can be considered even remotely realistic

Chance conversion - whilst I don't have any statistics to back this up, it appears to me that there's far too many chances that look simple being missed. Strikers completely miss the target when one-on-one (which as above could be anywhere between once and 456 times a game), and tap ins from a yard or two out are regularly placed carefully into the goalkeeper's hands by the striker.

Throw ins - Defenders, in particular full backs, seem to constantly mark the wrong player, leaving the winger free to run down the wing and receive the throw in

Players keep the ball in play and then start signing autographs for the crowd allowing the opposition to swoop in and nick the ball

 

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3 hours ago, Johnny Ace said:

I've reported this twice over two separate match engines, neither have been acknowledged but I'm sure it's in hand 

I have also reported this several times, I don't understand why there has been zero response on this.

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17 minutes ago, XaW said:

I know this might be swearing in a church (famous Norwegian proverb) here, at least compared to a lot of the recent posts, but I really like the current Match Engine. And I've pretty much liked it since I first started FM20 back in the Beta-days. For the whole time, I've seen a lot of complaints and issues, but I don't know if I'm the luckiest guy FM-wise, but I don't see the issues to the extent of others here.

Yes, there are issues with 1v1. For me, the issue lies with there being too many of them. Previously, wing play have been too strong and balls through the centre has been poor. I think the dial it turned a bit too much the other way now. But in general I see a lot of different goals in my matches. Clever 1-2's, through balls, crosses, set pieces, etc.

Tactically, the team are playing as I want, and my tactic works for the most part. I've reported some issues with the Halfback role being too advanced when the ball is in the final third, as well as a few other niggles here and there. In general, I'm really enjoying it and I've racked up about 350 hours so far.

Outside of the match engine, I really like the new youth development, as well as the club vision. Not that any of those are major new features, they are nice add-ons that gives me a better way of doing things.

I agree with you XaW, in the way that I am also enjoying the game, as well as the match engine. It does have some overall flaws, especially regarding defensive headers and players keeping the ball in play and just letting an opposition player take it away from him. 

But I know from the Youth Academy Challenge that you are not playing in a top league and neither am I. It does seem that issues regarding 1vs1 conversion and penalty conversion are working quite a lot better when you're playing outside the top leagues. I think it was @Neil Brock who mentioned that this might be an issue (sorry if i'm wrong on this Neil). 

But outside some of the issues with the match engine, the overall game is far superior to any other version IMO. Especially the Club Vision and Development Center. Youth development feels a lot more real now, maybe except for those strange cases when you have really, really talented players that seemingly no other clubs are interested in taking in on loan! 

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32 minutes ago, Tiger666 said:

Any idea what's supposed to be happening here?

 

It's either a) a wonky ME moment or b) the 'keeper cocked up & it was poorly represented in the ME 

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6 hours ago, Johnny Ace said:

It's either a) a wonky ME moment or b) the 'keeper cocked up & it was poorly represented in the ME 

GK got poor first touch, composure or both. Maybe..

Edited by Pasonen
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51 minutes ago, Tiger666 said:

Any idea what's supposed to be happening here?

 

Miss the  1vs0?

Anyway, the attacker pressing seems to work but damn defenders are stuck to ground and too passive

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2 minutes ago, Pasonen said:

GK got poor first touch, composure of both. Maybe..

If in doubt, hoof it out, you don't stand there with the ball at your feet doing nothing 

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Just now, Johnny Ace said:

If in doubt, hoof it out, you don't stand there with the ball at your feet doing nothing 

Yep. Its a poor presentation of gk mistake.

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1 minute ago, Pasonen said:

Yep. Its a poor presentation of gk mistake.

If he trips, stumbles, fills his pants then fair enough but it could be shown better. I think that's the reason for a lot of complains around here 

Edited by Johnny Ace
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20 minutes ago, saihtam said:

Miss the  1vs0?

Anyway, the attacker pressing seems to work but damn defenders are stuck to ground and too passive

What annoys me is when a player is running and beating his opponent to the ball then seems to slow or stop before running again only to be beaten as in what your goal keeper just did

 

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2 часа назад, wattzy сказал:

I would go back to FM19 but find it too hard to motivate myself to play a game I'd expected to replace. 

