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leviathan1904

incentives in contracts, any (mental) impact?

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Posted (edited)

I am wondering if bonuses have real impact on performances. Do they boost players' attributes, visible, "below the surface" or not at all? Interested in game mechanics, maybe someone has some information. Thanks. 

Edited by leviathan1904

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Good question. I’d be very interested in hearing an authoritative reply. In my present save I’ve just started a new season, given maximum bonuses and only one person appears to be pleased.

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If you mean the bonuses for winning the league and stuff that cut your transfer budget, the only thing noticeable is a boost in morale so it can improve team performance, lets just say it will make the players less relaxed as they can go from getting a 200k+ on wages and contract bonuses per week to getting that plus a nice 3M more or less more in one go, some players don't mind it that much for ex. Messi/Ronaldo don't mind much about it as they already have all the money they need/wish

Stats wise there is no change, but i would assume that under the hood it has to change something else like making the players more prone to give the 110% and not just play at their 80% against huddersfield

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Posted (edited)

It is more about if a player with incentives in his individual contract, such as money for goals scored, will put in more effort or not. 0, 100k or 1m per X goals - is there any motivational difference? The economical aspect of balanced wages (fixed and variable costs) is obvious, but the psychological is unresolved. Without any impact, I do not have to think about thresholds, "boundary value" and so on. 

 

 

 

Edited by leviathan1904

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They are just there for other options in contracts, there is not impact at all, players won't accept huge goal bonuses if wage is lowered a lot, also player won't accept hugely lowered bonuses if wage is not increased this are just monetary figures, nothing to do with performance, you can make players accept lower wages if bonuses are high even add non reacheable bonuses for them to accept like offering relegation release clause when your team is at the top (less effective than with low table teams)

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They are just there for other options in contracts, there is not impact at all, players won't accept huge goal bonuses if wage is lowered a lot, also player won't accept hugely lowered bonuses if wage is not increased this are just monetary figures, nothing to do with performance, you can make players accept lower wages if bonuses are high even add non reacheable bonuses for them to accept like offering relegation release clause when your team is at the top (less effective than with low table teams)

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Okay, thanks, good to know. I had something in my mind like maybe ambition +1 for defenders due to high clean-sheet-bonus, ambition +1 but also selfishness (hidden attribute) +1 for strikers due to high goal-scoring-bonus, patience +1 or -1 for players due to high unused substitution fee or high appearance fee. And in a more complicated manner, the extent of a boost or downgrade depends on player's personality, age and so on. The reception of what is high or low would differ. 

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I had always assumed the individual bonuses had a very minor impact on body language/morale in a match - ie a striker having a bad game has a marghinal reduction in morale if he realises he is not getting a big bonus if he doesn't score.

Team bonuses as well, marginal if any impact over the course of a whole season.

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I thought they didn't mean much, but if you're working with a shoestring budget, bonuses can help you to sign players whose wage demands you can't meet, given the difference isn't huge.

E.g. If you're, say, 15-20% short of the player's wage request, a Yearly Wage Increase clause or a Wage after N games one can convince him to sign even though he's settling for less money, at least initially.
Less appealing or lower-impact bonuses and clauses aren't probably going to move the needle though... Like, 200k for 20 goals are peanuts if you're offering him 500k fewer as basic wage.

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All right, I understand. So the contract negotiations are "only" about optimizing the ratio between fixed costs (salary) and variable costs (bonus) in favour of performance-related payments. And FM makes it possible to offer premiums that sometimes seem absurd in order to reduce salary costs. This is the economic perspective that I can totally understand, but which my original question was not necessarily aimed at.

Of course, it is or would be difficult to derive a motivating connection between the promised bonus and actual performance retroactively. I have certainly formulated this misleadingly. A striker would always like to score goals and preferably as many as possible. A defender wants to prevent goals and, just like a goalkeeper, doesn't like to get goals against him.

What I'm interested in, however, is the fact that not every player has the same character as the FM already depicts. Someone who has a little less work rate or determination (mental attributes) will, for example, tend to "drag" towards the end of the game. A perfectionist is also disturbed by the goal scored in the 95th minute, although the game is won. A less ambitious personality could reduce performance or concentration due to a tendency to indifference. Here came already the reference to the body language. And it can also be observed again and again that some players tend to "switch off" mentally at some point because they are sure of victory. As a manager, I have the opportunity during the game to counteract with a shout. In my original question I had in mind whether success-related bonuses are another lever to counteract these mental "carelessness". I don't have to promise any bonuses to the perfectionist, who is annoyed - as already written - at every goal at any time. But the "less ambitious", who at the same time is not averse to money, might remember in the 80th minute that there is an extra bonus for a clean sheet. So if financial incentives are indeed also a way to compensate for "mental weaknesses", I would consider this aspect more in future contract negotiations. 

The prerequisite for this is that these effects are planned and possible in the game mechanics. At best, I wanted an "official" confirmation. Otherwise, they only exist in my imagination. That is possible, but only half as satisfying. 

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Posted (edited)

it boosts morale by a bit. 

And for me, i assume it  sets a higher threshold for morale drops. 

Edited by DownTheFrank

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I get what you are saying, and I think in some way it should be part of the game but it has to make sure it isn't too overpowering. 

 

I know if it was me, especially in the lower leagues, if I was earning £500 a week and had a £200 goal bonus, I'd be working until the last second to try and grab a goal knowing I'd get a few quid more, but if if I played and was earning £80,000 a week and had a £2,000 goal bonus, i'm not sure I'd be quite as motivated in the 92nd minute to make that burst into the box to score. 

 

It should be based on the personalities of the players more than anything but considering I know nothing about making a computer game, I have no idea if this is even possible to implement. 

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I see no impact coming from better individual bonuses. But I see this:

- players tend to get lazy after renewing a multi-year contract.

- low team bonuses turn into poor/negative performance (in cups I don't care)

- oftentimes, the agent is the biggest mercenary of all

In sum, as @leviathan1904 elegantly pointed out, contractual bonuses is about managing your finances across fixed and variable costs. (I was super generous with individual bonuses and noticed that my expenses were going through the roof, so watch out...)

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5 hours ago, phd_angel said:

 

- oftentimes, the agent is the biggest mercenary of all

 

This!

Have you noticed, when contract talks appear to be stalemate - offering the Agent a few grand (or hundred grand) more can be all that's needed to seal the deal?

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Posted (edited)

Yeah agents suck usually. I often give a youngster who only looks like he has half a chance of making it a nice cheap pro contract with an inflated agent fee just to bring round the agent when I need to make a big first team signing.

It may be coincidence, but when I started giving out big bonuses for CL (QF, SF, Final, Winner) and Ligue 1 (Winner) in my Lyon save in the first season, we smashed the league (partially tactically but I just didn't see any games where players were unmotivated) and arguably got better with each round of the CL until we put 8 past Man United in the final. Whilst in the cups we sucked, even though I played strong teams - the likes of Guingamp really did seem to want it more.

Edited by zlatanera

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