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I’ve been trying to get the most out of my APs for a long time, but can’t figure out how. I want to play a 4231 with Arsenal. What tactics could I use?

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Make sure you have enough early runners (Attack duties) ahead or next to him that he can pass the ball to. Whether that means using a two-striker formation or attacking Wingers/Inside Forwards, is down to you and your squad.

APs have Take More Risks PI locked in, which means they will always look for through balls. So, for example, if the only one making an early run is your lone striker, you could end up with a very predictable and one-dimensional attack.

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5 hours ago, Arsenal457 said:

I want to play a 4231 with Arsenal. What tactics could I use?

Depends on the players you have. I know what kind of tactic I would use if i played a 4231 with the current Arsenal squad, but you have changed a number of players in the meantime, so it may not work if the new players are of a different type than the current ones. And the question is why do you want to play with an AP in the AMC position? If you have a player with the right attributes for an AP role, you can play him as an AM and customize his PIs so that he would act as a quasi-PM, rather than being an actual PM (for example). Or you can use a PM on a flank instead of the middle (again just an example). 

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The AMC position may be a challenge sometimes. You have to set up your team correctly in order to offer him the correct passing options and supply, otherwise the other teams can mark your AMC and make your game very hard.

It happened with me: the AMC was the main creator, the team´s lungs, and the other teams simply man marked him and my team struggled. It happened also when my False 9 was dictating the game´s rythym and scoring too many goals.

It can be hard too for other reasons: if you use the AMC just too down on the pitch, near the center of the field, you have to compensate this or your attack may be isolated. If you put the AMC too high, you also have to compensate in order not to isolate your two central midfielders.

I think you should ask yourself what would you like your AMC to do, choose a role and duty to reach this goal and then organize the players around him. Then test, check his positioning and behaviour watching 2-3 full games, and then you can evaluate if any changes are necessary.

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Here is the tactic I’m currently running. This is by no means my bets XI. I do have screenshots of what is meant to be my best XI though. It hasn’t shown, but I also have Kai Havertz.

3BBACBD1-E171-4CE2-B073-4B11FC1B1D00.png

2A06E3D5-1570-47A6-8E60-9F2CFC9606B8.png

4984A7E1-EDBA-45CD-BF68-392A5E008A20.png

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11 minutes ago, Arsenal457 said:

Here is the tactic I’m currently running. This is by no means my bets XI

I don't understand. Who is playing in the tactic from the screenshot - your best 11 or the guys who are displayed in the tactics screen?

 

12 minutes ago, Arsenal457 said:

It hasn’t shown, but I also have Kai Havertz

Please don't tell me that you play him as a DLP on defend :kriss:

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20 minutes ago, Experienced Defender said:

I don't understand. Who is playing in the tactic from the screenshot - your best 11 or the guys who are displayed in the tactics screen?

From the screenshot showing my tactics, that isn’t my best XI

20 minutes ago, Experienced Defender said:

Please don't tell me that you play him as a DLP on defend :kriss:

I have once or twice, but against weaker sides. I try to keep him at CAM.

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20 minutes ago, Arsenal457 said:

From the screenshot showing my tactics, that isn’t my best XI

Why don't you play with your best 11? 

And btw, with so many new players brought in, you'll need plenty of the Team bonding training sessions.

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If you are going to play your AMC as an AP(s) then put the lone striker ahead of him in a goal-scoring role with an attack duty. AF(a), CF(a), P(A)...those would be my choices. This is especially true with Aubameyang, who I think is much more of a goal scorer than a facilitator.

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I've struggled to get a playmaker in the AMC slot to really work in a 4-2-3-1 setup on this version of FM. Getting the required movement in front and around them is key to making the role work. Be interested to see the responses to this. 

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12 hours ago, Experienced Defender said:

Okay, may I give you some food for thought?

Sure

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12 hours ago, Experienced Defender said:

Why don't you play with your best 11? 

And btw, with so many new players brought in, you'll need plenty of the Team bonding training sessions.

Because I’m up against Feyenoord, and I’m still in the group stage and things are looking comfortable, so may as well rotate.

How do you do that? Keep in mind I’m on FM Touch

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8 hours ago, Overmars said:

If you are going to play your AMC as an AP(s) then put the lone striker ahead of him in a goal-scoring role with an attack duty. AF(a), CF(a), P(A)...those would be my choices. This is especially true with Aubameyang, who I think is much more of a goal scorer than a facilitator.

