4-4-2: Tactical Advice needed

[Vidic15]

So, I'm currently in my third season with Hapoel Ramat-Gan, started in the Israeli 2nd tier.

Have to say I'm a very experienced player (playing since cm01/02), but I was never a tactical genius, I'm better at building and managing my squad, keeping everyone happy and that's how I get good results. Anyway, I got promoted first season, played a 4-1-2-3 wide and wasn't too happy with it, after 7-8 league games in the second season I switched to a 4-4-2 , went on a Leicester-esque run (8 points dropped between November and April) and won the league.

Now i'm almost half-way through my third season. I managed to get to the CL playoffs, lost to Celtic, then managed to get one point from a group with Marseille, Celta Vigo and Lokomotiv Moscow, though I wasn't really outplayed and with better luck could maybe get 7-8 points.

In the league I'm almost perfect, 14 wins and 1 draw in 15 games and now with the EL fixture congestion out of the way I should be cruising to another title. But, I'm not too happy with my team's attacking play. Seems lacking over the past 2-3 months, my strikers are hot and cold and we've been very lucky to win easy games on paper.

This is my setup

I have some very good players but I feel I'm not getting the best out of them. Meir is a decent attacking wing-back, good on the ball and decent crossing. Radocaj is a traditional right winger, very quick and good crossing. On the left I have Montano who is a terrific defender but going forward he's poor, 6-7 crossing and dribbling which is a shame because in front of him I have Shapkarov who's my one of my best players and as a WP he cuts inside, so the space for an overlap is there. When he arrived he was a right footed central player but I retrained him to be a WP on the left and he's doing alright, but felt he could do better. Reason he's not playing in the middle of the park is Mekonen and Di Santantonio. Mekonen is an excellent ball winner, good tackling, strong, hard working but very average on the ball. Di Santantonio is a very all round midfielder, he can play just about any role in the middle and he's been my best player since the first season. Up front I have Jackson who hit 31 league goals last season from the f9 role. He's a tall, strong, all-around striker, only weakness is his 9 for passing (and a 'plays with back to goal' PPM which I can't get rid of). Bertolini came in this season, he's very quick with great finishing and off the ball but also got 5 for jumping, 7 for passing and a weak right foot. On the bench I have Matan Hozez who I got this season and still couldn't find a role for him:

I thought about switching to a 4-2-3-1, Shakparov as a no.10 and Hozez on the left, but I'm reluctant to do so because I have 2 great Israeli strikers on the bench and I want to give them enough game time.

Now when I read back it was maybe a bit of a long post so sorry for that. I'd appreciate any advice. Would you select different roles, line the team up differently? Go for that 4-2-3-1? Thanks!

 

[lferreira]

A few observations: 

- Two ball magnets next to each other (DLP and WP)

- Attacking roles for all positions in both flanks

The roles for the forwards seem OK, but I'd try a IW-Su on the left flank with a WB/FB-At behind, and a FB-Su behind the Winger on attack. That should create more variation for your passing. If your DLP has good dribbling and off the ball, try changing him for a RPM.

If you've got a good team you will profit more from fewer attacking roles, which makes your team too structured. What you probably see is a lot of players making attacking runs and little providers or your DLP passing the ball back to defenders because all the rest of your players, except for your F9, are on attack duty and heavily marked right next to the area, having to play with their back to goal and lacking space to run onto.

 

[Experienced Defender]

12 hours ago, Vidic15 said:

This is my setup

I first have to say that I fully agree with this: 

10 hours ago, lferreira said:

Two ball magnets next to each other (DLP and WP)

The question is whether you need 2 PMs anyway, let alone next to each other. If you want to play possession-oriented football, there are other - and much better - ways (even though 442 as a system is better suited to more direct, counter-attackish styles). 

And I also agree with this observation: 

10 hours ago, lferreira said:

Attacking roles for all positions in both flanks

This could be defensively risky even in a system that has a DM, and hence even more so in a 442. 

 

12 hours ago, Vidic15 said:

In the league I'm almost perfect, 14 wins and 1 draw in 15 games and now with the EL fixture congestion out of the way I should be cruising to another title. But, I'm not too happy with my team's attacking play. Seems lacking over the past 2-3 months, my strikers are hot and cold and we've been very lucky to win easy games on paper

This could at least partly be caused precisely by your good results. Your team reputation has probably grown, so other teams have adapted their approach and now play with (much) more caution against you. And even if your tactic was better balanced, you would probably still have problems breaking down these defensive opponents in the sense of creating good goal-scoring opportunities (not only CCCs but good chances in general). Simply because they are packing defenses and thus making it more difficult for your players to create more promising chances within the penalty area.

However, this still does not mean that your tactic cannot be improved. Of course it can. 

