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Football Manager 2020 Pre-Release Beta *Official* Feedback Thread

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13 minutes ago, dangngo6 said:

yeah right, my tactic again... when i said playing control posseision, short pass, play out of defense, lower tempo my DC ( set to less risk, short pass) have the ball, and literally IN FRONT OF HIM IS A TEAMMATE, no he blast the ball 50 yards forward. For more info, he have zero traits
so yeah it is my tactic i guess

 That's all well and good but if he's incapable of actually playing that style of football then yes he might well just blast it forward. 

Edited by kiwityke1983

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4 минуты назад, styluz05 сказал:

Without being stupid... "Report Bug" easy just clicking on that?

It will link you in forum. You need this subforum for this issue

https://community.sigames.com/forum/712-transfers-contracts-scouting-and-staff-responsibilities/

 

and this is SI cloud where you can load your game and call file name in raised thread.

https://oc.sigames.com/owncloud/index.php/s/Kzvhd0MdU3v4Nv4

So if you have time for this SI will check AI decisions and improve them

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3 minutes ago, Feriboy2 said:

LOL, that button just brings up the bug report forum in the brower :D

What else were you expecting. Send a personal text and snapchat to the dev with detailed bug report? :D

 

Edited by pats

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Are there any plans for a pre release ME patch?

 

I know you are working hard to fix all the bugs. But i'm at a state where i can't Beta Test anymore. The ME is taking all the fun out of the game for me.

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Just now, pats said:

What else were you expecting. Send a personal text and snapchat to the dev with detailed bug report? :D

 

Maybe a report form within the game? Where you can describe the bug, automatically attach PKM files...

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7 minutes ago, Herbie2100 said:

Are there any plans for a pre release ME patch?

 

I know you are working hard to fix all the bugs. But i'm at a state where i can't Beta Test anymore. The ME is taking all the fun out of the game for me.

Same here, I'm gonna finish my season tonight & have a chill, the crazy stuff on the pitch breaks my head. I wouldn't be expecting a ME update before release

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41 minutes ago, kiwityke1983 said:

 That's all well and good but if he's incapable of actually playing that style of football then yes he might well just blast it forward. 

You speak of player capability having limitations, yet your Barnsley squad are able to keep the ball away from superior opposition, climb to a promotion spot and score 90 goals in the process? 

The first question I would ask if how / why are the AI not exploiting the limitations of your players?

The inconvenient truth is that despite an abundance of tactical options at our disposal, there is currently an extremely limited range of play styles that consistently win in the current match engine.

Since their introduction, the AI has had no sustainable answer to high LOE & counter press styles. There will be the odd match in which the user dominates yet fails to win; but over the course of a season this inevitably leads to over-achievement. There seems to have been little to zero progress in addressing the over-powered nature of this approach.

@dangngo6 has made observations that chime with my experience. There is a decisions hierarchy problem in the BETA build, resulting in players opting for both longer balls from the back, and an over abundance of extreme / high-risk cross-field passes (rather than shorter, ground-based forward passes). I just watched Loki's latest Newcastle episode in which he had a promising 5 v 3 breakaway in the opposition half. The ball carrier could have slipped it through to any one of 3 team mates, but instead elected to stop, turn, and pass it back 30 yards (giving it away which led to a goal). Getting decision making right is the key to whether we end up with a match engine that will allow users to succeed (providing they have the right players) using a diverse range of tactical styles.

Until then, it's all aboard the Gegenpress Express, calling at: Long Shots, Crosses, Set Pieces - final destination; trophies.

Edited by rdbayly

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Do parent clus ever send out loanees to your club?
It never happened to me in FM19 and hasn't happened in 2 1/2 seaons on FM20 either here.

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5 минут назад, roykela сказал:

Do parent clus ever send out loanees to your club?
It never happened to me in FM19 and hasn't happened in 2 1/2 seaons on FM20 either here.

they gave me a list of players who agreed to loan in first week of August as I remember (FM19)

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24 minutes ago, rdbayly said:

You speak of player capability having limitations, yet your Barnsley squad are able to keep the ball away from superior opposition, climb to a promotion spot and score 90 goals in the process? 

The first question I would ask if how / why are the AI not exploiting the limitations of your players?