Thank you, I couldn’t formulate this feeling on my own :) 

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1 hour ago, Novem9 said:

Thank you, I couldn’t formulate this feeling on my own :) 

I was playing on FM 18 and I abandoned my long term save to come to FM 20.

I've invested a lot of time in FM 20, setting training, monitoring promising youth and creating training notes for them watching every match in comprehensive.

I'm really competing at the top of the Premier League so wins aren't the problem. The problem is the cinematic experience which I never wanted in the penalty box

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I feel like the game is still super easy for more attacking mentalities, even with the long ball over the top threat, because:

1) 1on1's after long balls are not converted at a high rate

2) counter attacking really lacking other than the long balls over the top

3) the more you attack, the more you expose the 'zombie defenders'. 

The second one has never been really good in any FM (I think 17 was the best in that where I actually enjoyed creating CCC's with proper counter attacks). But the defending (reaction to the path of crosses, passes and runners, and terrible clearances) got a lot worse in FM 20, leading to way too many shots.

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12 minutes ago, bleventozturk said:

3) the more you attack, the more you expose the 'zombie defenders'. 

Yes I have seen this while setting tempo from slow/normal to High. Possession increases.. what is mm a little odd.. :D

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Did anyone manage to get good performance from BWM's or BBM's? I play a simple 4-3-3, and I get good ratings with AP, DLP and regular CM(s), because they keep producing key passes, but the more defensive roles or the more roaming ones seldom get good ratings in my setup. 

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3 minutes ago, Novem9 said:

Ohhh it was sexy :hammer:

but if analyze I'm almost sure there are some defensive issues :D but not today for me, not today

 

Nice movement there. But yes, that CB (number 5) looks like a good example of zombie defending. My fear is, again, that if defending will improve, we will have FM 19 ME all over again, with no central play. 

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10 minutes ago, bleventozturk said:

Nice movement there. But yes, that CB (number 5) looks like a good example of zombie defending. My fear is, again, that if defending will improve, we will have FM 19 ME all over again, with no central play. 

Ha it's always number 5. Ban number 5!!

You might have a point..

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3 minutes ago, Mitja said:

Ha it's always number 5. Ban number 5!!

You might have a point..

His positioning looks fine in general throughout the highlight imo, but he is a bit late on reacting to that last ball that is played to Kane. You can of course chalk it up to bad defending, but the slow reaction by defenders (especially to high balls) is a trend in this ME.

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11 hours ago, Bakiano said:

All my penalties are low shots and whenever the opposite GK goes to the side where the penalty taker shoots, he saves the penalty.

Same. It's so frustrating. Feels unrealistic seeing players with 15+ penalty taking miss so regularly. 

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2 hours ago, bleventozturk said:

Did anyone manage to get good performance from BWM's or BBM's? I play a simple 4-3-3, and I get good ratings with AP, DLP and regular CM(s), because they keep producing key passes, but the more defensive roles or the more roaming ones seldom get good ratings in my setup. 

I have noticed this from my test saves sometimes. I will need to keep an eye on it. 

Edited by Gee_Simpson
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On 18/12/2019 at 10:29, Neil Brock said:

There's a number of issues which have been raised by the community, but having spoken to the match team in more depth, there's a few things on the radar. With one-on-ones it's not as simple as say 'players are missing too many', first of all, why are they missing them? Are they ignoring players in better positions and taking on shots from worse angles? Sometimes yes. But then we can't always have the players making the right decisions every time as that isn't realistic either. It's a real balancing act. We can't just up their ability to score one on ones, it's not that simplistic. But yes, conversion and how these chances are taken is something we're looking at.

We're also aware that defending longer balls through the middle requires attention and appreciate everyone who has raised examples. We've also seen a number of people raise issues with missed penalties. This is more of an odd one as our stats taken over thousands of seasons to get an average suggest that the overall number of penalties converted per season is about right - so we've got a bit more of a theory that perhaps there's an issue specifically with highly rated penalty takers. This is something under review, but as with everything else it's not always quite as obvious as it seems. 