In that respect, the first thing I would do is get rid of one PM. Personally, I would keep the DLP, whereas the WP would be changed either into an IW on support or WM on support (depending on the type of player), with the fullback behind him as a FB on attack duty (instead of WB on support).

The next change I would consider pertains to the opposite flank. With a winger on attack, I would want the fullback behind him to be a bit more conservative. I would also rather opt for a standard CM on defend that BWM, simply because the former will keep his defensive position better (unlike BWM, who tends to press a bit too aggressively). 

That would be it regarding roles and duties.

What about instructions? Hard to offer a more meaningful piece of advice without knowledge of your players' strengths and weaknesses (and the style of play you want to implement), but here are a couple of suggestions for you to think about:

- remove pass into space (and instead use it only occasionally, because it makes sense only when there is the space left by the opposition; otherwise, it is more likely to lead to a needless loss of possession)

- I guess you opted for low crosses because you have fast strikers, which generally makes sense, but if you face (very) defensive opposition most of the time, there might be too little space for these low crosses to be effective; so I would consider the whipped ones (or simply leave them on default/mixed and let the players decide which option is the best in a given situation)

There are some other potential tweaks, but whether you should try them really depends on the quality of your players (which is unknown to me). 

 

 

[Vidic15]

 

First of all, want to thank your for your replies, some good insights there.

22 hours ago, lferreira said:

If your DLP has good dribbling and off the ball, try changing him for a RPM.

He has 13 for off the ball but only 10 for dribbling so I guess I'll stick with the DLP? He doesn't have to be playmaker, I thought of Mezzala on support but does that work in a 442? He was a very good at this role when I played 3 in the middle.

11 hours ago, Experienced Defender said:

The question is whether you need 2 PMs anyway, let alone next to each other. If you want to play possession-oriented football, there are other - and much better - ways (even though 442 as a system is better suited to more direct, counter-attackish styles). 

I grew up on United and always loved the direct style of play, don't really care for possession tbh, so that was one of my reasons to go with 442. And also Mike Bassett!

12 hours ago, Experienced Defender said:

What about instructions? Hard to offer a more meaningful piece of advice without knowledge of your players' strengths and weaknesses (and the style of play you want to implement)

This is a good point. As I said I prefer a more direct style of play, also I believe it fits the team as I've got a fairly pacey squad.

I made some tweaks based on your opinions but still haven't had the chance to actually play, busy week at work. Looks like this now:

So I wanna show you my team

 

And this is Hozez again, he's the 12th player and can do either flank:

Here is what I'm not 100% with. Shapkarov has 16 for passing and vision which is why I thought WP is better for him. I have no problem giving Di Santantonio another role, not sure which one though. Another thing, in this setup my fullbacks are not being fully utilized, Montano is more attacking but as you can see he's pretty useless going forwards and on the other side I have Meir who could be great on the overlap but for now given a limited role. Also, should I prefer Hozez to Radocaj, he's left footed (but a strong right foot)? Maybe give him the IW role and then let Meir utilize the space? I'm really open to any suggestions, please tell me what you think.

 

[Experienced Defender]

6 hours ago, Vidic15 said:

I made some tweaks based on your opinions but still haven't had the chance to actually play, busy week at work. Looks like this now:

This setup looks very nice to me  

 

6 hours ago, Vidic15 said:

 

6 hours ago, Vidic15 said:

Here is what I'm not 100% with. Shapkarov has 16 for passing and vision which is why I thought WP is better for him

When I look at his profile, his attributes make for a pretty good WM on support. I fear that his dribbling is not good enough for an IW. Plus, his flair is also pretty low, and is not fast enough either. But as a WM on support told to take more risks, he would actually act as a quasi-WP, but without being a ball-magnet. In that case, you can even consider swapping the 2 CMs around, so that the DLPsu would play in the MCR, whereas the CMde would be the MCL.

P.S: I'll analyze your other players' profiles later, when I have more time 

[lferreira]

Shakparov looks like a good WM, like @Experienced Defender said, you can tweak his individual instructions to take advantage of his passing and vision.

Your left fullback is less suited to an attacking role than your right one - he's strong in the air, has good tackling and physical attributes, but he can't cross or dribble, lacks composure and he can't pass. That guy will be starting a lot of counters for your opposition by losing the ball or delivering a poor cross into a defender.

I'd switch your forwards too. That guy you have as a F9 is the one you want in the box to win headers and beat defenders in the air, he's tall, strong, he can head the ball alright and he has decent anticipation and off the ball. The other one is quicker, has better passing, excellent off the ball and decent dribbling. Play him as a F9 or DLF-Su and tell him to roam from position and he will catalyse a lot of offensive moves for your team.