@Experienced Defender What is your thoughts on this? You’ve said a big no no to AF to me before. What about the other ones?

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7 hours ago, >LJ< said:

I've struggled to get a playmaker in the AMC slot to really work in a 4-2-3-1 setup on this version of FM. Getting the required movement in front and around them is key to making the role work. Be interested to see the responses to this. 

Yeah I agree, they often end up with nothing above 7.

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34 minutes ago, Arsenal457 said:
9 hours ago, Overmars said:

If you are going to play your AMC as an AP(s) then put the lone striker ahead of him in a goal-scoring role with an attack duty. AF(a), CF(a), P(A)...those would be my choices. This is especially true with Aubameyang, who I think is much more of a goal scorer than a facilitator.

@Experienced Defender What is your thoughts on this? You’ve said a big no no to AF to me before. What about the other ones?

Not a "big no no". I said that AF can struggle a lot and often end up isolated when played as a lone striker, especially in a tactic that looks to dominate possession and control the game (camping in the opposition half). So when it comes specifically to Aubameyang in an attack/possession-minded 4231, I would play him either as a poacher (with the move into channels PI) or PF on attack (alternatively on the left flank as a RMD for example).

And I absolutely agree with @Overmars that Auby is the scorer/runner type of striker, not a creator ("facilitator"), which means that playing him in roles such as CF, DLF or F9 would make little (if any) sense. 

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45 minutes ago, Arsenal457 said:

And btw, with so many new players brought in, you'll need plenty of the Team bonding training sessions

 

45 minutes ago, Arsenal457 said:

How do you do that? Keep in mind I’m on FM Touch

I've never played FM Touch, so I really don't know how training works there. I guess that you cannot set up the schedules yourself, right?

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11 minutes ago, Experienced Defender said:

 

I've never played FM Touch, so I really don't know how training works there. I guess that you cannot set up the schedules yourself, right?

Nope, just say what you want them to train, and it’s very limited.

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14 minutes ago, Experienced Defender said:

Not a "big no no". I said that AF can struggle a lot and often end up isolated when played as a lone striker, especially in a tactic that looks to dominate possession and control the game (camping in the opposition half). So when it comes specifically to Aubameyang in an attack/possession-minded 4231, I would play him either as a poacher (with the move into channels PI) or PF on attack (alternatively on the left flank as a RMD for example).

And I absolutely agree with @Overmars that Auby is the scorer/runner type of striker, not a creator ("facilitator"), which means that playing him in roles such as CF, DLF or F9 would make little (if any) sense. 

Yeah I meant in the 4231. How exactly do the PF and CF work? What do they do?

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56 minutes ago, Arsenal457 said:
13 hours ago, Experienced Defender said:

Okay, may I give you some food for thought?

Sure

I'll now tell you how I would look to set up my 4231 system if I managed Arsenal with your players. Then I'll try to explain why such a setup.

POat

IFsu         AMsu         APat

DLPde    BBM

 

FBat     CDco     CDde     IWBde

SKde

Which 11 players I would prefer for these roles within the system and what PIs I would give them:

GK/SKde - Leno - take fewer risks 

DL/FBat - Chilwell (Kolasinac) - no PIs

DR/IWBde - Bellerin - no PIs

DCL/CDco - Skriniar - stay wider

DCR/CDde - De Ligt - close down less

MCL/DLPde - Zaniolo - mark tighter, close down less

MCR/BBM - Torreira - mark tighter

AML/IFsu - Paulinho - sit narrower

AMR/APat - Felix - no PIs

AMC/AMsu - Havertz - roam from position, mark tighter

ST/POat - Aubameyang - move into channels, shoot more often

What team instructions I would start an average match with:

Mentality - Positive

In possession - shorter passing, play out of defence, work ball into box, be more expressive, whipped crosses, overlap right (optional/occasional instruction - higher tempo)

In transition - counter, roll it out, distribute to CBs and FBs, counter-press (but not against strong teams)

Out of possession - higher d-line, standard LOE, default pressing, use tighter marking, prevent short GKD

*   *   *

Now let me explain what's the idea...

