Jump to content
Sports Interactive Community
Mr U Rosler

FM19.3.5 - In search of realistic football - Introducing the Flat 541

Recommended Posts

Greetings

Thought I’d pop this one up.

My Academy Challenge has been going well enough, but after 4 promotions in 6 years I was stalling in the Championship albeit unluckily losing the last 2 playoff finals after missing automatic promotion by 3 points. All of this was using my gung-ho 442, whilst effective, after 9 seasons I was getting a bit sick of the high scoring games and ridiculous shot counts, sometimes a combined 50 shots a game.

Typically, Premier League games average out at about 24 shots per games. Mid-level teams like Wolves tend to average 12 for, 12 against. Top Teams like City average an 18/6 split.

It was also in the back of my mind that I would get caned in the Premier League playing like that with an Academy Team with no time to adjust/improve to that level of football.

So I set out with the following objectives, create a more realistic match experience with a combined shot count of generally around the 24 mark (hopefully skewed in my favour), yet still scoring 2 goals a game whilst conceding close to 0.5 goals a game if I can (with a mid-level team for my division).

Thereby hopefully delivering a realistic match day experience whilst still achieving success along the way.

This turns out to be quite a satisfying way to play, in particular those thoroughly professional 0-2 away wins when we just turn up, shut down the opposition, craft 2 good goals and are out of there with the 3 points.

Games are over quickly, with far fewer, but more meaningful highlights as opposed the endless succession of long shots and goals mouth scrambles I’d become accustomed to, which sounds exciting but actually becomes tiresome.

Tactically I’ve already put up a 4141 which whilst closer to delivering my ideal than the 442 still generated ‘wasteful football’, with high shot counts and poor chance conversion rates so it was back to the drawing board.

I was committed to a 1 Striker formation as I need the extra defender or midfielder to be defensively sound, I had established that ML/MR were very effective this year as either traditional or inverted wingers so these would be in. This narrowed down the possible formations to 4141, 451, 541.

The 4141 I had tried and was not convinced, the 451 was good but a back 4 was just not solid enough defensively, even with toned down full back behavior. It had to be the 541, but it has a really defensive look, how could I get enough goals?

I tried inverting the Pyramid first with Inverted Wingbacks playing out to Wingers who hugged the touchline, (Playing IN to OUT) this works great with 2 striker formations but whilst there was a steady delivery of crosses we could not get support to our lone Striker quickly enough for this to be a consistent way to score goals.

So we flip the Pyramid back round, with a wide base playing to a narrow point with our Wingers Inverted and encouraged to get forward quickly, moving centrally to support our Striker whilst our Wingbacks play high and wide delivering crosses to a penalty area where we now have numbers.

Whilst we maintain a positive mentality, high line and press, we remove any means of forcing play (i.e. overlaps/underlaps, directing play thru the middle or flanks etc) and allow play to develop naturally as our players see fit. We also avoid hard tackling so play is not broken up and we avoid picking up cards.  

Voila! I’m seeing the football I’d hoped for, rock solid defensively whilst still offering an effective attacking threat.

We absolutely crushed the Championship, 28 points clear at the top with a team predicted to finish 18th.   

stk-champ.png

tactic.png

Defence

Having 3 Central Defenders stay back at all times means we are well equipped to snuff out counter attacks, in fact they were near impossible to penetrate at times. Far better than going with a DM.

Our possession stats were one of the lowest in the leagues at 44%, but our opponents were faced with breaking down two banks of 5, they would pass across the pitch and often backwards before eventually giving the ball away for us to Counter Attack. My main striker has 14 acceleration and pace, not slow but his understudy, although not possessing a great all-round game, has 17 acceleration and pace and he could crucify teams on his day.

We only conceded 29 goals all season. 16 from set pieces so only 13 from open play. A great result.

Attack

Whilst nominally only having 1 Striker, our Wide Midfielders are effectively auxiliary Strikers as illustrated by their goal returns below. A combined 57 league goals between my front 3, evenly spread with 31 assists as well.

lee-williams.png

rui.png

harvey.png

Essentially, our Striker can run in behind or play with his back to goals as required, our Wide Midfielders attack the ‘channels’ whilst our Wing Backs overlap on the flanks. Normally a recipe for defensive disaster, but not with our 3 Centre Backs in covering positions.

Our central midfielders are true ‘box to box’ building and linking play, breaking up attacks and chipping in with some longshots.

 

Corners are not ‘gamey’, just lumped into a big bloke at the near post (still pretty effective), I set up throw in’s the 1st week the game came out, there is a structured routine but again, nothing tricky going on.

 

Summary

I have broadly met all of my objectives. Scoring 2.1 goals a game, conceding 0.6 with average shot counts across the season of 23.

The football on display is fairly realistic, chance conversion rates are high providing entertaining games whilst avoiding inefficient boring games with excessive long shots and penalty box scrambles.

To give some wider context I holidayed a season with the weakest and strongest teams in the division, results below.

city.png

cardiff.png

 

These were holidays test, literally loading up a new save, putting the tactic in and holidaying the season. Would expect better results with actual user management.

 

NOTES

Left Wingback takes left corners & throw in's

Right Wingback takes right corners & throw in's

 

My training thread is here 

 

Looking forward my first season in the Premier League!