We're also aware of an issue related to clear cut chances being record inaccurately - sometimes chances are being marked as CCC when if you watch them back they may be considered half chances or even less. This is giving an inflated view that lots of chances are being missed which should be scored. That's not to try and say that conversion rates are perfect and it's just the stats showing it wrong, but we do think this could do with some tweaking alongside the match AI. Just because I've not mentioned other specifics doesn't mean other issues are being ignored. There are hundreds of areas we'd like to try and improve, some of which are more realistic than others given our resources. What we always aim for is a balanced, fair match engine which outputs the kinds of results which the appropriate team strengths and tactical setups should be achieving. We do feel like we have that now, but of course we're aware of feedback and as said, are always striving to improve the game where we can. 

Realistically the match engine is not an easy area of the game to improve and given the amount of work and testing required to make sure any changes do as we expect and don't have any knock-ons, we're going to need time. Whilst the old adage of never say never, with the holidays approaching it's unlikely we'll be able to release any further changes to the match engine until the New Year. We really do appreciate anyone who takes the time to raise any issue or add additional examples via the match engine bug forums. We'll still be adding to and logging new issues into our bugs database to make sure everything is recorded and can be investigated by our match team. Appreciate those who take the time to read these types of messages from us. We are busy so don't always have the time to respond to every post, but we do try to make sure as much as possible is read.

Also would appreciate at this time of year remember the Mods on these forums are volunteers. They're not paid for helping out, they do so as they just want people to try and enjoy the game and when on these forums, be able to engage with each other in the best way possible. Whilst you don't always have to agree with them (or us for that matter) please try to respect their opinions. Likewise everyone at SI and within the Mod team tries to respect your opinions, even if they're critical of us. All we'd ask is if you are criticising please try and keep it constructive. We don't want to be in a position where we're restricting anyone's access to these forums, but direct attacks on other users, moderators or the development team won't be tolerated. 

Cheers. 

@RobertPage I don’t know if you have read the post I quoted from Neil Brock. 

The holiday period is not long over, but as above be aware they know of the issues and are working on them. 

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12 minutes ago, Tiger666 said:

Should Al-Sadd be the third most reputable club in the world?

Capture.PNG.40f7a44dd6b7646dc0047b454ae7bac0.thumb.PNG.a23439277f5a374b8a841513a7287e48.PNG

If there has not been an editor used, no they shouldn't be- please report this in the relevant Bugs forum as it is clearly not right.

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3 minutes ago, FrazT said:

If there has not been an editor used, no they shouldn't be- please report this in the relevant Bugs forum as it is clearly not right.

I used the pre-game editor to remove Brexit and tweak a couple of player stats, nothing else. Will report it.

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4 minutes ago, Bobek said:

I just wonder who are your ME testers.

As a long time FM player ( Above 1500 hours fm 17, above 500 hours fm 18 and 19)  I bought fm 20 in December.

I just played 25  hours of this game and I stopped playing it.

While playing it I've noticed tones of bugs that were mentioned before ( especially too much 1vs1, too much long balls over def line and too much missing's of 1vs1 by strikers). Also i noticed simple things like low crosses are not working , too much books for RBS and LBS and that players are often carring the ball and he stops and then he  loose it. ( its known bug)

So, after just 25 hours of playing Inoticed a lot of bugs in ME.

Who does test it before releasing game?? Maybe you should change your testers and let it test more relevant players. 

 

 

@Bobek Your feedback on the game is appreciated and the issues that you have raised have all been acknowledged.  Your comments on the testers are not appreciated however and unless you are a member of the alpha and beta test teams are disrespectful to them and the issues that have been identified during the test process..  Please lets have no more comments like this

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2 minutes ago, Tiger666 said:

I used the pre-game editor to remove Brexit and tweak a couple of player stats, nothing else. Will report it.

Thank you:thup:

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5 minutes ago, Bobek said:

With my greatest respect,

This game was released 2 months ago and this game is still unfinished. I bought not finished game for a full price and i feel like users are your testers. I just dont understand while knowing that there are so many problems and issuess especially at ME the realease date wasn't delayed? (Naughty Dog did it and other greatest companies - its not a shame)

So , Your ME testers  did not notice bugs or they wasnt fixed after getting reports from your teams.

By all means raise your concerns about the game, but since you are not part of the test process, you have no idea about the workings and process involved.  Suggesting that the testers are replaced is disrespectful and I would ask that you read and absorb the contents of this part of the forum rules before posting again.

https://community.sigames.com/topic/509042-providing-feedback-and-engaging-with-others/

  Please also read your private messages about your account and respond.