The inconvenient truth is that despite an abundance of tactical options at our disposal, there is currently an extremely limited range of play styles that consistently win in the current match engine.

Since their introduction, the AI has had no sustainable answer to high LOE & counter press styles. There will be the odd match in which the user dominates yet fails to win; but over the course of a season this inevitably leads to over-achievement. There seems to have been little to zero progress in addressing the over-powered nature of this approach.

@dangngo6 has made observations that chime with my experience. There is a decisions hierarchy problem in the BETA build, resulting in players opting for both longer balls from the back, and an over abundance of extreme / high-risk cross-field passes (rather than shorter, ground-based forward passes). I just watched Loki's latest Newcastle episode in which he had a promising 5 v 3 breakaway in the opposition half. The ball carrier could have slipped it through to any one of 3 team mates, but instead elected to stop, turn, and pass it back 30 yards (giving it away which led to a goal). Getting decision making right is the key to whether we end up with a match engine that will allow users to succeed (providing they have the right players) using a diverse range of tactical styles.

Until then, it's all aboard the Gegenpress Express, calling at: Long Shots, Crosses, Set Pieces - final destination; trophies.

Yet his complaint is he can't get this tactic to work at all. Seeing as it ccan work it must be his tactics that cause them not to work. 

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Is Almeria a sugarddady club of the type that will throw money at the club to spend?

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9 minutes ago, Novem9 said:

they gave me a list of players who agreed to loan in first week of August as I remember (FM19)


Good to know it happens then.
Wish it could happen at my clubs too :D

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Pitch degradation seems very exaggerated. In Goldenfm's newest video there's so many visible mud patches only 5 minutes in to a game at the Camp Nou 

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1 hour ago, rdbayly said:

Since their introduction, the AI has had no sustainable answer to high LOE & counter press styles. There will be the odd match in which the user dominates yet fails to win; but over the course of a season this inevitably leads to over-achievement. There seems to have been little to zero progress in addressing the over-powered nature of this approach.

This might be true for higher tiers, but down in the really lower leagues, this really don't work. I had a go with a gegenpress style tactic, but I only experienced long balls over the top for the opponent to score loads. Quite realistic really, so that is, at best, a truth with an asterix behind it.

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2 hours ago, Feriboy2 said:

LOL, that button just brings up the bug report forum in the brower :D

I thought that but as I haven't played the game in a few years I wasn't 100% sure.

2 hours ago, pats said:

What else were you expecting. Send a personal text and snapchat to the dev with detailed bug report? :D

 

The same as in a lot of games, it asks you to describe the bug/problem also an option were you just hit an 'upload' button so you can upload your save to the bug report.

It really would be a lot better not just for the players but also for SI for getting more reports, a lot of players are put off reporting bugs and problems as they have to jump through hoops to do so, also not everyone even knows how to upload their saves and can't be bothered to learn.

Anyway I don't see it changing soon, I'm pretty sure it gets brought up every year, at least it did when I was playing the game.

Edited by daylight

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3 hours ago, metallimuse said:

3 season's in with only the Scottish leagues loaded and I'm having HUGE difficulty selling my unwanted players. Nobody wants them even at knock down prices, never encountered this before.

Evan a star player valued at £9.5m who wants away, offered him out and not one interested party.

Can't be right surely?

Do you have a lot of players loaded?

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3 hours ago, Herbie2100 said:

Are there any plans for a pre release ME patch?

 

I know you are working hard to fix all the bugs. But i'm at a state where i can't Beta Test anymore. The ME is taking all the fun out of the game for me.

Isn't that the whole point of Beta?

1. Get to see the game early.

2. Be a part of the public testing.

 

It's understandable that you aren't having fun but unfortunately you cannot expect that in the Beta. There will be major and minor bugs which are being worked on by SI which might take a long time to release.

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3 minutes ago, endtime said:

Do you have a lot of players loaded?

No just the Scottish league that's it.

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1 minute ago, metallimuse said:

No just the Scottish league that's it.

Yeah, but what database did you select? Did you load any additional players?

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1 minute ago, endtime said:

Yeah, but what database did you select? Did you load any additional players?

Large Scottish database, nothing additional.

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There is no “reload skin” button in the preference settings for me (use Mac). This means I haven’t been able to get logos/face packs etc in to game, which to me is something I have to have to enjoy the game. 