 

 

 

 

        

Rosler 451.fmf

Edited by Mr U Rosler

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Great write up once again thank you

 

Ill try your latest tactic out with Everton

 

thanks 

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Firstly, good write up and am always interested in tactics you create and have been for years.
Secondly, how very dare you suggest that my beloved Cardiff City are the worst team in the league ('tis true but shhh!) :)

Using this would be very different from my current tactic and I have more playmaker style CMs than your typical BBMs but have d/l it and will give it a bash if I start a new save.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Ah yes. Very much enjoying this. Already turned down West Ham, Leicester and Bournemouth since I've plugged it in. Cant wait to get a proper season with it.

829514984_Screenshot2019-06-17at04_57_54.thumb.png.8718f6f42a2aefb4ea418c8020cc4a62.png

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Just letting you know that the file that you've uploaded is called "Rosler 451".

 

Gonna try out the tactic, looks interesting

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

So after using it the second half of last season I got promoted with Sheffield United..Currently half way through my first season in the premier and sat comfy 10th place. Pretty much the same squad that got me promoted with the exception of 1 or 2.

Got the 6th best defence in the league as it stands. 12th highest goalscorer.

 

I'll post up some stats etc at the end of the season.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

End of season round up as promised..

a very respectable league finish

192436475_Screenshot2019-06-23at23_47_38.thumb.png.3e4ddb0b24f51ec4cf2972c3bd475df5.png

 

  • 10th highest goal scorers
  • 9th best defence
  • 2nd highest yellow cards
  • 1st highest reds

My strikers and wide men didn't really chip in as much as I'd like. For a newly promoted side I guess it weren't to bad though.

 864829419_Screenshot2019-06-23at23_57_06.thumb.png.70a3f40a061bdf8b1de5a5eacce73973.png

This was my starting XI. McBurnie was brought in at the start of the season and just didn't produce as I'd hoped. Grandsir and Stefaniak came up with me so I'm fairly happy what that chipped in.

 

1141562108_Screenshot2019-06-24at00_02_18.thumb.png.b019821eb22e738b5d4ddb1892c446dc.png1207665661_Screenshot2019-06-24at00_02_40.thumb.png.f93f4a342938b80c8c0ae68f87a57298.png

 

The only thing I really found that let me down was balls to the far post. Any sort of pass between my WB and CB would nearly always result in a goal. They just seemed to freeze, I've seen a few other people complain about this when using 5 at the back so not sure it can really be helped.

 

Overall im fairly happy with it. Hopefully with a few upgrades player wise It can kick on again.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Trying to replicate this tactic for FM 18. Looks promising so far (small sample size). Could you post individual player instructions for each position (e.g. BBM get further forward, move into channels)?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
On 16/06/2019 at 12:58, Mr U Rosler said:

Looking forward my first season in the Premier League!

I'd love to hear how you got on

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

my first season in the SPL with Raith, i was expected to be relegated. finished 4th. could of been 3rd but rested my first 11 for the Scottish cup final against Celtic which i won. i had 2nd highest clean sheets in the league behind celtic. ive attached my full fixture list and results.

going into my second season as we speak. wish me luck in Europe too!

 

 

*EDIT* I've made it to the group stages!!!!*

 

ive attached my fixtures on my way to qualification, ive mad a slight tweek to the tactic only my striker ive made him an attacking pressing forward, seems to score more now and get more assists. 

541.jpg

541fix.jpg

541.jpg

esp.jpg

Edited by Jamees691
Euro Update

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Anyone still using this? If so, can they let me know what sort of goals are scored? I'm looking for some variety in a tactic, headers from crosses, great through balls etc. I'd like to give this a try, but am on a long term save and would have to completely change my team - so was hoping for some feedback first.

 

Cheers.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Hello @Mr U Rosler, I've tried out your setup on FMT20 with some reasonable success - nicked a CL spot in La Liga with Bilbao.

Made one modification by turning one of the B2B players into a DLP (s). I found it gave more variation to midfield play with some horizontal movements. Also played around with the Set-Pieces to take full advantage of 3 CBs.

Tactic would likely be even more successful with another team that didn't have the same transfer restrictions regarding Basque players only.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Further update.

The 5-4-1 tactic has also worked out very well indeed with Brescia. Media predicted finishes were 18th and 15th for seasons 2019/20 and 2020/21. However actual finishes were 7th and 3rd respectively.

Third season is looking even better so far.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
28 minutes ago, Vokes said:

Further update.

The 5-4-1 tactic has also worked out very well indeed with Brescia. Media predicted finishes were 18th and 15th for seasons 2019/20 and 2020/21. However actual finishes were 7th and 3rd respectively.

Third season is looking even better so far.

Out of interest, have tried this yet? Getting good results in the FM20 testing league. Should out perform the 541, maybe not if you drop it in mid season mind.  

   

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Not yet. But planning to today. I have a particular underdog team in mind.

The 5-4-1 performed very well in FM20. 1st place finishes with Brescia in 2022 and 2023.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Did some small changes to the tactic because my team did have players which were not as good as yours and it worked really great!

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Join the conversation

You can post now and register later. If you have an account, sign in now to post with your account.

Guest
Reply to this topic...

×   Pasted as rich text.   Paste as plain text instead

  Only 75 emoji are allowed.

×   Your link has been automatically embedded.   Display as a link instead

×   Your previous content has been restored.   Clear editor

×   You cannot paste images directly. Upload or insert images from URL.


  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×
×
  • Create New...