You have a very talented squad with a lot of creativity and flair both in the midfield and up front, so you just need to think logically about how you can set them up within the system in order to get the best out of them. To do that, you need to be able to think outside the box. If you look carefully at your players' attributes, traits and stronger foot, you can easily get the idea of which set of roles each of them could generally play in a satisfactory way. The next step is to understand how these roles interact with each other, and then how you can make the most of that interaction via proper team and player instructions. Once you have sorted all this out, you have what I like to call a "primary/basic/starting tactic". That's the tactic that you can comfortably start most of your matches with, and then see if any small tweaks are needed or not.

On the defensive side, you always need to bear in mind that 4231 is a top-heavy system with nobody in a DM position, which inherently tends to make your defense potentially vulnerable. That's why I gave the cover duty to Scriniar as the more experienced and defensively solid of the two CBs, and why I opted to play Bellerin on defend rather than support duty, but with the Overlap right TI that will make him a bit more attack-minded so that he can link up with the midfield and provide more meaningful support in the final third when needed. He also needs to cover for the BBM on occasion.

On the other flank, the attacking fullback is there to make natural overlaps and cross the ball into the box for the poacher who has great speed, movement and very good anticipation, as well as others who will arrive from deeper areas to attack the ball in and around the box. A top-heavy formation coupled with a high-risk mentality allows you to play with relatively few attack duties (3 in this case) and still have sufficient penetration.

If you have any questions, you are welcome :thup:

 

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1 hour ago, Arsenal457 said:

How exactly do the PF and CF work? What do they do?

They are very different roles. PF is essentially what DF was in the previous version, but now it can be played on attack duty as well. In the attacking phase, it's a pretty simple role. You should not expect anything special or extraordinary in terms of creation and flair (unless you play such type of player in the role). Players playing in a PF role basically need to have good stamina, work rate, aggression, bravery, determination... as well as decent technical skills and movement. 

CF on the other hand needs to be a bit of everything. He is a creator, a runner, a scorer, a dribbler - all at the same time. So he needs a lot of attributes - off the ball, first touch, passing, decisions, vision, composure, technique, finishing, anticipation, balance, agility and at least decent speed and some strength. 

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8 horas atrás, herne79 disse:

I don't often do this (because some people will just blindly copy things only to find it doesn't work for them), but I want to link a 4231 I've been using since FM17.  It's very simple, has great variety of play and gets the basics right.  Sometimes we fall into the trap of overthinking things and so end up trying to run before we can walk.

But before I link the tactic I want to link the following "reference sheet" I sometimes use, just to help focus in on some of the basic stuff.  There is of course more than just these ways of going about things, but it's simple and I like simple:

bZ71w2x.png

Anyway, onto the system (and yes there are some PIs you can't see, mainly to do with Pressing and Risky Passes):

0GjmWLs.png

I also have a second more cautious version of that adding in just one more TI (higher def line) with the Cautious mentality.

Essentially what the system is doing is giving the creative AMC room to operate in.  So an attack duty striker to push defenders back away from the AMC (and be available for a through ball from him); a Winger to stretch play a bit and provide crosses; an attacking IF to scare the hell out of defenders; a solid midfield base; and supporting fullbacks.  Mentality and the players themselves do the rest.  Depending on personnel I'll change the striker role to a Poacher or AF.

The only thing I don't like about the 4231, and something I'll never use, is a support duty AMC behind a support duty striker (sorry OP).  That's not to say it can't work but it can become more complex to implement well.  And we already know I like simple,  Why don't I like it?  Because the AMC (as do all players) likes room to work in, so if the striker is coming deep he'll bring the defence deep with him and suddenly the AMC doesn't have room to work in.  In that instance I'd look to use an AMC with an attack duty to make runs behind the defence beyond the striker - kind of a classic False 9 / False 10 partnership.

But as Arsenal I'd have one of the best attacking strikers in the game (PEA) and one of the most creative AMCs (Ozil) so I'd look to build around that.

Gotta love that simplicity !!! :applause:

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16 hours ago, Experienced Defender said:

They are very different roles. PF is essentially what DF was in the previous version, but now it can be played on attack duty as well. In the attacking phase, it's a pretty simple role. You should not expect anything special or extraordinary in terms of creation and flair (unless you play such type of player in the role). Players playing in a PF role basically need to have good stamina, work rate, aggression, bravery, determination... as well as decent technical skills and movement. 

CF on the other hand needs to be a bit of everything. He is a creator, a runner, a scorer, a dribbler - all at the same time. So he needs a lot of attributes - off the ball, first touch, passing, decisions, vision, composure, technique, finishing, anticipation, balance, agility and at least decent speed and some strength. 