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3 minutes ago, metallimuse said:

Large Scottish database, nothing additional.

In my experience loading a single league with a large db really restricts the demand for your players, you're better off loading a small or medium one, or adding some leagues, at least on view only.

But it might also be worth raising a bug report if you believe that transfer activity is too low :thup:

Edited by endtime

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1 minute ago, endtime said:

In my experience loading a single league with a large db really restricts the demand for your players, you're better off loading a small or medium one, or adding some leagues, at least on view only.

I've just added in the English/Italian/French/Dutch leagues which will become active end of this season, that should help yes?

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3 hours ago, rdbayly said:

Until then, it's all aboard the Gegenpress Express, calling at: Long Shots, Crosses, Set Pieces - final destination; trophies.

image.thumb.png.e84dd76b92b00b8ed84fdcf377fc98f7.png

 

I seriously question whether you've even played FM2020 if you think the only way to score is via crosses. Through-balls and great interplay around the box are now legitimate ways to score, that was impossible in FM19. As you can see above I've managed to get goals from 24 crosses, 23 through balls and 15 short passes. The assists have come from across the park too.  (lets not forget that most goals IRL originate from crosses by the way so it isn't unrealistic to see most goals come via that route)

Yes there are too many long shot goals and too many one on ones. But in many ways especially passing fluidity the ME is light years ahead of FM19 or any other ME that we've had prior.

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37 minutes ago, metallimuse said:

I've just added in the English/Italian/French/Dutch leagues which will become active end of this season, that should help yes?

It definitely should, yeah, but it probably depends on your Brexit version as well, e.g. a hard Brexit where Scotland stays in the UK should, in theory, make it easier to sell players to England as teams look to fill their HG quotas, but harder to sell to other countries with foreign player limits.

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I seriously question your understanding of how utterly flawed that tool is to use it as evidence to support your view. It is an established fact that balls over the top and passes to feet are aggregated and counted as 'through balls', when in reality they are not. It also incorrectly classifies 'overhead kicks' and even fails to count penalties properly.

You say that interplay around the box and through balls were impossible to achieve in FM19? Not according to the below analysis tool screenshot from my last FM19 save:

image.thumb.png.53f02fed07aba7c741dba0ecbcc7ce0d.png 

What have we here? An even spread of assists with 16 coming from through balls? Either you were wrong about it being impossible in FM19 or the tool you are relying on to prove a point is flawed. 

Anyway there is no point bickering so I'll leave it there. Enjoy the game.

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1 minute ago, rdbayly said:

I seriously question your understanding of how utterly flawed that tool is to use it as evidence to support your view. It is an established fact that balls over the top and passes to feet are aggregated and counted as 'through balls', when in reality they are not. It also incorrectly classifies 'overhead kicks' and even fails to count penalties properly.

You say that interplay around the box and through balls were impossible to achieve in FM19? Not according to the below analysis tool screenshot from my last FM19 save:

image.thumb.png.53f02fed07aba7c741dba0ecbcc7ce0d.png 

What have we here? An even spread of assists with 16 coming from through balls? Either you were wrong about it being impossible in FM19 or the tool you are relying on to prove a point is flawed. 

Anyway there is no point bickering so I'll leave it there. Enjoy the game.

I've got these things called eyes. The interplay around the box is markedly better within the ME just from watching it.

You said it was all crosses and geggenpress, patently false.

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24 minutes ago, kiwityke1983 said:

image.thumb.png.e84dd76b92b00b8ed84fdcf377fc98f7.png

 

I seriously question whether you've even played FM2020 if you think the only way to score is via crosses. Through-balls and great interplay around the box are now legitimate ways to score, that was impossible in FM19. As you can see above I've managed to get goals from 24 crosses, 23 through balls and 15 short passes. The assists have come from across the park too.  (lets not forget that most goals IRL originate from crosses by the way so it isn't unrealistic to see most goals come via that route)

Yes there are too many long shot goals and too many one on ones. But in many ways especially passing fluidity the ME is light years ahead of FM19 or any other ME that we've had prior.

agree that the center play are LOT better than last year, my tactic work as i think, the only problem as i said there are too many long pass from Defenders

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2 hours ago, XaW said:

This might be true for higher tiers, but down in the really lower leagues, this really don't work. I had a go with a gegenpress style tactic, but I only experienced long balls over the top for the opponent to score loads. Quite realistic really, so that is, at best, a truth with an asterix behind it.