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18 minutes ago, bitzu_rock said:

@FrazT Hi! I think a person that bought the game, spent money, spent his time to play the game has at least the right to some harsh opinion. It is very annoying to see you paid for a product that makes your head hurt while using it. I know that there is a huge amount of work behind the game, but still the fact is if SI knew there are some issues ....at least when releasing the game they should specify there are some problems that will be fixed in the future, right? This way people could have had the possibility not to buy the game immediately. Or maybe the game should have not been released. It is not users fault that there are issues, so at least do not be so hard on them and threaten to, i do not know warn them or something else. As long as someone does not use cursed words and paid for the game at least it should not be banned for expressing his frustrations. Anyway all of us who are annoyed by the obvious issues in the game we will still play it....so...i do not see any reason for you (SI, moderators) to be upset....

They do have the possibility to not the buy the game immediately. By having patience and some self control. They can try the demo first if they're not sure. Especially if "the ME has been broken for the last 746 FMs".
There will always be issues. Tricky part is to figure out what the subjective issues are and what the actual issues are.
Those banned are banned because they're not following the rules, terms and conditions they agreed to when they signed up for the forums. If they adhere to the rules and try to be constructive it would help themselves, the community and, most importantly, SI.
Mods have been very lenient and patient, in my opinion.

For what it's worth; this product does not make my head hurt. I'm having a blast with it. Issues? Sure there are. I just don't focus on those issues. If i do, it is to try using it to my advantage, if possible.

Edited by roykela
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40 minutes ago, bitzu_rock said:

@FrazT Hi! I think a person that bought the game, spent money, spent his time to play the game has at least the right to some harsh opinion. It is very annoying to see you paid for a product that makes your head hurt while using it. I know that there is a huge amount of work behind the game, but still the fact is if SI knew there are some issues ....at least when releasing the game they should specify there are some problems that will be fixed in the future, right? This way people could have had the possibility not to buy the game immediately. Or maybe the game should have not been released. It is not users fault that there are issues, so at least do not be so hard on them and threaten to, i do not know warn them or something else. As long as someone does not use cursed words and paid for the game at least it should not be banned for expressing his frustrations. Anyway all of us who are annoyed by the obvious issues in the game we will still play it....so...i do not see any reason for you (SI, moderators) to be upset....

There are no issues with any users expressing their opinion both positively and negatively about the game. There are, however, a set of forum rules that users accept when they sign up and all we ask as Moderators is that users read and abide by those rules.  No user has ever been banned for criticising the game but will incur warnings if they do so in a way that is unacceptable.  SI have made it abundantly clear, particularly in the post that I linked to above, that criticism is fine, but when it gets personal or the competence of the SI team is questioned, then that is not fine.

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1 hour ago, bitzu_rock said:

@FrazT Hi! I think a person that bought the game, spent money, spent his time to play the game has at least the right to some harsh opinion. It is very annoying to see you paid for a product that makes your head hurt while using it. I know that there is a huge amount of work behind the game, but still the fact is if SI knew there are some issues ....at least when releasing the game they should specify there are some problems that will be fixed in the future, right? This way people could have had the possibility not to buy the game immediately. Or maybe the game should have not been released. It is not users fault that there are issues, so at least do not be so hard on them and threaten to, i do not know warn them or something else. As long as someone does not use cursed words and paid for the game at least it should not be banned for expressing his frustrations. Anyway all of us who are annoyed by the obvious issues in the game we will still play it....so...i do not see any reason for you (SI, moderators) to be upset....

I'd disagree that anyone has the right to post anything on the forum. What people do have is the privilege of posting, and providing both positive and negative feedback about the game, as long as they follow the rules of the forum, which people agree to as part of signing up. The rules have pretty much always said "don't personally insult SI staff, testers, or other members of the forum". I'm pretty sure that saying "either SI or the testers don't know how to do their job. You should sack and replace them with 'relevant' players" qualifies as insulting.

What would have perhaps been a better comment is "I have concerns regarding the bug reporting/testing for the game both currently and when it was in alpha, due to the number of bugs spotted. Is there anything that can be done, or anything interested members of the community can do to get involved and contribute?". That both identifies the issues/concerns in question, and makes a positive contribution to the thread and the process.