I played FM18 but that was about it. And I never used the DF, so I’m clueless on the DF.

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17 hours ago, Experienced Defender said:

I'll now tell you how I would look to set up my 4231 system if I managed Arsenal with your players. Then I'll try to explain why such a setup.

POat

IFsu         AMsu         APat

DLPde    BBM

 

FBat     CDco     CDde     IWBde

SKde

Which 11 players I would prefer for these roles within the system and what PIs I would give them:

GK/SKde - Leno - take fewer risks 

DL/FBat - Chilwell (Kolasinac) - no PIs

DR/IWBde - Bellerin - no PIs

DCL/CDco - Skriniar - stay wider

DCR/CDde - De Ligt - close down less

MCL/DLPde - Zaniolo - mark tighter, close down less

MCR/BBM - Torreira - mark tighter

AML/IFsu - Paulinho - sit narrower

AMR/APat - Felix - no PIs

AMC/AMsu - Havertz - roam from position, mark tighter

ST/POat - Aubameyang - move into channels, shoot more often

What team instructions I would start an average match with:

Mentality - Positive

In possession - shorter passing, play out of defence, work ball into box, be more expressive, whipped crosses, overlap right (optional/occasional instruction - higher tempo)

In transition - counter, roll it out, distribute to CBs and FBs, counter-press (but not against strong teams)

Out of possession - higher d-line, standard LOE, default pressing, use tighter marking, prevent short GKD

*   *   *

Now let me explain what's the idea...

You have a very talented squad with a lot of creativity and flair both in the midfield and up front, so you just need to think logically about how you can set them up within the system in order to get the best out of them. To do that, you need to be able to think outside the box. If you look carefully at your players' attributes, traits and stronger foot, you can easily get the idea of which set of roles each of them could generally play in a satisfactory way. The next step is to understand how these roles interact with each other, and then how you can make the most of that interaction via proper team and player instructions. Once you have sorted all this out, you have what I like to call a "primary/basic/starting tactic". That's the tactic that you can comfortably start most of your matches with, and then see if any small tweaks are needed or not.

On the defensive side, you always need to bear in mind that 4231 is a top-heavy system with nobody in a DM position, which inherently tends to make your defense potentially vulnerable. That's why I gave the cover duty to Scriniar as the more experienced and defensively solid of the two CBs, and why I opted to play Bellerin on defend rather than support duty, but with the Overlap right TI that will make him a bit more attack-minded so that he can link up with the midfield and provide more meaningful support in the final third when needed. He also needs to cover for the BBM on occasion.

On the other flank, the attacking fullback is there to make natural overlaps and cross the ball into the box for the poacher who has great speed, movement and very good anticipation, as well as others who will arrive from deeper areas to attack the ball in and around the box. A top-heavy formation coupled with a high-risk mentality allows you to play with relatively few attack duties (3 in this case) and still have sufficient penetration.

If you have any questions, you are welcome :thup:

 

I’ll be honest, I’ve next to never used PI. If possible, can you explain why you chose those certain ones? Also, with the cover duty, would I want to take offside trap off?

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I have noticed both of you say to put keeper on defend. Why? Why not use support/attack?

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17 hours ago, Experienced Defender said:

I'll now tell you how I would look to set up my 4231 system if I managed Arsenal with your players. Then I'll try to explain why such a setup.

POat

IFsu         AMsu         APat

DLPde    BBM

 

FBat     CDco     CDde     IWBde

SKde

Which 11 players I would prefer for these roles within the system and what PIs I would give them:

GK/SKde - Leno - take fewer risks 

DL/FBat - Chilwell (Kolasinac) - no PIs

DR/IWBde - Bellerin - no PIs

DCL/CDco - Skriniar - stay wider

DCR/CDde - De Ligt - close down less

MCL/DLPde - Zaniolo - mark tighter, close down less

MCR/BBM - Torreira - mark tighter

AML/IFsu - Paulinho - sit narrower

AMR/APat - Felix - no PIs

AMC/AMsu - Havertz - roam from position, mark tighter

ST/POat - Aubameyang - move into channels, shoot more often

What team instructions I would start an average match with:

Mentality - Positive

In possession - shorter passing, play out of defence, work ball into box, be more expressive, whipped crosses, overlap right (optional/occasional instruction - higher tempo)

In transition - counter, roll it out, distribute to CBs and FBs, counter-press (but not against strong teams)

Out of possession - higher d-line, standard LOE, default pressing, use tighter marking, prevent short GKD

*   *   *

Now let me explain what's the idea...