Gegenpress has worked fine for me in National League South - 4 league games left & I am going to finish 2nd (preseason prediction was 7th) and have reached the FA Trophy final.

Occasionally there are games where I get caught out at the back with balls over the top or I fail to score but mostly I win games easily.

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2 minutes ago, stevedaytona said:

Gegenpress has worked fine for me in National League South - 4 league games left & I am going to finish 2nd (preseason prediction was 7th) and have reached the FA Trophy final.

Occasionally there are games where I get caught out at the back with balls over the top or I fail to score but mostly I win games easily.

Hmh, maybe you have found a way that work. I had no luck at all and switched to hoofball with success.

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Has anyone tried playing a CAM as a playmaker support?? Maybe this will cut out long ball's persistence? Or even have a deeplying playmaker on defend. Or a trait that says comes deep to get the ball along side passing shorter? If the use of any of these don't reduce the numbers surely it's a bug that the SI have already gathered and possibly worked on enough for the official 1.0 patch. 

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I'm finding away matches difficult at the moment. I use a basic 4-4-1-1, normally my away days are close affairs, but at the moment I'm conceding ridiculous amount of shots, upward 20+.

 

The problem I'm having is I have no idea what to change to fix it, because it's either, some nonsense long ball where my centrebacks seem oblivious to (I've dropped the defensive line to compensate but it didn't really help), or I get the pattern of right flank-left flank, which I've no idea how to analyse because it's an odd pattern of play. My defensive unit seems to tuck in along the penalty area lines, leaving the flanks vacant for exploitation.

I see the same thing on attack at times, I get the impression a Full back or wing back on attack is going to be lethal because despite playing with a traditional winger, he cuts in towards the box even with no PPMs telling him to. This combined with the narrow defensive tucking in is leading to fullbacks being the widest and sometimes unmarked players. Maybe that's why we're seeing the consistent switching of play all the time? 

I would like to see the traditional winger go wide more as well though.

Also, evidently the 'shoot on sight' is overtuned, when the AI is chasing a game their fullbacks can and do shoot from the halfway lines at times. It's funny, there's a mismatch in what I'm seeing and in what the commentary seems to say.

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3 minutes ago, BigV said:

Has anyone tried playing a CAM as a playmaker support?? Maybe this will cut out long ball's persistence? Or even have a deeplying playmaker on defend. Or a trait that says comes deep to get the ball along side passing shorter? If the use of any of these don't reduce the numbers surely it's a bug that the SI have already gathered and possibly worked on enough for the official 1.0 patch. 

I dropped my CAM in a 4-2-3-1 Wide to the midfield line as he was nowhere to be seen in CAM. The play is better and I don't see many crossfield passes as before.

The 3 line midfield actually creates a more possession football than before as well

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6 minutes ago, BigV said:

Has anyone tried playing a CAM as a playmaker support?? Maybe this will cut out long ball's persistence? Or even have a deeplying playmaker on defend. Or a trait that says comes deep to get the ball along side passing shorter? If the use of any of these don't reduce the numbers surely it's a bug that the SI have already gathered and possibly worked on enough for the official 1.0 patch. 

I use an AP(S) in a 4-2-3-1, pass shorter, control possession type instructions, I don't see many balls lumped forward, what I do see is every central player lumping it to the wings. Logically, he's a number 10, to support the number 9 & advanced wide players but he loves playing 50 yard passes to the left & right back  

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1 minute ago, kiwityke1983 said:

I've got these things called eyes. The interplay around the box is markedly better within the ME just from watching it.

You said it was all crosses and geggenpress, patently false.

Don't get me wrong, I agree that passing combinations around the box have improved; however, I'm only interested in the outcome of these passing exchanges. At present, in the central and attacking third, we are seeing too many switches from left to right when there are clear and obvious forward / central options that could lead to a goal scoring opportunity. Too often, the result of this is a goal from long range or a cross.