[Vidic15]

16 hours ago, Experienced Defender said:

When I look at his profile, his attributes make for a pretty good WM on support. I fear that his dribbling is not good enough for an IW. Plus, his flair is also pretty low, and is not fast enough either. But as a WM on support told to take more risks, he would actually act as a quasi-WP, but without being a ball-magnet. In that case, you can even consider swapping the 2 CMs around, so that the DLPsu would play in the MCR, whereas the CMde would be the MCL.

P.S: I'll analyze your other players' profiles later, when I have more time 

OK, will try that. And I'll really appreciate an analysis, thanks!

10 hours ago, lferreira said:

Shakparov looks like a good WM, like @Experienced Defender said, you can tweak his individual instructions to take advantage of his passing and vision.

Your left fullback is less suited to an attacking role than your right one - he's strong in the air, has good tackling and physical attributes, but he can't cross or dribble, lacks composure and he can't pass. That guy will be starting a lot of counters for your opposition by losing the ball or delivering a poor cross into a defender.

I'd switch your forwards too. That guy you have as a F9 is the one you want in the box to win headers and beat defenders in the air, he's tall, strong, he can head the ball alright and he has decent anticipation and off the ball. The other one is quicker, has better passing, excellent off the ball and decent dribbling. Play him as a F9 or DLF-Su and tell him to roam from position and he will catalyse a lot of offensive moves for your team.

I hear you. Say I play Bertolini as a F9, which role should I give Jackson then? AF would be the best? Thanks!

[lferreira]

Actually taking a look at Bertolini, his passing and vision are not that great, but he's got good work rate, pace, acceleration. Maybe PF-Su and Jackson as AF or TM-At. 

You could have Jackson as a TM-Su and Bertolini as a Poacher too. Decide if you want the big guy feeding the small guy or the other way around.

[Experienced Defender]

I've analyzed your players (though I couldn't see their traits and preferred feet in the screenshoots), and I can only say that my tactic - as well as overall playing style - would be pretty much different from yours. But since you said in the OP that you are getting very good results with your tactic, I am not sure if it would be a wise idea for you to make changes (and particularly not big ones).

[Vidic15]

5 hours ago, lferreira said:

Actually taking a look at Bertolini, his passing and vision are not that great, but he's got good work rate, pace, acceleration. Maybe PF-Su and Jackson as AF or TM-At. 

You could have Jackson as a TM-Su and Bertolini as a Poacher too. Decide if you want the big guy feeding the small guy or the other way around.

I think I'll try Jackson feeding Bertolini, Thanks

1 hour ago, Experienced Defender said:

I've analyzed your players (though I couldn't see their traits and preferred feet in the screenshoots), and I can only say that my tactic - as well as overall playing style - would be pretty much different from yours. But since you said in the OP that you are getting very good results with your tactic, I am not sure if it would be a wise idea for you to make changes (and particularly not big ones).

Most of them don't have any traits (though I think Di Stantatonio has a 'Gets into opposition area' PPM, Jackson has 'Play with back to goal'). As for preferred feet, most of them are right or right only, apart from Montano and Bertolini which are left. Hozez (on the bench) is a left but has a strong right foot. Anyhow, I'm curious to know what your idea is. Might get through January to more or less clinch the league then I think I'll be able to start implementing something new.

[Experienced Defender]

3 hours ago, Vidic15 said:

Anyhow, I'm curious to know what your idea is

Basically my idea is a counter-attacking setup with both strikers on attack duties - Jackson as TM on attack in STCL and Bertolini as either AF or PF on attack in STCR. As I don't think that your players in general are good enough to play some "fancy" possession-based style, I would look to be strong and disciplined at the back (2 solid banks of four) and look to hit quickly on the break once the possession has been won. And based on the attributes of your preferred starting 11, "my" setup would basically come down to this:

TMat      AF/PFat

 

WMat        CMsu      CMde        Wsu

 

NFB        CDde      CDde       WBsu

SKsu/de

Mentality would be Balanced (at least initially), tempo higher, playing out of defence sometimes but not in every match, hit early crosses would be added, counter-attack in transition would of course remain and GK distribution would be left to the keeper's discretion. Out of possession - LOE would be a notch lower than DL for the sake of better vertical compactness (standard DL & lower LOE would probably be my preferred choice, given that the quality of your defense does not make me quite confident of their ability to play safely on a higher DL).

Player instructions:

RW (Radocaj) would be told to get further forward and all 4 midfielders to mark tighter.

But once again: if your current tactic works - and as long as it does - do not make changes, please.

[Vidic15]

It seems like a good setup. In terms of Israeli football standards this squad is not the best right now but not far from it at all, and in a season or two the gap in quality between us and the league will be significant, even more so as I'll progress. The money you get from qualifying to a European group stage makes recruitment much easier as the league is very weak financially. So it's maybe a bit too conservative for (most of) the domestic games so I won't change much, but when I'll play in Europe next season I'll definitely take some of your points, also depending on the squad I'll possess.