You have a very talented squad with a lot of creativity and flair both in the midfield and up front, so you just need to think logically about how you can set them up within the system in order to get the best out of them. To do that, you need to be able to think outside the box. If you look carefully at your players' attributes, traits and stronger foot, you can easily get the idea of which set of roles each of them could generally play in a satisfactory way. The next step is to understand how these roles interact with each other, and then how you can make the most of that interaction via proper team and player instructions. Once you have sorted all this out, you have what I like to call a "primary/basic/starting tactic". That's the tactic that you can comfortably start most of your matches with, and then see if any small tweaks are needed or not.

On the defensive side, you always need to bear in mind that 4231 is a top-heavy system with nobody in a DM position, which inherently tends to make your defense potentially vulnerable. That's why I gave the cover duty to Scriniar as the more experienced and defensively solid of the two CBs, and why I opted to play Bellerin on defend rather than support duty, but with the Overlap right TI that will make him a bit more attack-minded so that he can link up with the midfield and provide more meaningful support in the final third when needed. He also needs to cover for the BBM on occasion.

On the other flank, the attacking fullback is there to make natural overlaps and cross the ball into the box for the poacher who has great speed, movement and very good anticipation, as well as others who will arrive from deeper areas to attack the ball in and around the box. A top-heavy formation coupled with a high-risk mentality allows you to play with relatively few attack duties (3 in this case) and still have sufficient penetration.

If you have any questions, you are welcome :thup:

 

I should I use the AP on the AMR? And why on attack? I used to use BBM a while back but they never seemed to get a higher rating, often going bellow the default rating. Can you explain the fullbacks as well? I don’t get why you chose those roles over a wingback on support like I use. Also what is the benefit to Poacher over the other roles? And what should I use for others like Dolberg and Geubells?

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6 hours ago, Arsenal457 said:

I have noticed both of you say to put keeper on defend. Why? Why not use support/attack?

Because Leno does not have the right attributes for a SK on support or attack. I would prefer a SK on support, but unfortunately your keeper has poor passing, vision and first touch. 

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9 minutes ago, Experienced Defender said:

Because Leno does not have the right attributes for a SK on support or attack. I would prefer a SK on support, but unfortunately your keeper has poor passing, vision and first touch. 

What keepers have the attributes to do that?

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6 hours ago, Arsenal457 said:

I should I use the AP on the AMR? And why on attack?

I don't say that you have to use an AP on attack in AMR. I just offered that as a possibility. All roles and duties - as well as instructions - are there for a reason, taking into account your players' attributes and the specifics of 4231 as a system. Most players are generally able to play more than one role. But which one of these roles a certain player should play depends on the tactical system in which he is played. For example, Aubameyang can play nicely as an AF, as a poacher and a PF on attack. But in this system and tactical style you want to play, I don't think an AF role would suit him in an optimal way. In a different type of tactic, I would gladly play him as an AF.

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3 minutes ago, Arsenal457 said:

What keepers have the attributes to do that?

A lot of keepers have attributes for a SK on support (and some can even play on attack). Liverpool's GK Becker for example. Or Neuer from Bayern. And so on...

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20 minutes ago, Experienced Defender said:

I don't say that you have to use an AP on attack in AMR. I just offered that as a possibility. All roles and duties - as well as instructions - are there for a reason, taking into account your players' attributes and the specifics of 4231 as a system. Most players are generally able to play more than one role. But which one of these roles a certain player should play depends on the tactical system in which he is played. For example, Aubameyang can play nicely as an AF, as a poacher and a PF on attack. But in this system and tactical style you want to play, I don't think an AF role would suit him in an optimal way. In a different type of tactic, I would gladly play him as an AF.

Sorry I didn't word that well, why should I play an AP on AMR? What's the benefit?

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How can you get the AP to consistently work at CAM, forgetting the players I have, but still using similar tactics to that of the type I use.

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I also meant to ask, why do you play with less pressing and use tighter marking? What is your thought process through that?

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54 minutes ago, Arsenal457 said:

Sorry I didn't word that well, why should I play an AP on AMR? What's the benefit?