Check out this guy from my Leeds save. He just scored 26 goals from central midfield (about half of them from long range) as a direct result of being on the end of these drawn out flank to flank attacking patterns.

image.thumb.png.bd344ecd5d995ef28a3e7436d897609d.png

My point about Gegenpress was that the majority of successful FM systems are currently based on a high LOE and a counter press (just my opinion). This means you end up camping in the oppositions half for large portions of the game. This is due to the AI not committing enough players upfield (or enough attack duties from deep) to punish overly aggressive systems when they lose the ball. The end result is the AI constantly give away the ball (which drives up your own possession numbers). This gives the illusion that a system is possession based when it's actually pressing based.

 

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Ok, so I was waiting for the full release before playing it, despite buying the game weeks ago as I want to avoid bugs and crashes.

But today I gave in and am immediately hooked.

The last few seasons, SI have really nailed the stability of the game, especially in the beta or just after release and FM20 is no different.

I love the Club Vision feature.  Without question, this is the single best new addition to the game in years.  I love long term saves (20+ seasons) and this is right down my street.

It has taken me awhile to find where stuff is, as it does every year, but I am there now and addicted once again.

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Forgot to add - Code of Conduct is another excellent addition.  Had my first red card of the season and the player was automatically fined according to the CoC.

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18 минут назад, DazRTaylor сказал:

Forgot to add - Code of Conduct is another excellent addition.  Had my first red card of the season and the player was automatically fined according to the CoC.

I enjoyed to fine them manually... :cool: If seriously I never fined player if his red card was helpful for result, as example. Or fines for a lot of YC - for some positions yellow cards is a work

Edited by Novem9

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18 minutes ago, DazRTaylor said:

Forgot to add - Code of Conduct is another excellent addition.  Had my first red card of the season and the player was automatically fined according to the CoC.

I love the Code of Conduct.  Great feature.

 

For those of you saying play around the box is better and goals are coming from through balls, have you got any highlights of central through balls on the ground into the box?  Not passes over the top, not diagonal passes to outside the box.  I'm looking specifically for the classic #10 pass.

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1 hour ago, frank_olaf said:

Just a small thing, I'm not a fan of the new placement of the 'Existing Contract' and 'Previous Contract' buttons. In FM19 they were spread out on top of the contract offer section, so I could easily click on them and move back and forth. Now, in FM20, they are behind a drop down so I first need to hover over the drop down to open it up and then click on the button I want.

As I said, it's a really small thing but I just find the new placement of these buttons annoying.

The whole interface of contract negotiations is a mess as far as I'm concerned. Complete disaster as there was absolutely zero need to change it from what it was.

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On 07/11/2019 at 16:07, isignedupfornorealreason said:

Refereeing / Match Sounds:

Just want to point out, a whistle is not required to signal for a corner kick. It gets a bit excessive to hear the whistle going everytime a corner is awarded, and sometimes the whistle is going before a shot even gets saved/deflected over for a corner kick. There's no requirement to whistle for corner-kicks, so you could probably edit this out of the match sounds and leave it only for the odd referee who insists on whistling for every corner... It would also save my sanity hearing the bloody thing all the time.

 

 

Definitely agree with this. I was constantly finding that I knew a goal had been scored a half a second before it showed on the animation due to the whistle blowing. Very annoying.

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Im currently in 2nd place managing Liverpool, 2 points behind Man City after 16 games, yet the board are disappointed that the team "only challenged" for the league this season. a bit premature no?

and

the fact that the team is so many points behind where we were expected to finish makes the under achievement even more pronounced.

Is this a bug?

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Also, there seems to be a hook for "Referee xxx went to VAR to check the goal" that crops up after any report. It cropped up after a red card once.


"XXX was sent off for a horror tackle in the 24th minute. The referee XXX went to VAR to check the goal."

Pretty cool that a red card is a goal thesedays. :P

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2 minutes ago, isignedupfornorealreason said:

Disappointed so far, being what exactly? Performance-wise? They're unbeaten at this point by the by, with the only dropped points being Arsenal and Wolves away. Not sure what metric they're using.

disappoint.png

Worth uploading the save. Especially given getting top 4 the usual target

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Flipping great

Just beat 'gladbach away from home, scored twice, Gnabry runs from the halfway line & chips the 'keeper, second goal he backheel passes for a Lewandowski goal, try to upload to YouTube & the game crashes 

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Judging Staff Ability, but more importantly Negotiating. That's a nice little addition to help when you're trying to make an offer for a player!

Screenshot 2019-11-08 at 19.24.33.png

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