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@JordanMillward_1

Regarding this...."I'd disagree that anyone has the right to post anything on the forum. What people do have is the privilege of posting, and providing both positive and negative feedback about the game, as long as they follow the rules of the forum, which people agree to as part of signing up. The rules have pretty much always said "don't personally insult SI staff, testers, or other members of the forum". I'm pretty sure that saying "either SI or the testers don't know how to do their job. You should sack and replace them with 'relevant' players" qualifies as insulting."...well sometimes people do get sacked if they do not do the job right....ok i understand in this case is a huge amount of work, but anyway there are some bugs or annoying match behaviors that raise question of how they were not discovered during testing. I am pretty sure they were aware of some but of course it is not developers and testers fault, they do not decide what happens with the product, but still....at least i think we should have the right to complain. Maybe some post some harsh words because are really disappointed and that means they love the game and are passionate about it. Just saying....

 

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What would make the game a lot better, would be if it had some kind of "dong" sound every time it return from a processing break. (If it's implemented don't forget to make a setting that turn it off)

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1 hour ago, Miravlix said:

What would make the game a lot better, would be if it had some kind of "dong" sound every time it return from a processing break. (If it's implemented don't forget to make a setting that turn it off)

After reading the previous 4 or 5 messages this made me chuckle far more than it should’ve done. Outstanding. 

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When I go to my manager profile, I see that the game defines me with 'attacking mentality' and 'route one' style. My team played the complete opposite of this the entire season, so this is messed up, and will be a game breaker if it contradicts how the board wants you to play. Is this a known issue? Man, there are so many issues in this year's game, and somehow I am still enjoying it mostly, but it really feels like a Beta version to be honest.

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17 minutes ago, bleventozturk said:

When I go to my manager profile, I see that the game defines me with 'attacking mentality' and 'route one' style. My team played the complete opposite of this the entire season, so this is messed up, and will be a game breaker if it contradicts how the board wants you to play. Is this a known issue? Man, there are so many issues in this year's game, and somehow I am still enjoying it mostly, but it really feels like a Beta version to be honest.

As we will always say in this kind of circumstance, please report it in the Bugs forum as it will not get looked at in here.

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You're team just smashed there Rivals 4-1 and the game generated press conference is all about the one goal and the opposition player that scored it.

 

I don't think you see that in the real world where a majority of the focus is on the SMASHED team being able to score 1 goal. The press conference need to remove or limit  positive questions about the team that just got owned, there is NOTHING positive about being able to ONLY score 1 goal when you just got owned 4-1.

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17 minutes ago, Miravlix said:

You're team just smashed there Rivals 4-1 and the game generated press conference is all about the one goal and the opposition player that scored it.

 

I don't think you see that in the real world where a majority of the focus is on the SMASHED team being able to score 1 goal. The press conference need to remove or limit  positive questions about the team that just got owned, there is NOTHING positive about being able to ONLY score 1 goal when you just got owned 4-1.

There should be more colorful answer options if they ask stupid things. Like "I hope he is happy for the goal like we're after winner 4-1". :D

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2 hours ago, Novem9 said:

You started this cicle for new lap. I didn't buy FM20 after FM19 which I never enjoyed really, but I checked demo FM20 ME v2021. Despite some members were unhappy I found this version pretty good and bought FM20 in sure that all mistakes of FM19 were taken into account and next update will be only better or the same at least. V2026 released some time later and it brokes any pleasure from this game for me. I never would have bought v2026. So only one way for me in future - dont buy FM and dont use demo until last patch will be released. If it exaclty about patience you said - ok you're right, it will be a lesson for me

There should be some possibility to reverse back ME version for users, I think steam even offers this possibility for games in their settings. It is done in several games where simulation is used and updates are changing a lot. Right now only way do to this is copy every version of your game differently and start in offline version that is not ideal.

Secondly, I am sad to say this but I feel only way to somehow be more noticed is to leave good and informative (but negative) review on the Steam page(please just dont spam and be offensive - this will not get us nowhere). One example: LINK
Comments here will drown anyway, maybe reviews will be viewed more often and more when they are sayd to be helpful by other users. This and maybe holding out on initial buy for FM might be something that can bring more attention - when there are more people doing they will notice.

And Lastly please dont direct testers and developers disrespectfully. Software development is not that straight forward and we have no idea what or how decisions are being made or complication might occur while fixing things.

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