You can play him anywhere. But the reason why I opted to put him on a flank is that he is likely to have more space there to operate than in the middle. Because when you are a top team like Arsenal, you'll most frequently have to deal with very defensive teams that tend to pack the middle and protect their central areas of defensive third. But it does not mean than I wouldn't play him in a different position and/or a different role/duty in some other circumstances. Plus, I always have in mind my other players when deciding whom I should play, where and how.

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32 minutes ago, Arsenal457 said:

I also meant to ask, why do you play with less pressing and use tighter marking? What is your thought process through that?

Where have you seen "less pressing" in my team instructions? 

As for tighter marking, I prefer it to both hard tackling and high pressing as a way of putting pressure on the opposition, because it's safer in the sense that it does not disrupt your defensive shape. 

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7 hours ago, Arsenal457 said:

And what should I use for others like Dolberg and Geubells?

I would play Dolberg either as an IF on support in AML, or as a DLF on support with Aubameyang moved to AML as a RMD. But that would require tweaking other roles and duties as well.

As for Geubbels, can you post a screenshot of his player profile?

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Posted (edited)
On 07/05/2019 at 07:43, Experienced Defender said:

I'll now tell you how I would look to set up my 4231 system if I managed Arsenal with your players. Then I'll try to explain why such a setup.

POat

IFsu         AMsu         APat

DLPde    BBM

 

FBat     CDco     CDde     IWBde

SKde

Which 11 players I would prefer for these roles within the system and what PIs I would give them:

GK/SKde - Leno - take fewer risks 

DL/FBat - Chilwell (Kolasinac) - no PIs

DR/IWBde - Bellerin - no PIs

DCL/CDco - Skriniar - stay wider

DCR/CDde - De Ligt - close down less

MCL/DLPde - Zaniolo - mark tighter, close down less

MCR/BBM - Torreira - mark tighter

AML/IFsu - Paulinho - sit narrower

AMR/APat - Felix - no PIs

AMC/AMsu - Havertz - roam from position, mark tighter

ST/POat - Aubameyang - move into channels, shoot more often

What team instructions I would start an average match with:

Mentality - Positive

In possession - shorter passing, play out of defence, work ball into box, be more expressive, whipped crosses, overlap right (optional/occasional instruction - higher tempo)

In transition - counter, roll it out, distribute to CBs and FBs, counter-press (but not against strong teams)

Out of possession - higher d-line, standard LOE, default pressing, use tighter marking, prevent short GKD

*   *   *

Now let me explain what's the idea...

You have a very talented squad with a lot of creativity and flair both in the midfield and up front, so you just need to think logically about how you can set them up within the system in order to get the best out of them. To do that, you need to be able to think outside the box. If you look carefully at your players' attributes, traits and stronger foot, you can easily get the idea of which set of roles each of them could generally play in a satisfactory way. The next step is to understand how these roles interact with each other, and then how you can make the most of that interaction via proper team and player instructions. Once you have sorted all this out, you have what I like to call a "primary/basic/starting tactic". That's the tactic that you can comfortably start most of your matches with, and then see if any small tweaks are needed or not.

On the defensive side, you always need to bear in mind that 4231 is a top-heavy system with nobody in a DM position, which inherently tends to make your defense potentially vulnerable. That's why I gave the cover duty to Scriniar as the more experienced and defensively solid of the two CBs, and why I opted to play Bellerin on defend rather than support duty, but with the Overlap right TI that will make him a bit more attack-minded so that he can link up with the midfield and provide more meaningful support in the final third when needed. He also needs to cover for the BBM on occasion.

On the other flank, the attacking fullback is there to make natural overlaps and cross the ball into the box for the poacher who has great speed, movement and very good anticipation, as well as others who will arrive from deeper areas to attack the ball in and around the box. A top-heavy formation coupled with a high-risk mentality allows you to play with relatively few attack duties (3 in this case) and still have sufficient penetration.

If you have any questions, you are welcome :thup:

 

it is waste to set Bellerin as IWBd ,  

Edited by z464

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31 minutes ago, z464 said:

it is waste to set Bellerin as IWBd

I can partly agree with that, but the problem is that you need to consider the whole system, rather than just individual players/roles. He insists on playing a 4231, so I had to take both the formation and the players he currently has at his disposal into account. The Overlap right TI is there to make Bellerin play slightly higher up the pitch though (as I explained in the post btw).

My personal preference would be a 4141Dm Wide, as that would allow for a more adventurous setup of roles and duties, including Bellerin's role. But the guy simply wants to persist with 4231.

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, Experienced Defender said:

I can partly agree with that, but the problem is that you need to consider the whole system, rather than just individual players/roles. He insists on playing a 4231, so I had to take both the formation and the players he currently has at his disposal into account. The Overlap right TI is there to make Bellerin play slightly higher up the pitch though (as I explained in the post btw).

My personal preference would be a 4141Dm Wide, as that would allow for a more adventurous setup of roles and duties, including Bellerin's role. But the guy simply wants to persist with 4231.

I would not suggest overlap TI or any other TIS unless we are fully understand . 

 

I'm not trying to set the whole team , since so many options it could be use . 

            / 

IFa      /      Aps

       /     CMd

 /      /       /    WBa    

 

 

The  AP moved to left is also a idea . 

 

                     / 

Aps             /            IFs

            /         / 

/          /         /          WBa 

Edited by z464

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7 hours ago, Experienced Defender said:

Where have you seen "less pressing" in my team instructions? 

As for tighter marking, I prefer it to both hard tackling and high pressing as a way of putting pressure on the opposition, because it's safer in the sense that it does not disrupt your defensive shape. 

Yeah I mis worded again, sorry. I meant with you suggested a standard LOE and standard pressing compared to what I have.

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7 hours ago, Experienced Defender said:

I would play Dolberg either as an IF on support in AML, or as a DLF on support with Aubameyang moved to AML as a RMD. But that would require tweaking other roles and duties as well.

As for Geubbels, can you post a screenshot of his player profile?

I also forgot about this other guy, so I took 2 screenshots.

8C184398-BC2C-4CBD-8586-BBC38A258299.png

9850349A-270E-4037-9B4B-F8336A5A9B5B.png

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4 hours ago, Experienced Defender said:

 He insists on playing a 4231, so I had to take both the formation and the players he currently has at his disposal into account.

 

Sorry about that...

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33 minutes ago, Arsenal457 said:

I meant with you suggested a standard LOE and standard pressing compared to what I have

On Positive mentality the level of pressing is already high enough on the default setting (slightly more urgent), as well as d-line and LOE. You need to know that mentality affects other settings, including pressing, DL and LOE n defense (and tempo, passing style and width in attack). So there is no need to increase it even further and thus needlessly risk disrupting your team's defensive shape. With counter-press and prevent short GKD coupled with a high-risk mentality (such as Positive), the players are already aggressive enough. And the combo of higher DL and standard LOE is for the sake of vertical compactness, because 4231 is a top-heavy system - and with no DM at that - so your channels will potentially be more exposed than in a more balanced formation. So it's important to make DL and LOE be a bit closer to each other, in order to reduce this potential exposure of the channels. 

Btw, I recommend you take a look at my recently written guide on defending.

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44 minutes ago, Arsenal457 said:

8C184398-BC2C-4CBD-8586-BBC38A258299.png

A very talented guy with great potential. Can play a number of roles up front, depending on the system you use. In your current 4231, I would most likely play him either as an IF on support in AML or as a DLF on attack. Of course, Aubameyang would be my first-choice, but Geubbels can occasionally come off the bench and you can also use him in cup games.

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51 minutes ago, Arsenal457 said:

9850349A-270E-4037-9B4B-F8336A5A9B5B.png

Another nice talent that could develop into a great striker. But given that you already have too many strikers, I would look to send him on loan to a club with great training facilities and make sure he will be used as a key player there (or at least a first-team regular).

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53 minutes ago, Arsenal457 said:

@Experienced Defender One major question is for Skriniar, why play wider?

To cover the space left by the attacking FB. But that PI is not a necessary one. I like to use it and it works well for me. But you don't have to if you don't want. It's just an option, nothing more than that.

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2 hours ago, z464 said:

        / 

IFa      /      Aps

       /     CMd

 /      /       /    WBa    

 

 

The  AP moved to left is also a idea . 

 

                     / 

Aps             /            IFs

            /         / 

/          /         /          WBa 

Speaking of ideas, there are a number of potential ones. For example:

DLFsu

RMD             TQ             Wsu

CAR/BBM   DLPde

 

WBsu    CDde    CDde    IWBat

This one could also suit his players well (with Auby as the RMD, Dolberg DLFsu, Felix TQ and so on...).

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